Jobs says Apple won't offer refunds to early iPhone adopters

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  • Reply 101 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post


    I think almost 1 million people learned a valuable lesson about impulse buying.



    Okay, I don't think it's fair to call everyone who bought this phone an "impulse" buyer. Remember, the Apple faithful had been waiting for this phone. It was going to be the BEST phone ever. That's why I bought it; not on impulse. And aside from a few shortcomings that I can live with, this is the best phone I have ever used and owned. I actually like to carry my phone with me now.
  • Reply 102 of 169
    bageljoeybageljoey Posts: 1,932member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by onceuponamac View Post


    So ? if the group that paid $499 or $599 is really upset ? why not act together to show apple our frustration. Assuming we had the discipline ? we could not purchase any new apple products for 12 ? 18 months. Presumably, the 300,000 or so of us that acquired iPhones and aren?t within the window to obtain a refund are mostly early adopters ? I?m the owner of a variety of mac products including a g5 iMac, intel core duo imac, core2duo 17? macbook pro, many airport expresses, several airport extremes, a mac mini, each generation of ipod (including a nano and a shuffle), several apple TV?s and, of course, an iphone. If we exercise our power as a group ? we might get more respect from Apple. Think about it this way ? there must be a lawyer among us ? shouldn?t there be a legal argument under a construct of bad faith that apple and ATT violated their commitments and promises to us by not introducing promised upgrades (based on public statements by Apple and ATT to be distributed shortly after the introduction of the iPhone) ? hence, allowing us to void our contracts with ATT with no further obligation for a contract breakage fee? Apple has demonstrated by it?s price decrease today that the period to meet commitments is something less than 3 months ? it hasn?t provided any meaningful upgrades that don?t require a separate purchase (new iLife). Probably a smart lawyer among us could develop a legal basis for canceling our contracts with ATT even without Apple and ATT?s failure to meet their promises of service and device upgrades, given we paid in full for our devices and received no other meaningful consideration from ATT in exchange for entering into our contracts. If 300,000 (or even 170,000 of us) cancel our ATT contracts and acquire the hack to use the devices on other networks ? we would demonstrate the organized power of the consumer and gain some attention given the lost revenue to ATT and Apple would be a multiple of the contract commitments that they failed to meet their commitments on. Of course, our nature as early adopters, suggests the discipline to punish Apple for a year or more is difficult ? but as a group we have substantial purchasing power ? simply aggregate our ATT contract commitments for two years times some number between 170k and 300k. My own view (which is that of a layman, but close follower of Apple?s product developments) is that Apple has over diversified it?s line up of ipods ? I doubt the hard disk ipod will garner much in new sales ? the iTouch may sell ? but not if they introduce a 3G iPhone in the next 60 days. My own experience is that I use the extended features of the iPhone when I?m within distance of a wifi connection but don?t use them on the GSM network because it?s painfully slow ? I?ll be much more upfront about this with other potential consumers given Apple?s act of bad faith yesterday.





    Or you could learn to use paragraphs...
  • Reply 103 of 169
    There are ways to get some of your money back if you've had it over the 14 days and under a month. [email protected] saps that bought the 4G models. hehehe. I wonder did they have this planned, seems odd for cingular to only offer 14 days to check out the phone, when all other phones get a 30 tryout time frame.
  • Reply 104 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Shelf Life View Post


    Dropping the price $200 after 10 weeks wasn't decided yesterday.



    They obviously took advantage of the goodwill I had toward their company by overinflating their price at launch. I'm not bitching, I am merely stating that I will never show them any goodwill again, and will no longer be making any unneccasary purchases from them ever again.



    Goodwill? You people sound like your iPhones were taken from you and you have nothing to show for your $600 spent. \
  • Reply 105 of 169
    I remember when I was a kid, and I my mom was on the phone, cooking, and doing the dishes all at the same time. She had the audacity (or so I perceived it at the time) to ask my eight year-old self to help with the dishes. I threw a fit, and didn't do them. She tried to explain how busy she was with everything, but I was too stubborn. She was cooking my food, and washing my dirty juice cups, yet I was too self-absorbed to understand. It was all about me. Me, me, me.



    I believe this situation echoes my past, and the immaturity in a lot of apple customers. I have difficulty understanding why customers believe they were victims of price gauging, when we knew 3 days prior to the launch that Apple's iPhone manufacturing costs were at least rumored around $260 (US). I am confused as to those who claim that some magnanimous purchase from Apple reflected their good-will to bring a company up in sales. Was it really for Apple, or was it all for you? You, you, you?



    Can we at least be honest here? In my opinion, early adopters are disgruntled that other, less hard-core customers got a better deal. This behavior is a product of the last couple of hundred of years of culture. It's not that complex. Or maybe it is, maybe that's why no one can calm down this crowd.



    The iPhone price drop is an unfortunate, but expected matter with any highly anticipated product launch. I think as "fanboys" we should realize that apple always releases new products, and its going to anger those purchased the older ones 15 days prior. Apple always stirs up some spirit (good and bad) with every product launch. In the end, it comes down to business. And I truly believe Apple ends up stirring more good vibes than bad. Can you honestly say you will never purchase from Apple again?



    It really boils down to maturity, if you poured your savings into buying an iPhone and then the deposit for the service plan, then its an issue of poor judgement. Of course you're going to be frustrated by such a large price drop! You probably stress about money on a daily basis to make you feel this way.



    The best way to get over it is to think and remember the first time you opened your iPhone. How happy did it make you feel to plug it into your computer, and see it activate for the first time? How good did it make you feel to see comrades wet their pants at the pure sight of your amazing phone?



    It felted damned good for me. I couldn't put a price on it.
  • Reply 106 of 169
    msanttimsantti Posts: 1,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CosmoNut View Post


    It's supply and demand, folks. Supply and demand.



    Apple knew how many iPhones they'd have opening weekend and then estimated how many people would want to buy one that weekend. They priced the phones accordingly to keep demand as far DOWN as possible.



    Imagine the demand if these suckers were $399 on June 29.



    I do think they should have introduced a 16GB version for $599 Wednesday. That might have lessened the sting a bit.





    You are right. Apple could not have waited for more supply before the launch. Makes sense to not want demand.
  • Reply 107 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by BlackSummerNight View Post


    I'm not sure what your point it. Cingular is subsidizing the other smartphones not the makers. So comparing it to other smartphones out of contract is correct. You DO NOT have to sign a new contract to get the iPhone at it's current price.



    Your iPhone, as purchased at an Apple Store, is useless unless activated.



    Guess how you activate it? With AT&T. On a new 2-year contract (or pay-as-you-go, if not credit-worthy or not a fan of 2-year contracts).



    Either way, $399 is a subsidized price. Apple are kicked back from AT&T a percentage of monthly billing (which percentage varies depending on which report you read). Lowering the price to $399 will increase the residual payments to Apple, by sheer volume of new customers, while reducing their initial profit from the sale of the phone.



    From the AT&T website:



    Quote:

    Q. How much does iPhone cost?



    A. There are currently two versions of iPhone available. $299 for the 4GB model (while supplies last) and $399 for the 8GB model. Both prices require a 2-year service agreement.



    If you are a current customer, you still need to 're-up' for the 2-year term.
  • Reply 108 of 169
    Jeezus - what a bunch of whining craybaby pussies these guys must be !



    At least you can frikkin' buy a frakkin' iPhone in your country. I'd happily pay $599 one, even now.



    These people are just making you American's look like spoilt children. Get over it. The #1 rule of technology purchasing - what you buy today will be cheaper and better tomorrow.



    Why don't you try living over here, where every Apple product is 10-20% more expensive than what you pay (and Adobe products 100% ) ?
  • Reply 109 of 169
    mark2005mark2005 Posts: 1,158member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by freeny View Post


    True, but on what grounds?



    Hurt feelings?
  • Reply 110 of 169
    Oh - and a quick lesson in economics. It's called 'supply and demand' - if the demand is high, you raise the price to control the demand (and to make as much profit as the market can bear)



    If Apple had NOT charge $599 for the iPhone and could have done, they would have had an even more irate, and more justified, group of people baying for blood - their shareholders.
  • Reply 111 of 169
    desarcdesarc Posts: 642member
    Well Jobs has been corrected... by Jobs.



    http://www.apple.com/hotnews/openiphoneletter/





    $100 apple store credit...
  • Reply 112 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Shelf Life View Post


    Dropping the price $200 after 10 weeks wasn't decided yesterday.



    They obviously took advantage of the goodwill I had toward their company by overinflating their price at launch. I'm not bitching, I am merely stating that I will never show them any goodwill again, and will no longer be making any unneccasary purchases from them ever again.



    Losing out on any further business from me, and any future iTunes purchases I might have made, is also the "tough luck of technology."



    As above - OPINIONs are nice FACTS are better.



    Do you have any? (FACTs that is)
  • Reply 113 of 169
    The totally funny thing is that if Apple had raised the price by $50 or $100 due to the popularity of the iPhone, all of you early adopters would have been braggin' your asses off about how smart you were to stand in line.



    I don't understand your logic that you were abused by the price cut, because you weighed the total value of the iPhone before you paid for it, and willingly plopped down your $600. But you knew (or should have) that Cingular could have reduced service in your area the very next day, leaving you with nothing. Or a fatal flaw in Apple's marketing plan might have caused the phones to become extinct in less than a year (leaving you with a $600 iPod Touch+).



    But the iPhone you bought is still yours, you're still getting to use it. It's not like they changed carriers, and now your phone doesn't work. So, better luck next time. After all, it's 200 bucks. If that's a really big deal to you, maybe you shouldn't be out buying a $600 cell phone. (Gee, if you had bought $600 of APPL stock instead of an iPhone that day, you wouldn't be crying about the price cut today, would you?)



    I don't understand the surprise at the rapid price change, either. These people must either walk everywhere you go or completely rely on public transportation. People who drive cars and buy fuel face these kinds of price swings every day. I don't know how many times I've seen gas fluctuate by 12% - 20% OVERNIGHT (usually right after I fill up only to see it 25% cheaper at the next exit). I can easily lose $200 in two months by not watching and timing where and when I buy gas. It's all speculation.



    Another example: I buy CoffeeMate(R) creamer regularly. The small grocery store down the street from my office charges me $2.75 for a bottle, but the big one closer to home always has it for $2.35. But frequently another store has it at 3 jugs for $5 at the same time I'm paying $2.75 apiece just for proximity convenience.



    I guess I should write hate letters, and try to convince people to boycott the small store. Or maybe I could just learn to do without creamer & drink coffee black while I wait for CoffeeMate to go on sale. Ask your girlfriend... timing is everything. (She's the one who likely pays $200 to get her hair done, even though she knows it's gonna grow out in a month.)
  • Reply 114 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mrjoec123 View Post




    Knowing what I now know about the price drop, if I could go back in time I still wouldn't wait ten weeks to buy an iPhone. I'm guessing most other iPhone users would say the same thing.



    $200 is a night or two out at a nice restaurant. I'll take ten weeks of iPhone ownership over that any day of the week.



    Oh really?! Well, how about I rent my iPhone to you for $100 a month? How about that since you think it's such a bargain.



    Price drops were expected, but not just two months after a brand new product intro. This is almost unheard for a product like the iPhone. For most people, $200 is a lot of money, it certainly is for me. I bought my iPhone on the first day but held it unopened for almost two weeks trying to decide if I was really going to be an early adopter. I finally succumbed to the allure of the iPhone but I figured I'd have at least 5 or 6 months of use before being taunted by Apple with an upgraded version or a cheaper price. Had I known anything like this was possible from Apple (which is masterful at squeezing the last possible dollar from the tech that they sell) there is no way in hell I would have purchased the phone. It's fine that Apple has reduced the price of the phone in such a short time, but it's not okay to just shaft those people who just purchased the device.



    Job's statement to the effect that this is the way the tech world works and no consideration is to be paid to initial customers is complete B.S. That's like saying that since we live in an imperfect world, Apple shouldn't be upset at the theft and vandalism they endure at their stores.



    This situation is not analogous to buying a Mac or any other established line of electronics that Apple sells. This is a brand new market segment for Apple...their proposed treatment of their early supporters is shameful.



    Given the two year contract we are tied to with AT&T a simple and cheap way out of this problem would be for Apple to credit our wireless accounts with the price difference we paid for the phones (or close to it).



    Geesh! I'm steamed.
  • Reply 115 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Bacillus View Post


    We are the few, the proud, the iFools. Its not the money, its the idea that we iPhone early adopters were played like a fiddle; like lemmings we were.



    [CENTER][/CENTER]



    Well... I *did* have the opportunity -- for the first time EVER -- to go to Europe and have a drool-inspiring piece of mobile technology that wasn't yet available there.



    Before the iPhone, the situation had been exactly opposite.



    Besides, an argument can certainly be made that *all* early adopters of *anything* are essentially lemmings.
  • Reply 116 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by audiopollution View Post


    Your iPhone, as purchased at an Apple Store, is useless unless activated.



    Guess how you activate it? With AT&T. On a new 2-year contract (or pay-as-you-go, if not credit-worthy or not a fan of 2-year contracts).



    Either way, $399 is a subsidized price. Apple are kicked back from AT&T a percentage of monthly billing (which percentage varies depending on which report you read). Lowering the price to $399 will increase the residual payments to Apple, by sheer volume of new customers, while reducing their initial profit from the sale of the phone.



    From the AT&T website:







    If you are a current customer, you still need to 're-up' for the 2-year term.



    That's my problem. I would never buy anything form ATT. I remember how they gouged us on our landline phone costs when they were in total control of our nations phone system before the breakup. They suck! You would think they would help the process by doing a iPhone all inclusive plan and undercut other carriers for the service by 20 bucks a month to get the market share but Nooooo. They go by American profit standards which rip consumers. Apple/Jobs understands this an is hedging by cannibalizing the touch-screen for ipods and expanding his music download base. I think it's brilliant!!!
  • Reply 117 of 169
    desarcdesarc Posts: 642member
    Zanshin, Blurp., Promethias, Timeline...



    try READING the posts ahead of yours before you complain more.



    http://www.apple.com/hotnews/openiphoneletter/
  • Reply 118 of 169
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by desarc View Post


    Well Jobs has been corrected... by Jobs.



    http://www.apple.com/hotnews/openiphoneletter/





    $100 apple store credit...



    <waits for annoying chorus of whining to begin about the 'other' $100>
  • Reply 119 of 169
    desarcdesarc Posts: 642member
    To all iPhone customers:



    I have received hundreds of emails from iPhone customers who are upset about Apple dropping the price of iPhone by $200 two months after it went on sale. After reading every one of these emails, I have some observations and conclusions.



    First, I am sure that we are making the correct decision to lower the price of the 8GB iPhone from $599 to $399, and that now is the right time to do it. iPhone is a breakthrough product, and we have the chance to 'go for it' this holiday season. iPhone is so far ahead of the competition, and now it will be affordable by even more customers. It benefits both Apple and every iPhone user to get as many new customers as possible in the iPhone 'tent'. We strongly believe the $399 price will help us do just that this holiday season.



    Second, being in technology for 30+ years I can attest to the fact that the technology road is bumpy. There is always change and improvement, and there is always someone who bought a product before a particular cutoff date and misses the new price or the new operating system or the new whatever. This is life in the technology lane. If you always wait for the next price cut or to buy the new improved model, you'll never buy any technology product because there is always something better and less expensive on the horizon. The good news is that if you buy products from companies that support them well, like Apple tries to do, you will receive years of useful and satisfying service from them even as newer models are introduced.



    Third, even though we are making the right decision to lower the price of iPhone, and even though the technology road is bumpy, we need to do a better job taking care of our early iPhone customers as we aggressively go after new ones with a lower price. Our early customers trusted us, and we must live up to that trust with our actions in moments like these.



    Therefore, we have decided to offer every iPhone customer who purchased an iPhone from either Apple or AT&T, and who is not receiving a rebate or any other consideration, a $100 store credit towards the purchase of any product at an Apple Retail Store or the Apple Online Store. Details are still being worked out and will be posted on Apple's website next week. Stay tuned.



    We want to do the right thing for our valued iPhone customers. We apologize for disappointing some of you, and we are doing our best to live up to your high expectations of Apple.



    Steve Jobs

    Apple CEO
  • Reply 120 of 169
    mark2005mark2005 Posts: 1,158member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Shelf Life View Post


    Dropping the price $200 after 10 weeks wasn't decided yesterday.



    They obviously took advantage of the goodwill I had toward their company by overinflating their price at launch. I'm not bitching, I am merely stating that I will never show them any goodwill again, and will no longer be making any unneccasary purchases from them ever again.



    Losing out on any further business from me, and any future iTunes purchases I might have made, is also the "tough luck of technology."



    "Unneccasary" - I assume by this you mean "as long as you can control your impulses."
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