Safari on iPhone - typing in forms?

nevenmrgan

I haven't seen this brought up elsewhere on the forum...



How are we going to type text into form fields on web pages using iPhone's "mini-Safari"? All we've seen Steve do so far is type into the address bar and search bar. Those would bring up the half-screen keyboard on the bottom.



But what about typing in, for instance, search fields? Do you think the keyboard will pop up when you click in a text field? Or will it be enabled some other way?



Also, do you think it will be possible to upload files from iPhone? If I take a picture with my iPhone and I go to Flickr.com, will I be able to hit "Upload" and browse over to /Pictures on iPhone? What if I saved a file from a webpage? I guess the bigger question is, what does iPhone's "Home folder" look like?



I know we'll lose a lot of browser features as a consequence of the size, but these sound crucial to me... Ideas?

jupiterone

Quote:

Originally Posted by nevenmrgan


I know we'll lose a lot of browser features as a consequence of the size,.....

Why do you say that? I didn't get that impression from the keynote. As a matter of fact, I thought that the fact that you WON'T have a "mini" browser (rather, a full functioning one) is one of the selling points.

nevenmrgan

It's a "mini" browser any way you spin it; its HTML-rendering engine might be WebKit, but it's not going to have all the functionality of Safari. I think that much is obvious. We don't yet know if Flash will be supported. How about embedded QuickTime, a download manager, History, RSS, WebClips? I'm not saying it will be a bad browser for lacking these, but it obviously won't have EVERY feature of "desktop Safari".



In any case, I was bringing up features it pretty much HAS to have and asking, what is your idea for the implementation of those?

jupiterone

I have no idea because I always thought that the iPhone would have a fully functional web browser.



I have to now go back and review the keynote again because I thought Jobs specifically made a point of this, and now I'm curious as to where *I* got that idea. But what is giving you the idea that it won't be full blown Safari? Is it because no other phone does this?



From the iPhone web page...

Quote:

iPhone features a rich HTML email client and Safari ? the most advanced web browser ever on a portable device ? which automatically syncs bookmarks from your PC or Mac. Safari also includes built-in Google and Yahoo! search. iPhone is fully multi-tasking, so you can read a web page while downloading your email in the background over Wi-Fi or EDGE.

nevenmrgan

Think about it. It's a browser without a toolbar, menu bar, or status bar, running in a window about 320 x 380px. You don't have a keyboard or mouse to use with it. I'm pretty sure it won't have all the features we're used to in Safari, but that's not the point anyway - my point is, what WILL the features it WILL have look like?



What if I click a drop-down menu on a web page? How will that work? How will we scroll that? How easy is it going to be to fill out a form? That's what I was asking.

jupiterone

I just reviewed the keynote. At 1:02:00 he says "We have Safari running on the iPhone". And he talks about it being a "fully functioning" web browser and "not a WAP browser". Also, the keynote clearly shows a tool bar with URL field, reload and stop icon at the top and forward, back, bookmarks, new page icons on the bottom.



So to answer your question, I would expect to fill out a form on the iPhone Safari just as you fill out a form on the Mac Safari. Zooming in, if you have to.

spamsandwich

Quote:

Originally Posted by nevenmrgan


Think about it. It's a browser without a toolbar, menu bar, or status bar, running in a window about 320 x 380px. You don't have a keyboard or mouse to use with it. I'm pretty sure it won't have all the features we're used to in Safari, but that's not the point anyway - my point is, what WILL the features it WILL have look like?



What if I click a drop-down menu on a web page? How will that work? How will we scroll that? How easy is it going to be to fill out a form? That's what I was asking.

Well, how did Steve type in his search for the Starbucks in Google Maps?... or was it already marked?

nevenmrgan

Quote:

Originally Posted by JupiterOne


So to answer your question, I would expect to fill out a form on the iPhone Safari just as you fill out a form on the Mac Safari. Zooming in, if you have to.

You mean I'll type on my Apple keyboard? Jeez, why is it so hard to understand what I'm saying. I'm guessing the half-screen keyboard will pop up when you click on a form field, but we haven't seen this, and it raises a number of questions.

nevenmrgan

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpamSandwich


Well, how did Steve type in his search for the Starbucks in Google Maps?... or was it already marked?

Google Maps has its own search bar at the top. We've seen Steve type in that for the address and search, but we haven't seen him, for instance, type in his zip code at Fandango.com.

jupiterone

Quote:

Originally Posted by nevenmrgan


You mean I'll type on my Apple keyboard? Jeez, why is it so hard to understand what I'm saying. I'm guessing the half-screen keyboard will pop up when you click on a form field, but we haven't seen this, and it raises a number of questions.

I understand what you're saying, but it looks like you just answered your own question. Yes, I would imagine that if you "touched" inside a text form, a keyboard will pop up. If you "touch" a drop down box, it will drop down. And so on..... do you understand what I mean?



There will be some changes for the fact that you have no real keyboard or mouse, but otherwise it will be like Safari on the desktop.

nevenmrgan

Quote:

Originally Posted by JupiterOne


There will be some changes for the fact that you have no real keyboard or mouse, but otherwise it will be like Safari on the desktop.

Well that's exactly what I said, and that's exactly what I thought I'd make this thread about - how do you think they'll implement the features that we haven't yet seen, and will obviously be included? But you keep arguing about whether it's "really" Safari or it's not. That's beside the point.



Some more things to think about:



How easy is it going to be to highlight text? Is there any sort of clipboard on iPhone? How would you mail a link to a page?



Think about the things you do in your browser on a daily basis and try to guess which ones will be possible and how in iPhone. That is all!

spindrift

Nevenmrgan, you seem to ask questions that we can't actually answer, only guess at, but then you assume Safari will be a 'lite' version, when we know it is a full desktop class web browser - Safari!

nevenmrgan

Ok, forget it. God forbid someone should ask for speculation on this forum. And yeah, it's going to be "full" Safari, complete with Java, Flash, embedded video, and RSS. And it's not at all interesting how they'll implement features we take for granted on full-size computers.

mr. me

Quote:

Originally Posted by nevenmrgan


Ok, forget it. God forbid someone should ask for speculation on this forum. ...

By their very nature, any answer you get to your question is speculation. The problem, it seems, is that you are upset at the speculative answers which disagree with your preconceived notions.

hobbes

Interesting questions. My guess is that for the most part it'll work like Safari, just require more user input to zoom in to make sure things like pull-down menus and the like are readable -- and of course more scrolling.



It seems extremely likely you'll be able to pull up the keyboard at any time as well to fill out form fields and the like as well.



You can be sure Quicktime and Javascript will be there. Apple has said Java will not. Flash I believe it still undecided. Probably not at launch, though maybe it'll be folded in later.



One thing I can guarantee: the worst thing, hands down, about browsing the web using a 1G iPhone will be EDGE. It's no coincidence Apple has demo'd browsing on the iPhone using WiFi only (and even that didn't look all that speedy).

Quote:

How easy is it going to be to highlight text? Is there any sort of clipboard on iPhone? How would you mail a link to a page?

Also good questions. There's just no way Apple is going to nail everything on the first rev, so it's reassuring to know they intend to update the software on regular basis for free, just like OS X point upgrades (though hopefully with more features).

the beatles

peace

project2501

As I understand it, full browser is just an marketing term for a browser that can read xhtml pages, not only WAP or XHTML MP, pages. Browsing experience is propably going to be quite close what it is with other new mobile phones. E.g. Nokia Nxx series. Not having keyboard is presenting some limitations, but naturally they can be be circumvented with virtual keyboard. It's kind of stupid to assume that iPhone will have only a slightly modified version of desktop Safari, because even if memory and prosessing power were no problems, the pure physical limitations will make the browsing experience quite different. New nokia phones, render WEB pages guite nicely, using webkit, but no way does the experience equal desktop browsing.

nevenmrgan

So let's try rescuing this thread...



What will we see when we click "Browse" to upload a file on iPhone? I can think of a few possibilities:



1. Nothing - no browsing for files (unlikely)

2. The Home folder, complete with Pictures, Documents, Movies, etc. (unlikely)

3. A "Media Browser", like in iLife/iWork apps, showing the pictures, notes, and other files.

4. Something completely unexpected



I guess the question could be phrased as, what does iPhone's Finder look like?

saiko

Wow.. If you really think about it, there are a million unanswered questions relating to the iPhone in many ways and forms. Lots of good questions in this thread, I've never really thought this in depth about it. There seems to be a lot of people gung-ho about purchasing an iPhone ASAP and plunking town a heck of a lot of money not only for the device, but for the plan as well. I'd be lying to say that I'm not, but usually when I make purchases this big, I like to know the product inside and out, maybe even test it a little bit.



I guess that little rant brings me to my question, how many of you who have decided to purchase an iPhone will wait to demo a unit, read more about how things are done (how a clipboard works; ctrl+v? uploading files, filling out forms, etc etc...), read reviews and see how people really deal with it in the real world, or just pop into an Apple / AT&T store on launch day and no questions asked, fork over your credit card? Is what you've heard from in the January Keynote and on Apple's website enough for you to purchase right away?

nevenmrgan

My thinking is that Apple has thought of everything I've thought of (and more) and if we disagree, it will be on minor features. Or at least I hope so. We'll see - my hope is enough to make me buy one on the first day it's available.

hobbes

Quote:

Originally Posted by nevenmrgan


So let's try rescuing this thread...

I guess the question could be phrased as, what does iPhone's Finder look like?

I think the answer to this will be pretty simple. There is no Finder. You access your data via iPhone's apps -- that's it.



It's not a little Mac, after all. (Or not yet. ) It's a very savvy iPod / phone.



I will be very interested to see just how Apple implements text selection and cutting and pasting (assuming it can be done at all) without traditional menus or keyboard commands.... and via multi-touch. It'll be fascinating to see how they do it.