Woz rips Apple a new one
Right here
Ouch...
Quote:
Do you think that is at all similar to the computer industry, where engineers develop a product and someone else sets the price?
It's very much like that, but sometimes the engineers are - yeah, no, I think it's very similar, very similar. Sometimes the engineers are true artists and really care what they're doing, doing a really great job. Although, I don't know how much I can even say that because the big companies, Microsoft, Apple and AOL, they tend to turn out the crappiest products, you know, software-wise. The ones that have the most bugs, the most items that are supposedly in there but don't work. The most things that are left out because they aren't finished. The most things that are inconsistent with the way they did their last program. I get the worst, worst software almost always from Apple.
You think so?
Oh yeah. I get third-party stuff and it's almost always just better, cleaner and more understandable. It works better and does what you'd expect instead of, you know, buggy things or not what you expect.
What's an example?
I couldn't give you an example. It happens just all the time. Over and over and over.
Is OS X is problematic in that way?
I don't even call it a problem; it's just something you learn to work around. It's like, there was such a cleaner, good approach to it and they did this stupid thing. But remember, the people who wrote the OS X weren't the people who developed the Lisa and Macintosh. Those guys are gone.
Do you think that is at all similar to the computer industry, where engineers develop a product and someone else sets the price?
It's very much like that, but sometimes the engineers are - yeah, no, I think it's very similar, very similar. Sometimes the engineers are true artists and really care what they're doing, doing a really great job. Although, I don't know how much I can even say that because the big companies, Microsoft, Apple and AOL, they tend to turn out the crappiest products, you know, software-wise. The ones that have the most bugs, the most items that are supposedly in there but don't work. The most things that are left out because they aren't finished. The most things that are inconsistent with the way they did their last program. I get the worst, worst software almost always from Apple.
You think so?
Oh yeah. I get third-party stuff and it's almost always just better, cleaner and more understandable. It works better and does what you'd expect instead of, you know, buggy things or not what you expect.
What's an example?
I couldn't give you an example. It happens just all the time. Over and over and over.
Is OS X is problematic in that way?
I don't even call it a problem; it's just something you learn to work around. It's like, there was such a cleaner, good approach to it and they did this stupid thing. But remember, the people who wrote the OS X weren't the people who developed the Lisa and Macintosh. Those guys are gone.
Ouch...
Comments
As far as leaving out features in an application because they aren't finished, the alternative is not shipping at all. As the *other* Steve has been quoted as saying, "Great artists ship."
However if you look at the current state of application development you see a "fix it in the mix" attitude with regards to API evolution that pretty much guarantees that apps don't function %100 bug free.
Originally posted by Voxapps
Let's see: Woz has been a big proponent of iCab. On my list of preferred Mac browsers, it's about...5th? 6th? Its biggest fans seem to be hairshirts who wail "Well, it *would* render that site if the HTML was perfect." I guess Woz prefers a browser that punishes its users for the errors of Web developers.
As far as leaving out features in an application because they aren't finished, the alternative is not shipping at all. As the *other* Steve has been quoted as saying, "Great artists ship."
Perhaps its more a situation of "fix iPhoto, a mediocre app, before you make Apeture, a truly stinking app" or "before you pile on new features on Mac OS X by the hundreds per year, what about fix the the problems that has been pointed out since day one?" or "fine to make a truly sleek app like iCal but what about actually make it usable and fast instead of just beautiful"
The part I don´t understand is his general critisism of X. OS 9 (or perhaps even more 8.6, can´t really remember anymore) had moved towards perfection within the frame that the "core" of the OS permitted. Truly protected memory could not have been done without actually changed so much it would have given problems. Better to start with a good blank sheet, add the nessesary features of a modern OS and THEN perfect it.
I'm just hoping the whole story is somehow out of context. Otherwise...
Originally posted by kcmac
And just how are Woz's latest ventures fairing?
I'm just hoping the whole story is somehow out of context. Otherwise...
Did Woz's company invent the Hiptop?
I think Woz just dislikes new mac stuff by Apple in general. Hiptop contacts work with Entourage, Palm Desktop (!!!) and Outlook Express (!!!) on the Mac. Wow.
That makes it a non starter for me right out of the blocks.
Although they seem to have a following on the internet, I have yet to see one of these in public. No advertising, etc. Kind of like the old Apple...
Originally posted by kcmac
Although they seem to have a following on the internet, I have yet to see one of these in public. No advertising, etc. Kind of like the old Apple...
A hiptop? You must not live in a T-Mobile area. I see them all the time.
I have seen them at the kiosks in the malls (pretty bulky) but never actually seen anyone using one.
one such app, imho, is itunes. i actually regard itunes 2 or 3 era as much more usable (and sensible) than those versions that have glommed on features solely for the purpose of selling a new ipod. seriously, why else would an app like iTUNES organize PHOTOS and now VIDEOS? but people look the other way because, hey, the ipod is friggin' saving the company.
tiger has some just bizarre anomalies that only a mother could love. seriously, burning a cd made a HELL of a lot more sense under panther than tiger. now, i'm not saying pathfinder is the perfect solution (far from it... i think it has way too much), but there's got to be a happy medium.
the dock seems to be feature-frozen now, but that does help small developers like mr. thompson keep finding a market for dragthing (which, again, has almost too much functionality, but man-o-man, there's nothig it can't do).
i remember back when the ipod first came out, apple's syncing with it was, shall we say, less than stellar, and they created it! woz recommended a shareware app (i forget the name), that ran circles around apple's technique. i think that's really what he's saying here. i mean, his expecttations are higher of apple because a.) he started the company and b.) if apple is the first (and sometimes ONLY) company that knows what they're doing next, they should be able to make the software that DOES it best, too. it's the lisa simpson problem... when you get a's all the time, everyone freaks out when you get a b, but your bratty idiot kid brother eeks out a c for the first time in years, and everyone acts like he's a saint. sometimes a legacy of greatness can be its own punishment.
luckily, though, i don't EVER get the impression that apple sits on its laurels.