Performance beyond G5

machead @ amherstmachead @ amherst
Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
All the discussion on this forum concerning speed has side-stepped other critical factors and determinants of overall performance. What I'd like to know is what people have to say (and more importantly inform) regarding the medium-term architectural improvements to the Dual G5s motherboards. Info or illuminating discussion on the prospects of the adoption of HT2, PCIe, RapidIO (for PBs in case of Freescale if not refactored for HT - also how difficult would refactoring be if pursued??), memory subsytem improvements, possible modifications to the current SATA scheme, etc...



Also out of curiosity, anyone know what the bus multiplier is on the 2.3Ghz Xserves at VTech is?



Technically-inclined posts most welcome!!!!

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 16
    talksense101talksense101 Posts: 1,738member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Machead @ Amherst

    Technically-inclined posts most welcome!!!!



    Try this for a more geeky discussion:



    http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/...2&f=8300945231
  • Reply 2 of 16
    wmfwmf Posts: 1,164member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Machead @ Amherst

    Also out of curiosity, anyone know what the bus multiplier is on the 2.3Ghz Xserves at VTech is?



    2:1 of course.
  • Reply 3 of 16
    nr9nr9 Posts: 182member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by talksense101

    Try this for a more geeky discussion:



    http://episteme.arstechnica.com/eve/...2&f=8300945231



    most people at arstechnica don't know shit but just pretend that they know shit.
  • Reply 4 of 16
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,455member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Nr9

    most people at arstechnica don't know shit but just pretend that they know shit.



    Are you still here mr. insult from IBM?



    Arstechnica has plenty of good information. Their breakdown of PCI-Express is probably the best article I have read to date that distinguishes what PCI-Express is compared to other bus types. I have been very satisfied with arstechnica over the last few years.



    Either way, I think the big performance boost is going to come more from software in the next year. Of course hardware will get faster, but I want to address the software side of things.



    IBM's PPC assembly / C compiler has been seen in recent Developer mailed cds. It seems apple is pushing PPC assembly a little bit for the 64 bit libraries. If GOOD assemblers can do some inline assembly in intense CPU programs (cinema, maya, etc) we could see some programs FLY on g5s.



    Fairly soon we should see some Tiger builds being seeded to others besides the extremely privileged. We will be able to optimize more towards the new 64bit libraries included with tiger... I am anxiously awaiting my copy .
  • Reply 5 of 16
    zapchudzapchud Posts: 844member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Nr9

    most people at arstechnica don't know shit but just pretend that they know shit.



    In the other end, we have Nr9, who still will be ignored or not taken as seriously as he would prefer, until he starts to manage to present his knowledge to other people. I, for one, trust the arstechnica people more than you just because of this.
  • Reply 6 of 16
    airslufairsluf Posts: 1,861member
    Kickaha and Amorph couldn't moderate themselves out of a paper bag. Abdicate responsibility and succumb to idiocy. Two years of letting a member make personal attacks against others, then stepping aside when someone won't put up with it. Not only that but go ahead and shut down my posting priviledges but not the one making the attacks. Not even the common decency to abide by their warning (afer three days of absorbing personal attacks with no mods in sight), just shut my posting down and then say it might happen later if a certian line is crossed. Bullshit flag is flying, I won't abide by lying and coddling of liars who go off-site, create accounts differing in a single letter from my handle with the express purpose to decieve and then claim here that I did it. Everyone be warned, kim kap sol is a lying, deceitful poster.



    Now I guess they should have banned me rather than just shut off posting priviledges, because kickaha and Amorph definitely aren't going to like being called to task when they thought they had it all ignored *cough* *cough* I mean under control. Just a couple o' tools.



    Don't worry, as soon as my work resetting my posts is done I'll disappear forever.

  • Reply 7 of 16
    aphelionaphelion Posts: 736member
    Ars Technica is a good technical site, and has many very knowledgeable posters. Unfortunately it also has a cadre of arse's that for their own reasons constantly denigrate all things Apple.



    amateur has just posted a very good summary of the problem at ars in the 41 page iMac G5 topic here:



    amateur's ars post



    At times in the past posting anything pro Apple was an invitation for a gang-bang by the "regulars" that inhabit the "battlefront". The usual gang of suspects still exist at ars, but many of them have bought Macs now and are not so sure of how bad Apple computers are.
  • Reply 8 of 16
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,455member
    Agreed on the users at ars... but the forum users don't make the articles normally.
  • Reply 9 of 16
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    I don't think the speed of the processors would seem as necessary. If they could equal PC's in graphics most of the performance numbers that get so much attention would climb right up the chart, and major increases wouldn't be expected because many of the numbers would be matching, or be close to matching PC's statistics.
  • Reply 10 of 16
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,455member
    But onlooker,



    We both know that even with the same hardware, the macs numbers would lag behind.... because of OpenGL implementation on OS X.
  • Reply 11 of 16
    onlookeronlooker Posts: 5,252member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by emig647

    But onlooker,



    We both know that even with the same hardware, the macs numbers would lag behind.... because of OpenGL implementation on OS X.



    I'm thinking/saying/implying - when saying "graphics" that includes improved new better optimization of OGL.



    I don't know why they don't have this licked by now anyways. They have been using OGL for years. Why is it so neglected? I'm starting to think this is their biggest issue.

    They (Apple) release all these great #'s, and statistics, but when there tested outside by independents they turn out sluggish in odd areas, and under-whelming where they should have been either neck, and neck, or out performing others.

    They need to straighten this out, and before Core Image. If they let Core Image just make up the difference where they screwed up on OGL Core Image will never perform to it's full potential either. Just like the PowerMacs, the rest of them it will be scoffed at when performance tested by outside independent testers as anther Apple gimmick to hype an under-performing technology that Apple once again exaggerated to boost sales of another mediocre line of Apple computers. What if all it was - is the OGL that was slowing the majority of things down all along?
  • Reply 12 of 16
    splinemodelsplinemodel Posts: 7,311member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by Nr9

    most people at arstechnica don't know shit but just pretend that they know shit.



    This is so, so true.



    "We're prosumers!"



    Great. I'm a real professional, and I don't seem to have a problem with using dated hardware so long as it gets the job done. The intelligence and knowledge density at AI is much higher than at Ars.
  • Reply 13 of 16
    airslufairsluf Posts: 1,861member
    Kickaha and Amorph couldn't moderate themselves out of a paper bag. Abdicate responsibility and succumb to idiocy. Two years of letting a member make personal attacks against others, then stepping aside when someone won't put up with it. Not only that but go ahead and shut down my posting priviledges but not the one making the attacks. Not even the common decency to abide by their warning (afer three days of absorbing personal attacks with no mods in sight), just shut my posting down and then say it might happen later if a certian line is crossed. Bullshit flag is flying, I won't abide by lying and coddling of liars who go off-site, create accounts differing in a single letter from my handle with the express purpose to decieve and then claim here that I did it. Everyone be warned, kim kap sol is a lying, deceitful poster.



    Now I guess they should have banned me rather than just shut off posting priviledges, because kickaha and Amorph definitely aren't going to like being called to task when they thought they had it all ignored *cough* *cough* I mean under control. Just a couple o' tools.



    Don't worry, as soon as my work resetting my posts is done I'll disappear forever.

  • Reply 14 of 16
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    That is pretty funny considering some of the same people that post there post here. Are you trying to imply that the change of URL increases a persons intelligence



    There is one big difference between Ars and this forum. The people on Ars often back their claims up with good sources of information. Here we have people posting things that seem to run contrary to industry trend and refuse to support their positions with good references.



    Some positions that I've objected to personally, I do so due to a number of factors. For the concerns about 90nm, I look at the industry as a whole, when doing so I don't see everyone going into convulsions with respect to 90nm. IBM may be getting the market ready for when they fatten their chips but that doesn't mean everybody has to take the same approach. IF IBM can not scale frequency on their 90nm process all that really means is that Apple hooked up with the wrong CPU maker again. IBM is not the only choice when it comes to custom chips and may not even be the industry leader that many suspect it of being.



    Quote:

    Originally posted by Splinemodel

    The intelligence and knowledge density at AI is much higher than at Ars.



    Well DENSE could be applied to some here.
  • Reply 15 of 16
    emig647emig647 Posts: 2,455member
    Very true Wizard69, towards aspect of people making claims here and not backing it up with any proof... AHEM Nr9.
  • Reply 16 of 16
    airslufairsluf Posts: 1,861member
    Kickaha and Amorph couldn't moderate themselves out of a paper bag. Abdicate responsibility and succumb to idiocy. Two years of letting a member make personal attacks against others, then stepping aside when someone won't put up with it. Not only that but go ahead and shut down my posting priviledges but not the one making the attacks. Not even the common decency to abide by their warning (afer three days of absorbing personal attacks with no mods in sight), just shut my posting down and then say it might happen later if a certian line is crossed. Bullshit flag is flying, I won't abide by lying and coddling of liars who go off-site, create accounts differing in a single letter from my handle with the express purpose to decieve and then claim here that I did it. Everyone be warned, kim kap sol is a lying, deceitful poster.



    Now I guess they should have banned me rather than just shut off posting priviledges, because kickaha and Amorph definitely aren't going to like being called to task when they thought they had it all ignored *cough* *cough* I mean under control. Just a couple o' tools.



    Don't worry, as soon as my work resetting my posts is done I'll disappear forever.

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