my opinion of flash...
well, i have been self-training on flash, and i have to honestly say that while the technology is cool, i now remember why i haven't learned it sooner...
flash is one of the most counter-intuitive, dialog-box driven authoring environments i have ever seen, which started off as a decent, if not rudimentary, animation tool, and then found its niche in creating web content no one else could touch. but now, truthfully, i see why people who are flash experts are such hot commodities -- no one's brain is supposed to think like this. drawing tools that work counter to every other drawing app, functions that work on some object and not others, for no discernible reason, masks that only take effect when you lock them (?), etc., etc., etc. you don't actually LEARN flash, so much as you MEMORIZE it.
i mean, don't get me wrong, i am getting it. hell, i learned complex photoshop channel operations since photoshop 3, so i'm pretty sure i can make myself learn anything when it comes to app training, but reading through training books and tutorials for flash has taught me that it is not a good thing that macromedia has the ONLY flash authoring tool out there. they have no impetus to correct interface problems that have been in this app for years. i often find myself resorting to "monkey-see, monkey-do" tutorials, rather than try to make sense of why a "motion" tween can tween more than just motion, yet can't be used on a shape, which needs a shape tween, even if you use a shape tween to, you guessed it, simulate motion.
what -- the -- f*ck.
perhaps this is an arena where even -- dare i say it -- apple can make a competing app? now that adobe gave up on livemotion, i don't see anyone else out there willing to take on the challenge (and i am sure microsoft would just love to buy out macromedia for access to two things: coldfusion and flash.
anyway, i just had to vent. i don't know if anyone else feels the same, but there's a lot of us who kick, yell and scream about interface issues with apple's apps, or even microsoft's, but now that i am looking at an application such as this with fresh eyes, i can see how we can take certain things for granted.
flash is one of the most counter-intuitive, dialog-box driven authoring environments i have ever seen, which started off as a decent, if not rudimentary, animation tool, and then found its niche in creating web content no one else could touch. but now, truthfully, i see why people who are flash experts are such hot commodities -- no one's brain is supposed to think like this. drawing tools that work counter to every other drawing app, functions that work on some object and not others, for no discernible reason, masks that only take effect when you lock them (?), etc., etc., etc. you don't actually LEARN flash, so much as you MEMORIZE it.
i mean, don't get me wrong, i am getting it. hell, i learned complex photoshop channel operations since photoshop 3, so i'm pretty sure i can make myself learn anything when it comes to app training, but reading through training books and tutorials for flash has taught me that it is not a good thing that macromedia has the ONLY flash authoring tool out there. they have no impetus to correct interface problems that have been in this app for years. i often find myself resorting to "monkey-see, monkey-do" tutorials, rather than try to make sense of why a "motion" tween can tween more than just motion, yet can't be used on a shape, which needs a shape tween, even if you use a shape tween to, you guessed it, simulate motion.
what -- the -- f*ck.
perhaps this is an arena where even -- dare i say it -- apple can make a competing app? now that adobe gave up on livemotion, i don't see anyone else out there willing to take on the challenge (and i am sure microsoft would just love to buy out macromedia for access to two things: coldfusion and flash.
anyway, i just had to vent. i don't know if anyone else feels the same, but there's a lot of us who kick, yell and scream about interface issues with apple's apps, or even microsoft's, but now that i am looking at an application such as this with fresh eyes, i can see how we can take certain things for granted.
Comments
Forget everything you've ever learned to do in any other app, Flash's authoring environment reinvents the wheel into a square.
Originally posted by rok
flash is one of the most counter-intuitive, dialog-box driven authoring environments i have ever seen,
I really don't understand the need to single out Flash and dump on it like this.
Macromedia's ENTIRE f*cking line-up of apps are probably the most pathetic display of programing in the creative application market. God only knows how they can take really cool ideas and mesh them with horrible interfaces and buggy code.
Certainly gives Microsoft a run for their money.
Originally posted by the cool gut
I really don't understand the need to single out Flash and dump on it like this.
Macromedia's ENTIRE f*cking line-up of apps are probably the most pathetic display of programing in the creative application market. God only knows how they can take really cool ideas and mesh them with horrible interfaces and buggy code.
Certainly gives Microsoft a run for their money.
well, because i had to learn it this weekend. but i agree that macromedia's entire lineup need a serious "fresh eye" examination to clean it up. but i guess i have "memorized" how dreamweaver works, and i get just as frustrated with fireworks, but then i just do all of my stuff in photoshop/imageready.
and i think therein lies the answer to your question, aside fromt he fact that it just happens to be on my plate at the time, but also, as i said, when it comes to flash authoring, macromedia is the ONLY game in town. that's not good. hate dreamweaver? fireworks? freehand? no problems. there are a few major and many minor competing products for each. but when it comes to flash, just suck it up, unless microsoft or apple decide to get in the game...
p.s. please forgive me if i have forgotten some alternate flash authoring tool, but, honest to god, i can't think of another.
I made the leap a few years ago and it is glorious.
Mmmmmmm variables..objects...conditionals....loops.....
i.e. learn true programming (or at least animation-related programming) first, not a mere implementation of one company's program's authoring environment.
But hell yeah, Macromedia needs a thorough GUI overhaul.
Bring back the old Director 6/7 UI (hey, I liked it anyway - more exact and immediate).
Originally posted by johnq
Learn ActionScripting to intermediate/advanced levels and you will rarely even use the timeline for animation.
I made the leap a few years ago and it is glorious.
maybe that's what i'm finding it so byzantine. it's like it's trying to force down programming into a "flip-book" model.
Originally posted by johnq
i.e. learn true programming (or at least animation-related programming) first, not a mere implementation of one company's program's authoring environment.
what would you suggest? i really don't think my programming needs would extend beyond what flash sites i have seen do (though, then again, that's quite a lot)
Originally posted by rok
maybe that's what i'm finding it so byzantine. it's like it's trying to force down programming into a "flip-book" model.
what would you suggest? i really don't think my programming needs would extend beyond what flash sites i have seen do (though, then again, that's quite a lot)
I won't lie, the subject is fairly steep (in time investment if not difficulty).
Speaking for myself I use all the O'Reilly Flash books but particularly ActionScript: The Definitive Guide.
Basically I've done self contained Flash projects in which there is zero tweening and only one frame (horizontally) of the timeline used.
(Pisses other people off that need to edit it later if they don't know ActionScript but such is life.)
If you can think in terms of objects that react to events and variables rather than manually creating every instance of animation you might need it is far more rewarding, both in terms of labor and expandability. I can change things radically with a few changes of a few variables whereas otherwise I'd have to rip out entire sections and re-tween things and it is a nightmare.
If you want to learn it take your time, ask around and be patient. before you know it you'll use not much aside from the actionscript editor and maybe the Library and a few other things.
For some simple things the timeline is ok, but I shy away from thinking in literal terms of frames and such. Dynamic is way better and changes are immediate (and easily reverted).
ActionScript. One reason I have tended to stray away from Flash for a while. Programming. Again it raises its ugly analytical head upon us creatives...I have seen so many job offers of small time agencies and web designers begging for someone to make their beautifully designed Flash site to actually work...ActionScript.
Give me Flash on an Apple Pro w/ 21" Cinema Display and I'm in heaven. On any display smaller than that...shear terror and frustration. Too many boxes to juggle.
Flash. You work with it for a month and then drop it. When you return to work with it again...You have to learn it all over again. I love it and I hate it.
I only wish Illustrator was as fast, unbloated, or easy to use as it. Mind you, I personally use Flash purely for it's vector capabilities.
MX 2004 is entirely different, however. While Flash MX would open on my G3 iBook with little more than a bounce, MX 2004 would take 5 bounces, then sit at a splash screen nearly as long as photoshop. And still worse, it is bloated. =\\ I hate that. Even though I pir.. erm, acquired MX 2004, I still use MX exclusively.
- Xidius
Originally posted by Jeremiah Rich
Isn't live motion Adobe's alternative? Of course from what I understand it is even worse and very limited...
Yes and yes.
It does have that Adobe UI touch that we love, though. But UI alone can't save it. To be honest I haven't used it since 1.0 so I will refrain from bashing it altogether. But Macromedia, like it or not, will always be my preferred source for Flash authoring.
(I guess there are other apps that are decent for linear animation or pseudo 3D).
Originally posted by Jeremiah Rich
Isn't live motion Adobe's alternative? Of course from what I understand it is even worse and very limited...
yes, but adobe came out and officially declared livemotion dead, as they will not be expanding the app beyond version 2.0 (except MAYBE patches for stability to license owners). of course, it's really imagestyler 4.0, since they bought that app, went through a revision, changed its name to livemotion, then livemotion 2, and then, nothing...
as a matter of fact, i have no idea if ANYone has an authoring tool for the svg format anymore (which was supposed to be the official w3c sanctioned standard alternative to flash, i think).
Originally posted by rok
as a matter of fact, i have no idea if ANYone has an authoring tool for the svg format anymore (which was supposed to be the official w3c sanctioned standard alternative to flash, i think).
Does Toon Boom count?
I know it's mostly animation, not authoring per se...but I haven't tried it lately...is it more robust now?
Originally posted by >_>
I love flash MX (not 2004).
I only wish Illustrator was as fast, unbloated, or easy to use as it. Mind you, I personally use Flash purely for it's vector capabilities.
MX 2004 is entirely different, however. While Flash MX would open on my G3 iBook with little more than a bounce, MX 2004 would take 5 bounces, then sit at a splash screen nearly as long as photoshop. And still worse, it is bloated. =\\ I hate that. Even though I pir.. erm, acquired MX 2004, I still use MX exclusively.
- Xidius
Well, you should do your vectors in Electric Image. It does beziers, B-splines, and anything else MEGA FAST. . . oh. . . that's right. . . it's a 3d app. anyway, it's so damn good. For $999 it's a steal and can do a lot. Plus it renders wicked fast, if you're a 3D guy. I highly recommend.
Originally posted by Splinemodel
...if you're a 3D guy. I highly recommend.
You mean, ...if you're a 3D girl. I highly recommend.