Lying Liar-John Kerry
I did, I didn't, I did but I didn't inha... I mean they weren't mine
Seems Kerry finally told one lie to many and got caught by himself, on tape.
When will people wake up and see that Kerry and his ilk are trying to have their cake and eat it too. He was demonizing his own troops abroad and using his own medals to protest about it domestically. He crosses a line and then parses and lies to get out of it.
Sad, sick and wrong. Although I'm sure Al Franken will devote a chapter of his next book to it.
Nick
Seems Kerry finally told one lie to many and got caught by himself, on tape.
When will people wake up and see that Kerry and his ilk are trying to have their cake and eat it too. He was demonizing his own troops abroad and using his own medals to protest about it domestically. He crosses a line and then parses and lies to get out of it.
Sad, sick and wrong. Although I'm sure Al Franken will devote a chapter of his next book to it.
Nick
Comments
www.votenader.org
Nader is the only one who will bring real change.
Originally posted by Existence
I'm not suprised, but then again no one is voting for Kerry because they like him or think he's the best presidential candidate possible. They are voting for him because he's not Bush.
www.votenader.org
Nader is the only one who will bring real change.
Things will change an awful lot more if Bush gets reelected...
How many war medals does the Chickenhawk Gang have?
Originally posted by ShawnJ
Things will change an awful lot more if Bush gets reelected...
... which a vote for Nader is infinitely more likely to do, than to actually elect Nader....
Nick
Originally posted by groverat
That's a damned funny lie to catch him in from the Republican stand point.
How many war medals does the Chickenhawk Gang have?
How many of the chickenhawk gang accused American soldiers, fighting abroad of participating in rape, murder, torture and other "atrocities?"
Nick
Originally posted by groverat
That's a damned funny lie to catch him in from the Republican stand point.
How many war medals does the Chickenhawk Gang have?
Really. Its like an embarrasment of riches . . . so many heroic deeds that he threw them away . . or said that he did in solidarity and anger . . . in youthful passion and anger . . then reclaimed them or simply decided to acknowledge he kept them . . . yeah, somewhere, probably back in 71 he either lost his nerve, and didn't throw them away (in oride) or now, doesn't have them . . .
Um . . . gee . . . is that really that bad?
better that then lie to start a war that didn't need to be founght and shouldn't have been fought in the manner that it was, thereby gauranteeing that more terrorism would ensue and American isolation would continue and etc etc etc
Is this all that the repubs can muster . . . trying to take an obviously valorous man down to the level of snivelling little-avoid-a-bullet-with-a-silver-spoon?
@ Formerlurker, of course, if everybody keeps saying that nothing will ever change.
Originally posted by Dylsexic Manupilator
Maybe it's just me and the pessimist mood I'm in, but I find this kind of behaviour very childish and utterly moot. What is all this mudslinging good for anyway?
This is what's wrong with modern politics, people spend too much time and effort trying to defame the opponent rather than give reasons to support their choice candidate.
Telling me what a stoop kerry is isn't going to chance the fact that I think bush is a stoop too. Maybe if you could show me why bush isn't a stoop, then I'd reconsider, but so far, whenever asked, people always resort to "but kerry..."
A popular buzz term these days when it comes to politics is: "lesser of two evils" that that is true sums up pretty well how lame things are
Originally posted by Dylsexic Manupilator
@ Formerlurker, of course, if everybody keeps saying that nothing will ever change.
How much will voting for Nader change things? Does anyone who voted for him last time, seriously think that their vote led to any change at all (other than the realization that they could have elected Gore instead of Bush)?
I'm not saying change is not needed, just that a Nader vote is an ineffectual way to accomplish it. What's needed is a change that will fully challenge the two-party duopoly, either with a 3rd party with mainstream appeal, or an effective coalition of smaller 3rd parties and true Independents.
Just voting for Nader and saying "at least I'm trying to change things" seems a little... well, lazy. If you really want to try to help change things, there are places to volunteer, organize, contribute, network.... but spending 5 minutes every 4 years casting a ballot for someone that's going to get 5% if he's lucky, isn't going to change anything.
Originally posted by pfflam
Really. Its like an embarrasment of riches . . . so many heroic deeds that he threw them away . . or said that he did in solidarity and anger . . . in youthful passion and anger . . then reclaimed them or simply decided to acknowledge he kept them . . . yeah, somewhere, probably back in 71 he either lost his nerve, and didn't throw them away (in oride) or now, doesn't have them . . .
Um . . . gee . . . is that really that bad?
better that then lie to start a war that didn't need to be founght and shouldn't have been fought in the manner that it was, thereby gauranteeing that more terrorism would ensue and American isolation would continue and etc etc etc
Is this all that the repubs can muster . . . trying to take an obviously valorous man down to the level of snivelling little-avoid-a-bullet-with-a-silver-spoon?
The Logic Twisting Justification is Astounding!
Nick
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
This is what's wrong with modern politics, people spend too much time and effort trying to defame the opponent rather than give reasons to support their choice candidate.
Telling me what a stoop kerry is isn't going to chance the fact that I think bush is a stoop too. Maybe if you could show me why bush isn't a stoop, then I'd reconsider, but so far, whenever asked, people always resort to "but kerry..."
A popular buzz term these days when it comes to politics is: "lesser of two evils" that that is true sums up pretty well how lame things are
Exactly. It seems to stem from the very nature of the two-party system, it's us vs. them, issues be damned, it's whatever party (or team) you decide to identify yourself with. And each election is like a sports contest, you root for YOUR team. If you don't identify strongly with one of the two parties, then "lesser of 2 evils" is exactly what it comes down to.
Wouldn't it be great if the primaries weren't full elimination - if each party put its TWO top candidates forward, and we could choose from FOUR candidates instead of TWO? Making the general election more of a runoff...
I think that these are small indiscretions: he has two things to stand up for even today: he took a risk and went to war and performed valorously, and then, when he returned he realized that the war wherein he and other soldiers performed valorously was not just and not every soldier performed valorously.
Twice he stood for what he believed in . . . once in the war then when he realized what he thought, again when he got back.
many soldiers that are highly respected did the same thing . . . as a right winger on these boards pointed to Hackworth, trying to show how he wrote something about Kerry . . . well this poster didn't know that Hackworth, the editor of "Soldiers Of Truth" a forum site and magazine for Soldiers to get to the bottom of what is happening, an interesting site and very respected amoung military-fact-numbers-types, also experienced the same sort of dissilusionment and even wrote a book about it . . .anyway, Kerry has little to be ashamed of, whereas the people who are trying desperately to attack him on this front should be hanging their heads
Originally posted by Wrong Robot
This is what's wrong with modern politics, people spend too much time and effort trying to defame the opponent rather than give reasons to support their choice candidate.
Telling me what a stoop kerry is isn't going to chance the fact that I think bush is a stoop too. Maybe if you could show me why bush isn't a stoop, then I'd reconsider, but so far, whenever asked, people always resort to "but kerry..."
A popular buzz term these days when it comes to politics is: "lesser of two evils" that that is true sums up pretty well how lame things are
You nailed it there. For the first time in long time, I am in complete agreement with my Robotic colleague. At least NadAr will state things as they ARE, not as they need to be to get votes. I gotta give him credit for being authentic.
It's hard to decide between SHRUB and THE KETCHUP KING. Maybe we'll just stay home.
Originally posted by trumptman
Seems Kerry finally told one lie to many and got caught by himself, on tape.
So what's wrong with this? Did he throw out his ribbons or not?
Originally posted by groverat
That's a damned funny lie to catch him in from the Republican stand point.
How many war medals does the Chickenhawk Gang have?
War medals ! = Good leader.
Originally posted by Dylsexic Manupilator
Maybe it's just me and the pessimist mood I'm in, but I find this kind of behaviour very childish and utterly moot. What is all this mudslinging good for anyway? Why are people more upset about what some guy (albeit a presidential candidate) did over 30 years ago then over the real issues like keeping the human race from destroying itself and our planet with it?
@ Formerlurker, of course, if everybody keeps saying that nothing will ever change.
Former,
Sure there are childish cases of "gotcha" politics that are terrible because they change the debate away from ideas.
However there are also cases where the gotcha is someone LYING about their politics. That to me is important because if the person isn't going to follow through on their ideas, why vote for them?
Kerry for example claims Bush is selling out the average tax payer for corporate interests. However Kerry has proposed a reduction in the corporate tax rate while allowing the Bush tax cuts to lapse which would, raise taxes on the normal everyday person.
Kerry claims that money corrupts political speech and voted for McCain-Feingold. He then skips public financing, campaign limits, mortgages a house his rich wife's money purchased and "loans" his campaign the millions of dollars from it.
Lastly Kerry rode the back of proclaiming these "atrocities" for his own political gain. So while our soldiers abroad were doing the right thing, he was home calling them criminals and using the limelight from calling them that to help himself get elected to office.
If you want to complain about Bush driving drunk, Gore smoking some pot, whatever, sure that sort of gotcha politics detracts from the debate of ideas. However watching someone use people, go around the laws and ideas they claim to defend and desire, that is entirely different.
Nick
Originally posted by trumptman
However watching someone use people, go around the laws and ideas they claim to defend and desire, that is entirely different.
Nick
Almost seems hypocritical doesn't it...
You are such a bloated windbag buffoon its amazing . . . give it a rest
This is nothing . . .
nearly 700 AMerican soldiers and thousands of Iraqis have been KILLED because of LIES told by a **** ***** ********* sh**hole and you smear this guy for saying, 30 years ago, that he 'returned his ribbons' . . . you are so full of shit it amazes me.
You think this is some kind of revelation of import?