Apple picks at Psystar counterclaim as court info goes secret

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2014
Apple has responded to Psystar's latest copyright abuse claims against it by pointing out technicalities; simultaneously, both have successfully won approval for a protection order that keeps some of their discoveries out of each other's view.



The latest shot in the conflict between the Cupertino-based Mac maker and its unsanctioned, clone-building nuisance was exchanged on Wednesday when Apple submitted its response to Psystar's amended complaint, which accused Apple of abusing its end-user license agreement and the Digital Millennium Copyright Act by forbidding third-party hardware from running Mac OS X.



Submitted through a Northern District of California court in San Francisco, the 13-page response unsurprisingly denies Psystar's accusations point-for-point but takes issue with Psystar's requests that the court find Apple's claimed copyrights untenable until it no longer interprets the license or the DMCA as valid.



Simply stated, Apple claims that the Mac clone builder hasn't asked for declaratory relief, or its own rights, in the newest form of the complaint. The move doesn't necessarily force a further amendment by Psystar, but does leave room for Apple to voice its opinion further on into the case.



Regardless of any possible modifications to the case, the discovery phase that follows next is now closer to reality.



A day before the Apple response, Northern District Judge William Alsup approved the protective order requested by both sides. The decision prevents anyone but the attorneys and others necessarily involved in any court proceedings from viewing information marked as confidential.



While most of the case will remain public, the order will prevent either company from obtaining trade secrets, such as source code for Mac OS X, in the course of collecting evidence before they go to trial -- though both will have to prove that the information is important enough to be worth protecting, the judge said.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 172
    macmadmacmad Posts: 62member
    I really don't understand how Psystar can even have a case.



    If I purchased a Sony PS3 game and then got home and found it didn't play on a Nintendo Wii, how could I take Sony to court for this?



    Apple's software/OS etc, clearly states on the box the system requirements... a Mac machine.



    What am I missing here?
  • Reply 2 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacMad View Post


    I really don't understand how Psystar can even have a case.



    If I purchased a Sony PS3 game and then got home and found it didn't play on a Nintendo Wii, how could I take Sony to court for this?



    Apple's software/OS etc, clearly states on the box the system requirements... a Mac machine.



    What am I missing here?





    I agree with you 100%
  • Reply 3 of 172
    Why is Apple letting this happen?



    I by macs for a reason ( not because its shiny [for all you win fanboys who think that is the reason])



    I use macs because they use their own software and hardware.



    for Psystar to keep operating as a company that sells third party mac machines is crazy.



    I understand that Apple wants to gain growth in the computer market but, this is not how you do it.



    What Psystar is doing is illegal!!!



    they are ignoring Apple's copyright and user agreements.
  • Reply 4 of 172
    macmadmacmad Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jenkman91 View Post


    I agree with you 100%



    Then there are at least two of us who are really confused!



    I know the legal system in the U.S. is a funny thing, but, well, I just really don't get it.
  • Reply 5 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacMad View Post


    Then there are at least two of us who are really confused!



    I know the legal system in the U.S. is a funny thing, but, well, I just really don't get it.



    HAHA



    I don't understand why Apple is letting Psystar getting away with this.



    Like I said in my comment: Pystar is going against the copyright and user agreements that Apple set in stone.



    I don't have a problem if somebody does a homebrew mod on a machine and is able to put OS X on it for fun.



    But to go and start out a company to sell OS X is f*** up. It just boggles my mind at how they are getting away with this.



    If I was in the Apple legal dept. I would be raising hell, and doing everything I can to shutdown this company
  • Reply 6 of 172
    macmadmacmad Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jenkman91 View Post


    I don't have a problem if somebody does a homebrew mod on a machine and is able to put OS X on it for fun.



    Personally, I have a problem with this too. I think if you want Apple's OS, you should buy the Mac that was designed to run it. But for sure, the idea that a company does this and then sells it to make a profit is... well... plain illegal.



    Though the fact that a court is even hearing the case makes me worried for Apple.
  • Reply 7 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacMad View Post


    Personally, I have a problem with this too. I think if you want Apple's OS, you should buy the Mac that was designed to run it. But for sure, the idea that a company does this and then sells it to make a profit is... well... plain illegal.



    Though the fact that a court is even hearing the case makes me worried for Apple.





    True... But what if one purchases OS X legally, then it should be okay.



    oops, I think I just said what Psystar said in their claim



    I still think apple should put a bullet into Pystar's head.



    Thats like Microsoft buying Apple machines then selling it with VISTA on it. :X



    (blah blah blah) I know Microcrap is a software comapny.....(its a metaphor) (for all you win fanboys trying to find something wrong in my commnet)



    your welcome
  • Reply 8 of 172
    aaarrrggghaaarrrgggh Posts: 1,578member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jenkman91 View Post


    Why is Apple letting this happen?

    What Psystar is doing is illegal!!!



    NO



    Psystar is violating Apple's licensing terms which is a civil matter. Psystar is claiming either that Apple's licensing terms are not binding, or that their claim of copyright protection under DMCA is not applicable... can't quite tell which.



    I prefer Apple hardware, and I am well aware of the fact that Apple's strengths are in no small part due to the fact that they only consider about 30 models to be supported by their OS.



    I also prefer to only pay $100 for "point upgrades" rather than them costing $500.



    But, long-term, I don't think it is best for Apple or the industry to block the hackintosh or virtualization. There are too many benefits. I also hate the idea that a EULA can be binding if it is more than one paragraph of plain english.
  • Reply 9 of 172
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post


    But, long-term, I don't think it is best for Apple or the industry to block the hackintosh or virtualization. There are too many benefits. I also hate the idea that a EULA can be binding if it is more than one paragraph of plain english.



    Apple has yet to go after the Hackintosh community. They have only gone after a company that selling Mac clones without their consent. I think we'll find when all is said and done that a company can't act as a reseller of wares if the copyright holder doesn't wish them too. Reselling the physcial media is not the problem, reselling the installed media which is being transfer (read: copied) from the disc to the HDD and then selling it is the issue. This never had anything to do with the end user.
  • Reply 10 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post


    NO





    I also prefer to only pay $100 for "point upgrades" rather than them costing $500.






    What do you mean by "point upgrades"?



    You can buy a mac machine and upgrade it yourself for a cheaper price than what Apple charges.



    Yes, Apple makes it hard to access some parts of their machines, but they don't totally stop you from actually putting more RAM in your machine.



    It would have cost me $200 for a RAM upgrade from Apple. I bought the Mac without the optional upgrade. Went to NEWEGG.com and bought the RAM for more than half of what Apple was charging.
  • Reply 11 of 172
    walneywalney Posts: 70member
    .....
  • Reply 12 of 172
    chris_cachris_ca Posts: 2,543member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jenkman91 View Post


    Why is Apple letting this happen?



    Hello? Did you read this article (or the dozens of other related articles)?

    Why do you think Apple is "letting this happen?"

    You do realize this is a court case in which Apple is not simply "letting it happen?"
  • Reply 13 of 172
    chris_cachris_ca Posts: 2,543member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jenkman91 View Post


    What do you mean by "point upgrades"?



    10 point 3

    10 point 4

    10 point 5
  • Reply 14 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post


    10 point 3

    10 point 4

    10 point 5



    good point. I did not understand what I was reading at that point in time. He should have said the different versions of OS X. less confusing
  • Reply 15 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post


    Hello? Did you read this article (or the dozens of other related articles)?

    Why do you think Apple is "letting this happen?"

    You do realize this is a court case in which Apple is not simply "letting it happen?"



    If Apple was really trying, Psystar would only be a faint memory now.
  • Reply 16 of 172
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Walney View Post


    ...unless it's a Mini, where they are a bit sniffy about you doing the upgrade yourself



    But, its still possible. I have done memory upgrades numerous times on my mac minis. Yes, its difficult, but not impossible. All you need is patience, and the right tool
  • Reply 17 of 172
    hillstoneshillstones Posts: 1,490member
    What confidential info would Psystar even have? How to build a piece of crap computer?



    The fine print on their website is interesting. When you buy one of their Mac clones, they give you a retail copy of Leopard. However, that disc is USELESS because it will not install on the Mac clone they sold you. They preinstall (or hack) OS X to get it installed. If you need to recover your system, you have to contact them and submit a form requesting their "special" software disc that will allow you to re-install Mac OS X. Also, they state that Boot Camp doesn't work because that only works with Apple-specific hardware. So it is clear based on their fine print that their computers are not truely compatible with OS X.
  • Reply 18 of 172
    go Pystar.... here's hoping.!
  • Reply 19 of 172
    elrothelroth Posts: 1,201member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post


    NOI also prefer to only pay $100 for "point upgrades" rather than them costing $500



    Are you crazy or a troll? Vista costs $500, each Mac OS upgrade is $129.



    The only reason they number them 10.1, 10,2, etc. is to keep the number 10 in the name. They could easily have named them 10, 11, 12, etc. They are not equivalent to other software makers' point upgrades.
  • Reply 20 of 172
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 4,622member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Archipellago View Post


    go Pystar.... here's hoping.!



    Hey everyone! The troll has returned!
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