An iPhone with in-screen Touch ID could ship as soon as 2021

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited August 5
Apple analyst Ming-Chi Kuo isn't limiting himself to rumors about 2019 and 2020 phones, and has published one now predicting that the 2021 iPhone will have both Face ID and Touch ID.

Comparing Face ID and Touch ID


In a note published on early Monday morning, Kuo predicts that the 2021 iPhone may adopt fingerprint on display (FOD) technology in 2021. The expected supplier of the technology is Qualcomm, using its ultrasonic technology, rather than others that have been developed over the last year or so.

Kuo believes that "four critical technical issues" will improve in the next 12 to 18 months. Limiting factors cited are module thickness, sensing area, power consumption, and lamination yield rate.





Apple has filed patents on the technology, which Kuo believes proves Apple's continued interest in implementing under-screen solutions. In April, Apple was granted a patent to turn the entire display into a fingerprint reader by taking advantage of acoustic imaging -- exactly what Kuo has predicted here.

A slightly different implementation is apparently also in the works, using a series of pinholes in the display panel, which would allow for an optical sensor. It is less likely that this method will be used, according to Kuo, however.

Apple maintains that the chance of another face matching a stored user is about one in a million. Identical twins have on occasion fooled the system, and it is possible to train the system with a failed Face ID unlock and a PIN entry to identify two people that look substantively alike. Touch ID has a one in 50,000 unlock with somebody else's fingerprint.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 28
    crowleycrowley Posts: 6,063member
    I wonder if the user will have control over which authentication to use, or even to require both.  I think I'd got the Touch Id route, I find myself having to pick up or adjust the phone to get the angle right a lot, and even then it quite often fails and I need to fall back to PIN entry.  Touch Id used to fail occasionally, but I remember it a lot less, and the only major user-facing downside was being unable to use it with gloves.

    Maybe Touch Id in the summer, and Face Id in the winter?
    dysamoria
  • Reply 2 of 28
    badmonkbadmonk Posts: 838member
    crowley said:
    I wonder if the user will have control over which authentication to use, or even to require both.  I think I'd got the Touch Id route, I find myself having to pick up or adjust the phone to get the angle right a lot, and even then it quite often fails and I need to fall back to PIN entry.  Touch Id used to fail occasionally, but I remember it a lot less, and the only major user-facing downside was being unable to use it with gloves.

    Maybe Touch Id in the summer, and Face Id in the winter?
    great point!  i for one prefer FaceID because it is better when doing chores around the home and the under the screen US method sounds too complex and another battery sap but being able to switch between the two has some benefit during different activities and seasons.
  • Reply 3 of 28
    uraharaurahara Posts: 310member
    crowley said:
    I wonder if the user will have control over which authentication to use, or even to require both.  I think I'd got the Touch Id route, I find myself having to pick up or adjust the phone to get the angle right a lot, and even then it quite often fails and I need to fall back to PIN entry.  Touch Id used to fail occasionally, but I remember it a lot less, and the only major user-facing downside was being unable to use it with gloves.

    Maybe Touch Id in the summer, and Face Id in the winter?
    It might be really so that you had less problems with TouchID than with FaceID. Or your brain might have remembered more positive things; and the feeling of frustartion with TouchID in certain cases has weared off. True, if they could introduce the TouchID to work parallel with FaceID then it'd win-win.
    repressthis
  • Reply 4 of 28
    wood1208wood1208 Posts: 2,026member
    Face ID is superior than touch id but takes part of the screen notch to hide sensors. If whole screen is touchid than why bother having both methods present ? Don't see benefits keeping faceid.
  • Reply 5 of 28
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 4,298member
    In that timeframe I think we could see solutions like this but along the edge of the phone.

    There are rumours of so called 'waterfall displays' being released in the next two months. The question remains on what will happen to physical buttons on the sides as a result but perhaps just holding the phone might be enough to unlock it safely at some point in the next few years.
  • Reply 6 of 28
     Hard to believe they would give Qualcomm additional leverage like this..
  • Reply 7 of 28
    wood1208 said:
    Face ID is superior than touch id but takes part of the screen notch to hide sensors. If whole screen is touchid than why bother having both methods present ? Don't see benefits keeping faceid.
    Face ID is superior than touch id For SOME use cases.
    It is not superior when you are wearing a full face crash helmet.
    I'd keep both. Then it is down to the user to choose and it also makes it harder for people to break into the phone if they don't know which option has been chosen.

    muthuk_vanalingamchemengin1dysamoria
  • Reply 8 of 28
    spice-boyspice-boy Posts: 1,026member
    Great another layer of complexity just to use a damn phone.
  • Reply 9 of 28
    rogifan_newrogifan_new Posts: 4,213member
    spice-boy said:
    Great another layer of complexity just to use a damn phone.
    He’s just spitballing. I doubt this ever happens. 
    canukstorm
  • Reply 10 of 28
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 21,283member
    spice-boy said:
    Great another layer of complexity just to use a damn phone.
    He’s just spitballing. I doubt this ever happens. 
    While I initially did not I now tend to agree with you. This one is based on his personal opinion from what I'm reading and not on his far more reliable supply chain contacts. Spitballing likely
    edited August 5
  • Reply 11 of 28
    JFC_PAJFC_PA Posts: 359member
    As a backup to FaceID I’d be happy to have TouchID return. But not were it a replacement. FaceID is just too convenient for me. 
    edited August 5 caladanian
  • Reply 12 of 28
    frantisekfrantisek Posts: 558member
    Too bad whether it is true. It means that there may be no small iPhone in 2020.
  • Reply 13 of 28
    ivanhivanh Posts: 391member
    Were still in 2019 and the current year models are not out yet!
    Is there nothing attractive from the current year models?
    Last week it was all taking about models in 2020 and today talking about 2021.
    why not talk about the models in 2030?
    dysamoria
  • Reply 14 of 28
    seanismorrisseanismorris Posts: 1,106member
    Patents mean nothing.

    FaceID isn’t going anywhere.  It’s to tied in to what Apple is doing with AR.  Even on Apple’s cheapest phone, AR (FaceID) will be supported...

    While I prefer TouchID to FaceID.  Multiple authentication methods (support) would be better.  For example, a FaceID + Yubikey + Pin. Or, FaceID + voice authentication.

    Users should be able to set whatever method they want, including multi user authentication.  

    You might also want to set a backup... TouchID (right hand pinky + left hand pinky + right hand middle finger).

    If you set that up (in addition to) device wipe after 8 attempts... that would be very secure.

    With the TouchID combo (backup) you could let your kids, spouse, executor, etc. know and they could use your corpse to unlock your phone.  

    You’d need to be able to turn off Apple’s timed lockout for that method.

    Bottom line, more options are better.
    edited August 5
  • Reply 15 of 28
    SoliSoli Posts: 9,364member
    gatorguy said:
    spice-boy said:
    Great another layer of complexity just to use a damn phone.
    He’s just spitballing. I doubt this ever happens. 
    While I initially did not I now tend to agree with you. This one is based on his personal opinion from what I'm reading and not on his far more reliable supply chain contacts. Spitballing likely
    While I'd absolutely love it to happen, I don't see it happening.
  • Reply 16 of 28
    mobirdmobird Posts: 316member
    Like many states already, here in Tennessee a new law went into effect July 1st that is referred to as the "Hands Free" law regarding phones/mobile devices making it illegal for a driver to:
    (a) hold a cellphone or mobile device with any part of their body,
    (b) write, send, or read any text-based communication,
    (c) reach for a cellphone or mobile device in a manner that requires the driver to no longer be in a seated driving position or properly restrained by a seat belt,
    (d) watch a video or movie on a cellphone or mobile device, and
    (e) record or broadcast video on a cellphone or mobile device.
    So with all of that said, Sync3 in my Ford Edge Sport does a great job overall but my iPhone is very difficult to wake up when in the cradle (trying to access at a stop light or not in motion) and FaceID is practically useless requiring the input of the code. TouchID would be preferable in this situation.
    edited August 5
  • Reply 17 of 28
    Eric_WVGGEric_WVGG Posts: 684member
    wood1208 said:
    Face ID is superior than touch id but takes part of the screen notch to hide sensors. If whole screen is touchid than why bother having both methods present ? Don't see benefits keeping faceid.
    Apple claims the chances of a random finger unlocking your phone is 1 in 50,000; FaceID is one in a million.

    That said, I'd take TouchID back in a heartbeat. Turns out that two of my common iPhone use-cases are on the table, off to the side, without getting picked up; and pulling out of pocket, and glancing down out hip-height without holding up to face.

    I'm switching back to an iPhone SE part-time; between TouchID (v1!) and the shorter screen travel, it's hilarious how much faster and more nimble it feels than my 10S.
  • Reply 18 of 28
    seanismorrisseanismorris Posts: 1,106member
    mobird said:
    Like many states already, here in Tennessee a new law went into effect July 1st that is referred to as the "Hands Free" law regarding phones/mobile devices making it illegal for a driver to:
    (a) hold a cellphone or mobile device with any part of their body,
    (b) write, send, or read any text-based communication,
    (c) reach for a cellphone or mobile device in a manner that requires the driver to no longer be in a seated driving position or properly restrained by a seat belt,
    (d) watch a video or movie on a cellphone or mobile device, and
    (e) record or broadcast video on a cellphone or mobile device.
    So with all of that said, Sync3 in my Ford Edge Sport does a great job overall but my iPhone is very difficult to wake up when in the cradle (trying to access at a stop light or not in motion) and FaceID is practically useless requiring the input of the code. TouchID would be preferable in this situation.
    I use my iPhone/IPad for maps.  How are the cops going to know ‘usage’?  They don’t have the authority to demand your password...

    I think they can currently request the device unlocked with FaceID or TouchID.  I don’t think they can demand a pin/password or device like Yubikey.  I bet Tennessee is going to have a bunch of court dates to schedule...

    I wonder about voice authentication...

    But, that just goes to show that Apple needs multi factor authentication... (from a user standpoint).



    edited August 5
  • Reply 19 of 28
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 2,343member
    mobird said:
    Like many states already, here in Tennessee a new law went into effect July 1st that is referred to as the "Hands Free" law regarding phones/mobile devices making it illegal for a driver to:
    (a) hold a cellphone or mobile device with any part of their body,
    (b) write, send, or read any text-based communication,
    (c) reach for a cellphone or mobile device in a manner that requires the driver to no longer be in a seated driving position or properly restrained by a seat belt,
    (d) watch a video or movie on a cellphone or mobile device, and
    (e) record or broadcast video on a cellphone or mobile device.
    So with all of that said, Sync3 in my Ford Edge Sport does a great job overall but my iPhone is very difficult to wake up when in the cradle (trying to access at a stop light or not in motion) and FaceID is practically useless requiring the input of the code. TouchID would be preferable in this situation.
    Any accommodation for GPS mapping/directions?
  • Reply 20 of 28
    oseameoseame Posts: 57member
    I would really like touch ID to come back. When I'm in bed or using apple pay it's so much more likely to work or quicker respectively. The only feature I'd be happier to see return would be the 3.5mm audio jack. I know Face ID is more secure but having the preference to use either or both would be great.
    edited August 5
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