Voting machines (again), "conspiracy" and lawyers' letters
I know this has been touched on before, but I really thought the following was interesting (and worthy of a reasoned discussion). Bev Harris, the owner of Talion.com, a small PR firm, has spent some time researching voting machine companies and - perhaps more importantly - the ownership of voting machine companies. The first company she decided to research most thoroughly was Omaha based Election Systems & Software (ES&S), the world's largest provider of "total election management solutions." You can read her findings in detail here, but the gist of it is that...
What's funny is that Bev Harris never goes so far as to state that some sort of conspiracy defraud the US electorate exists. She just wonders why the companies who make the machines that will count the votes are so loath to provide full disclosure with respect to ownership and queries whether conflicts of interest are something that we want to have at the heart of the democratic process. Prior to being sent the letter, her site began with the statement:
Now, I'm sure some of AO's more conservative posters (and probably some of the centrist and liberal ones) will read these links and think "big deal...these people are in the business of making money. Voting machines are a good way to make money right now." Imagine then that these companies were financed, operated and primarily owned by individuals with strong connections to the Democrat party...or, better yet, imagine that these companies were financed, operated and primarily owned by interests with strong ties to fundamentalist Islamic groups. Wouldn't you start to wonder if maybe, just maybe, you should find out a little more?
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- ES&S counted 56 percent of the US national vote in each of the last four presidential and congressional elections.
- ES&S was co-founded by Bob Urosevich (current CEO of Diebold Election Systems). Bob's brother Todd continues on at ES&S as VP of customer service.
- ES&S was funded (as American Information Systems Inc.) by the Ahmanson family. That's Ahmanson as in Howard F. Ahmanson Jr., heir to the Home Savings & Loan fortune, member of the Council for National Politics and former financier / board member of Christian reconstructionist Rev. R. J. Rushdoony's Chalcedon Foundation, a group that has in the past advocated the death penalty for crimes like...homosexuality.
- Sandra Mortham (former Secretary of State for Florida and Jeb Bush's first choice as running mate in 1998), worked for ES&S and received a commission for every county that purchased ES&S machines.
- ES&S counts over 80 percent of the votes in Nebraska (need to verify this, other reports say 85 percent).
- ES&S is co-owned (up to 35 percent? I haven't been able to verify this) by the McCarthy Group, an asset management organization run by Michael McCarthy, who is campaign treasurer for Nebraska Senator Chuck Hagel (R).
- Chuck Hagel has an investment of between $1-$5 million under management by the McCarthy Group.
- Chuck Hagel ran for office in Nebraska when he, through his investment in the McCarthy Group and its co-wonership of ES&S, held a significant interest in the company that counted most of the votes in Nebraska.
What's funny is that Bev Harris never goes so far as to state that some sort of conspiracy defraud the US electorate exists. She just wonders why the companies who make the machines that will count the votes are so loath to provide full disclosure with respect to ownership and queries whether conflicts of interest are something that we want to have at the heart of the democratic process. Prior to being sent the letter, her site began with the statement:
Quote:
This is an article about just three things: disclosure, conflict of interest and potential for manipulation. It is not a conspiracy theory or a political point of view.
This is an article about just three things: disclosure, conflict of interest and potential for manipulation. It is not a conspiracy theory or a political point of view.
Now, I'm sure some of AO's more conservative posters (and probably some of the centrist and liberal ones) will read these links and think "big deal...these people are in the business of making money. Voting machines are a good way to make money right now." Imagine then that these companies were financed, operated and primarily owned by individuals with strong connections to the Democrat party...or, better yet, imagine that these companies were financed, operated and primarily owned by interests with strong ties to fundamentalist Islamic groups. Wouldn't you start to wonder if maybe, just maybe, you should find out a little more?
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Comments
Originally posted by kneelbeforezod
imagine that these companies were financed, operated and primarily owned by interests with strong ties to fundamentalist Islamic groups.
good point
The truth is that no matter who owns these companies, anyone can create the conspiracy.
Know the game Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon? Same applies here. If you move more than two or three levels away, ANY company/organization can be technically linked to ANY group.
Of course, the fact that liberals are too stupid to know how to count may have something to do with this... <just kidding, sorta>
Originally posted by jccbin
The truth is that no matter who owns these companies, anyone can create the conspiracy.
By saying this you're either admitting that you haven't read the news that's freely available to you or you don't understand it.
Originally posted by jccbin
f you move more than two or three levels away, ANY company/organization can be technically linked to ANY group.
But it is not "more than two or three levels away." In one case a Senatorial candidate owned a chunk of the company that counted votes in his state.
Does it not bother you at all that these kinds of conflicts of interest may, potentially, lead to American democracy being damaged?
How about if it were a member of the Saud family that owned these companies? How about if they purchased them tomorrow? Would that worry you?
Kewl.
The talking points gang is out.
Whee.
Well, yes, I do think it is agood thing if a few successful people become senators, presidents, and the like, and gee, you don't suppose that the BLIND Frigging TRUSTS that they have to put their money in mean anything.
Bunge(r), pick a time.
Originally posted by jccbin
Of course, the fact that liberals are too stupid ...
Originally posted by jccbin
Less than one post before the personal attacks.
Yup, less than one post before you started with the attacks.
Originally posted by jccbin
Well, yes, I do think it is agood thing if a few successful people become senators, presidents, and the like
What are your feelings regarding wealthy individuals with close ties to religious interest groups and politicians cornering the market on the means by which votes are cast and counted? Is that a good thing? Or to clarify, is that a good thing for democracy? Is there any risk that conflicts of interest could possibly occur?
BLIND Frigging TRUSTS
Not in this case.
December 9, 2003
Senator Bob Graham, D-Florida, today introduced the Voter Verification Act, legislation that would require computer voting systems to produce a paper record.
"After the election of 2000 and the mid-term election - where stories of voter problems were not uncommon - we have to put an electoral system into place in which Americans can have full confidence," said Graham. "This legislation will take us one step further to ensure that every vote really counts and we do not have another debacle like the 2000 election."
Key provisions of the legislation include:
- Requiring that all voting systems produce voter-verified paper records for use in manual audits
- Banning the use of undisclosed software and wireless communication devices in voting systems
- Requiring mandatory surprise recounts in .5 percent of both domestic and overseas jurisdictions.
- All voting systems would have to meet these requirements in time for the November 2004 election.
There is bi-partisan companion legislation already filed in the House. HR 2239 is sponsored by Representative Rush Holt, Democrat of New Jersey, and 94 other members.
Graham's bill will be referred to the Senate Governmental Affairs Committee.
You can see if your Representative has declared his or her support for HR 2239 here. All it takes is a phone call (which, lets face it, is a much easier way to ensure democracy than the revolutions that many of our forebears had to fight).
Just wanted to thank you for your posts in this thread.
I can clearly say that people like jccbin worry me.
Fellowship