I think this purchase has a pretty obvious logic. Apple want to do well in the handheld business and they see two issues which are critical to its success: power and size, that is, low power and small size. PA Semi obviously have expertise in this field and Apple want it.
Part of why Apple succeed is their focus. They don't stray from the product lines they have chosen, and they do what products they have chosen to create well. If they're going to do better than other people they can't just have good software, which they have, they need to have better hardware than the competition. They have wisely invested in the critical areas where they get a jump over the competition, differentiating their product where it matters most to the customer: long battery life and a sleek, attractive product.
Ok this is about the dumbest idea they could have done. They are not in the Semi business, this is just going to drag them down.
Companies need to focus on what they do well, and Apple does not do SEMI well. I can see having a controlling interest or making investments to ensure your ideal are heard and solutions are provided but owning and operating it will only burn resources that could be used else where.
This could be a smart move if they are securing some groundbreaking intellectual property (patents).
Clearly the mobile computing opportunities are going to explode over the next decade. There will be a plethora of devices ranging from Nano sized products to UMPC style computing initiatives. I welcome them all because one size does NOT fit all.
It also give Apple leveredge. Intel's not always going to have the best solution. In house designs give Apple another option to explore if they do not get what they want from a 3rd party.
After watching the iPhone SDK/Enterprise keynote It certainly looks like the OS X stack for the iPhone/iTouch is overengineered and with more power will be able to spread it's wings even more.
I'm looking forward to seeing the fruits of this acquisition labor.
Ok this is about the dumbest idea they could have done. They are not in the Semi business, this is just going to drag them down.
Companies need to focus on what they do well, and Apple does not do SEMI well. I can see having a controlling interest or making investments to ensure your ideal are heard and solutions are provided but owning and operating it will only burn resources that could be used else where.
It is very difficult for those on the outside to determine the validity of the purchase without knowing the plans or reasons for the purchase. This is one of those times. Now if Apple had purchased Toy R US, I would agree with your statement but at this time, we have no idea why and so it is hard for us to say good or bad when they purchase a reputable industry leading company in their field.
I dont' think so eitehr, but It depends what they were working on. Remember the Bungie acquisition by MS. I don't think Apple would want that to happen again.
This is NOT because of iPhones & iPods (could be an extra reason)
This is NOT for desktop macs (mostly)
This IS for new computing device, aka the "tablet pda" style device that has long been rumored.
At least this is what I've heard.
I was told "think knowledge navigator + iphone + crack = "
The possible uses are more than just the new device, but the purchase is for that reason alone, not to power some iphones.
I apologize for not knowing you from Adam to better understand whatever insight you have but it does strike me funny with stating "Just to be clear before the rumors go crazy...." and then see "At least this is what I've heard."
I'm not arguing the reasons but just found the statements entertaining since this kind of news sparks rumors and your statements alone will add to them even though you're trying to discount others.
No matter though it wouldn't surprise me. I had severe doubts previous to reading yours that this had anything to do with anything Mac, ipods or iphones as we currently know them. This company would have to have something pretty special to overcome the resources and cost benefits from Intel and others already involved in those markets. The biggest things that came to mind for me were technology patents. Apple seems to like getting more involved in chip design than many might think so I could see them doing the same with Intel and others like they did with the PPC.
Why is that so far fetched, Lots of companies buy up other companies to prevent them from being bought up by competition, You don't think that RIM might have been looking at that chip maker to build something to compete with Apple. Microsoft does it, Adobe does it, it happens everyday by Energy companies, and banks.
Its more than likely Apple and PA Semi have been working together for awhile now. Its possible this acquisition has happened right before the introduction of the product that will come from their collaboration.
Apple has done this before. Such as with Fingerworks that provided the touch screen technology.
PA Semi wanted to be a major PC chip provider like Intel and AMD. They also wanted to provide these chips for Apple.
I would imagine since Apple going Intel, secretly both parties began going in a different direction. The company prides itself on producing energy saving chips. That is a paramount feature mobile devices need.
Good. So do you think late 2008 then? Because that is what I was hoping for because this year I want to proclaim from the rooftops....product in hand........MACTOUCH FTW!!! Yaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!
Dan Dobberpuhl said in 2006 that PA Semi was working on a series of processor cores at various power points. So they probably have chips in the pipeline that would suit the iPhone/iPod.
PA Semi current chips are primarily used in embedded devices such as routers and storage devices.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
Dan Dobberpuhl said in 2006 that PA Semi was working on a series of processor cores at various power points. So they probably have chips in the pipeline that would suit the iPhone/iPod.
PA Semi current chips are primarily used in embedded devices such as routers and storage devices.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
It's very curious that PA Semi could outrun Intel on this front, but there's obviously something they bring to the table that Intel could not touch... Apple ownership.
You are correct, a 5-13W chips is not for the iPhone, but neither is the 2GHz speed that is quoted. Their current product has no bearing on Apple's current product line. Apple would have to make a completely new device, or more likely, P.A. Semi would have to create an entirely new chip.
I'm guessing your right and this has nothing to do with what they make now. I wouldn't doubt that the PPC architecture gets thrown out the window, and they utilize their talents for something more intrinsic to what Apple needs. I'm thinking the new Raycer Graphics acquisition. If you remember that.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
What's the advantage of a RISC chip in this setting? I don't see what these new chips(or their technology) bring to the table that Apple doesn't already have available form Intel in regards to the ATV or any other device that doesn't run on a battery.
It would seem to me that this technology is only advantageous to Apple for mobile devices. Otherwise there are cheap, 'good enough' alternatives that are readily available.
Edit: Saw the part about an auto NAV and perhaps there is an advantage there.
Good. So do you think late 2008 then? Because that is what I was hoping for because this year I want to proclaim from the rooftops....product in hand........MACTOUCH FTW!!! Yaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!
In Apple's recent acquisitions. Once Apple announce the acquisition the fruit of the collaboration appeared soon afterwards.
The assumption is that Apple bought PA Semi. And now will begin working on the product. That has not been Apple's recent history. They have already been working on the product in secret and the acquisition is announced right before the product is released.
A MacTouch might be in the pipeline. But using occam's razor, ie common sense. Apple buying a company that produces low power processors would be for a product that actually exists and one that Apple has already expended substantial resources. Namely the iPhone, or even the iPod and Apple TV.
I wonder what PA Semi have cooking in the labs because a 2Ghz PPC chip running 5-13W isn't a natural fit in the Apple line up today. It'd be useful hidden away in a router, Time Capsule or maybe AppleTV but it's too power hungry for anything else and not powerful enough for a Mac. That was two years ago though that they were hitting performance per watt that Intel are only just getting to. Perhaps Jobs got impatient waiting.
I can see it now... Steve Jobs on stage at WWDC....
"You know we said we were done with Power... well, I lied... Announcing the new 6Ghz 16 core PowerMac. We call it the G-Inifinty."
Or perhaps not.
I can't see PA Semi chips in an iPhone though. The new ARM cores are very, very efficient. A 5W PPC isn't needed.
I think the thought goes something like this, "We are entering a VERY competitive market in mobile computing. If we can own a technology that beats the competition in speed/power, we will have a large advantage that they won't be able to match for a while. If we do not own the technology, then it can and will be purchased by our competitors."
Any business works on expanding their market and increasing their customer base. If Apple didn't buy this company, but only bought their processor/technology, and those processors were clear leaders for mobile devices, you better bet the company isn't going to only want to sell to Apple, they are going to want to sell to Apple's competitors as well. I think Apple wants to rule the mobile market and they are trying to cover all the bases.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64
Ok this is about the dumbest idea they could have done. They are not in the Semi business, this is just going to drag them down.
Companies need to focus on what they do well, and Apple does not do SEMI well. I can see having a controlling interest or making investments to ensure your ideal are heard and solutions are provided but owning and operating it will only burn resources that could be used else where.
The assumption is that Apple bought PA Semi. And now will begin working on the product. That has not been Apple's recent history. They have already been working on the product in secret and the acquisition is announced right before the product is released.
PA Semi and Apple have a relationship going back before the Intel transition. PA Semi back then were expecting to sell their chips to Apple but Apple jumped ship. If PA Semi are a business worth anything then they'd not petulently stomp out but persue Apple with even better products.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell
A MacTouch might be in the pipeline. But using occam's razor, ie common sense. Apple buying a company that produces low power processors would be for a product that actually exists and one that Apple has already expended substantial resources. Namely the iPhone, or even the iPod and Apple TV.
I wouldn't think so unless PA Semi have been developing ARM architecture chips instead of PowerPC in secret. The ARM chips would have to be something special to beat the new 45nm ARM11 chips too. Or are you expecting Apple to start using FAT binaries on the iPhone too - supporting both ARM and PPC architectures? That would be stupid.
Dan Dobberpuhl said in 2006 that PA Semi was working on a series of processor cores at various power points. So they probably have chips in the pipeline that would suit the iPhone/iPod.
PA Semi current chips are primarily used in embedded devices such as routers and storage devices.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
Umm....hell no. The vibe is very strong imo that Apple's plans for PA Semi will be for something MUCH more aggressive.
Comments
Part of why Apple succeed is their focus. They don't stray from the product lines they have chosen, and they do what products they have chosen to create well. If they're going to do better than other people they can't just have good software, which they have, they need to have better hardware than the competition. They have wisely invested in the critical areas where they get a jump over the competition, differentiating their product where it matters most to the customer: long battery life and a sleek, attractive product.
Ok this is about the dumbest idea they could have done. They are not in the Semi business, this is just going to drag them down.
Companies need to focus on what they do well, and Apple does not do SEMI well. I can see having a controlling interest or making investments to ensure your ideal are heard and solutions are provided but owning and operating it will only burn resources that could be used else where.
This could be a smart move if they are securing some groundbreaking intellectual property (patents).
Clearly the mobile computing opportunities are going to explode over the next decade. There will be a plethora of devices ranging from Nano sized products to UMPC style computing initiatives. I welcome them all because one size does NOT fit all.
It also give Apple leveredge. Intel's not always going to have the best solution. In house designs give Apple another option to explore if they do not get what they want from a 3rd party.
After watching the iPhone SDK/Enterprise keynote It certainly looks like the OS X stack for the iPhone/iTouch is overengineered and with more power will be able to spread it's wings even more.
I'm looking forward to seeing the fruits of this acquisition labor.
Ok this is about the dumbest idea they could have done. They are not in the Semi business, this is just going to drag them down.
Companies need to focus on what they do well, and Apple does not do SEMI well. I can see having a controlling interest or making investments to ensure your ideal are heard and solutions are provided but owning and operating it will only burn resources that could be used else where.
It is very difficult for those on the outside to determine the validity of the purchase without knowing the plans or reasons for the purchase. This is one of those times. Now if Apple had purchased Toy R US, I would agree with your statement but at this time, we have no idea why and so it is hard for us to say good or bad when they purchase a reputable industry leading company in their field.
They may have simply done it so no one else can.
I don't think so.
I don't think so.
I dont' think so eitehr, but It depends what they were working on. Remember the Bungie acquisition by MS. I don't think Apple would want that to happen again.
Just to be clear before the rumors go crazy....
This is NOT because of iPhones & iPods (could be an extra reason)
This is NOT for desktop macs (mostly)
This IS for new computing device, aka the "tablet pda" style device that has long been rumored.
At least this is what I've heard.
I was told "think knowledge navigator + iphone + crack = "
The possible uses are more than just the new device, but the purchase is for that reason alone, not to power some iphones.
I apologize for not knowing you from Adam to better understand whatever insight you have but it does strike me funny with stating "Just to be clear before the rumors go crazy...." and then see "At least this is what I've heard."
I'm not arguing the reasons but just found the statements entertaining since this kind of news sparks rumors and your statements alone will add to them even though you're trying to discount others.
No matter though it wouldn't surprise me. I had severe doubts previous to reading yours that this had anything to do with anything Mac, ipods or iphones as we currently know them. This company would have to have something pretty special to overcome the resources and cost benefits from Intel and others already involved in those markets. The biggest things that came to mind for me were technology patents. Apple seems to like getting more involved in chip design than many might think so I could see them doing the same with Intel and others like they did with the PPC.
I don't think so.
Why is that so far fetched, Lots of companies buy up other companies to prevent them from being bought up by competition, You don't think that RIM might have been looking at that chip maker to build something to compete with Apple. Microsoft does it, Adobe does it, it happens everyday by Energy companies, and banks.
Its more than likely Apple and PA Semi have been working together for awhile now. Its possible this acquisition has happened right before the introduction of the product that will come from their collaboration.
Apple has done this before. Such as with Fingerworks that provided the touch screen technology.
PA Semi wanted to be a major PC chip provider like Intel and AMD. They also wanted to provide these chips for Apple.
I would imagine since Apple going Intel, secretly both parties began going in a different direction. The company prides itself on producing energy saving chips. That is a paramount feature mobile devices need.
Good. So do you think late 2008 then? Because that is what I was hoping for because this year I want to proclaim from the rooftops....product in hand........MACTOUCH FTW!!! Yaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!
PA Semi current chips are primarily used in embedded devices such as routers and storage devices.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
Dan Dobberpuhl said in 2006 that PA Semi was working on a series of processor cores at various power points. So they probably have chips in the pipeline that would suit the iPhone/iPod.
PA Semi current chips are primarily used in embedded devices such as routers and storage devices.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
It's very curious that PA Semi could outrun Intel on this front, but there's obviously something they bring to the table that Intel could not touch... Apple ownership.
You are correct, a 5-13W chips is not for the iPhone, but neither is the 2GHz speed that is quoted. Their current product has no bearing on Apple's current product line. Apple would have to make a completely new device, or more likely, P.A. Semi would have to create an entirely new chip.
I'm guessing your right and this has nothing to do with what they make now. I wouldn't doubt that the PPC architecture gets thrown out the window, and they utilize their talents for something more intrinsic to what Apple needs. I'm thinking the new Raycer Graphics acquisition. If you remember that.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
What's the advantage of a RISC chip in this setting? I don't see what these new chips(or their technology) bring to the table that Apple doesn't already have available form Intel in regards to the ATV or any other device that doesn't run on a battery.
It would seem to me that this technology is only advantageous to Apple for mobile devices. Otherwise there are cheap, 'good enough' alternatives that are readily available.
Edit: Saw the part about an auto NAV and perhaps there is an advantage there.
Good. So do you think late 2008 then? Because that is what I was hoping for because this year I want to proclaim from the rooftops....product in hand........MACTOUCH FTW!!! Yaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!
In Apple's recent acquisitions. Once Apple announce the acquisition the fruit of the collaboration appeared soon afterwards.
The assumption is that Apple bought PA Semi. And now will begin working on the product. That has not been Apple's recent history. They have already been working on the product in secret and the acquisition is announced right before the product is released.
A MacTouch might be in the pipeline. But using occam's razor, ie common sense. Apple buying a company that produces low power processors would be for a product that actually exists and one that Apple has already expended substantial resources. Namely the iPhone, or even the iPod and Apple TV.
Just to be clear before the rumors go crazy....
This is NOT because of iPhones & iPods (could be an extra reason)
This is NOT for desktop macs (mostly)
This IS for new computing device, aka the "tablet pda" style device that has long been rumored.
At least this is what I've heard.
I was told "think knowledge navigator + iphone + crack = "
The possible uses are more than just the new device, but the purchase is for that reason alone, not to power some iphones.
I wonder what PA Semi have cooking in the labs because a 2Ghz PPC chip running 5-13W isn't a natural fit in the Apple line up today. It'd be useful hidden away in a router, Time Capsule or maybe AppleTV but it's too power hungry for anything else and not powerful enough for a Mac. That was two years ago though that they were hitting performance per watt that Intel are only just getting to. Perhaps Jobs got impatient waiting.
I can see it now... Steve Jobs on stage at WWDC....
"You know we said we were done with Power... well, I lied... Announcing the new 6Ghz 16 core PowerMac. We call it the G-Inifinty."
Or perhaps not.
I can't see PA Semi chips in an iPhone though. The new ARM cores are very, very efficient. A 5W PPC isn't needed.
Any business works on expanding their market and increasing their customer base. If Apple didn't buy this company, but only bought their processor/technology, and those processors were clear leaders for mobile devices, you better bet the company isn't going to only want to sell to Apple, they are going to want to sell to Apple's competitors as well. I think Apple wants to rule the mobile market and they are trying to cover all the bases.
Ok this is about the dumbest idea they could have done. They are not in the Semi business, this is just going to drag them down.
Companies need to focus on what they do well, and Apple does not do SEMI well. I can see having a controlling interest or making investments to ensure your ideal are heard and solutions are provided but owning and operating it will only burn resources that could be used else where.
The assumption is that Apple bought PA Semi. And now will begin working on the product. That has not been Apple's recent history. They have already been working on the product in secret and the acquisition is announced right before the product is released.
PA Semi and Apple have a relationship going back before the Intel transition. PA Semi back then were expecting to sell their chips to Apple but Apple jumped ship. If PA Semi are a business worth anything then they'd not petulently stomp out but persue Apple with even better products.
A MacTouch might be in the pipeline. But using occam's razor, ie common sense. Apple buying a company that produces low power processors would be for a product that actually exists and one that Apple has already expended substantial resources. Namely the iPhone, or even the iPod and Apple TV.
I wouldn't think so unless PA Semi have been developing ARM architecture chips instead of PowerPC in secret. The ARM chips would have to be something special to beat the new 45nm ARM11 chips too. Or are you expecting Apple to start using FAT binaries on the iPhone too - supporting both ARM and PPC architectures? That would be stupid.
Dan Dobberpuhl said in 2006 that PA Semi was working on a series of processor cores at various power points. So they probably have chips in the pipeline that would suit the iPhone/iPod.
PA Semi current chips are primarily used in embedded devices such as routers and storage devices.
I think we will first see PA Semi chips in AppleTV and future embedded devices such as in-car entertainment/communication/navigation systems.
Umm....hell no. The vibe is very strong imo that Apple's plans for PA Semi will be for something MUCH more aggressive.