How long before the smaller independent Apple Dealers get the same treatment?
Those people are free to pursue an ACR (Apple Certified Reseller) status, this status isn't going anywhere (at least not for a long time) it is what the large stores have. (MicroCenter, MacMall, Circuit City ..etc.) They just have to do a certain volume every year.
I don't know if that's an indicator though, I know a lot of small single location shops that don't have a web site or a very good one - but the actual shop is still often good. They weren't Apple-affiliated or sold/serviced Apple products, but the quality of the web presence can often be quite different from their real presence.
When you go to a consulting firm web site and there isn't a contact person, street address or phone number, I would be very suspect.
Not easy for rural america to stay on top of technology. Cable and Phone companies will not provide service. Government will not help like they did with electricity. Now when start ups can't supplement selling apple solutions the public and apple gets hurt. Of course all decisions are not hurting apples bottom line as all decisions are dollar based. It is the rural customer that will continue to have problems. 4 and 1/2 hours to MSP and 4 hours to Milwaukee, and 6 hours to Chicago. Not possible to start a store up here and attain the volume goals that have been set. If it was easy apple would open a store.
When you go to a consulting firm web site and there isn't a contact person, street address or phone number, I would be very suspect.
Maybe, but that's not a proof of the argument. It's hard for me to explain, but for most people, I don't think they look on the Internet to find a local business. The Internet isn't their market, nor is it their means of promoting themselves because their market doesn't need a business that has a web site.
We were participating in this program. We loved it. We are a Mac only Brick n mortar reseller. We have other programs to fall back on. But, this particular program had a lot of benefits. We are too small to carry a huge selection of product or be able to purchase product in sufficient volume to get any price break worth even mentioning through the distributor channels. Below a certain size the distributors really aren't your best friend. As a small reseller, it is aggravating to know that a customer could buy a computer from Apple in the education channel at a better price that you could buy it from the distributor. This program let us sell anything available from the Apple store. And we didn't have to expend resources to keep it up to date. There were specials and discounts that we could never otherwise offer. Being able to sell the refurbished machines in particular was very nice. That alone put a mac in the hands of people who might not be able to afford one. Or put them in a nicer model of Mac than they could afford otherwise. Financially, We made less per sale than other channels, But, It was worth it because we didn't have to deal with the inevitable problems with Apple double dinging an account, Pairing the customers order with it's payment. Which each is handled through separate methods and must be re-associated AT Apple. Which leads to an inevitable lost order or miss pairing of order and payment. I wish this program had offered more specials like the back to school iPod special and the current printer special. And I wish it offered more discount incentives which were useful for closing a more difficult sale. It was a great sales tool. it had some small problems. Tracking a order for our own records was nearly impossible. I hope Apple will consider making this online store available to their resellers and perhaps consider expanding it's specials and incentives. A black Friday special blowout would be AWESOME! As it is we'll be closed instead.
Yes. Many are. Again, quite a few web sites are down, don't display Apple anywhere and/or, have no brick/mortar contact info.
I am a Business Agent and a Certified Member of the Apple Consultants Network. I used my AABA status so I could order product, prepare for installation and install that product seamlessly... as a single resource for my clients. My Business' website (www.macintek.com) has its affiliation quite prominently displayed.
I, for one, am insulted by the arrogance of this cancellation. There are agents who sell six-figure numbers every year and those who barely make the twenty-grand quota. Apple's margins on those sales are plenty enough to cover the cost of the program. Having been one of the pilot group guinea pigs, I've watched the program grow... even to the point where Apple no longer considered it a "Pilot Program". What I have seen is the politics of Corporate Apple... there are those who see a value in grass-roots evangelism of the brand (classic Apple philosophy) and those who believe in a more formal model where the brand can only be represented by uniformed, salaried employees of the government... err... corporation (Apple Retail, Small Business and Enterprise Channels).
The model that our program fit was one that encouraged cooperation, one that saw a niche for both the retail space and a more personal, consultancy-based approach. In essence.. there's room in the retail world for both of us so... let's consider ourselves on the same team... after all, it ought to be US against Windows, not US against US.
Unfortunately, a more aggressive and less ethical model won a battle that many didn't even realize was being fought...
I first saw it when, at MacWorld, I noticed a small (AABA) table just inside the Hall, against the wall... I then saw another Table right as you enter the Hall at the front of the Apple Booth with a banner advertising Apple Business Sales. They had brochures. We had none. The had a link on the main Apple online store. We didn't. They appeared to have the support of Apple, we didn't. We have always been the red-headed stepchild.
The next year... just after Thanksgiving... I became aware of the internal policy of Apple Retail and Small Business Channels to raid AABA clients' saved shopping carts and use that information to hijack our customers. This is not paranoid suspicion, it was confirmed by Apple as a policy of the channel.
Then, there was the on-again, off-again access to refurbs, the iPhone sales and, finally, the virtual abandonment of the AABA store website, only to have that rectified less than a week before the program's cancellation notices were sent out... The web site was fixed the same time the notices were begin printed. Someone at Apple is getting a sick thrill out of teasing AABAs. They clearly don't respect us... and I have nothing but distain for them.
Please note that I am not referring to anyone who worked so hard to make the program succeed (which it did). I am referring to the greedy, self-possessed control freaks who fought against a program that wasn't harming their bottom line in the least.
Apple, as a corporation, has fallen into the same mold as HP... they had a fine philosophy for many years... then, someone hires an outsider to ramp up the retail channel (week before last) and, in their arrogance, they decide to make cuts for the sake of making cuts to establish themselves. And we got trampled. 'Sounds like a stereotypical mega corporation to me...
We were participating in this program. We loved it.
I also am a participating member for the last year or so. I really liked it. I was invited by Apple to join as I worked for an Apple VAR at the time and to continue being an VAR, you needed to buy $100K per year. Sometimes we met that... other times we did not. So, they killed out account and I decided to join as an independent to the Business Agent program.
I am also bummed it is being disbanded. It was a nice way to earn a few $$ off of the referrals and helping Apple sell more Macs into business markets. I install these iMacs as POS systems at retail stores. So, having an Apple affiliation was nice but now I guess I just send these clients away to get their own computers.
Apple always seems to do stuff like this. They had a big VAR shakeup years ago where good stores seemed to be pinched out. Maybe they were making way for the newer Apple Stores. Who knows.
Anyway, I still love Apple but today I am just a pissed off family member because I am being cut-off from the family again. I nnce was a VAR, then an Apple Business Agent, and maybe now I will become a hobo.
I also am a participating member for the last year or so. I really liked it. I was invited by Apple to join as I worked for an Apple VAR at the time and to continue being an VAR, you needed to buy $100K per year. Sometimes we met that... other times we did not. So, they killed out account and I decided to join as an independent to the Business Agent program.
I am also bummed it is being disbanded. It was a nice way to earn a few $$ off of the referrals and helping Apple sell more Macs into business markets. I install these iMacs as POS systems at retail stores. So, having an Apple affiliation was nice but now I guess I just send these clients away to get their own computers.
Apple always seems to do stuff like this. They had a big VAR shakeup years ago where good stores seemed to be pinched out. Maybe they were making way for the newer Apple Stores. Who knows.
Anyway, I still love Apple but today I am just a pissed off family member because I am being cut-off from the family again. I nnce was a VAR, then an Apple Business Agent, and maybe now I will become a hobo.
tj
I also wonder why Apple did not just allow Apple Consultants to have a similar online store as the business agents. Maybe they could have just closed down the Apple Business Agent program and rolled it together with the Apple Consultant program so you need to meet certain criteria to become one (ie: help selling $50K per year of product or something) and see how this flew. This would take out the one time sellers of $2000 per year and focus on groups that do help move some product for a living.
I guess I don't really see much benefit to a consultant not being able to make some profit from sales of Apple equipment. Every little bit helps keeps us going and pushing the Apple envelope.
While I love Apple products, the way they are treating their folks who got them where they are, is not unexpected. To summarily drop them is in poor taste at best, immoral at worst, which I think Apple has done. I have just had a miserable experience at an Apple store. It is the most ill run, ill conceived retail store I have ever visited. Apple had best be glad that they are on a roll right now, but rest assured they will crash and crash very hard. This is the easiest call to make I have ever seen. You can only live on glitz for so long. Apple desperately needs to re-think their strategy. Customer service is not like their products. If Apple wants to expand their base from Apple lovers to more mainstream they had better get up to speed. Customers will only put up with this inflated ego attitude for so long. I truly hope they change their ways for I am a long time Apple lover, not a Johnny-come-lately to the Apple party.
While I love Apple products, the way they are treating their folks who got them where they are, is not unexpected. To summarily drop them is in poor taste at best, immoral at worst, which I think Apple has done. I have just had a miserable experience at an Apple store. It is the most ill run, ill conceived retail store I have ever visited. Apple had best be glad that they are on a roll right now, but rest assured they will crash and crash very hard. This is the easiest call to make I have ever seen. You can only live on glitz for so long. Apple desperately needs to re-think their strategy. Customer service is not like their products. If Apple wants to expand their base from Apple lovers to more mainstream they had better get up to speed. Customers will only put up with this inflated ego attitude for so long. I truly hope they change their ways for I am a long time Apple lover, not a Johnny-come-lately to the Apple party.
I don't know what Apple store you went to or why you had a bad experience, but the majority of things I hear about the Apple Retail Stores are positive. My personal experience has just been that the stores are often under-staffed, leaving customers waiting for too long. Other than that, it is a good, unique shopping experience.
Also, if you have ever had to utilize part of a warranty on an Apple product (be in the short-term included warranty or the extended AppleCare), it is unlikely that you would be able to speak negatively of Apple customer service.
I am also a "canceled" ABA and would like to find a similar arrangement with a reseller. Does anyone know if any of the authorized resellers offer commissions to consultants who bring them business ?
Please excuse my ingorance on this topic. I'm rather new to Macs. Does this mean that places like MacMall and other sites will soon be gone? I just bought a Macbook back in March (kind of a test it all out kind of thing) and I am planning on buying a MacPro (Penryn) for myself and an IMac for my wife. However I wanted to buy one from an online retailer that gave me a coupon for a discount on my next purchase.
I guess If I'm understanding this right, that company will be gone soon..
While I love Apple products, the way they are treating their folks who got them where they are, is not unexpected. To summarily drop them is in poor taste at best, immoral at worst, which I think Apple has done. I have just had a miserable experience at an Apple store. It is the most ill run, ill conceived retail store I have ever visited. Apple had best be glad that they are on a roll right now, but rest assured they will crash and crash very hard. This is the easiest call to make I have ever seen. You can only live on glitz for so long. Apple desperately needs to re-think their strategy. Customer service is not like their products. If Apple wants to expand their base from Apple lovers to more mainstream they had better get up to speed. Customers will only put up with this inflated ego attitude for so long. I truly hope they change their ways for I am a long time Apple lover, not a Johnny-come-lately to the Apple party.
I share the same sentiment as you. The Apple store that is three miles from my residence is terrible when it comes to customer service so I drive twenty-three miles to go to one that is decent about customer service and to purchase items. In the trading circles I deal with there is the consensus that Apple is becoming like other corporations equating to less interest in holding Apple stocks or options. As much as I enjoy, and as long as I have been purchasing Apple products (since 1984), I too am changing my stance on Apple unless something changes, which I doubt.
I don't know what Apple store you went to or why you had a bad experience, but the majority of things I hear about the Apple Retail Stores are positive. My personal experience has just been that the stores are often under-staffed, leaving customers waiting for too long. Other than that, it is a good, unique shopping experience.
A unique shopping experience is private shopping at Saks Fifth Avenue, Nordstrom, or having your clothes hand tailored from a shop in Savile Row. Apple has followed the Bang & Olufsen model for stores regarding tenant improvements and FF&E, but not staff.
Please excuse my ingorance on this topic. I'm rather new to Macs. Does this mean that places like MacMall and other sites will soon be gone? I just bought a Macbook back in March (kind of a test it all out kind of thing) and I am planning on buying a MacPro (Penryn) for myself and an IMac for my wife. However I wanted to buy one from an online retailer that gave me a coupon for a discount on my next purchase.
I guess If I'm understanding this right, that company will be gone soon..
The thread is discussing another group of people/ businesses that Apple used to distribute it's products called Business Agents.
There is no reason to believe that MacMall or similar resellers are being dropped by Apple
A unique shopping experience is private shopping at Saks Fifth Avenue, Nordstrom, or having your clothes hand tailored from a shop in Savile Row. Apple has followed the Bang & Olufsen model for stores regarding tenant improvements and FF&E, but not staff.
Private shopping? You mean like the Personal Shopping that Apple Stores offer where you make an appointment and have an Apple employee only helping you for an hour?
Comments
How long before the smaller independent Apple Dealers get the same treatment?
Those people are free to pursue an ACR (Apple Certified Reseller) status, this status isn't going anywhere (at least not for a long time) it is what the large stores have. (MicroCenter, MacMall, Circuit City ..etc.) They just have to do a certain volume every year.
I don't know if that's an indicator though, I know a lot of small single location shops that don't have a web site or a very good one - but the actual shop is still often good. They weren't Apple-affiliated or sold/serviced Apple products, but the quality of the web presence can often be quite different from their real presence.
When you go to a consulting firm web site and there isn't a contact person, street address or phone number, I would be very suspect.
When you go to a consulting firm web site and there isn't a contact person, street address or phone number, I would be very suspect.
Maybe, but that's not a proof of the argument. It's hard for me to explain, but for most people, I don't think they look on the Internet to find a local business. The Internet isn't their market, nor is it their means of promoting themselves because their market doesn't need a business that has a web site.
Yes. Many are. Again, quite a few web sites are down, don't display Apple anywhere and/or, have no brick/mortar contact info.
I am a Business Agent and a Certified Member of the Apple Consultants Network. I used my AABA status so I could order product, prepare for installation and install that product seamlessly... as a single resource for my clients. My Business' website (www.macintek.com) has its affiliation quite prominently displayed.
I, for one, am insulted by the arrogance of this cancellation. There are agents who sell six-figure numbers every year and those who barely make the twenty-grand quota. Apple's margins on those sales are plenty enough to cover the cost of the program. Having been one of the pilot group guinea pigs, I've watched the program grow... even to the point where Apple no longer considered it a "Pilot Program". What I have seen is the politics of Corporate Apple... there are those who see a value in grass-roots evangelism of the brand (classic Apple philosophy) and those who believe in a more formal model where the brand can only be represented by uniformed, salaried employees of the government... err... corporation (Apple Retail, Small Business and Enterprise Channels).
The model that our program fit was one that encouraged cooperation, one that saw a niche for both the retail space and a more personal, consultancy-based approach. In essence.. there's room in the retail world for both of us so... let's consider ourselves on the same team... after all, it ought to be US against Windows, not US against US.
Unfortunately, a more aggressive and less ethical model won a battle that many didn't even realize was being fought...
I first saw it when, at MacWorld, I noticed a small (AABA) table just inside the Hall, against the wall... I then saw another Table right as you enter the Hall at the front of the Apple Booth with a banner advertising Apple Business Sales. They had brochures. We had none. The had a link on the main Apple online store. We didn't. They appeared to have the support of Apple, we didn't. We have always been the red-headed stepchild.
The next year... just after Thanksgiving... I became aware of the internal policy of Apple Retail and Small Business Channels to raid AABA clients' saved shopping carts and use that information to hijack our customers. This is not paranoid suspicion, it was confirmed by Apple as a policy of the channel.
Then, there was the on-again, off-again access to refurbs, the iPhone sales and, finally, the virtual abandonment of the AABA store website, only to have that rectified less than a week before the program's cancellation notices were sent out... The web site was fixed the same time the notices were begin printed. Someone at Apple is getting a sick thrill out of teasing AABAs. They clearly don't respect us... and I have nothing but distain for them.
Please note that I am not referring to anyone who worked so hard to make the program succeed (which it did). I am referring to the greedy, self-possessed control freaks who fought against a program that wasn't harming their bottom line in the least.
Apple, as a corporation, has fallen into the same mold as HP... they had a fine philosophy for many years... then, someone hires an outsider to ramp up the retail channel (week before last) and, in their arrogance, they decide to make cuts for the sake of making cuts to establish themselves. And we got trampled. 'Sounds like a stereotypical mega corporation to me...
What ever happened to "Think Different"?
We were participating in this program. We loved it.
I also am a participating member for the last year or so. I really liked it. I was invited by Apple to join as I worked for an Apple VAR at the time and to continue being an VAR, you needed to buy $100K per year. Sometimes we met that... other times we did not. So, they killed out account and I decided to join as an independent to the Business Agent program.
I am also bummed it is being disbanded. It was a nice way to earn a few $$ off of the referrals and helping Apple sell more Macs into business markets. I install these iMacs as POS systems at retail stores. So, having an Apple affiliation was nice but now I guess I just send these clients away to get their own computers.
Apple always seems to do stuff like this. They had a big VAR shakeup years ago where good stores seemed to be pinched out. Maybe they were making way for the newer Apple Stores. Who knows.
Anyway, I still love Apple but today I am just a pissed off family member because I am being cut-off from the family again. I nnce was a VAR, then an Apple Business Agent, and maybe now I will become a hobo.
tj
I also am a participating member for the last year or so. I really liked it. I was invited by Apple to join as I worked for an Apple VAR at the time and to continue being an VAR, you needed to buy $100K per year. Sometimes we met that... other times we did not. So, they killed out account and I decided to join as an independent to the Business Agent program.
I am also bummed it is being disbanded. It was a nice way to earn a few $$ off of the referrals and helping Apple sell more Macs into business markets. I install these iMacs as POS systems at retail stores. So, having an Apple affiliation was nice but now I guess I just send these clients away to get their own computers.
Apple always seems to do stuff like this. They had a big VAR shakeup years ago where good stores seemed to be pinched out. Maybe they were making way for the newer Apple Stores. Who knows.
Anyway, I still love Apple but today I am just a pissed off family member because I am being cut-off from the family again. I nnce was a VAR, then an Apple Business Agent, and maybe now I will become a hobo.
tj
I also wonder why Apple did not just allow Apple Consultants to have a similar online store as the business agents. Maybe they could have just closed down the Apple Business Agent program and rolled it together with the Apple Consultant program so you need to meet certain criteria to become one (ie: help selling $50K per year of product or something) and see how this flew. This would take out the one time sellers of $2000 per year and focus on groups that do help move some product for a living.
I guess I don't really see much benefit to a consultant not being able to make some profit from sales of Apple equipment. Every little bit helps keeps us going and pushing the Apple envelope.
tj
While I love Apple products, the way they are treating their folks who got them where they are, is not unexpected. To summarily drop them is in poor taste at best, immoral at worst, which I think Apple has done. I have just had a miserable experience at an Apple store. It is the most ill run, ill conceived retail store I have ever visited. Apple had best be glad that they are on a roll right now, but rest assured they will crash and crash very hard. This is the easiest call to make I have ever seen. You can only live on glitz for so long. Apple desperately needs to re-think their strategy. Customer service is not like their products. If Apple wants to expand their base from Apple lovers to more mainstream they had better get up to speed. Customers will only put up with this inflated ego attitude for so long. I truly hope they change their ways for I am a long time Apple lover, not a Johnny-come-lately to the Apple party.
I don't know what Apple store you went to or why you had a bad experience, but the majority of things I hear about the Apple Retail Stores are positive. My personal experience has just been that the stores are often under-staffed, leaving customers waiting for too long. Other than that, it is a good, unique shopping experience.
Also, if you have ever had to utilize part of a warranty on an Apple product (be in the short-term included warranty or the extended AppleCare), it is unlikely that you would be able to speak negatively of Apple customer service.
My $0.02.
I guess If I'm understanding this right, that company will be gone soon..
While I love Apple products, the way they are treating their folks who got them where they are, is not unexpected. To summarily drop them is in poor taste at best, immoral at worst, which I think Apple has done. I have just had a miserable experience at an Apple store. It is the most ill run, ill conceived retail store I have ever visited. Apple had best be glad that they are on a roll right now, but rest assured they will crash and crash very hard. This is the easiest call to make I have ever seen. You can only live on glitz for so long. Apple desperately needs to re-think their strategy. Customer service is not like their products. If Apple wants to expand their base from Apple lovers to more mainstream they had better get up to speed. Customers will only put up with this inflated ego attitude for so long. I truly hope they change their ways for I am a long time Apple lover, not a Johnny-come-lately to the Apple party.
I share the same sentiment as you. The Apple store that is three miles from my residence is terrible when it comes to customer service so I drive twenty-three miles to go to one that is decent about customer service and to purchase items. In the trading circles I deal with there is the consensus that Apple is becoming like other corporations equating to less interest in holding Apple stocks or options. As much as I enjoy, and as long as I have been purchasing Apple products (since 1984), I too am changing my stance on Apple unless something changes, which I doubt.
I don't know what Apple store you went to or why you had a bad experience, but the majority of things I hear about the Apple Retail Stores are positive. My personal experience has just been that the stores are often under-staffed, leaving customers waiting for too long. Other than that, it is a good, unique shopping experience.
A unique shopping experience is private shopping at Saks Fifth Avenue, Nordstrom, or having your clothes hand tailored from a shop in Savile Row. Apple has followed the Bang & Olufsen model for stores regarding tenant improvements and FF&E, but not staff.
Please excuse my ingorance on this topic. I'm rather new to Macs. Does this mean that places like MacMall and other sites will soon be gone? I just bought a Macbook back in March (kind of a test it all out kind of thing) and I am planning on buying a MacPro (Penryn) for myself and an IMac for my wife. However I wanted to buy one from an online retailer that gave me a coupon for a discount on my next purchase.
I guess If I'm understanding this right, that company will be gone soon..
The thread is discussing another group of people/ businesses that Apple used to distribute it's products called Business Agents.
There is no reason to believe that MacMall or similar resellers are being dropped by Apple
A unique shopping experience is private shopping at Saks Fifth Avenue, Nordstrom, or having your clothes hand tailored from a shop in Savile Row. Apple has followed the Bang & Olufsen model for stores regarding tenant improvements and FF&E, but not staff.
Private shopping? You mean like the Personal Shopping that Apple Stores offer where you make an appointment and have an Apple employee only helping you for an hour?