PCI-express(what is it...when is it)
I just heard about this, apparently it's a very high bandwidth type of PCI system, with theoretical max of upto 32 GB/sec(in the future)
Do you think apple will use this? They seem to be all about internal bandwidth these days, so I'm sure they will make use of it when it is available.
any more information about it?
Do you think apple will use this? They seem to be all about internal bandwidth these days, so I'm sure they will make use of it when it is available.
any more information about it?
Comments
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
I just heard about this, apparently it's a very high bandwidth type of PCI system, with theoretical max of upto 32 GB/sec(in the future)
Do you think apple will use this? They seem to be all about internal bandwidth these days, so I'm sure they will make use of it when it is available.
any more information about it?
PCI Express is Intel's answer to HyperTransport. Apple uses HyperTransport and won't likely use PCI Express. HyperTransport 2.0 (just released), however, is capable of mapping to PCI Express. HT2 can go up to about 22GBs.
As to Intel's claims of 32GBs, just look at their claims about USB. I'd take anything they say with a block of salt. If PCI Express ever reaches 32GBs, it will be WAY into the future.
So apple already has an answer to this though? or what's the deal wit htaht?
http://forums.appleinsider.com/showt...threadid=36350
Hypertransport and PCI-Express will compliment each other, Apple is apart of the working groups for each.
And yes, Apple will use PCI-Express in their systems with in two years, the future of high performance video cards is going in that direction. ATI and Nvidia, will release cards that work on this bus this year. With-in one year the majority of new PC's on the market will use PCI-Express.
Originally posted by Faeylyn
PCI Express is Intel's answer to HyperTransport. Apple uses HyperTransport and won't likely use PCI Express.
This really isn't at all accurate and the two really cover different markets. I'm certain Apple will introduce a board with PCI Express around Q3 this year if only so they can support the graphics chips that will be coming out.
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Thanks for that, I feel like a 'tard for not searching first
No need to feel that way...
OMF
Originally posted by Telomar
This really isn't at all accurate and the two really cover different markets. I'm certain Apple will introduce a board with PCI Express around Q3 this year if only so they can support the graphics chips that will be coming out.
From ArsTechnica:
HyperTransport and PCI Express have long since been thought of as competing standards. AMD supports HyperTransport and Intel holds high the banner for PCI Express, while both of them are available for royalty-free licensing. On Monday, the HypterTransport Technology Consortium will officially announce v2.0 of the HyperTransport I/O spec. Of note in the new spec is the ability of HT 2.0 to map to PCI Express host bus adapters. This will ensure that PCI Express devices can be used by HyperTransport and will shorten the development curve associated with the new spec.
"Mapping?that's actually a big deal," said Dean McCarron, an analyst with Mercury Research in Cave Creek, Ariz., who said he had not been briefed on the technology. "It's a big deal to recycle software infrastructure." The same principle would be even more useful in enterprise-class applications, where the budget is exponentially larger.
In addition to playing nice with PCI Express, HT 2.0 will allow for greater data throughput (up to 22.4GBps from 12.8GBps) as well as three new speed grades allowing clock speeds of up to 1.4GHz. HyperTransport currently tops out at 800MHz and is currently used in Apple's Power Macintosh G5, AMD Opteron and Athlon 64, and NVIDIA nForce chipsets. The new spec should be a big boost for HyperTransport 2.0, and the ability to map the interface to PCI Express will likely speed its adoption and increase its popularity. Look for systems using HT 2.0 to begin shipping in late 2004."
I don't really care. If you do, you can go argue the finer points with them.
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Do you think apple will use this?
Yes. At a minimum, Apple will have a PCI Express graphics slot in Power Macs to support next generation graphics cards. The only thing that will change in the Power Mac G5 architecture is that Apple replaces the AGP bus support in the system ASIC with a PCI Express bus, changes the AGP slot to a PCI Express slot and the corresponding wires.
Eventually, there will be enough PCI Express cards out there that Apple will eventually use PCI Express for "expansion" as well. It will be interesting whether Apple will support backwards compatible (to PCI) slots or not. If they do, all that changes is they change out the Hypertransport PCI tunnel chip to a Hypertransport PCI Express chip.
They seem to be all about internal bandwidth these days, so I'm sure they will make use of it when it is available. any more information about it?
All PCI Express is is a next generation PCI. It won't change Apple's motherboard architecture at all.
Originally posted by Big Mac
If there is a compelling reason for Apple to provide support for PCI-Express, then they will do so. (...) As others have noted, we've already had this discussion; it's still too early to tell how things will develop.
What PCI-Express is really meant for is to replace AGP.
AGP 8x doubled the bandwidth to 2 GB/s to achieve a meagre 5% more peformance. With 128MB+ VRAM the cards don't require that bandwidth. What is needed is a faster bus. The bus at 66MHz is a bottle neck for fast graphic cards today.
So the question is not "will it come?" the only question is "when will it come?"
Originally posted by Big Mac
It seems that this discussion will be settled by hardware providers. If there is a compelling reason for Apple to provide support for PCI-Express, then they will do so. The only question is how quickly they'll choose to adopt the technology in the event that it does become an industry standard. If Intel wishes to it will shove PCI-Express down everyone's throats - it can certainly build the technology into its motherboards and compell companies to support the standard. As others have noted, we've already had this discussion; it's still too early to tell how things will develop.
Well, Intel does want to push it out as quickly as possible for Pentium 4 Motherboards. According to Anandtech, there's not much pointing to any AGP support for motherboards on their roadmap:
http://www.anandtech.com/chipsets/showdoc.html?i=1953
Anandtech also notes that the flagship Intel motherboards from SiS technology this year won't have AGP, just a PCI Express slot:
http://www.anandtech.com/chipsets/showdoc.html?i=1960
Via will support both AGP and PCI-Express, however:
http://www.anandtech.com/chipsets/showdoc.html?i=1954
Originally posted by Faeylyn
From ArsTechnica:
<blah>
I'm not sure you quite understand the idea of mapping but simply put it doesn't change the need for PCI-Express hardware, which is the future for add in and graphics cards. Where current boards have HT to the PCI-X controller future boards will have HT to PCI-Express but it will still physically be there.
A new version of the HyperTransport specification comes out Monday that will, ideally, boost performance in PCs and communications equipment over the next year.
PCs containing PCI Express links, for instance, will start to show up in the second quarter. Initially, PCI Express will link the processor to the graphics chip, replacing the AGP link, but it will incrementally supplant existing connections between the processor and USB ports, now connected through PCI, or the processor and main memory. These systems will also come with memory based on the DDR 2 specification.
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