PowerBook 12" Dual Display Performance (in Japanese)

pais · January 28, 2003 4:20AM

I'm one of the many waiting to receive my BTO 12" PowerBook G4. (I've had many Macs since my 512K in '84, but none newer than the 6400/200; only Linux and Windows boxen. It's been quite a wait!)

Naturally, I'm very excited about my purchase, and voraciously looking at nearly every scrap of information I can find about it! From what I can tell, I'm not the only one.

Today, I came across <a href="http://www.zdnet.co.jp/macwire/0301/27/rj00_12inchpb4.html"; target="_blank">this article</a> from ZDNet Japan. I can't read Japanese, but I infer that the author is testing the performance of the little PowerBook under various display configurations.

This is of particular interest to me, since I plan on using my PowerBook with a CRT.

Has anyone else seen this article? Can anyone read Japanese well enough to determine what the tests are, and the results? (I hate to raise alarm for no reason, but the <a href="http://www.zdnet.co.jp/macwire/0301/27/xbench1l.gif"; target="_blank">xbench results</a> make me a little uncomfortable -- to be fair, I haven't a clue what it really means.)

Any light you can shed would be greatly appreciated.

pais · January 28, 2003 4:32AM

After filtering through Babelfish's comically <a href="http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/tr?doit=done&urltext=http://www.zdnet.co.jp% 2Fmacwire%2F0301%2F27%2Frj00_12inchpb4.html&lp=ja_ en" target="_blank">mangled output</a>, I gathered a little more data. Again, it would be helpful if someone could confirm this -- I'm just shooting from the hip.

It appears that when the PowerBook is set to sleep and connected to a single CRT only, the performance drops about 50%. The author reports that the fan immediately turns on, and the system is significantly slower.

This doesn't appear to happen, however, in any dual-display mode (what I prefer to run).

My theory is that the closed lid and hinge blocks airflow -- especially to the grille and fan in the back -- so the computer throttles the CPU down (as I've read you manually accomplish).

Well, as long as I can use two displays, I'll be a happy camper.

icruise · January 28, 2003 5:36AM

Yes, according to him the fans go on high and system slows down when you try to use the powerbook with the lid closed and connected to an external monitor. I'm not entirely sure why that would be (and he doesn't really say either beyond the heat issue) but perhaps it is a problem with the video drivers. I don't think this is a big deal, really, since the vast majority of people will be wanting to use monitor spanning over two screens, and that seems fine.

pais · January 28, 2003 11:32AM

Thanks a lot! I still think it would be a heat issue -- can't imagine why a single display (CRT or not) would be that much slower than driving two displays.

At any rate, it's too bad we can't drive the new 20". That's a sweet price.

defiant · January 28, 2003 2:08PM

you can. If you buy all those converters to get from D-Sub 15 to DVI and then to ADC.

escher · January 28, 2003 3:42PM

[quote]Originally posted by Defiant:

you can. If you buy all those converters to get from D-Sub 15 to DVI and then to ADC.

<hr></blockquote>

Actually, a single <a href="http://www.gefen.com/kvm/product.jsp?prod_id=1301"; target="_blank">VGA-to-ADC conversion box</a> (from Gefen) ought to do the job. See this <a href="http://forums.appleinsider.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=002028"; target="_blank">existing thread</a> on that topic.

Escher

[ 01-28-2003: Message edited by: Escher ]

shetline · January 28, 2003 3:52PM

[quote]Originally posted by Escher:

Actually, a single <a href="http://www.gefen.com/kvm/product.jsp?prod_id=1301"; target="_blank">VGA-to-ADC conversion box</a> (from Gefen) should do the job.

Escher<hr></blockquote>

It's important to note that converting VGA to ADC (or DVI) isn't anywhere near as good as having a DVI port in the first place. When you start with a DVI port, pixels in memory are mapped directly to pixels on your LCD display, one-to-one. If you go through an analog VGA port first, the video signal has to be redigitized, adding noise, and the colors of the original pixels in memory end up smearing and blurring a bit over the horizontal pixel boundaries of your display.

I think the new 12" PowerBooks are great -- but I'm still hoping that by waiting and getting a little more use out of my 800 MHz TiBook that by time I'm ready the 12" PowerBook will have DVI too. Even with VGA, however, the extra portability of the 12" is awfully tempting... must... resist...!!!

[ 01-28-2003: Message edited by: shetline ]

escher · January 29, 2003 12:20PM

[quote]Originally posted by shetline:

It's important to note that converting VGA to ADC (or DVI) isn't anywhere near as good as having a DVI port in the first place.<hr></blockquote>

No question about it, shetline. There's no point in converting the internal digital signal to analog (VGA) back to digital (DVI/ADC). Unless you have lots of money and really like Apple's displays.

I really wish Apple had put a DVI port on the 12-inch PowerBook! That would have spared us this whole discussion.

Escher

neutrino23 · January 31, 2003 1:28AM

Basically he likes it. He claims it can be twice as fast as the 800MHz iBook but for normal tasks (typing, surfing, mail) it is about the same. The mini P is nice and rigid. The sound system is better on the iBook - either through speakers or headphones. The iBook is a little more stylish. From far away the iBook is readily identifiable. The mini P from a distance looks similar to other notebooks. It does seem to run at half speed with the lid closed. probably this is because the fan exhaust is at the back and it is obstructed with the lid closed.

This is actually a six part review. If you click through the other links you will find other pictures and results. <a href="http://www.zdnet.co.jp/macwire/0301/23/nj00_12pbg4.html"; target="_blank">This page</a> shows various temperature measurements at different points on the body.

serrano · January 31, 2003 2:03AM

[quote]Originally posted by icruise:

Yes, according to him the fans go on high and system slows down when you try to use the powerbook with the lid closed and connected to an external monitor. I'm not entirely sure why that would be (and he doesn't really say either beyond the heat issue) but perhaps it is a problem with the video drivers. I don't think this is a big deal, really, since the vast majority of people will be wanting to use monitor spanning over two screens, and that seems fine.<hr></blockquote>

You seem confused, it is a heat issue. And by issue I mean that running with the lid closed at full power for extended periods of time would severely shorten your machines lifetime, and possibly melt your keyboard.

fireants22 · January 31, 2003 2:21AM

mmm...i connected my TiG4-800 to span onto a 21"CRT and I found the performance slowing down at least 20% as well...is this normal? I was guessing that, the second monitor is sucking CPU/video power from the powerbook...sounds logical does it not?

eldios · January 31, 2003 7:20AM

Hey Guys

I can read Japanese. I will post translation later on today. I read over the article briefly and I can give a really brief summary. First, In his first article about the minibook (apparently this is the 3rd) he said that the characters in Bugdom II and Ottomatic were difficult to move because he believed the quality of the keys on the keyboard were not good. He says he was mistaken and that the next time he played everything worked fine.

The next part of the article talks about connecting an external monitor. First he explains how to connect, then talks about some issues he had: mainly the computer falling asleep if you run it on the powerbook's internal battery.

He next talks about speed. Basically he says the speed of the proc only drops noticeably when you use an external CRT. I'll do a more complete translation later. Hope this helps.

[quote]Originally posted by Pais:

I'm one of the many waiting to receive my BTO 12" PowerBook G4. (I've had many Macs since my 512K in '84, but none newer than the 6400/200; only Linux and Windows boxen. It's been quite a wait!)

Naturally, I'm very excited about my purchase, and voraciously looking at nearly every scrap of information I can find about it! From what I can tell, I'm not the only one.

Today, I came across <a href="http://www.zdnet.co.jp/macwire/0301/27/rj00_12inchpb4.html"; target="_blank">this article</a> from ZDNet Japan. I can't read Japanese, but I infer that the author is testing the performance of the little PowerBook under various display configurations.

This is of particular interest to me, since I plan on using my PowerBook with a CRT.

Has anyone else seen this article? Can anyone read Japanese well enough to determine what the tests are, and the results? (I hate to raise alarm for no reason, but the <a href="http://www.zdnet.co.jp/macwire/0301/27/xbench1l.gif"; target="_blank">xbench results</a> make me a little uncomfortable -- to be fair, I haven't a clue what it really means.)

Any light you can shed would be greatly appreciated.<hr></blockquote>

[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: Eldios ]

[ 01-31-2003: Message edited by: Eldios ]

scott · January 31, 2003 9:09AM

Hey thanks. Maybe a 12" owner here can do the same test?

icruise · January 31, 2003 9:17AM

[quote]Originally posted by serrano:



You seem confused, it is a heat issue. And by issue I mean that running with the lid closed at full power for extended periods of time would severely shorten your machines lifetime, and possibly melt your keyboard.<hr></blockquote>

How does what you say relate to the issue of slowness?

By the way, there is already a detailed analysis of this article on the Macnn forums:

<a href="http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=142591"; target="_blank">http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=142591</a>;

PowerBook 12" Dual Display Performance (in Japanese)

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