Apple says Psystar holding back info in Mac clone legal case

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  • Reply 81 of 157
    piotpiot Posts: 1,346member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    That is why Psystar needs to win, so that consumers actually have the rights to things that they paid for.



    Psystar is NOT A CONSUMER.

    Is Apple going after consumers?



    Quote:

    the bigger picture is consumers actually owning things they paid for, instead of corporations playing this ridiculous "it's just a license" game



    Fine. I'm just about to release a film based on that book that you wrote. You won't mind will you, 'cos I own the book?



    You wouldn't recognize a "bigger picture" if it fell on your head.
  • Reply 82 of 157
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member
    I am in no way in favor of Psystar - I think they're a bunch of crooks selling knockoffs. However I don't understand why they have to give all their intimate financial details out. How is that relevant to the question of copyright over-extension?
  • Reply 83 of 157
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ascii View Post


    I am in no way in favor of Psystar - I think they're a bunch of crooks selling knockoffs. However I don't understand why they have to give all their intimate financial details out. How is that relevant to the question of copyright over-extension?



    I wondered that, too. Perhaps the John Doe's in the lawsuit are suspected as being financial backers of Psystar, which would make them culpable or perhaps Apple wants to know how much many they have made off Apple's IP.
  • Reply 84 of 157
    bsenkabsenka Posts: 799member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by piot View Post


    Fine. I'm just about to release a film based on that book that you wrote. You won't mind will you, 'cos I own the book?





    That's not what's happening. This constant need for people to lie about what Psystar is doing does nothing to help your case.



    Psystar is buying a legal retail product, then buying a bunch more retail products and selling them together. Psystar's challenge here is the validity of the EULA claiming to restrict resale, it's not a counterfeiting case.



    The closest thing to a book analogy would be if they bought the book, and then also bought some some other books, and also bought a nice little slip case for them, put the books in that case and resold the whole lot.



    Even in your book/movie analogy, to even come close to what Psystar is doing you'd have to buy and resell a retail copy of my book for every ticket or DVD you distribute. I'll more more money from that venture than you will.
  • Reply 85 of 157
    dr millmossdr millmoss Posts: 5,403member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    Apple can develop and market any product they want. What they should not be able to do, is tell people what they can do with those Apple products after purchase. You want to jailbreak your iPhone? That is none of Apple's business. You buy OS X, but want to try to install it on a Super Nintendo? Dumb thing to try, but still your own right as a consumer who paid for the product to do so. None of Apple's business. That is why Psystar needs to win, so that consumers actually have the rights to things that they paid for. It's the Apple vs the clones argument that is short-sighted, the bigger picture is consumers actually owning things they paid for, instead of corporations playing this ridiculous "it's just a license" game.



    The analogy to consumer rights is not meaningful. Apple has never gone after anyone for building a hackintosh for their own use, or for jailbreaking their iPhone. Pystar is a business, not a consumer. Psystar is reselling OSX, and effectively selling Macintosh computers. They are trading on Apple's copyrights and trademarks, which they have no right to do. This is a huge difference.



    EDIT: Should have read the trailing posts before writing this -- I can see this point has been made.
  • Reply 86 of 157
    Quote:

    OSX 10.5 w/ iLife & iWork

    2.83GHz C2Q Q9550

    8GB DDR2-800

    1TB HDD

    20x DVD burner

    9800GT 512mb

    802.11n

    Keyboard/Mouse

    Three year warranty on parts and support

    Add in a $300 monitor from newegg and the final price is 2032.98.



    Comparatively from Apple:

    2.66 Quad Xeon

    3GB 1066DDR3

    1TB HDD (same as above, 7200 rpm SATA)

    nvidia Gt 120 512mb

    keyboard/mouse

    802.11n

    iWork 09

    No monitor mind you, all for 2698.00



    The 2.66 Nehalem Xeon is way faster than the Q9550.



    Anyway, you can build a PC way cheaper than the Psystar and just Hackintosh it.



    Psystar and EFI-X are so lame
  • Reply 87 of 157
    piotpiot Posts: 1,346member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    That's not what's happening. This constant need for people to lie about what Psystar is doing does nothing to help your case.



    It's not MY case, it's Apple's case. No-one is trying to lie to you. You just seem to be fooling yourself.



    As a CONSUMER do you have the right to buy one copy of Msoft's Vista Ultimate Edition... and install it on 20 computers? Do you have the right to pretend to be a student and buy the Ed version of Office and then use it for your professional work? Companies can control who they sell certain products to... and how certain products can be used. There are always ways around these restrictions but the company then has the right to ask a court to stop you. " You think licensing your products is just a "game"? Tell that to the judge.





    Quote:

    Even in your book/movie analogy, to even come close to what Psystar is doing you'd have to buy and resell a retail copy of my book for every ticket or DVD you distribute. I'll more more money from that venture than you will.



    You really don't get it do you? I thought If I said it was "your" book that you might see what was unjust about the situation. Sure... you want me to give copies of your book with my movie... no problem. Unfortunately your book didn't do so well. I can pick them up real cheap. But guess what? My movie is going great guns. It's turned into a mega global hit. I'm already shooting the sequel.



    So you sold a few more cheap books. Big deal. Hollywood ain't gonna knock on your door. I bought YOUR book. I used YOUR intellectual property to create a product that people actually wanted and I now have more money than God. You think that's fair because I paid for your measly book?



    Did I mention that I now also get to sleep with Scarlett Johansson?
  • Reply 88 of 157
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by piot View Post


    Did I mention that I now also get to sleep with Scarlett Johansson?



    Her husband may have a problem with that.
  • Reply 89 of 157
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Hey its Hollywood her husband may may want to join in.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Her husband may have a problem with that.



  • Reply 90 of 157
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post


    Hey its Hollywood her husband may may want to join in.



    To each their own. You can have Van Wilder, but I'll take Scarlett and for the 3rd party let's go with Jessica Alba.
  • Reply 91 of 157
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Not that I want to participate in any of it, I'm just pointing out that in Hollywood the moral compass swings in a very different direction from what's considered the social norm.



    I would guess at this point Ryan Reynolds does not want to share Johansson. Give it a couple of years and the story will likely be different.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    To each their own. You can have Van Wilder, but I'll take Scarlett and for the 3rd party let's go with Jessica Alba.



  • Reply 92 of 157
    piotpiot Posts: 1,346member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    To each their own. You can have Van Wilder, but I'll take Scarlett and for the 3rd party let's go with Jessica Alba.



    Actually Jess was a wee bit clingy but we are still good friends.





  • Reply 93 of 157
    tenobelltenobell Posts: 7,014member
    Not the worst problem to have, .



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by piot View Post


    Actually Jess was a wee bit clingy but we are still good friends.



  • Reply 94 of 157
    bsenkabsenka Posts: 799member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by piot View Post


    It's not MY case, it's Apple's case. No-one is trying to lie to you. You just seem to be fooling yourself.



    You think licensing your products is just a "game"? Tell that to the judge.



    Licensing is more than just a game, it's bullshit. I bought it, I own it, it is mine. You cannot tell me what I can do with it after I've paid you for it.



    Flour is made from wheat that is grown from patented genetically modified grains. I can still make anything I want from that flour, and Monsanto can't say shit.



    People ARE telling it to the judges. Psystar is right now, and so are EFF regarding iPhone jailbreaking.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by piot View Post


    You really don't get it do you? I thought If I said it was "your" book that you might see what was unjust about the situation. Sure... you want me to give copies of your book with my movie... no problem. Unfortunately your book didn't do so well. I can pick them up real cheap. But guess what? My movie is going great guns. It's turned into a mega global hit. I'm already shooting the sequel.



    So you sold a few more cheap books. Big deal. Hollywood ain't gonna knock on your door. I bought YOUR book. I used YOUR intellectual property to create a product that people actually wanted and I now have more money than God. You think that's fair because I paid for your measly book?





    If the movie is hot, the book is hot too, it always is. That means I'll not only sell one with every ticket you sell, but I'll sell even more of them from other sources, and collect a hefty advance for further books. Not only that, but since I wrote the book for the hit movie, other movie studios are now backing up truckloads of money to get me to write their movies. No matter how you slice it, I make more than you do under your scenario.
  • Reply 95 of 157
    jimdreamworxjimdreamworx Posts: 1,063member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bloggerblog View Post


    ...BTW: Mr.Pedraza reminds me of Mr.Gates during his appearance in court and Mr.Gonzales, both of these guys couldn't seem to remember or understand a thing, so they claimed. The tactic seemed to have served them very well.



    This is a big surprise? It is the sign of a person who requires help, due to problems they are having with their mental faculties. One merely has to look at what their ruling over a company has produced. It's not a very good thing and can be considered criminal.



    Just look at the dysfunctional companies these guys run, and that should prove these gentlemen need help. And so do the people under them who did not see the problem and stop them. Feel sorry for them.
  • Reply 96 of 157
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    Licensing is more than just a game, it's bullshit. I bought it, I own it, it is mine. You cannot tell me what I can do with it after I've paid you for it.



    Flour is made from wheat that is grown from patented genetically modified grains. I can still make anything I want from that flour, and Monsanto can't say shit.



    People ARE telling it to the judges. Psystar is right now, and so are EFF regarding iPhone jailbreaking.



    You idea of capitalism, ownership and IP rights are so warped. Despite the numerous times people in the know have attempted to school you on such basic things you still think that a company has the right to do what Psystar is doing. I bet you agree with agree with China's illegal cloning operations, too.
  • Reply 97 of 157
    piotpiot Posts: 1,346member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    If the movie is hot, the book is hot too, it always is. That means I'll not only sell one with every ticket you sell, but I'll sell even more of them from other sources, and collect a hefty advance for further books. Not only that, but since I wrote the book for the hit movie, other movie studios are now backing up truckloads of money to get me to write their movies. No matter how you slice it, I make more than you do under your scenario.



    You mate are in denial!

    DO YOU STILL NOT GET IT?



    In my fantasy movie scenario..... I TOOK YOUR STUFF!



    I took your characters and your badly written plot and your rubbish dialogue and made a blockbuster movie out of them. You could have made millions out of the film rights but it's too late. I've made the film! Yes indeed publishers are salivating over the next book. Unfortunately, for you, they prefer my script to your book so I will be writing it.



    It's all OK though, cos I read on an internet forum that "I bought it, I own it, it is mine".





    Did I mention that I am now seeing Keira Knightley?
  • Reply 98 of 157
    bsenkabsenka Posts: 799member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by piot View Post




    In my fantasy movie scenario..... I TOOK YOUR STUFF!



    You didn't take anything, you bought it.



    Psystar has not taken anything, They BOUGHT copies of OS X, then resold them along with a box of computer parts. They are not re-engineering any proprietary Apple hardware, or counterfeiting anything, they are simply reselling off the shelf products.



    Again, you still seem to think that reselling something you bought is the same thing as counterfeiting.
  • Reply 99 of 157
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    Psystar has not taken anything, They BOUGHT copies of OS X, then resold them along with a box of computer parts. They are not re-engineering any proprietary Apple hardware, or counterfeiting anything, they are simply reselling off the shelf products.



    How many copies of Mac OS X does the Psystar customer get when he receives his illegal Mac clone?



    If you say one, then you are not thinking, per your MO. If you say two, then you are correct, but how do you explain the transference from the DVD to the harddrive if Psystar is not doing anything illegal. I can't legally make copies of Office or Photoshop or DVD movies and distribute them at will for a fee so why do you think Psystar should be able to break this law and get away with it? Apple owns the rights to the contents of that DVD just like MGM owns the rights to the contents of their movies. I can't start a business where I stick movies onto another DVD or a bunch of movies on harddrives and then sell them so why do you think Psystar should be allowed to break this law?
  • Reply 100 of 157
    piotpiot Posts: 1,346member
    Why are you being such a bonehead?



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bsenka View Post


    You didn't take anything, you bought it.



    Did you sell me the movie rights to your book?

    Or did I just take them?

    Did you sell me the rights to make and sell little plastic characters from your book?

    Or did I just take them?



    Quote:

    Again, you still seem to think that reselling something you bought is the same thing as counterfeiting.



    You don't appear to even try and understand what people here are trying to tell you?
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