Just two generations of consoles and Microsoft's a player. Apple can do this. They have to open up the coffers and buy some good IP but the hardware is simple with Nvidia and ATI doing the heavy lifting.
Plus this will allow them to focus on keeping OpenGL a factor in the gaming sector.
When you look at the consoles they are no longer just gaming boxes. They are mini entertainment devices. The Xbox 360 now can download HD content, playback HTPC media centre contenet and game. This and the Playstation 3 are a threat to the future of Apple products that seek to do the same minus the gaming.
Apple has all the pieces put together. iTunes for music and videos. OS X/Quicktime for infrastructure and the funds to become a player quickly. I'd buy an Apple console.
I'm not so sure about your evaluation of the xBox. A few years ago, Jobs dismissed rumors that Apple was developing a PDA, saying that, "the PDA market is not a happy place to be." I'd argue that the game console market, today, is also not a happy place to be. MS's xBox units is still hemorrhaging money out the ass, and Sony looks to lose quite a bit on the PS3 for at least the next year or year and a half. Nintendo seems to be doing alright for the time being, but for how long? There's no guarantee that people won't get tired of the Wii -- that the novelty might wear off.
The only reason why MS is in the game console market is because they have a carte blanche thanks to all of the money that comes in from the desktop monopoly they enjoy. They will try to dominate any new markets that they can, but it hasn't been easy with xBox. Nothing that they have done has really gotten them any closer to turning a profit, much less dominating the industry.
If Apple is said to be working towards their advancement in the gaming market, you can be almost certain that this is little more than a push to try and get better game support to the mac desktop, rather than some grand plan to enter the console market. Now that they use x86's and EFI, it's presumably much easier to leverage existing hardware products, and it undoubtedly reduces the amount of snafu bugs that show up (and have to be debugged) due to the difference in PPC and x86 architectures.
2. Aquire a large gaming company with great upcoming game.
3. Develop a console that plays games, downloads movies, streams video/photos
4. License the hell out of the platform.
Microsoft has created a winner in just 3 generations of Xbox consoles. Apple can cut that down to 2 generations if they just follow the pattern of success and avoid the pitfalls.
Bring on the iGame Console!
MS has created a "winner" that continues to lose billions for them. Wow, a few more winners and they could really be hurtin'.
MS has created a "winner" that continues to lose billions for them. Wow, a few more winners and they could really be hurtin'.
Yep, and its amazing how many people forget this, and also aren't even aware that the US is the only major market where the Xbox has done anything at all. In Europe, the Xbox has done much poorer in sales, and in Japan you can't hardly give them away. Pfft. Some 'success'.
Hey, give me a couple of billion dollars to chuck away, with no hard milestone date by which I have to start turning a profit, and I can grab 15 percent of the console gaming market too. Not much of an achievement under those conditions, really. \
I think Hobbes has it. Apple can find a nice little niche with games designed for the next gen of video iPods (i'd love ports of the old arcade stuff for instance). There's not much elbow room in the console market and little chance of success without a multi-year, billion dollar investment.
All this speculation based on Apple hiring some game developers? Hello? Apple is already in the game market, writing games for sale for the iPod. They already have the hardware, the API and the delivery mechanism. And you can be sure it'll all work seamlessly with the upcoming iPhone. (Right?)
This would be another uphill battle for Apple. If I were to speculate I'm guessing that Apple is exploring this avenue. Doesn't mean it will happen. However if Apple is succesful in selling a set top box for movies and music to a large market segment, what's to stop them from adding video game capability 2-4 generations into it's life.
According to electronics supply chain iSuppli, the manufacturing processes involved for Microsoft's Xbox 360 have "matured" enough to the point where related costs have been reduced signifigantly. The latest teardown analysis of associated components for the Xbox 360 show that the average estimated cost for producing a console comes out to around $323.30 US. Looking at the retail pricing for Xbox 360 consoles, the manufacturing costs are actually $24.30 US lower than the price of a "core" Xbox 360 package, and $75.70 US lower than a "premium" one.
Clearly some of you are working with assumptions or old info. Add in Xbox live Gold subs and Microsoft is making money folks.
2. Aquire a large gaming company with great upcoming game.
3. Develop a console that plays games, downloads movies, streams video/photos
4. License the hell out of the platform.
Microsoft has created a winner in just 3 generations of Xbox consoles. Apple can cut that down to 2 generations if they just follow the pattern of success and avoid the pitfalls.
Bring on the iGame Console!
I agree to the API would be key. I think a big game isn't the way since most of the big games push the hardware. I think the best model is more like the Nintendo Wii in that the hardware isn't hardcore like Sony's or Microsoft's and the games aren't as demanding. Nintendo is making money both on software and hardware. Microsoft while 3 generations is still losing mega $$$ on hardware (as is Sony) and Microsoft is still is not making money on the software side( which was fundamental in their gaming business model).
The iPod / iTV ~ Mac mini / cell phone / front row / iTunes in conjunction with a solid gaming API and easy licensing program to create a value added feature of the whole widget. .
Leave the bad ass mega games to the $$$ loosing Xbox's and Playstations. Go for fun smaller Wii type games that make the combined uniform Apple platform that much more robust without diverting too many resources and without heading out in uncharted waters.
Later if the API and licensing is a success and the Apple Game ecosystem is robust enough, then that might merit entering a dedicated gaming device.
Gaming is the one market where there's literally room for just about anyone who can deliver compelling games and service.
Apple doesn't have to compete directly with the Playstation/Xbox 360/Wii on the gaming front. They can slant towards movies/Audio with some cursory gaming support as well. With multi-core cpu and the power of GPUs the hardware isn't becoming something you need to go too deep into the red over anymore. It's swinging back to "just create good games" the hardware is commoditizing right before our eyes.
Microsoft's next major version of the Zune will be very similar to the current PSP.
It will be designed and marketed by the XBOX division.
It will be a media and gaming platform.
Solution...
Apple will be first to market with its "true video/gaming" iPod.
It will have a form factor similar to the PSP but smaller.
Apple will also be releasing the iTV its home theater/entertainment platform.
You will be able to buy a game through the iTunes store.
It will download digitally and be playable on the iTV
Apple will probably sell bluetooth controllers seperately
The same game can be transfered to the the true video/gaming iPod.
Apple's competitors(MS, SONY, and Nintendo) have to make their money back on games.
Their games are primarily sold on physical media and cost $60-70.
Apple will sell the iTV at a profit and then make more money by selling
Music, AudioBooks, TV Shows, Movies, Games
All their distribution is digital and games will probably cost $10-20.
Now this is what I was thinking!
If Apple is going to sell games, they're going to do something like this.
You download the games with your iTV and use the remote control to play them, if you have a video iPod you can send them to the player and play them on the road too.
The games will be very basic, and will cost $10 at the very max.
That's just a teardown analysis of the hardware. Doesn't include things like marketing costs (which have always been considerable for Xbox) and shipping. Best guesstimates are that MS is probably just now starting to break even on the 360, or is getting close. However... (see below)
Quote:
Clearly some of you are working with assumptions or old info. Add in Xbox live Gold subs and Microsoft is making money folks.
Since you bring up old info... breaking even really isn't helping MS's Xbox division dig their way out of the $4 billion hole the first-generation Xbox put them into:
Forbes: Xbox lost Microsoft $4 billion (and counting)
The latest teardown analysis of associated components for the Xbox 360 show that the average estimated cost for producing a console comes out to around $323.30 US. Looking at the retail pricing for Xbox 360 consoles, the manufacturing costs are actually $24.30 US lower than the price of a "core" Xbox 360 package, and $75.70 US lower than a "premium" one.
Clearly some of you are working with assumptions or old info. Add in Xbox live Gold subs and Microsoft is making money folks.
I think you have to look at it all though murch.
How much money has MS lost through the entire course of its Xbox venture?
EVen if they've gotten the cost of building each unit below its retail price how many units do they sell and how much actual real profit are they making?
Add all this up the balance sheet is still in the negative column.
I agree with the consensus - getting into gaming is a bad idea, unless it's a mild expansion of the existing gaming service for the iPod.
...though it would be neat to see Apple stick it to MS by successfully attacking Xbox as retribution for MS attacking the iPod line with Zune. But seriously, the console market is too fierce to attack head-on. They'd need to niche.
Partnering with Nintendo might also be a good idea - they have enough in common to benefit from working together.
How much money has MS lost through the entire course of its Xbox venture?
EVen if they've gotten the cost of building each unit below its retail price how many units do they sell and how much actual real profit are they making?
Add all this up the balance sheet is still in the negative column.
Maybe so but as previously noted, Xbox is still in its infancy, its still a second generation product. Microsoft is in this battle for the longterm and as demonstrated earlier, is now making a small profit on the console. This is a HUGE achievement in the context of video game consoles and a pretty big improvement over the 1st gen xbox.
More and more games are coming to the Xbox and this means more fees due to Microsoft. I think the Xbox is a long term winner...
Comments
Just two generations of consoles and Microsoft's a player. Apple can do this. They have to open up the coffers and buy some good IP but the hardware is simple with Nvidia and ATI doing the heavy lifting.
Plus this will allow them to focus on keeping OpenGL a factor in the gaming sector.
When you look at the consoles they are no longer just gaming boxes. They are mini entertainment devices. The Xbox 360 now can download HD content, playback HTPC media centre contenet and game. This and the Playstation 3 are a threat to the future of Apple products that seek to do the same minus the gaming.
Apple has all the pieces put together. iTunes for music and videos. OS X/Quicktime for infrastructure and the funds to become a player quickly. I'd buy an Apple console.
The only reason why MS is in the game console market is because they have a carte blanche thanks to all of the money that comes in from the desktop monopoly they enjoy. They will try to dominate any new markets that they can, but it hasn't been easy with xBox. Nothing that they have done has really gotten them any closer to turning a profit, much less dominating the industry.
If Apple is said to be working towards their advancement in the gaming market, you can be almost certain that this is little more than a push to try and get better game support to the mac desktop, rather than some grand plan to enter the console market. Now that they use x86's and EFI, it's presumably much easier to leverage existing hardware products, and it undoubtedly reduces the amount of snafu bugs that show up (and have to be debugged) due to the difference in PPC and x86 architectures.
Getting into gaming is fairly easy.
1. Develop a powerful gaming API for OSX
2. Aquire a large gaming company with great upcoming game.
3. Develop a console that plays games, downloads movies, streams video/photos
4. License the hell out of the platform.
Microsoft has created a winner in just 3 generations of Xbox consoles. Apple can cut that down to 2 generations if they just follow the pattern of success and avoid the pitfalls.
Bring on the iGame Console!
MS has created a "winner" that continues to lose billions for them. Wow, a few more winners and they could really be hurtin'.
MS has created a "winner" that continues to lose billions for them. Wow, a few more winners and they could really be hurtin'.
Yep, and its amazing how many people forget this, and also aren't even aware that the US is the only major market where the Xbox has done anything at all. In Europe, the Xbox has done much poorer in sales, and in Japan you can't hardly give them away. Pfft. Some 'success'.
Hey, give me a couple of billion dollars to chuck away, with no hard milestone date by which I have to start turning a profit, and I can grab 15 percent of the console gaming market too. Not much of an achievement under those conditions, really.
.
It will be designed and marketed by the XBOX division.
It will be a media and gaming platform.
Solution...
Apple will be first to market with its "true video/gaming" iPod.
It will have a form factor similar to the PSP but smaller.
Apple will also be releasing the iTV its home theater/entertainment platform.
You will be able to buy a game through the iTunes store.
It will download digitally and be playable on the iTV
Apple will probably sell bluetooth controllers seperately
The same game can be transfered to the the true video/gaming iPod.
Apple's competitors(MS, SONY, and Nintendo) have to make their money back on games.
Their games are primarily sold on physical media and cost $60-70.
Apple will sell the iTV at a profit and then make more money by selling
Music, AudioBooks, TV Shows, Movies, Games
All their distribution is digital and games will probably cost $10-20.
Hey, maybe this would force Apple to put a real GPU in the Macbook!
No. Because that (or an option to upgrade) would be logical.
.
MS has created a "winner" that continues to lose billions for them. Wow, a few more winners and they could really be hurtin'.
I don't know where you got this information.
http://www.neoseeker.com/news/story/6312/
Xbox 360 cost reduced by as much as %40
According to electronics supply chain iSuppli, the manufacturing processes involved for Microsoft's Xbox 360 have "matured" enough to the point where related costs have been reduced signifigantly. The latest teardown analysis of associated components for the Xbox 360 show that the average estimated cost for producing a console comes out to around $323.30 US. Looking at the retail pricing for Xbox 360 consoles, the manufacturing costs are actually $24.30 US lower than the price of a "core" Xbox 360 package, and $75.70 US lower than a "premium" one.
Clearly some of you are working with assumptions or old info. Add in Xbox live Gold subs and Microsoft is making money folks.
Getting into gaming is fairly easy.
1. Develop a powerful gaming API for OSX
2. Aquire a large gaming company with great upcoming game.
3. Develop a console that plays games, downloads movies, streams video/photos
4. License the hell out of the platform.
Microsoft has created a winner in just 3 generations of Xbox consoles. Apple can cut that down to 2 generations if they just follow the pattern of success and avoid the pitfalls.
Bring on the iGame Console!
I agree to the API would be key. I think a big game isn't the way since most of the big games push the hardware. I think the best model is more like the Nintendo Wii in that the hardware isn't hardcore like Sony's or Microsoft's and the games aren't as demanding. Nintendo is making money both on software and hardware. Microsoft while 3 generations is still losing mega $$$ on hardware (as is Sony) and Microsoft is still is not making money on the software side( which was fundamental in their gaming business model).
The iPod / iTV ~ Mac mini / cell phone / front row / iTunes in conjunction with a solid gaming API and easy licensing program to create a value added feature of the whole widget. .
Leave the bad ass mega games to the $$$ loosing Xbox's and Playstations. Go for fun smaller Wii type games that make the combined uniform Apple platform that much more robust without diverting too many resources and without heading out in uncharted waters.
Later if the API and licensing is a success and the Apple Game ecosystem is robust enough, then that might merit entering a dedicated gaming device.
Apple doesn't have to compete directly with the Playstation/Xbox 360/Wii on the gaming front. They can slant towards movies/Audio with some cursory gaming support as well. With multi-core cpu and the power of GPUs the hardware isn't becoming something you need to go too deep into the red over anymore. It's swinging back to "just create good games" the hardware is commoditizing right before our eyes.
Microsoft's next major version of the Zune will be very similar to the current PSP.
It will be designed and marketed by the XBOX division.
It will be a media and gaming platform.
Solution...
Apple will be first to market with its "true video/gaming" iPod.
It will have a form factor similar to the PSP but smaller.
Apple will also be releasing the iTV its home theater/entertainment platform.
You will be able to buy a game through the iTunes store.
It will download digitally and be playable on the iTV
Apple will probably sell bluetooth controllers seperately
The same game can be transfered to the the true video/gaming iPod.
Apple's competitors(MS, SONY, and Nintendo) have to make their money back on games.
Their games are primarily sold on physical media and cost $60-70.
Apple will sell the iTV at a profit and then make more money by selling
Music, AudioBooks, TV Shows, Movies, Games
All their distribution is digital and games will probably cost $10-20.
Now this is what I was thinking!
If Apple is going to sell games, they're going to do something like this.
You download the games with your iTV and use the remote control to play them, if you have a video iPod you can send them to the player and play them on the road too.
The games will be very basic, and will cost $10 at the very max.
I don't know where you got this information.
http://www.neoseeker.com/news/story/6312/
Xbox 360 cost reduced by as much as %40
That's just a teardown analysis of the hardware. Doesn't include things like marketing costs (which have always been considerable for Xbox) and shipping. Best guesstimates are that MS is probably just now starting to break even on the 360, or is getting close. However... (see below)
Clearly some of you are working with assumptions or old info. Add in Xbox live Gold subs and Microsoft is making money folks.
Since you bring up old info... breaking even really isn't helping MS's Xbox division dig their way out of the $4 billion hole the first-generation Xbox put them into:
Forbes: Xbox lost Microsoft $4 billion (and counting)
http://www.joystiq.com/2005/09/26/fo...-and-counting/
The latest teardown analysis of associated components for the Xbox 360 show that the average estimated cost for producing a console comes out to around $323.30 US. Looking at the retail pricing for Xbox 360 consoles, the manufacturing costs are actually $24.30 US lower than the price of a "core" Xbox 360 package, and $75.70 US lower than a "premium" one.
Clearly some of you are working with assumptions or old info. Add in Xbox live Gold subs and Microsoft is making money folks.
I think you have to look at it all though murch.
How much money has MS lost through the entire course of its Xbox venture?
EVen if they've gotten the cost of building each unit below its retail price how many units do they sell and how much actual real profit are they making?
Add all this up the balance sheet is still in the negative column.
...though it would be neat to see Apple stick it to MS by successfully attacking Xbox as retribution for MS attacking the iPod line with Zune. But seriously, the console market is too fierce to attack head-on. They'd need to niche.
Partnering with Nintendo might also be a good idea - they have enough in common to benefit from working together.
I think you have to look at it all though murch.
How much money has MS lost through the entire course of its Xbox venture?
EVen if they've gotten the cost of building each unit below its retail price how many units do they sell and how much actual real profit are they making?
Add all this up the balance sheet is still in the negative column.
Maybe so but as previously noted, Xbox is still in its infancy, its still a second generation product. Microsoft is in this battle for the longterm and as demonstrated earlier, is now making a small profit on the console. This is a HUGE achievement in the context of video game consoles and a pretty big improvement over the 1st gen xbox.
More and more games are coming to the Xbox and this means more fees due to Microsoft. I think the Xbox is a long term winner...