Font Management OS X
The Apple site <a href="http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/font.html" target="_blank">lists a font panel</a> that manages fonts in OS X. I've been using OS X for a while, and I've only just started actually trying to get some work done. A friend pointed out that Suitcase no longer has menufonts, which grouped fonts together by family names. This "font panel" seems to be Apple's utility for such a feature, but I can't find it to save my life right now. A search in Help Viewer provides no clue.
Could anyone help me along here while I continue to search for this?
Thanks in advance.
:cool:
Could anyone help me along here while I continue to search for this?
Thanks in advance.
:cool:
Comments
The font panel is only available to Cocoa apps, and is accessed through the font menu, not as a seperate utility as it is inferred.
D'OH!
<img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" />
<strong>The Apple site <a href="http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/font.html" target="_blank">lists a font panel</a> that manages fonts in OS X. I've been using OS X for a while, and I've only just started actually trying to get some work done. A friend pointed out that Suitcase no longer has menufonts, which grouped fonts together by family names. This "font panel" seems to be Apple's utility for such a feature, but I can't find it to save my life right now. A search in Help Viewer provides no clue.
Could anyone help me along here while I continue to search for this?
Thanks in advance.
:cool: </strong><hr></blockquote>
In short: the Font Panel is only accessible from Cocoa applications.
e.g. TextEdit, Stickies, TIFFany, OmniGraffle, etc.
For all these apps, command-T will open it up. You can resize and it will expand smartly to show more information and categories; you can show a preview of the font, and choose a slider or menu for font size. It's very nice.
Alas, practically all design applications are Carbon, and can't yet use the nifty Apple Font Panel. As the two APIs merge, this will hopefully change in the future.
And it's now the application's responsibilty to group and organize fonts -- there's currently no Adobe Type Reunion or MenuFonts to do this globally. Adobe's apps do a pretty good job of this. Some others don't.
edit: You beat me to it.
[ 12-02-2002: Message edited by: Hobbes ]</p>
I'd like to point out that the Apple Font Window SUX BALLS. I can't believe they would release such a buggy POS. You can remove directories without warning. Sometimes the fonts don't dislplay.
I expect this sort of nonsense from Windows, but as we can see OS X does indeed bring us closer to the XP experience.
Apple should clearly just leave it up to the developers who know what they're doing. Apple certainly revolutionized the publishing industry, now they're killing it softly with kisses.
I'm not a happy clam.
<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
<a href="http://www.apple.com/macosx/feedback/" target="_blank">http://www.apple.com/macosx/feedback/</a>
There's still time to spiff it up before Carbon apps get access to it. And Apple is listening.
<strong>I'd like to point out that the Apple Font Window SUX BALLS. I can't believe they would release such a buggy POS. You can remove directories without warning. Sometimes the fonts don't dislplay.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I've encountered one exasperating bug -- symbol fonts don't properly work in Cocoa applications. You have to use the Character Palette.
I think this is due to some complicated problem with Cocoa and Unicode (not sure what it is exactly). But it hasn't been fixed yet, and it's getting embarassing.
Fix it, Apple! <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
But otherwise, I find the Font panel a vast improvement -- in just about every single way -- to type management and design. It's compact, yet expandable, and utterly customizable. And it's built into every Cocoa app, which brings a new level of sophistication even to the simplest text editor. I've been very impressed.
What problems have you had "removing directories without warning"? Don't quite understand that. The Font panel dynamically loads fonts turned on and off in Suitcase with no problems.
<strong>What problems have you had "removing directories without warning"? Don't quite understand that. The Font panel dynamically loads fonts turned on and off in Suitcase with no problems.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Sorry, in haste sometimes I don't make myself completely clear... go to any app that supports the font panel and open it. Select edit collections from the extras pulldown menu. Select a collection. Hit the [-] button. See your collection vanish without confirmation. Oops. You've hit the wrong button. The hour you've just spent adding fonts to that collection is gone.
Like I said, I expect that type of behavior from Windows, not Mac. But even XP does a good job of confirming the "button push" these days, so Apple really needs a kick on this one. It's not like they haven't had a million years to bring us OS X. Perhaps I exaggerate.
Font management is one of the biggest concerns of any designer/design studio. How can Apple afford to let us down?
I think the major issue may be how to incorporate something like menufonts, which was (is) a very popular utility. Adobe isn't about to change it's widgets to accomodate Apple's new font management system--so what's the point?
<img src="confused.gif" border="0">
[ 12-02-2002: Message edited by: MacLuv ]</p>
<strong>And Apple is listening.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, but to whom?
Considering Apple's board of directors has just been rated among the 8 worst in America by BusinessWeek, could they be listening to <a href="http://www.rmhcchicago.org/img/ronald.gif" target="_blank">this man?</a>
<img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" />
[ 12-02-2002: Message edited by: MacLuv ]
[ 12-02-2002: Message edited by: MacLuv ]</p>
<strong>Sorry, in haste sometimes I don't make myself completely clear... go to any app that supports the font panel and open it. Select edit collections from the extras pulldown menu. Select a collection. Hit the [-] button. See your collection vanish without confirmation. Oops. You've hit the wrong button. The hour you've just spent adding fonts to that collection is gone.
Like I said, I expect that type of behavior from Windows, not Mac. But even XP does a good job of confirming the "button push" these days, so Apple really needs a kick on this one. It's not like they haven't had a million years to bring us OS X. Perhaps I exaggerate.
Font management is one of the biggest concerns of any designer/design studio. How can Apple afford to let us down?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Huh -- didn't notice that. Pretty sloppy. Feedback 'em.
That said, I don't think it's fair to say OS X falls down on font management due to a few rough edges.
OS X is more complicated to manage fonts than OS 9 due to its multiuser nature, Classic, and two evolving APIs (a compromise that developers demanded) -- no argument there. But it comes with much more out of the box than OS 9 (which has no font management capabilities whatsoever until you add third-party utilities) and it works fine.
Could be better? Sure -- much.
[quote]<strong>I think the major issue may be how to incorporate something like menufonts, which was (is) a very popular utility. Adobe isn't about to change it's widgets to accomodate Apple's new font management system--so what's the point?</strong><hr></blockquote>
I always used ATM Deluxe & Type Reunion, so I'm not as familiar w/ menufonts. I do miss type grouping across the OS, but not as much as one might think, since movinh to InDesign. Adobe apps handle type great in X.
Working with Quark in Classic full-time is definitely not an acceptable solution at this point.
<strong>
Yes, but to whom?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
To people who send them feedback, obviously.
I doubt that the state of their board of directors has anything to do with the state of font management in OS X.
<strong>
To people who send them feedback, obviously.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Of course, forgive me. I normally get paid for Beta-testing, but in this case, since I just shelled out NZ $3K+, I'll do Apple a favor and send them feedback... I mean after all, Apple will listen to our feedback regarding fonts perhaps, but ask them to put a faster CPU in the machine and hell, what are we thinking? [/rant]
But let's no go into tangents about the board of directors, the G4 processor speeds and such when it's not really relevant to the topic at hand.
<strong>Let's not turn some oddities in the little Font Panel into a free-for-all. It has some nice little touches, and some poor stuff too. Like the color panel, it isn't as drag-n-drop friendly as I'd like it to be, and organizing it is a little cumbersome (not hard, just combersome). The font preview is nice (it needs a "grab handle" under the title bar though to let people know it's there), the combo slider and size presets is handy, plus the way it minimizes itself when you resize it is a nice perk.
But let's no go into tangents about the board of directors, the G4 processor speeds and such when it's not really relevant to the topic at hand.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well said.
Speaking of fonts. I just noticed that the latest beta of the excellent <a href="http://www.tex-edit.com/" target="_blank">Tex-Edit</a> -- which keeps getting better and better with each OS X release -- now uses the Font panel. (This requires 10.2.) It's the first Carbon app that I've seen to do so.
Nice to see.
And I always wanted a preview! I'll bet that was there all along and I just never noticed it. (Though when you move it by hand, the lines don't move properly.)
I was so hoping they'd come around (being as how EVERYTHING ELSE they make is doing really well in OS X). But nooooooo.
I now use Extensis Suitcase and I guess it's okay. Just different, where ATM just seemed some easy and solid. I get goofy messages and things in Suitcase.
Short of Adobe, then I simply wish Apple would tackle the problem. Perhaps with a new iApp, dedicated to Mac OS X font management?
iType or iFont or whatever. Cool-looking thing that works as well (and trasparently) as ATM Deluxe. Ship it free on all Macs (like the other iApps). I mean, they're getting almost halfway there with that font panel thing. Just make it where you can group sets, turn things on and off on the fly, gather fonts for output, etc.
I can easily see an updated Font panel tackling all of these issues with an improved UI and some new stuff under the Extras menu for "pro" use. Just adding some functionality to the font groups you make in the font panel, plus some more drag-n-drop functionality to its various elements would make most of the difference.
[ 12-03-2002: Message edited by: BuonRotto ]</p>
System-level/integrated-with-the-OS font management would be pretty snazzy. You're right: Apple could do it where it's meant to work seamlessly with the system and apps.
Basically, bastardize (and improve) upon ATM Deluxe and just make it part of the whole OS X experience. For those who don't need it, fine...you don't use it (just like now). But perhaps there could be a standalone app or a System Preference that activates/kicks in the "pro" mode, where you can group, subgroup, activate, deactivate, collect for output, etc.
<img src="confused.gif" border="0">
<a href="http://www.apple.com/macosx/feedback" target="_blank">Send feedback!</a> Ask not what Apple can do for you. Ask what you can... oh, forget it.
<strong>So what happens to Extensis?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
They've got other products. And maybe Suitcase will still have a place? People may actually prefer it over any OS X-implemented solution.
You never know. In any case, Suitcase isn't Extensis' only product. They'll live.