why does everyone think the powerbook g5s will suck?
Everytime someone makes a post about the eventual powerbook g5s, everyone chimes in with
1. That is an impossible dream until 2008
2. They are going to be so hot, you will be able to make stirfry
3. They really aren't going to be much faster thant the g4s
4. I'd rather have a dual processor pb
5. They will weigh more than a ton of bricks!
The biggest reasons for th epb to move to g5 are DDR support, faster FSB, and support for more RAM. I can't wait for them to get here. Heaven for bid I spend 2k on a PB and I can run FCP 6 and imovie 10 becasue they are all 64-bit programs.
Just my 2 cents.
Even the the 64 bit emachine is smaller or the same size as other PC notebooks...and has beter battery life than half of them.
I know it will some solid engineering, but I think Apple can come up with something fairly similar to the current gerneration with all of the new g5 architecture benefits.
1. That is an impossible dream until 2008
2. They are going to be so hot, you will be able to make stirfry
3. They really aren't going to be much faster thant the g4s
4. I'd rather have a dual processor pb
5. They will weigh more than a ton of bricks!
The biggest reasons for th epb to move to g5 are DDR support, faster FSB, and support for more RAM. I can't wait for them to get here. Heaven for bid I spend 2k on a PB and I can run FCP 6 and imovie 10 becasue they are all 64-bit programs.
Just my 2 cents.
Even the the 64 bit emachine is smaller or the same size as other PC notebooks...and has beter battery life than half of them.
I know it will some solid engineering, but I think Apple can come up with something fairly similar to the current gerneration with all of the new g5 architecture benefits.
Comments
first off of course people will want dual processors. that doesn't mean they think single will suck
second, they say it'll be too hot if they do it NOW, not when they do it. It's about not hurrying it. Again, that doesn't mean they think it will suck.
I'm not sure where people have said it is going to weigh a ton. In fact i think everyone knows it will not because Steve and Apple would not do that.
2008? Not likely. Again, I don't know where that comes from, but Apple has already alluded to availability maybe by year end '04, but most likely '05. 2008 is a Longhorn projection, not a G5 PB...
And I'm pretty sure everyone knows they'll be faster than G4s. Why? Cause they are now.
Just some counterpoints.
Well I never said it was an impossible dream, what I and many others have indicated is that such a machine would not offer a lot over a G4 machine. It is a given that we are talking about the newest rev of the G4 here.
The power issue is very real. A laptop is very much a sum of its parts, If Apple can't keep all of the support chips running fast and at the same time with low power usage then you will heat/power issues. This excessive heat generation directly affects the ability of one to use the battery.
This is not to say that there is no need for a SUVBook to join the PowerBook line up. The issue is like the SUV's you drive you give up something in return for the capability to drive all over the planet. I think it is obvious that
Apple and IBM are working on portable solutions, the reality is that applying todays technology to a 32 bit solution could have a very dramatic impact on power performance.
Thanks
Dave
Originally posted by jade
Everytime someone makes a post about the eventual powerbook g5s, everyone chimes in with
1. That is an impossible dream until 2008
2. They are going to be so hot, you will be able to make stirfry
3. They really aren't going to be much faster thant the g4s
4. I'd rather have a dual processor pb
5. They will weigh more than a ton of bricks!
The biggest reasons for th epb to move to g5 are DDR support, faster FSB, and support for more RAM. I can't wait for them to get here. Heaven for bid I spend 2k on a PB and I can run FCP 6 and imovie 10 becasue they are all 64-bit programs.
Just my 2 cents.
Even the the 64 bit emachine is smaller or the same size as other PC notebooks...and has beter battery life than half of them.
I know it will some solid engineering, but I think Apple can come up with something fairly similar to the current gerneration with all of the new g5 architecture benefits.
We all know heat is a very important issue, but the 90nanometer g5 chips have reasonable power consumption, as in the same as the current g4 chips.
The ati mobility 9700 video card is very low power, and should not hamper battery life in a notebook.
ars take on the 9700
And Apple is well-versed in the power requirements of hard drives, ram, usb contollers, firewire controllers and optical drives.
So the heat requirements will not be hugely different thant the current lineup, unless Apple finds a crazy new screen. (Although my favorites, like the Sony X-brite seem to have similar power requirements as current screens)
Based on the mobile AMD 64 notebooks on the other side, which is a higher power chip than the 970fx, we did not see a significant change in form factor or size or battery life.
It seems to me the evidence is there and fairly realistic for a relatively soon introduction, unless Apple has a different plan.'
Just because Motorola decided they wanted to make a 1.5 g4 notebook chip 2 years late doesn't mean Apple has to jump on the chip.
What do you think the delay is?
Next step is component delivery. If Apple pushes the technology (and we hope they do) there may be "challenges" getting everything in place to start production on the first 50,000 (100,000?) units. That can be a real pain for Steve J.
You know that Apple, and especially Steve J, wants a solid G5 PB released and generating revenues, as soon as possible. There would be a tremendous effort to get it out - all we have to do is be patient . . . ugh.
Just my .02 cents but until a new PB is released and people find out what Apple has accomplished with a new PowerBook release I for one wouldn't put any faith into anything people say WRT what can or can't happen and what will or wont be better... 99% of what your hearing is just people spouting off about something they couldn't possibly know about in the first place. I admit some of the comments are based on speculating what we currently know as fact but lets face it - whatever Apple has locked away in it's design labs have surprised us before and I'm sure they will surprise us again.
Bad thing about surprises is that they can be GOOD or BAD and either way they're still considered a surprise.
Finally, how on earth can you trust what someone says about something that that they hasn't yet seen it themselves?
Oh and as for speculation as to WHEN new PowerBooks may get release... GIVE UP THE SHIP my good man.. You should know by now AT THE BEST you might hear some slightly educated guesses as to when... AT THE WORST pure BS from trolls just trying to have fun with you.
Dave
Originally posted by jade
I'm exaggerating about the 2008. I am in the camp that says "they could come out any day now, latest sumsmer."
We all know heat is a very important issue, but the 90nanometer g5 chips have reasonable power consumption, as in the same as the current g4 chips.
You really can't say that with respect to the porcessors based on published specs. The high side potential with the 970 is just that prety high. You will only truely now what the results are by running the processors side by side with equal loads. I suspect that Apple knows at this time wether or not the FX is feasable in a laptop.
But this is just the processors you missed the whole point about supporting chips. The PowerMac G5 derives some of its vaunted performance advantages from its northbridge. This guy disapates HEAT, going to a lower power device "could" lower performance.
Quote:
The ati mobility 9700 video card is very low power, and should not hamper battery life in a notebook.
ars take on the 9700
And Apple is well-versed in the power requirements of hard drives, ram, usb contollers, firewire controllers and optical drives.
So the heat requirements will not be hugely different thant the current lineup, unless Apple finds a crazy new screen. (Although my favorites, like the Sony X-brite seem to have similar power requirements as current screens)
Again you can't say this without knowing just how much success Apple has had with the prototypes. Some of the 970's advantages come from running the rest of the system fast, Apple may not have the technology yet to allow them to do this in a laptop. Now that doesn't mean that they aren't working on it, 90 nm does provide them withpotential solutions.
Quote:
Based on the mobile AMD 64 notebooks on the other side, which is a higher power chip than the 970fx, we did not see a significant change in form factor or size or battery life.
Honestly I don't know how you can make the above statements. AMD has made excellent progress with their technology, but sticking a AMD 64 in a laptop does impact what that laptop could be with respect to other technologies. A centrino in the same foot print would have much better battery life.
Quote:
It seems to me the evidence is there and fairly realistic for a relatively soon introduction, unless Apple has a different plan.'
Well I'm not a tea leaf reader so I don't know. I would have to say it is pretty obvious that Apple is working on a new revison of the PowerBook and have probally looked at the 970FX and other technologies we don't know about. Apple could pull a bunny out of the hat and surprise us all.
One could look at Motorolas latest G4 and get the impression that it was optimised for Apple. After all who else has a portable based on Motorola hardware.
Quote:
Just because Motorola decided they wanted to make a 1.5 g4 notebook chip 2 years late doesn't mean Apple has to jump on the chip.
Nope Apple doesn't have to jump on it at all. Apple does have to satisfy customer though. Many would be very dissatisfied with a Laptop that needed to be plugged in constantly or only offered 50% of its capability will running on a battery.
I mena Apple could introduce a Powerbook with a 2GHz 970FX that only ran at 1GHz when on battery. Would you really want such a machine? Would such a machine perform all that well with the clock rolled back? Very Open questions that we can't answer here until we wee real hardware.
The delays could very well be the result of Apple looking at the results that they have gotten so far and saying nope this is not what we can sell successfully to our customers. Or it could simply be a manner of still being in development mode. The possibilities are endless especially if you look at SOC and hybred technologies.
The big question is is there really a delay. The PowerBooks are still selling well. In fact it could be argued that they are the only successful Apple hardware at the moment. given that this hardware is impoatant ot Apple they may be working hard on just getting the next rev RIGHT.
Quote:
What do you think the delay is?
because they are worried they will come out too soon and blow their newly purchased 1.25 aluminum out of the water at the same price point. 8)
Originally posted by jade
I know it will some solid engineering, but I think Apple can come up with something fairly similar to the current gerneration with all of the new g5 architecture benefits.
This seems to be the problem. Apple wants a Powerbook G5 that has the same form factor as a Powerbook G4. This essentially means Apple has to wait for specialized lower power components with the processor, system ASIC and I/O ASIC being the primary components needed.
If they wanted to, Apple could have shipped a G5 notebook in September of 2003 with a 1.1V 1.6 GHz 970. It would have to be 1.5+ inches thick like the Powerbook G3, but as is evident, that is not Apple's style anymore.
Originally posted by jade
Everytime someone makes a post about the eventual powerbook g5s, everyone chimes in with
[...]
I know it will some solid engineering, but I think Apple can come up with something fairly similar to the current gerneration with all of the new g5 architecture benefits.
Well, there was one comment by a senior Apple rep stating "Not Powerbook G5 for a long time". What this means is everyones guess, of course.
Apple does have a tradition of milking CPUs as long as they possibly could, so another year of G4 would not be completely impossible. Since they have a lot of very loyal customers, they'd still sell machines, even if they would be completely outperformed by the PC notebooks.
I don't really believe there are technicals hurdles that cannot be overcome to release a PowerBook G5 till summer. If we don't see one, it is a marketing issue - revenues on old tech are much higher...
Originally posted by Smircle
Well, there was one comment by a senior Apple rep stating "Not Powerbook G5 for a long time". What this means is everyones guess, of course.
I remember a similar statement in 2002(?) concerning the possibility of a G4 iBook. They said that the G3 has still a future in the iBook. Finally, after 1.5-2 years they made the transition. When that statement about a G5 Powerbook has been made?
Originally posted by PB
I remember a similar statement in 2002(?) concerning the possibility of a G4 iBook. They said that the G3 has still a future in the iBook. Finally, after 1.5-2 years they made the transition. When that statement about a G5 Powerbook has been made?
i thought at or just after wwdc 2003. 2 months or so later jobs said he expected a G5 powerbook before the end of 2004. both statements are the same; no powerbook G5 soon. only jobs coupled it with a timeframe...
[edit] link to macrumors about jobs statement regarding pb G5
[edit02] and another link about this subject with a quote of David Russel.
Originally posted by gar
i thought at or just after wwdc 2003. 2 months or so later jobs said he expected a G5 powerbook before the end of 2004. both statements are the same; no powerbook G5 soon. only jobs coupled it with a timeframe...
[edit] link to macrumors about jobs statement regarding pb G5
[edit02] and another link about this subject with a quote of David Russel.
Ah, thanks! So, if the iBook case is going to be repeated in Powerbook territory, then we can't expect G5 or whatever other than G4 Powerbooks before well in 2005. Perhaps the rumor saying that Apple and IBM are working on a mobile 64-bit chip, due in 2005, is true.
i am so so tempted to go and get 12 inch powerbook now but really dont want to be screwed by new updates... if i needed one i would get one but its more of a lust thang
The 64-bit PowerPC 970, a single-core version of the POWER4, can process 200 instructions at once at speeds of up to 2 GHz and beyond -- all while consuming just tens of watts of power. Its low power consumption makes it a favorite with notebooks and other portable applications on the one hand, and with large server and storage farms on the other. Its 64-bit capability and single instruction multiple data (SIMD) unit accelerate computationally intensive workloads such as multimedia and graphics. It is used in Apple desktops, Apple Xserve servers, imaging applications, and -- increasingly -- in networking applications. The Apple Xserve G5 features the first use of the new PowerPC 970FX -- the first chip made using both strained silicon and SoI technologies together, enabling the chip to run at even greater speeds with even less power consumption.
from http://www-106.ibm.com/developerwork...ary/l-powhist/
Originally posted by PLAN-B
i am truely praying for powerbook g5s and they defo will Noy suck they will rock.......
i am so so tempted to go and get 12 inch powerbook now but really dont want to be screwed by new updates... if i needed one i would get one but its more of a lust thang
Could anyone provide a translation of this post? Perhaps babelfish would be useful?
Originally posted by jade
Everytime someone makes a post about the eventual powerbook g5s, everyone chimes in with
1. That is an impossible dream until 2008
2. They are going to be so hot, you will be able to make stirfry
3. They really aren't going to be much faster thant the g4s
4. I'd rather have a dual processor pb
5. They will weigh more than a ton of bricks!
The biggest reasons for th epb to move to g5 are DDR support, faster FSB, and support for more RAM. I can't wait for them to get here. Heaven for bid I spend 2k on a PB and I can run FCP 6 and imovie 10 becasue they are all 64-bit programs.
Just my 2 cents.
Even the the 64 bit emachine is smaller or the same size as other PC notebooks...and has beter battery life than half of them.
I know it will some solid engineering, but I think Apple can come up with something fairly similar to the current gerneration with all of the new g5 architecture benefits.
1. They will most likely be released this year.
2. They won't be that hot because of the new 970 chip. Apple can always run them slower.
3. They are going to be much faster than the G4's mostly because of a faster clock and a much faster system bus.
4. Dual CPU PB's are absurd. There is no benefit to them and it would be almost impossible to design a motherboard for them.
5. They will weigh no more than the current lineup of PBs.
It takes time and energy to make a new machine, esp. a new portable. How long do most people think it took to make the G5 motherboard?
Originally posted by PLAN-B
i am truely praying for powerbook g5s and they defo will Noy suck they will rock.......
i am so so tempted to go and get 12 inch powerbook now but really dont want to be screwed by new updates... if i needed one i would get one but its more of a lust thang
dito,
just bought myself a new battery for my trusty old powerbook and it feels like new again (well, almost... it's quit slow in processor intensive tasks, but i will deal with that if the powerbook G5 15" arrives...
Originally posted by Jubelum
When was the last time Apple released ANYTHING that "SUCKS"
The iVac. Overpriced and underpowered and only came in Key Lime or Dalmation Flower.