What's the point on being this picky? It just has to work.
This is a few years off still.
Keep in mind that this would be AT&T's decision, not Apple.
Perhaps you were thinking along these lines, but it would be mostly useful for display from iPhone to TV, not really for display on the iPhone itself.
Hey this is a wish list. I also want to win the lottery.
I really want silverthorne or menlow because I think the device will be more powerful and able to run more apps. Any x86 osx app could possibly be ported to it. Yes with keynote I'd like a viewer that I can out put to a TV or projector.
I know a lot of people want 3g, but I've got that on my razor and meh. Perhaps I've shitty 3g service but its never impressed me. I want 4g. Yes, I'm a greedy bastard.
maybe i'm missing something here...but why is steve jobs so specific/ explicit about which features an apple product should have, rather than this partly being determined by customer demand? there are many features i have listed that many people would be happy to see, so why should jobs not include these, even if customers are screaming they would really like to have them?
If you wrote all of the features you're looking for on 1 piece of paper and all of the features the iPhone has on another then asked a random person which piece of paper they'd rather have, they'd most likely pick yours. The problem is that Apple doesn't make much money selling paper.
If you shoehorn all of those features into a phone, you'll wind up with a phone like the Nokia N95: big and expensive with a clumsy interface (full disclosure: I'm basing the "clumsy interface" bit on 5 minutes of playing with the phone at a Nokia kiosk in the mall, so take with a grain of salt. That said, the 5 minutes I've spent with an iPhone were much more enjoyable).
Under Jobs, Apple tends to design around the 80% rule. That is, they make a product that easily and intuitively does what 80% of its users will want it to do. 80% of customers aren't screaming for 3G and GPS (at least, not in the US, and like it or not, Apple designs for the US). A very vocal minority of customers are, but don't confuse volume with numbers.
If you wrote all of the features you're looking for on 1 piece of paper and all of the features the iPhone has on another then asked a random person which piece of paper they'd rather have, they'd most likely pick yours. The problem is that Apple doesn't make much money selling paper.
If you shoehorn all of those features into a phone, you'll wind up with a phone like the Nokia N95: big and expensive with a clumsy interface (full disclosure: I'm basing the "clumsy interface" bit on 5 minutes of playing with the phone at a Nokia kiosk in the mall, so take with a grain of salt. That said, the 5 minutes I've spent with an iPhone were much more enjoyable).
Under Jobs, Apple tends to design around the 80% rule. That is, they make a product that easily and intuitively does what 80% of its users will want it to do. 80% of customers aren't screaming for 3G and GPS (at least, not in the US, and like it or not, Apple designs for the US). A very vocal minority of customers are, but don't confuse volume with numbers.
1) the iphone is not cheap compared to the nokia n95
2) 80% rule? so you're happy to pay premium money for a product that isn't the best it can be?
3) i disagree with this argument of being in a minority - if it was such a small minority no phone maker would include many of these features as they would not prove to be cost effective
i believe apple will have to introduce a new model to fill the gap that was left when they cut the price of the iphone by $200 - and it would have to have features that the current phone does not, in order to justify the higher price. maybe more memory, features,etc?
1) the iphone is not cheap compared to the nokia n95
2) 80% rule? so you're happy to pay premium money for a product that isn't the best it can be?
3) i disagree with this argument of being in a minority - if it was such a small minority no phone maker would include many of these features as they would not prove to be cost effective
Okay, lets look at the numbers.
I don't know how many different models of cell phones there are, but there are about 10 that have all of the fetures in question. So imagine there are around 100 cell thone models. that means that
1/10 cell phones have these fetures. so if 10% of people want it, then wellah, wehave a perfect figure
Also, how is 599 cheaper than 399?
Quote:
Originally Posted by zed888
i believe apple will have to introduce a new model to fill the gap that was left when they cut the price of the iphone by $200 - and it would have to have features that the current phone does not, in order to justify the higher price. maybe more memory, features,etc?
There is no gap! the iPhone(current) will be the high-end iPhone when other models are realeased
i really hope someone of influence at apple reads this, as i say this not only on my own behalf, but also on behalf of others that have considered buying the iphone but have been discouraged from doing so. if apple can incorporate the following into a future version of the iphone i would be first in the queue to buy, becuse as it currently stands the iphone asks for too many compromises for me to justify. i would like:
Frankly for a model #1 the iPhone is a rather nice hardware package. Its shortcomings are mostly software related. Does that mean I have a iPhone - nope. It just means that it doesn't have the feature set I'd like to see on my next cell upgrade, it can hardly be called compromised.
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1) 3G + wi fi
3G is coming but it just isn't the shinny new rock that many think it is. Instead of a diamond it is really a bit like quartz. That is it looks good but really doesn't have a lot of value in it.
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2) a substantially improved camera (5 megapixel?) with autofocus/ flash
I have a love hate relationship with cell phone cameras. One the quality has never been there and two they aren't permitted in places I have to go. That being said if the 5 mega pixel camera was of extremely high quality I'd certainly go for it.
The good news here is that there has been a huge amount of research going on with respect to advance camera optics and detectors all to be squished into a cell phone. If you want an update go to the local library and get the recent copy of PHOTONICS that has the articles on cell phone tech. The biggest problem as I can see it is the research stage that some of the projects are in. So a 5 mega pixel camera, With REALLY good quality, is a possibility in the future.
Do to the potential in the future for video conferencing I'd like to see a camera that swivels front to back. That would be very useful.
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3) the ability to record video clips on it at 30 fps
I wouldn't be surprised if this is a software update. In any event we should state exactly what you mean by video clips. That is the horizontal and vertical resolution. The quality though will have to be worth it.
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4) GPS for satnav
I think the biggest problem here is the lack of space in the current iPhone for the chip set and antennae. A larger iPhone would handle this nicely though.
As to complaints about power usage that is frankly crap as the chip could be shut down for the most part until you need it.
For Apple this is a fantastic opportunity. In fact I kinda wish they would buy up Garmin or one of the other GPS suppliers. If they do this though the phone needs to ship with full coverage of the USA and also be easily upgradeable map wise.
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5) in-built radio (FM and DAB digital radio)
This is incredibly handy to have and I don't know why Apple has resisted the demand from the masses. Lets face it the tech can be had built into WiFi chips so the incremental cost is very little.
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6)replaceable battery and SIM
The soldered in battery is a big turn off there is no doubt about that. For commercial usage it is almost mandatory. Even having you phone off line to swap batteries can be a problem, having to send things out for battery replacement is a killer.
On the other hand I do understand that the reliability factor of a soldered in battery is huge. Maybe a design that makes local servicing much more effective might be the answer.
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7) the ability to upgrade the memory with a memory card + more internal storage (16GB?)
This I agree with 100%. But lets face it the model 1 iPhone isn't to bad and we all know and realize that expanded capacity machines will come in the future.
An SD slot would be just the nuts too. The problem is does this fit in with Apples vision for the platform? Until we see a mobile "FINDER" I don't see this happening.
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8) the ability to customise the interface as you wish (wallpapers, icons?), and be able to use the songs you have saved on this phone as your ringtone. also the ability to change the icon shortcuts.
I'm not sure I see the value in a lot of the above, but you do realize that a SDK is coming. What that SDK offers up is an open question in many a mind right now. Basically you are ahead of the curve right now.
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9) the opportunity to buy an unlocked iphone
Frankly you have two options here buy unlocked devices form someone else and make Apple very aware of why you did so. Or you can lobby the government to clean up the cell industry as a whole. Basically as an individual you are screwed here as any influence you have is minor.
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10) the option for haptic (vibrating) feedback when you press a virtual key, so you know you've pressed a key
Sounds like a garbage idea to me. The feed back means nothing if you press the wrong key.
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11) a hard button for the camera + hardbutton for camera zoom
Yeah I totally agree with the idea of a "shutter release" button. That button should be labeled so that it is totally obvious what it does and it should do only that. Zoom I don't know about to be honest, the problem being that you will quickly run out of space around the rim of the machine.
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12) longer battery life
Of Course. You do realize though that most of your requests will lower battery life.
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13)standard headjack so you can use your own headphones
I'm not convinced that that is a good idea. If I remember correctly the idea with the present arrangement was to increase the reliability of the iPhones hardware.
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14)voice memo recorder
SDK is coming.
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i only ask for things that are currently available in other top-end phones, and i would be prepared to pay more for a premium phone with all of the above. all i ask is for the iphone to be able to fully compete with the best out there.
I've been looking at the smart phone market for some time and if you carefully consider what the iPhone does it is a pretty impressive first attempt in the cell phone market place. Most of what I've looked at isn't really that competitive with Apple's iPhone. It is a sum of the parts thing, just consider what out there is competitive with Apples web browser and e-mail programs.
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an iphone with all the above would be my ultimate dream phone...\
Most of what you described above is very possible. What Apple will go for is another matter all together. In any event below is what I see as the perfect iPhone machine #2:
1.
A larger screen. It would be nice if the screen would gain about one half to three quarters of an inch in in height and keep a 16:9 ratio. Triming in the bezels on te left and fight ends a bit should give us a machine that is only slightly longer than the present. The screen resolution should be close to 720x480. This wouldn't be to bad of a machine in the pocket yet would be extremely useful once out of the pocket.
2.
More Flash as already has been mentioned. Hopefully the littel extra space afforded by the size increase will allow us to Expand that flash at low cost.
3.
A USB host port. Using a standard USB connector. The idea here of course is access to USB devices especially Flash cards and self powered disk drives. Access to real cameras wouldn't hurt either. The goal is to exploit the fact that a smart phone is a computer and to also provide a solid and quick system backup.
4.
An SD or compact flash port. Frankly I'd like to see the USB host port first as that would be far more flexible.
5.
Finish the software, a key part of which is getting things like the Bluetooth stack fully fleshed out. The slow evolution of the units OS is a real killer.
6.
Obviously a chipset/SOc upgrade is in order. As long as it is ARM based. I don't want any sort of Intel processor in the unit as I simply don't think Intel will ever be able to get the power usage low enough. Fortunately there is a huge amount of development going on with respect ot ARM SOC's designed for the cell space. The question is which way will Apple go. Frankly I'd like to see a dual core chip. Not dual core in the sense of an ARM and a DSP but rather two ARM chips capable of being applications processors.
7.
Disk mode and or a "FINDER" for mobile. This is a glaring and disgusting problem as Apple should have addressed this right out of the gate. Without such it is very difficult to leverage the iPhone for more advanced usage.
8.
Fix up the web browser to allow access to the local store and make sure it can more fully handle the average web site. The motivation is as follows. First; it allows one to view HTML documentation off line. Second; the iPhone needs to be able to handle even more on line web sights. In any event Apple needs to realize the extremely handy nature of being able to carry larges amounts of documentation/books around in the palm of your hand.
9.
For much the same reasons as above a good solid stand alone PDF reader is needed.
10.
I'd love to see a line in plug. A primary use here would be plugging in more effective microphones. The idea being that such a port would be used in conjunction with a audio recording program. This would be great for lectures, conferneces and such. Yes I realize the iPod connector already provides some of that capability but lets face it standard phono plugs are way easier to deal with and are compatible with a wide array of hardware. Ideally this would be another analog channel too, so that you don't loose the iPod connectors inputs nor the headset jacks capabilities.
11.
More RAM. I'm not sure why Apple has resisted the idea of Adobe Flash and a few other technologies, but the lack of RAM space could be a big issue here. For a start I'd like to see it doubled. This should allow for a much more useful browser that supports plugins and such.
12.
As has been mentioned GPS. But I want a high quality implementation. That would include sensitive hardware and a good antennae. The better electronics is one reason I'd like to see the larger model iPhone. If Apple implements this it needs to be able to compete with the best electronically. Of course an app that supports local storage of high resolution maps are in order. Ideally this software would make use of multitouch for zooming and such. Integration will Goolge earth would be nice also but we can't loose site of the fact that the software must be off line capable.
So that is what I want. A lot to stuff into the current iPhone. Not at all impossible as there are some very interesting technologies coming online next year. Especially with chip sets and SOC, that target the phone market specifically. But most important to me is the larger screen as I want to be able to see more.
Seeing more means the iPhone 2 becomes much more usable when stepping outside of the area of just being a phone. Screen size puts the smart into smart phones.
Frankly for a model #1 the iPhone is a rather nice hardware package. Its shortcomings are mostly software related. Does that mean I have a iPhone - nope. It just means that it doesn't have the feature set I'd like to see on my next cell upgrade, it can hardly be called compromised.
3G is coming but it just isn't the shinny new rock that many think it is. Instead of a diamond it is really a bit like quartz. That is it looks good but really doesn't have a lot of value in it.
I have a love hate relationship with cell phone cameras. One the quality has never been there and two they aren't permitted in places I have to go. That being said if the 5 mega pixel camera was of extremely high quality I'd certainly go for it.
The good news here is that there has been a huge amount of research going on with respect to advance camera optics and detectors all to be squished into a cell phone. If you want an update go to the local library and get the recent copy of PHOTONICS that has the articles on cell phone tech. The biggest problem as I can see it is the research stage that some of the projects are in. So a 5 mega pixel camera, With REALLY good quality, is a possibility in the future.
Do to the potential in the future for video conferencing I'd like to see a camera that swivels front to back. That would be very useful.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is a software update. In any event we should state exactly what you mean by video clips. That is the horizontal and vertical resolution. The quality though will have to be worth it.
I think the biggest problem here is the lack of space in the current iPhone for the chip set and antennae. A larger iPhone would handle this nicely though.
As to complaints about power usage that is frankly crap as the chip could be shut down for the most part until you need it.
For Apple this is a fantastic opportunity. In fact I kinda wish they would buy up Garmin or one of the other GPS suppliers. If they do this though the phone needs to ship with full coverage of the USA and also be easily upgradeable map wise.
This is incredibly handy to have and I don't know why Apple has resisted the demand from the masses. Lets face it the tech can be had built into WiFi chips so the incremental cost is very little.
The soldered in battery is a big turn off there is no doubt about that. For commercial usage it is almost mandatory. Even having you phone off line to swap batteries can be a problem, having to send things out for battery replacement is a killer.
On the other hand I do understand that the reliability factor of a soldered in battery is huge. Maybe a design that makes local servicing much more effective might be the answer.
This I agree with 100%. But lets face it the model 1 iPhone isn't to bad and we all know and realize that expanded capacity machines will come in the future.
An SD slot would be just the nuts too. The problem is does this fit in with Apples vision for the platform? Until we see a mobile "FINDER" I don't see this happening.
I'm not sure I see the value in a lot of the above, but you do realize that a SDK is coming. What that SDK offers up is an open question in many a mind right now. Basically you are ahead of the curve right now.
Frankly you have two options here buy unlocked devices form someone else and make Apple very aware of why you did so. Or you can lobby the government to clean up the cell industry as a whole. Basically as an individual you are screwed here as any influence you have is minor.
Sounds like a garbage idea to me. The feed back means nothing if you press the wrong key.
Yeah I totally agree with the idea of a "shutter release" button. That button should be labeled so that it is totally obvious what it does and it should do only that. Zoom I don't know about to be honest, the problem being that you will quickly run out of space around the rim of the machine.
Of Course. You do realize though that most of your requests will lower battery life.
I'm not convinced that that is a good idea. If I remember correctly the idea with the present arrangement was to increase the reliability of the iPhones hardware.
SDK is coming.
I've been looking at the smart phone market for some time and if you carefully consider what the iPhone does it is a pretty impressive first attempt in the cell phone market place. Most of what I've looked at isn't really that competitive with Apple's iPhone. It is a sum of the parts thing, just consider what out there is competitive with Apples web browser and e-mail programs.
Most of what you described above is very possible. What Apple will go for is another matter all together. In any event below is what I see as the perfect iPhone machine #2:
1.
A larger screen. It would be nice if the screen would gain about one half to three quarters of an inch in in height and keep a 16:9 ratio. Triming in the bezels on te left and fight ends a bit should give us a machine that is only slightly longer than the present. The screen resolution should be close to 720x480. This wouldn't be to bad of a machine in the pocket yet would be extremely useful once out of the pocket.
2.
More Flash as already has been mentioned. Hopefully the littel extra space afforded by the size increase will allow us to Expand that flash at low cost.
3.
A USB host port. Using a standard USB connector. The idea here of course is access to USB devices especially Flash cards and self powered disk drives. Access to real cameras wouldn't hurt either. The goal is to exploit the fact that a smart phone is a computer and to also provide a solid and quick system backup.
4.
An SD or compact flash port. Frankly I'd like to see the USB host port first as that would be far more flexible.
5.
Finish the software, a key part of which is getting things like the Bluetooth stack fully fleshed out. The slow evolution of the units OS is a real killer.
6.
Obviously a chipset/SOc upgrade is in order. As long as it is ARM based. I don't want any sort of Intel processor in the unit as I simply don't think Intel will ever be able to get the power usage low enough. Fortunately there is a huge amount of development going on with respect ot ARM SOC's designed for the cell space. The question is which way will Apple go. Frankly I'd like to see a dual core chip. Not dual core in the sense of an ARM and a DSP but rather two ARM chips capable of being applications processors.
7.
Disk mode and or a "FINDER" for mobile. This is a glaring and disgusting problem as Apple should have addressed this right out of the gate. Without such it is very difficult to leverage the iPhone for more advanced usage.
8.
Fix up the web browser to allow access to the local store and make sure it can more fully handle the average web site. The motivation is as follows. First; it allows one to view HTML documentation off line. Second; the iPhone needs to be able to handle even more on line web sights. In any event Apple needs to realize the extremely handy nature of being able to carry larges amounts of documentation/books around in the palm of your hand.
9.
For much the same reasons as above a good solid stand alone PDF reader is needed.
10.
I'd love to see a line in plug. A primary use here would be plugging in more effective microphones. The idea being that such a port would be used in conjunction with a audio recording program. This would be great for lectures, conferneces and such. Yes I realize the iPod connector already provides some of that capability but lets face it standard phono plugs are way easier to deal with and are compatible with a wide array of hardware. Ideally this would be another analog channel too, so that you don't loose the iPod connectors inputs nor the headset jacks capabilities.
11.
More RAM. I'm not sure why Apple has resisted the idea of Adobe Flash and a few other technologies, but the lack of RAM space could be a big issue here. For a start I'd like to see it doubled. This should allow for a much more useful browser that supports plugins and such.
12.
As has been mentioned GPS. But I want a high quality implementation. That would include sensitive hardware and a good antennae. The better electronics is one reason I'd like to see the larger model iPhone. If Apple implements this it needs to be able to compete with the best electronically. Of course an app that supports local storage of high resolution maps are in order. Ideally this software would make use of multitouch for zooming and such. Integration will Goolge earth would be nice also but we can't loose site of the fact that the software must be off line capable.
So that is what I want. A lot to stuff into the current iPhone. Not at all impossible as there are some very interesting technologies coming online next year. Especially with chip sets and SOC, that target the phone market specifically. But most important to me is the larger screen as I want to be able to see more.
Seeing more means the iPhone 2 becomes much more usable when stepping outside of the area of just being a phone. Screen size puts the smart into smart phones.
Dave
thank you wizard69. a comprehensive and well thoughtout answer, with views that compliment many of mine greatly. i only wish there were more like yourself that could see past the limitations of the iphone and understand what a great device it truly could become, given the opportunity...
No offense Zed, but it's painfully clear you don't own an iPhone--have you used one for any length of time? The complete experience of using it is so much better than my old phone that it's difficult to express--and it has very little to do with the megapixel level of the camera.
Put it another way--what phone has the features you're describing with a full touchscreen interface that SEAMLESSLY (and I emphasize that!) syncs and interfaces with my primary computer and provides at least 8 gigs of storage room for audio and video. If it does everything on your wish list AND the things I just described and was priced comparably to the iPhone (I only bought at $400, so I'm really not willing to pay more, frankly)--well, tell us about it.
No offense Zed, but it's painfully clear you don't own an iPhone--have you used one for any length of time? The complete experience of using it is so much better than my old phone that it's difficult to express--and it has very little to do with the megapixel level of the camera.
Put it another way--what phone has the features you're describing with a full touchscreen interface that SEAMLESSLY (and I emphasize that!) syncs and interfaces with my primary computer and provides at least 8 gigs of storage room for audio and video. If it does everything on your wish list AND the things I just described and was priced comparably to the iPhone (I only bought at $400, so I'm really not willing to pay more, frankly)--well, tell us about it.
Thank you! that's what I've been trying to say for a week.
32GB of flash may not currently be possible, due to form-factor limitations.
It's definitely possible. It's really just a thickness issue, and not that big of an issue in the first place. 32 MB of flash storage would require 4 flash packages of the one currently in existing in the iPhone:
The flash package is underneath the felt looking pad next to the SIM slot and battery in this picture. This is the same sort of flash package that must fit inside SDHC cards that are available now, so they are pretty small.
Apple can put 4 of these in the iPhone, but it would require another 1 to 2 mm of thickness making the iPhone 13 to 14mm in thickness rather than 11.5. With increased volume, the battery can also be increased in size or a user replaceable battery compartment created. This also will result in increased weight and a battery compartment will make it more flimsy. There's a lot of things Apple must balance, and thinness and robustness wins out. Only enough room for 1 flash storage package was made.
The biggest issue is also price. 4 8-GB flash packages would cost $280 and would likely result in a $700 iPhone. That's a pretty extreme price for a very targeted consumer product.
I am however quite disappointed that Apple didn't make room for at least 2 or 3 flash packages in the iPhone and made a strategic mistake by shipping iPhone version 1 (and maybe iPod shuffle version 3) with only 4 and 8 GB storage. With the iPod, Apple made, makes, it a very attractive product because it always has a GB/$ advantage over its competitors. The iPhone, especially with its features, requires lots of memory just for average usage. By only usage 1 flash package, it'll allow iPhone competitors, which has microSD slots, to catch up in about a year.
If it shipped at 8 and 16 GB (or 12 and 24), it becomes a more respectable product for Apple's core iPod users, and would prevent phones with microSDHC or SDHC slots from ever catching up other than through carrying multiple cards (you'll need 4 microSD cards at its current 2 GB max capacity, and that's 3 too many).
Some sort of thing for the iPod shuffle (needs 2 GB), and iPod touch (needs 12/24 or 16/32).
No offense Zed, but it's painfully clear you don't own an iPhone--have you used one for any length of time? The complete experience of using it is so much better than my old phone that it's difficult to express--and it has very little to do with the megapixel level of the camera.
In many ways I understand Zed's desires. The iPhone may work very well for you but I'm not convinced that it is ready to make me happy. In your case though it id doing very well from your comments. the difference is that in my case I want more computer like accessibility to the device. Much of that has already been achieved via hacking but I want an officially support direction from Apple.
By the way this shouldn't 't scare away anybody as it does not need to change the user interface much at all. Since the iPhone isn't all there yet I just sit and wait with my prepaid cheapo phone. The thing with zed's [posting is that much of what he wants can be had with solid software updates to the camera.
As to the cell camera they all pretty much suck at the moment. I do have a lot of hope here.
[/quote]
Put it another way--what phone has the features you're describing with a full touchscreen interface that SEAMLESSLY (and I emphasize that!) syncs and interfaces with my primary computer and provides at least 8 gigs of storage room for audio and video. If it does everything on your wish list AND the things I just described and was priced comparably to the iPhone (I only bought at $400, so I'm really not willing to pay more, frankly)--well, tell us about it.[/QUOTE]
The fact that such a beast doesn't exists does make the desire for one any less. Lets face it not many here can talk about owning an Apple 1 but a conversation about Apple 2's would go a long way. I believe the iPhone is much like the Apple 1, a very interesting technology implementation that could be improved significantly in the next rev. Considering the size of the Cell phone market I think that is a very good comparison. Apple is looking for 1%, that is ONE PERCENT of the world wide cell phone business with the iPhone 1. To get a significantly larger cut of that market place they will need to introduce what in effect is an Apple 2, a device that attracts the masses.
Actually Apple needs to do more than just that as they need additional devices that support people who have profoundly different needs. Mostly what I'm thinking about here is the people that are non smart phone users and are likely to never want one.
It all comes down to Apple either becoming significant in the cell market place or not.
I've been looking at the smart phone market for some time and if you carefully consider what the iPhone does it is a pretty impressive first attempt in the cell phone market place. Most of what I've looked at isn't really that competitive with Apple's iPhone. It is a sum of the parts thing, just consider what out there is competitive with Apples web browser and e-mail programs.
No doubt. It's a very competitive product as a gen 1 otherwise Apple wouldn't have let it out the door.
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Most of what you described above is very possible. What Apple will go for is another matter all together. In any event below is what I see as the perfect iPhone machine #2
You guys want a handheld computer. Should it be called iPhone? Maybe not.
Quote:
1. A larger screen. It would be nice if the screen would gain about one half to three quarters of an inch in in height and keep a 16:9 ratio. Triming in the bezels on te left and fight ends a bit should give us a machine that is only slightly longer than the present. The screen resolution should be close to 720x480. This wouldn't be to bad of a machine in the pocket yet would be extremely useful once out of the pocket.
They can have a 4 inch 3:2 screen in the current form factor if they can make the left and right bezels only 0.10 inch and have it maintain its structural robustness. And yup, increase the resolution would be great for web browsing.
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2. More Flash as already has been mentioned. Hopefully the littel extra space afforded by the size increase will allow us to Expand that flash at low cost.
This is a thickness issue.
Quote:
3. A USB host port. Using a standard USB connector. The idea here of course is access to USB devices especially Flash cards and self powered disk drives. Access to real cameras wouldn't hurt either. The goal is to exploit the fact that a smart phone is a computer and to also provide a solid and quick system backup.
Well, an iPod connector to USB port dongle would be fine...
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4. An SD or compact flash port. Frankly I'd like to see the USB host port first as that would be far more flexible.
Not needed really. They just need to either up the flash storage, currently at about $9/GB or make an 100+ GB HDD version. It's a version 1.0 product however. It'll be crazy to release so many models for a version 1 product though. Maybe version 2.
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5. Finish the software, a key part of which is getting things like the Bluetooth stack fully fleshed out. The slow evolution of the units OS is a real killer.
Well, evolve the software at a faster rate really.
Quote:
6. Obviously a chipset/SOc upgrade is in order. As long as it is ARM based.
You want a handheld hobbyist computer that bad?
Quote:
7.Disk mode and or a "FINDER" for mobile. This is a glaring and disgusting problem as Apple should have addressed this right out of the gate. Without such it is very difficult to leverage the iPhone for more advanced usage.
Well, it is a very targeted product. Yeah, I'm curious to see what Leopard Finder Coverflow and Quicklook would be like on the iPhone.
Quote:
10. I'd love to see a line in plug. A primary use here would be plugging in more effective microphones. The idea being that such a port would be used in conjunction with a audio recording program. This would be great for lectures, conferneces and such. Yes I realize the iPod connector already provides some of that capability but lets face it standard phono plugs are way easier to deal with and are compatible with a wide array of hardware. Ideally this would be another analog channel too, so that you don't loose the iPod connectors inputs nor the headset jacks capabilities.
Umm, how many ports are going to be in your dream phone?
It's definitely possible. It's really just a thickness issue, and not that big of an issue in the first place. 32 MB of flash storage would require 4 flash packages of the one currently in existing in the iPhone:
This is one of these it sort of depends situations. The flash storage could be a multilevel module that is a chip stack.
Quote:
The flash package is underneath the felt looking pad next to the SIM slot and battery in this picture. This is the same sort of flash package that must fit inside SDHC cards that are available now, so they are pretty small.
To bad you didn't remove that felt we may have been able to get a part number and manufacture off the chip.
Quote:
Apple can put 4 of these in the iPhone, but it would require another 1 to 2 mm of thickness making the iPhone 13 to 14mm in thickness rather than 11.5. With increased volume, the battery can also be increased in size or a user replaceable battery compartment created. This also will result in increased weight and a battery compartment will make it more flimsy. There's a lot of things Apple must balance, and thinness and robustness wins out. Only enough room for 1 flash storage package was made.
I agree that robustness has been winning out in Apple's "i" series devices. But he issue of storage is different. For example if SamSung is the manufacture of the you have the possibility of stacked chips and new technology hitting the street in January. I believe Apple would have no trouble at all of doubling storage space on the iPhone come early next year.
Quote:
The biggest issue is also price. 4 8-GB flash packages would cost $280 and would likely result in a $700 iPhone. That's a pretty extreme price for a very targeted consumer product.
Your estimates are way to high. I'd think that $120 would be more like it.
Quote:
I am however quite disappointed that Apple didn't make room for at least 2 or 3 flash packages in the iPhone and made a strategic mistake by shipping iPhone version 1 (and maybe iPod shuffle version 3) with only 4 and 8 GB storage.
I'm not sure it is needed at all. The space that is. As mentioned above there are two possibilities to making an iPhone with more internal memory. I actually think that the vision Apple had for this phone isn't exactly the same as what many of the current users have. Thus they got caught off guard. The quick life span of the 4 GB model is an indication here of a differing consumer perception of the device.
Quote:
With the iPod, Apple made, makes, it a very attractive product because it always has a GB/$ advantage over its competitors. The iPhone, especially with its features, requires lots of memory just for average usage. By only usage 1 flash package, it'll allow iPhone competitors, which has microSD slots, to catch up in about a year.
Considering Apples position within the flash industry I'm pretty sure that they will be able to respond to the higher storage space requirements and still beat out the competition. The reference to SD storage is a wholly different issue in my mind. I do wish that Apple had provided for some sort of user supplied memory, such memory though would result in a bigger package.
Quote:
If it shipped at 8 and 16 GB (or 12 and 24), it becomes a more respectable product for Apple's core iPod users, and would prevent phones with microSDHC or SDHC slots from ever catching up other than through carrying multiple cards (you'll need 4 microSD cards at its current 2 GB max capacity, and that's 3 too many).
Not only the core ipod users but the people who want to use the capabilities of the device in a more aggressive manner.
Quote:
Some sort of thing for the iPod shuffle (needs 2 GB), and iPod touch (needs 12/24 or 16/32).
I agree with the Shuffle and was very surprised that it didn't get rev'ed last year. The Touch I'd like to see go to 32/64 GB on a more advanced platform. That also means keeping he current Touch around for a while. The Current Touch really does meet many peoples needs as is. An Advanced Touch could also become a powerful PDA replacement.
In any event I don't think we are too far away from rev's on one or more of the current devices. By rev here I mean more or less a memory bump. Everything is coming online for it to happen one way or the other. What strikes me as really neat is that by mid year 2008 we should see cell smart phones that are more powerful than the vast majority of the desktop PC's I've ever owned. That is neat.
Comments
What's the point on being this picky? It just has to work.
This is a few years off still.
Keep in mind that this would be AT&T's decision, not Apple.
Perhaps you were thinking along these lines, but it would be mostly useful for display from iPhone to TV, not really for display on the iPhone itself.
Hey this is a wish list. I also want to win the lottery.
I really want silverthorne or menlow because I think the device will be more powerful and able to run more apps. Any x86 osx app could possibly be ported to it. Yes with keynote I'd like a viewer that I can out put to a TV or projector.
I know a lot of people want 3g, but I've got that on my razor and meh. Perhaps I've shitty 3g service but its never impressed me. I want 4g. Yes, I'm a greedy bastard.
maybe i'm missing something here...but why is steve jobs so specific/ explicit about which features an apple product should have, rather than this partly being determined by customer demand? there are many features i have listed that many people would be happy to see, so why should jobs not include these, even if customers are screaming they would really like to have them?
If you wrote all of the features you're looking for on 1 piece of paper and all of the features the iPhone has on another then asked a random person which piece of paper they'd rather have, they'd most likely pick yours. The problem is that Apple doesn't make much money selling paper.
If you shoehorn all of those features into a phone, you'll wind up with a phone like the Nokia N95: big and expensive with a clumsy interface (full disclosure: I'm basing the "clumsy interface" bit on 5 minutes of playing with the phone at a Nokia kiosk in the mall, so take with a grain of salt. That said, the 5 minutes I've spent with an iPhone were much more enjoyable).
Under Jobs, Apple tends to design around the 80% rule. That is, they make a product that easily and intuitively does what 80% of its users will want it to do. 80% of customers aren't screaming for 3G and GPS (at least, not in the US, and like it or not, Apple designs for the US). A very vocal minority of customers are, but don't confuse volume with numbers.
Lemon Bon Bon.
That's all.
I just want a 16gig or 32gig iPhone and a better AT&T reception where I live.
That's all.
And you'd be willing to pay?
And you'd be willing to pay?
Pay for what?
storage? iPhone 16 gig should be $499 at the most. That's fine with me. 32gig might be expensive now, but eventually will drop.
Contract?
Well, I have a Verizon contract, so no matter what I am stuck with a cell service contract.
But you're right, prices will drop. It's a fact of life. :P
I was referring to the 32gb storage, and assuming you'd purchase it if it were out now.
But you're right, prices will drop. It's a fact of life. :P
Not sure how much would cost an iPhone with 32gig now. $599, $699? I would pay $599.
If you wrote all of the features you're looking for on 1 piece of paper and all of the features the iPhone has on another then asked a random person which piece of paper they'd rather have, they'd most likely pick yours. The problem is that Apple doesn't make much money selling paper.
If you shoehorn all of those features into a phone, you'll wind up with a phone like the Nokia N95: big and expensive with a clumsy interface (full disclosure: I'm basing the "clumsy interface" bit on 5 minutes of playing with the phone at a Nokia kiosk in the mall, so take with a grain of salt. That said, the 5 minutes I've spent with an iPhone were much more enjoyable).
Under Jobs, Apple tends to design around the 80% rule. That is, they make a product that easily and intuitively does what 80% of its users will want it to do. 80% of customers aren't screaming for 3G and GPS (at least, not in the US, and like it or not, Apple designs for the US). A very vocal minority of customers are, but don't confuse volume with numbers.
1) the iphone is not cheap compared to the nokia n95
2) 80% rule? so you're happy to pay premium money for a product that isn't the best it can be?
3) i disagree with this argument of being in a minority - if it was such a small minority no phone maker would include many of these features as they would not prove to be cost effective
1) the iphone is not cheap compared to the nokia n95
2) 80% rule? so you're happy to pay premium money for a product that isn't the best it can be?
3) i disagree with this argument of being in a minority - if it was such a small minority no phone maker would include many of these features as they would not prove to be cost effective
Okay, lets look at the numbers.
I don't know how many different models of cell phones there are, but there are about 10 that have all of the fetures in question. So imagine there are around 100 cell thone models. that means that
1/10 cell phones have these fetures. so if 10% of people want it, then wellah, wehave a perfect figure
Also, how is 599 cheaper than 399?
i believe apple will have to introduce a new model to fill the gap that was left when they cut the price of the iphone by $200 - and it would have to have features that the current phone does not, in order to justify the higher price. maybe more memory, features,etc?
There is no gap! the iPhone(current) will be the high-end iPhone when other models are realeased
i really hope someone of influence at apple reads this, as i say this not only on my own behalf, but also on behalf of others that have considered buying the iphone but have been discouraged from doing so. if apple can incorporate the following into a future version of the iphone i would be first in the queue to buy, becuse as it currently stands the iphone asks for too many compromises for me to justify. i would like:
Frankly for a model #1 the iPhone is a rather nice hardware package. Its shortcomings are mostly software related. Does that mean I have a iPhone - nope. It just means that it doesn't have the feature set I'd like to see on my next cell upgrade, it can hardly be called compromised.
1) 3G + wi fi
3G is coming but it just isn't the shinny new rock that many think it is. Instead of a diamond it is really a bit like quartz. That is it looks good but really doesn't have a lot of value in it.
2) a substantially improved camera (5 megapixel?) with autofocus/ flash
I have a love hate relationship with cell phone cameras. One the quality has never been there and two they aren't permitted in places I have to go. That being said if the 5 mega pixel camera was of extremely high quality I'd certainly go for it.
The good news here is that there has been a huge amount of research going on with respect to advance camera optics and detectors all to be squished into a cell phone. If you want an update go to the local library and get the recent copy of PHOTONICS that has the articles on cell phone tech. The biggest problem as I can see it is the research stage that some of the projects are in. So a 5 mega pixel camera, With REALLY good quality, is a possibility in the future.
Do to the potential in the future for video conferencing I'd like to see a camera that swivels front to back. That would be very useful.
3) the ability to record video clips on it at 30 fps
I wouldn't be surprised if this is a software update. In any event we should state exactly what you mean by video clips. That is the horizontal and vertical resolution. The quality though will have to be worth it.
4) GPS for satnav
I think the biggest problem here is the lack of space in the current iPhone for the chip set and antennae. A larger iPhone would handle this nicely though.
As to complaints about power usage that is frankly crap as the chip could be shut down for the most part until you need it.
For Apple this is a fantastic opportunity. In fact I kinda wish they would buy up Garmin or one of the other GPS suppliers. If they do this though the phone needs to ship with full coverage of the USA and also be easily upgradeable map wise.
5) in-built radio (FM and DAB digital radio)
This is incredibly handy to have and I don't know why Apple has resisted the demand from the masses. Lets face it the tech can be had built into WiFi chips so the incremental cost is very little.
6)replaceable battery and SIM
The soldered in battery is a big turn off there is no doubt about that. For commercial usage it is almost mandatory. Even having you phone off line to swap batteries can be a problem, having to send things out for battery replacement is a killer.
On the other hand I do understand that the reliability factor of a soldered in battery is huge. Maybe a design that makes local servicing much more effective might be the answer.
7) the ability to upgrade the memory with a memory card + more internal storage (16GB?)
This I agree with 100%. But lets face it the model 1 iPhone isn't to bad and we all know and realize that expanded capacity machines will come in the future.
An SD slot would be just the nuts too. The problem is does this fit in with Apples vision for the platform? Until we see a mobile "FINDER" I don't see this happening.
8) the ability to customise the interface as you wish (wallpapers, icons?), and be able to use the songs you have saved on this phone as your ringtone. also the ability to change the icon shortcuts.
I'm not sure I see the value in a lot of the above, but you do realize that a SDK is coming. What that SDK offers up is an open question in many a mind right now. Basically you are ahead of the curve right now.
9) the opportunity to buy an unlocked iphone
Frankly you have two options here buy unlocked devices form someone else and make Apple very aware of why you did so. Or you can lobby the government to clean up the cell industry as a whole. Basically as an individual you are screwed here as any influence you have is minor.
10) the option for haptic (vibrating) feedback when you press a virtual key, so you know you've pressed a key
Sounds like a garbage idea to me. The feed back means nothing if you press the wrong key.
11) a hard button for the camera + hardbutton for camera zoom
Yeah I totally agree with the idea of a "shutter release" button. That button should be labeled so that it is totally obvious what it does and it should do only that. Zoom I don't know about to be honest, the problem being that you will quickly run out of space around the rim of the machine.
12) longer battery life
Of Course. You do realize though that most of your requests will lower battery life.
13)standard headjack so you can use your own headphones
I'm not convinced that that is a good idea. If I remember correctly the idea with the present arrangement was to increase the reliability of the iPhones hardware.
14)voice memo recorder
SDK is coming.
i only ask for things that are currently available in other top-end phones, and i would be prepared to pay more for a premium phone with all of the above. all i ask is for the iphone to be able to fully compete with the best out there.
I've been looking at the smart phone market for some time and if you carefully consider what the iPhone does it is a pretty impressive first attempt in the cell phone market place. Most of what I've looked at isn't really that competitive with Apple's iPhone. It is a sum of the parts thing, just consider what out there is competitive with Apples web browser and e-mail programs.
an iphone with all the above would be my ultimate dream phone...
Most of what you described above is very possible. What Apple will go for is another matter all together. In any event below is what I see as the perfect iPhone machine #2:
1.
A larger screen. It would be nice if the screen would gain about one half to three quarters of an inch in in height and keep a 16:9 ratio. Triming in the bezels on te left and fight ends a bit should give us a machine that is only slightly longer than the present. The screen resolution should be close to 720x480. This wouldn't be to bad of a machine in the pocket yet would be extremely useful once out of the pocket.
2.
More Flash as already has been mentioned. Hopefully the littel extra space afforded by the size increase will allow us to Expand that flash at low cost.
3.
A USB host port. Using a standard USB connector. The idea here of course is access to USB devices especially Flash cards and self powered disk drives. Access to real cameras wouldn't hurt either. The goal is to exploit the fact that a smart phone is a computer and to also provide a solid and quick system backup.
4.
An SD or compact flash port. Frankly I'd like to see the USB host port first as that would be far more flexible.
5.
Finish the software, a key part of which is getting things like the Bluetooth stack fully fleshed out. The slow evolution of the units OS is a real killer.
6.
Obviously a chipset/SOc upgrade is in order. As long as it is ARM based. I don't want any sort of Intel processor in the unit as I simply don't think Intel will ever be able to get the power usage low enough. Fortunately there is a huge amount of development going on with respect ot ARM SOC's designed for the cell space. The question is which way will Apple go. Frankly I'd like to see a dual core chip. Not dual core in the sense of an ARM and a DSP but rather two ARM chips capable of being applications processors.
7.
Disk mode and or a "FINDER" for mobile. This is a glaring and disgusting problem as Apple should have addressed this right out of the gate. Without such it is very difficult to leverage the iPhone for more advanced usage.
8.
Fix up the web browser to allow access to the local store and make sure it can more fully handle the average web site. The motivation is as follows. First; it allows one to view HTML documentation off line. Second; the iPhone needs to be able to handle even more on line web sights. In any event Apple needs to realize the extremely handy nature of being able to carry larges amounts of documentation/books around in the palm of your hand.
9.
For much the same reasons as above a good solid stand alone PDF reader is needed.
10.
I'd love to see a line in plug. A primary use here would be plugging in more effective microphones. The idea being that such a port would be used in conjunction with a audio recording program. This would be great for lectures, conferneces and such. Yes I realize the iPod connector already provides some of that capability but lets face it standard phono plugs are way easier to deal with and are compatible with a wide array of hardware. Ideally this would be another analog channel too, so that you don't loose the iPod connectors inputs nor the headset jacks capabilities.
11.
More RAM. I'm not sure why Apple has resisted the idea of Adobe Flash and a few other technologies, but the lack of RAM space could be a big issue here. For a start I'd like to see it doubled. This should allow for a much more useful browser that supports plugins and such.
12.
As has been mentioned GPS. But I want a high quality implementation. That would include sensitive hardware and a good antennae. The better electronics is one reason I'd like to see the larger model iPhone. If Apple implements this it needs to be able to compete with the best electronically. Of course an app that supports local storage of high resolution maps are in order. Ideally this software would make use of multitouch for zooming and such. Integration will Goolge earth would be nice also but we can't loose site of the fact that the software must be off line capable.
So that is what I want. A lot to stuff into the current iPhone. Not at all impossible as there are some very interesting technologies coming online next year. Especially with chip sets and SOC, that target the phone market specifically. But most important to me is the larger screen as I want to be able to see more.
Seeing more means the iPhone 2 becomes much more usable when stepping outside of the area of just being a phone. Screen size puts the smart into smart phones.
Dave
Frankly for a model #1 the iPhone is a rather nice hardware package. Its shortcomings are mostly software related. Does that mean I have a iPhone - nope. It just means that it doesn't have the feature set I'd like to see on my next cell upgrade, it can hardly be called compromised.
3G is coming but it just isn't the shinny new rock that many think it is. Instead of a diamond it is really a bit like quartz. That is it looks good but really doesn't have a lot of value in it.
I have a love hate relationship with cell phone cameras. One the quality has never been there and two they aren't permitted in places I have to go. That being said if the 5 mega pixel camera was of extremely high quality I'd certainly go for it.
The good news here is that there has been a huge amount of research going on with respect to advance camera optics and detectors all to be squished into a cell phone. If you want an update go to the local library and get the recent copy of PHOTONICS that has the articles on cell phone tech. The biggest problem as I can see it is the research stage that some of the projects are in. So a 5 mega pixel camera, With REALLY good quality, is a possibility in the future.
Do to the potential in the future for video conferencing I'd like to see a camera that swivels front to back. That would be very useful.
I wouldn't be surprised if this is a software update. In any event we should state exactly what you mean by video clips. That is the horizontal and vertical resolution. The quality though will have to be worth it.
I think the biggest problem here is the lack of space in the current iPhone for the chip set and antennae. A larger iPhone would handle this nicely though.
As to complaints about power usage that is frankly crap as the chip could be shut down for the most part until you need it.
For Apple this is a fantastic opportunity. In fact I kinda wish they would buy up Garmin or one of the other GPS suppliers. If they do this though the phone needs to ship with full coverage of the USA and also be easily upgradeable map wise.
This is incredibly handy to have and I don't know why Apple has resisted the demand from the masses. Lets face it the tech can be had built into WiFi chips so the incremental cost is very little.
The soldered in battery is a big turn off there is no doubt about that. For commercial usage it is almost mandatory. Even having you phone off line to swap batteries can be a problem, having to send things out for battery replacement is a killer.
On the other hand I do understand that the reliability factor of a soldered in battery is huge. Maybe a design that makes local servicing much more effective might be the answer.
This I agree with 100%. But lets face it the model 1 iPhone isn't to bad and we all know and realize that expanded capacity machines will come in the future.
An SD slot would be just the nuts too. The problem is does this fit in with Apples vision for the platform? Until we see a mobile "FINDER" I don't see this happening.
I'm not sure I see the value in a lot of the above, but you do realize that a SDK is coming. What that SDK offers up is an open question in many a mind right now. Basically you are ahead of the curve right now.
Frankly you have two options here buy unlocked devices form someone else and make Apple very aware of why you did so. Or you can lobby the government to clean up the cell industry as a whole. Basically as an individual you are screwed here as any influence you have is minor.
Sounds like a garbage idea to me. The feed back means nothing if you press the wrong key.
Yeah I totally agree with the idea of a "shutter release" button. That button should be labeled so that it is totally obvious what it does and it should do only that. Zoom I don't know about to be honest, the problem being that you will quickly run out of space around the rim of the machine.
Of Course. You do realize though that most of your requests will lower battery life.
I'm not convinced that that is a good idea. If I remember correctly the idea with the present arrangement was to increase the reliability of the iPhones hardware.
SDK is coming.
I've been looking at the smart phone market for some time and if you carefully consider what the iPhone does it is a pretty impressive first attempt in the cell phone market place. Most of what I've looked at isn't really that competitive with Apple's iPhone. It is a sum of the parts thing, just consider what out there is competitive with Apples web browser and e-mail programs.
Most of what you described above is very possible. What Apple will go for is another matter all together. In any event below is what I see as the perfect iPhone machine #2:
1.
A larger screen. It would be nice if the screen would gain about one half to three quarters of an inch in in height and keep a 16:9 ratio. Triming in the bezels on te left and fight ends a bit should give us a machine that is only slightly longer than the present. The screen resolution should be close to 720x480. This wouldn't be to bad of a machine in the pocket yet would be extremely useful once out of the pocket.
2.
More Flash as already has been mentioned. Hopefully the littel extra space afforded by the size increase will allow us to Expand that flash at low cost.
3.
A USB host port. Using a standard USB connector. The idea here of course is access to USB devices especially Flash cards and self powered disk drives. Access to real cameras wouldn't hurt either. The goal is to exploit the fact that a smart phone is a computer and to also provide a solid and quick system backup.
4.
An SD or compact flash port. Frankly I'd like to see the USB host port first as that would be far more flexible.
5.
Finish the software, a key part of which is getting things like the Bluetooth stack fully fleshed out. The slow evolution of the units OS is a real killer.
6.
Obviously a chipset/SOc upgrade is in order. As long as it is ARM based. I don't want any sort of Intel processor in the unit as I simply don't think Intel will ever be able to get the power usage low enough. Fortunately there is a huge amount of development going on with respect ot ARM SOC's designed for the cell space. The question is which way will Apple go. Frankly I'd like to see a dual core chip. Not dual core in the sense of an ARM and a DSP but rather two ARM chips capable of being applications processors.
7.
Disk mode and or a "FINDER" for mobile. This is a glaring and disgusting problem as Apple should have addressed this right out of the gate. Without such it is very difficult to leverage the iPhone for more advanced usage.
8.
Fix up the web browser to allow access to the local store and make sure it can more fully handle the average web site. The motivation is as follows. First; it allows one to view HTML documentation off line. Second; the iPhone needs to be able to handle even more on line web sights. In any event Apple needs to realize the extremely handy nature of being able to carry larges amounts of documentation/books around in the palm of your hand.
9.
For much the same reasons as above a good solid stand alone PDF reader is needed.
10.
I'd love to see a line in plug. A primary use here would be plugging in more effective microphones. The idea being that such a port would be used in conjunction with a audio recording program. This would be great for lectures, conferneces and such. Yes I realize the iPod connector already provides some of that capability but lets face it standard phono plugs are way easier to deal with and are compatible with a wide array of hardware. Ideally this would be another analog channel too, so that you don't loose the iPod connectors inputs nor the headset jacks capabilities.
11.
More RAM. I'm not sure why Apple has resisted the idea of Adobe Flash and a few other technologies, but the lack of RAM space could be a big issue here. For a start I'd like to see it doubled. This should allow for a much more useful browser that supports plugins and such.
12.
As has been mentioned GPS. But I want a high quality implementation. That would include sensitive hardware and a good antennae. The better electronics is one reason I'd like to see the larger model iPhone. If Apple implements this it needs to be able to compete with the best electronically. Of course an app that supports local storage of high resolution maps are in order. Ideally this software would make use of multitouch for zooming and such. Integration will Goolge earth would be nice also but we can't loose site of the fact that the software must be off line capable.
So that is what I want. A lot to stuff into the current iPhone. Not at all impossible as there are some very interesting technologies coming online next year. Especially with chip sets and SOC, that target the phone market specifically. But most important to me is the larger screen as I want to be able to see more.
Seeing more means the iPhone 2 becomes much more usable when stepping outside of the area of just being a phone. Screen size puts the smart into smart phones.
Dave
thank you wizard69. a comprehensive and well thoughtout answer, with views that compliment many of mine greatly. i only wish there were more like yourself that could see past the limitations of the iphone and understand what a great device it truly could become, given the opportunity...
Put it another way--what phone has the features you're describing with a full touchscreen interface that SEAMLESSLY (and I emphasize that!) syncs and interfaces with my primary computer and provides at least 8 gigs of storage room for audio and video. If it does everything on your wish list AND the things I just described and was priced comparably to the iPhone (I only bought at $400, so I'm really not willing to pay more, frankly)--well, tell us about it.
No offense Zed, but it's painfully clear you don't own an iPhone--have you used one for any length of time? The complete experience of using it is so much better than my old phone that it's difficult to express--and it has very little to do with the megapixel level of the camera.
Put it another way--what phone has the features you're describing with a full touchscreen interface that SEAMLESSLY (and I emphasize that!) syncs and interfaces with my primary computer and provides at least 8 gigs of storage room for audio and video. If it does everything on your wish list AND the things I just described and was priced comparably to the iPhone (I only bought at $400, so I'm really not willing to pay more, frankly)--well, tell us about it.
Thank you! that's what I've been trying to say for a week.
32GB of flash may not currently be possible, due to form-factor limitations.
It's definitely possible. It's really just a thickness issue, and not that big of an issue in the first place. 32 MB of flash storage would require 4 flash packages of the one currently in existing in the iPhone:
The flash package is underneath the felt looking pad next to the SIM slot and battery in this picture. This is the same sort of flash package that must fit inside SDHC cards that are available now, so they are pretty small.
Apple can put 4 of these in the iPhone, but it would require another 1 to 2 mm of thickness making the iPhone 13 to 14mm in thickness rather than 11.5. With increased volume, the battery can also be increased in size or a user replaceable battery compartment created. This also will result in increased weight and a battery compartment will make it more flimsy. There's a lot of things Apple must balance, and thinness and robustness wins out. Only enough room for 1 flash storage package was made.
The biggest issue is also price. 4 8-GB flash packages would cost $280 and would likely result in a $700 iPhone. That's a pretty extreme price for a very targeted consumer product.
I am however quite disappointed that Apple didn't make room for at least 2 or 3 flash packages in the iPhone and made a strategic mistake by shipping iPhone version 1 (and maybe iPod shuffle version 3) with only 4 and 8 GB storage. With the iPod, Apple made, makes, it a very attractive product because it always has a GB/$ advantage over its competitors. The iPhone, especially with its features, requires lots of memory just for average usage. By only usage 1 flash package, it'll allow iPhone competitors, which has microSD slots, to catch up in about a year.
If it shipped at 8 and 16 GB (or 12 and 24), it becomes a more respectable product for Apple's core iPod users, and would prevent phones with microSDHC or SDHC slots from ever catching up other than through carrying multiple cards (you'll need 4 microSD cards at its current 2 GB max capacity, and that's 3 too many).
Some sort of thing for the iPod shuffle (needs 2 GB), and iPod touch (needs 12/24 or 16/32).
No offense Zed, but it's painfully clear you don't own an iPhone--have you used one for any length of time? The complete experience of using it is so much better than my old phone that it's difficult to express--and it has very little to do with the megapixel level of the camera.
In many ways I understand Zed's desires. The iPhone may work very well for you but I'm not convinced that it is ready to make me happy. In your case though it id doing very well from your comments. the difference is that in my case I want more computer like accessibility to the device. Much of that has already been achieved via hacking but I want an officially support direction from Apple.
By the way this shouldn't 't scare away anybody as it does not need to change the user interface much at all. Since the iPhone isn't all there yet I just sit and wait with my prepaid cheapo phone. The thing with zed's [posting is that much of what he wants can be had with solid software updates to the camera.
As to the cell camera they all pretty much suck at the moment. I do have a lot of hope here.
[/quote]
Put it another way--what phone has the features you're describing with a full touchscreen interface that SEAMLESSLY (and I emphasize that!) syncs and interfaces with my primary computer and provides at least 8 gigs of storage room for audio and video. If it does everything on your wish list AND the things I just described and was priced comparably to the iPhone (I only bought at $400, so I'm really not willing to pay more, frankly)--well, tell us about it.[/QUOTE]
The fact that such a beast doesn't exists does make the desire for one any less. Lets face it not many here can talk about owning an Apple 1 but a conversation about Apple 2's would go a long way. I believe the iPhone is much like the Apple 1, a very interesting technology implementation that could be improved significantly in the next rev. Considering the size of the Cell phone market I think that is a very good comparison. Apple is looking for 1%, that is ONE PERCENT of the world wide cell phone business with the iPhone 1. To get a significantly larger cut of that market place they will need to introduce what in effect is an Apple 2, a device that attracts the masses.
Actually Apple needs to do more than just that as they need additional devices that support people who have profoundly different needs. Mostly what I'm thinking about here is the people that are non smart phone users and are likely to never want one.
It all comes down to Apple either becoming significant in the cell market place or not.
I've been looking at the smart phone market for some time and if you carefully consider what the iPhone does it is a pretty impressive first attempt in the cell phone market place. Most of what I've looked at isn't really that competitive with Apple's iPhone. It is a sum of the parts thing, just consider what out there is competitive with Apples web browser and e-mail programs.
No doubt. It's a very competitive product as a gen 1 otherwise Apple wouldn't have let it out the door.
Most of what you described above is very possible. What Apple will go for is another matter all together. In any event below is what I see as the perfect iPhone machine #2
You guys want a handheld computer.
1. A larger screen. It would be nice if the screen would gain about one half to three quarters of an inch in in height and keep a 16:9 ratio. Triming in the bezels on te left and fight ends a bit should give us a machine that is only slightly longer than the present. The screen resolution should be close to 720x480. This wouldn't be to bad of a machine in the pocket yet would be extremely useful once out of the pocket.
They can have a 4 inch 3:2 screen in the current form factor if they can make the left and right bezels only 0.10 inch and have it maintain its structural robustness. And yup, increase the resolution would be great for web browsing.
2. More Flash as already has been mentioned. Hopefully the littel extra space afforded by the size increase will allow us to Expand that flash at low cost.
This is a thickness issue.
3. A USB host port. Using a standard USB connector. The idea here of course is access to USB devices especially Flash cards and self powered disk drives. Access to real cameras wouldn't hurt either. The goal is to exploit the fact that a smart phone is a computer and to also provide a solid and quick system backup.
Well, an iPod connector to USB port dongle would be fine...
4. An SD or compact flash port. Frankly I'd like to see the USB host port first as that would be far more flexible.
Not needed really. They just need to either up the flash storage, currently at about $9/GB or make an 100+ GB HDD version. It's a version 1.0 product however. It'll be crazy to release so many models for a version 1 product though. Maybe version 2.
5. Finish the software, a key part of which is getting things like the Bluetooth stack fully fleshed out. The slow evolution of the units OS is a real killer.
Well, evolve the software at a faster rate really.
6. Obviously a chipset/SOc upgrade is in order. As long as it is ARM based.
You want a handheld hobbyist computer that bad?
7.Disk mode and or a "FINDER" for mobile. This is a glaring and disgusting problem as Apple should have addressed this right out of the gate. Without such it is very difficult to leverage the iPhone for more advanced usage.
Well, it is a very targeted product. Yeah, I'm curious to see what Leopard Finder Coverflow and Quicklook would be like on the iPhone.
10. I'd love to see a line in plug. A primary use here would be plugging in more effective microphones. The idea being that such a port would be used in conjunction with a audio recording program. This would be great for lectures, conferneces and such. Yes I realize the iPod connector already provides some of that capability but lets face it standard phono plugs are way easier to deal with and are compatible with a wide array of hardware. Ideally this would be another analog channel too, so that you don't loose the iPod connectors inputs nor the headset jacks capabilities.
Umm, how many ports are going to be in your dream phone?
It's definitely possible. It's really just a thickness issue, and not that big of an issue in the first place. 32 MB of flash storage would require 4 flash packages of the one currently in existing in the iPhone:
This is one of these it sort of depends situations. The flash storage could be a multilevel module that is a chip stack.
The flash package is underneath the felt looking pad next to the SIM slot and battery in this picture. This is the same sort of flash package that must fit inside SDHC cards that are available now, so they are pretty small.
To bad you didn't remove that felt we may have been able to get a part number and manufacture off the chip.
Apple can put 4 of these in the iPhone, but it would require another 1 to 2 mm of thickness making the iPhone 13 to 14mm in thickness rather than 11.5. With increased volume, the battery can also be increased in size or a user replaceable battery compartment created. This also will result in increased weight and a battery compartment will make it more flimsy. There's a lot of things Apple must balance, and thinness and robustness wins out. Only enough room for 1 flash storage package was made.
I agree that robustness has been winning out in Apple's "i" series devices. But he issue of storage is different. For example if SamSung is the manufacture of the you have the possibility of stacked chips and new technology hitting the street in January. I believe Apple would have no trouble at all of doubling storage space on the iPhone come early next year.
The biggest issue is also price. 4 8-GB flash packages would cost $280 and would likely result in a $700 iPhone. That's a pretty extreme price for a very targeted consumer product.
Your estimates are way to high. I'd think that $120 would be more like it.
I am however quite disappointed that Apple didn't make room for at least 2 or 3 flash packages in the iPhone and made a strategic mistake by shipping iPhone version 1 (and maybe iPod shuffle version 3) with only 4 and 8 GB storage.
I'm not sure it is needed at all. The space that is. As mentioned above there are two possibilities to making an iPhone with more internal memory. I actually think that the vision Apple had for this phone isn't exactly the same as what many of the current users have. Thus they got caught off guard. The quick life span of the 4 GB model is an indication here of a differing consumer perception of the device.
With the iPod, Apple made, makes, it a very attractive product because it always has a GB/$ advantage over its competitors. The iPhone, especially with its features, requires lots of memory just for average usage. By only usage 1 flash package, it'll allow iPhone competitors, which has microSD slots, to catch up in about a year.
Considering Apples position within the flash industry I'm pretty sure that they will be able to respond to the higher storage space requirements and still beat out the competition. The reference to SD storage is a wholly different issue in my mind. I do wish that Apple had provided for some sort of user supplied memory, such memory though would result in a bigger package.
If it shipped at 8 and 16 GB (or 12 and 24), it becomes a more respectable product for Apple's core iPod users, and would prevent phones with microSDHC or SDHC slots from ever catching up other than through carrying multiple cards (you'll need 4 microSD cards at its current 2 GB max capacity, and that's 3 too many).
Not only the core ipod users but the people who want to use the capabilities of the device in a more aggressive manner.
Some sort of thing for the iPod shuffle (needs 2 GB), and iPod touch (needs 12/24 or 16/32).
I agree with the Shuffle and was very surprised that it didn't get rev'ed last year. The Touch I'd like to see go to 32/64 GB on a more advanced platform. That also means keeping he current Touch around for a while. The Current Touch really does meet many peoples needs as is. An Advanced Touch could also become a powerful PDA replacement.
In any event I don't think we are too far away from rev's on one or more of the current devices. By rev here I mean more or less a memory bump. Everything is coming online for it to happen one way or the other. What strikes me as really neat is that by mid year 2008 we should see cell smart phones that are more powerful than the vast majority of the desktop PC's I've ever owned. That is neat.
Dave