Final Cut Studio 3

Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited January 2014
I dont know if it goes here (so i also posted in apps) u can move it if u want



but here it goes



So when is it coming out?



There were rumors for a shake 4 replacement called phenomenon

also there were rumors by some analyst that apple would go BLU

So any chance that apple would make that announcement at NAB 08



So basically FCS3 comes with

FCP7 (unchanged mostly, yet with AVCHD and AVC Intra native editing and support for 4K+ native)

Motion/Phenomenon (basically merge the weaker Motion with the stronger Shake)

Soundtrack Pro (with 7.1 PCM support for blu ray)

Compressor (with option to export to Disc Studio Pro for blu ray)

obviously Disc Studio Pro (for CD, DVD and BD (blu-ray disc) support with BD-J and BD-Live and Picture in Picture (PiP))



So that sounds about right?



Am i off or am i a year too early?
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 40
    robmrobm Posts: 1,068member
    Historically it's been 2 years between releases of fcp (pretty much, give or take).

    FCS 2 came out last year at NAB. So you could expect FCS 3 Nab 2009 but to be on the safe side I'd wait until Nab this year, yah never know.



    Not sure what's in the wings with Shake - but yeah, I expect something. Those who do know can't say (and I ain't one of them) ... it's been a long time since Shake 4.1. Might be at Nab ...
  • Reply 2 of 40
    NAB seems the place to announce a Shake replacement...or maybe even Siggraph. I don't think it will be part of Studio 3 with Motion already in it.
  • Reply 3 of 40
    northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,461member
    While not terribly important, I think FCP's interface could use a refresh to be more inline with the look of Motion, DVDSP, etc.



    As a side note, I'd love to be able to label track and layer names in FCP.
  • Reply 4 of 40
    And they should fix the damn issue with transparency not rendering realtime.

    Even Avid's old versions could handle that in realtime on a 1 GHz machine, with multiple tracks, not just two, which makes FCP 6 cripple on a MacPro..
  • Reply 5 of 40
    robmrobm Posts: 1,068member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by TripleCore View Post


    NAB seems the place to announce a Shake replacement...or maybe even Siggraph. I don't think it will be part of Studio 3 with Motion already in it.



    My biggest fear is that they give Shake the ol' Apple razzledazzle and bork the app - sheesh they couldn't wait to bundle Color and kick it out into the hands of the many to keep FCS sales rolling in.



    Wouldn't mind betting they'll bundle Shake/Phenomenon as well for the same reason.

    There's a chocolate fish here for any takers ...
  • Reply 6 of 40
    buddhabuddha Posts: 386member
    A GUI tweak of FCP would be nice. Motion stability could be greatly improved.
  • Reply 7 of 40
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,273member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by welcomb View Post


    I dont know if it goes here (so i also posted in apps) u can move it if u want



    but here it goes



    So when is it coming out?



    There were rumors for a shake 4 replacement called phenomenon

    also there were rumors by some analyst that apple would go BLU

    So any chance that apple would make that announcement at NAB 08



    So basically FCS3 comes with

    FCP7 (unchanged mostly, yet with AVCHD and AVC Intra native editing and support for 4K+ native)

    Motion/Phenomenon (basically merge the weaker Motion with the stronger Shake)

    Soundtrack Pro (with 7.1 PCM support for blu ray)

    Compressor (with option to export to Disc Studio Pro for blu ray)

    obviously Disc Studio Pro (for CD, DVD and BD (blu-ray disc) support with BD-J and BD-Live and Picture in Picture (PiP))



    So that sounds about right?



    Am i off or am i a year too early?



    Final Cut really needs a UI tweak. Nothing too drastic but just a refreshed yet functional UI. Color needs to be integrated more into the suite as well as Final Cut Server. Right now the suite resembles Tiger..a mismatch of UI



    We "may" see native AVCHD and AVC-Intra but I wouldn't count on it. ProRes 422 was designed primarily so that Apple DOES NOT have to suppor 31 flavors of codecs. AVCHD is a consumer format that doesn't even match HDV or DV bitrates so I'm in no hurry to see them expend energy on this. AVC Intra would be the new codec I'm interested in if any.



    I expect a new DVD Studio Pro with native Blu-ray support as an option at least complete with options for TrueHD and DTS-HD MA. Linear PCM is nothing special. Apple could support that right now out of the box but Linear PCM is the "fat" version of multichannel audio. Give me the the Dolby and DTS options please as compressor plugins and add BD-Java authoring.



    I'd love to see Apple announce Logic Pro 8.5 complete with outstanding integration with FCS 3. Soundtrack Pro is good for video guys that need audio but Logic Pro is for audio guys that need video.





    I do think a Shake replacement is coming and odds are studios like Weta Digital and others are beta testing it right now. It'll be like Motion but on "Barry Bonds" type steroids. Motion 3 showed Apple's work with 3D and that'll be pumped up in Phenomenon as well as the masking stuff.



    Now if Apple could just aquire a Match Moving company and round this baby out.



    I'm looking forward to NAB 08.
  • Reply 8 of 40
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,946member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    We "may" see native AVCHD and AVC-Intra but I wouldn't count on it. ProRes 422 was designed primarily so that Apple DOES NOT have to suppor 31 flavors of codecs.



    That's just a matter of how it's supported, whether a format is supported but it's converted on import/capture or it's supported for native playback. What ProRes does is allow more versatility because it loads the CPU a lot less. AVCHD and presumably AVC-intra are incredibly compute intensive formats, and it makes little sense to try to edit them natively.



    Quote:

    AVCHD is a consumer format that doesn't even match HDV or DV bitrates so I'm in no hurry to see them expend energy on this.



    Being a consumer format is hardly an issue, DV and HDV are consumer formats that still managed to get adopted as a low end pro format. AVCHD doesn't even need the same bitrate, but if someone feels it's needed, the format can go up to 24Mbps. It's quite stunning at 17Mbps/1080p coming from a consumer camera.
  • Reply 9 of 40
    sennensennen Posts: 1,465member
    FCS is being re-written from the ground up, or so i hear. hopefully we'll see FCS3 at nab09...
  • Reply 10 of 40
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,946member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sennen View Post


    FCS is being re-written from the ground up, or so i hear. hopefully we'll see FCS3 at nab09...



    As I understand it, it does need to happen because it's Carbon based and there will be no 64 bit Carbon, so it needs to go to Cocoa in order to work as a 64 bit program.
  • Reply 11 of 40
    sennensennen Posts: 1,465member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    As I understand it, it does need to happen because it's Carbon based and there will be no 64 bit Carbon, so it needs to go to Cocoa in order to work as a 64 bit program.



    correctomundo!
  • Reply 12 of 40
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,273member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    That's just a matter of how it's supported, whether a format is supported but it's converted on import/capture or it's supported for native playback. What ProRes does is allow more versatility because it loads the CPU a lot less. AVCHD and presumably AVC-intra are incredibly compute intensive formats, and it makes little sense to try to edit them natively.



    Agreed. I think Apple's done good with ProRes 422 and by next year if Red is on time with shipping their $3000 Scarlet 3K camera we'll have "affordable" HD recording using RAW. I think AVCHD is a good consumer format but I'm in no hurry to see it proliferate into the semi pro ranks despite it's potential for excellent quality. I think the increased editing difficulty erases much of the size advantage of the format.







    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    Being a consumer format is hardly an issue, DV and HDV are consumer formats that still managed to get adopted as a low end pro format. AVCHD doesn't even need the same bitrate, but if someone feels it's needed, the format can go up to 24Mbps. It's quite stunning at 17Mbps/1080p coming from a consumer camera.



    I think it's somewhat of an issue because in the case of HDV and now AVCHD both are using Long GOP codecs aimed at delivery. This is great for squeezing recording time onto 13GB tapes but by next year we're going to see 16 and 32GB compact Flash and other storage take over. I figure consumers will love the longer record times while videographers will enjoy being able to record at higher bitdepth and colorspace with easier editing.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    As I understand it, it does need to happen because it's Carbon based and there will be no 64 bit Carbon, so it needs to go to Cocoa in order to work as a 64 bit program.



    Wooohooooo!
  • Reply 13 of 40
    northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,461member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sennen View Post


    FCS is being re-written from the ground up, or so i hear. hopefully we'll see FCS3 at nab09...



    How do you know this? I'm not challenging you, I just want to know that this is accurate. If it is, then it's good news. I'm willing to wait as long as Apple needs to get it right.



    Hopefully Apple's team is working hard on updating Color's interface. I LOVE Color. But it needs some of that Apple UI magic, you know?
  • Reply 14 of 40
    Here is what I've heard from some industry insiders.



    Apple MAY be looking to sell it's pro apps to Adobe. I know it's shocking, but I heard this from a reputable source. This is not a definite sale, but don't be surprised if it happens.



    Motion & Shake will be combined into one powerful 3D application. I haven't heard of a new name, but lovingly referred to as SH-MOTION for now. ;-)



    My own personal thoughts are that DVD Studio Pro will be upgraded to include Blu-Ray authoring.



    COLOR still has some bugs, and an update is needed for this great tool.



    As for the announcement of Final Cut Studio 3, I don't think Apple will announce it at NAB 2009 (since they did not participate in NAB 2008). I would bet on January 2009.
  • Reply 15 of 40
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,273member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Megawatt View Post


    Here is what I've heard from some industry insiders.



    Apple MAY be looking to sell it's pro apps to Adobe. I know it's shocking, but I heard this from a reputable source. This is not a definite sale, but don't be surprised if it happens.



    Motion & Shake will be combined into one powerful 3D application. I haven't heard of a new name, but lovingly referred to as SH-MOTION for now. ;-)



    My own personal thoughts are that DVD Studio Pro will be upgraded to include Blu-Ray authoring.



    COLOR still has some bugs, and an update is needed for this great tool.



    As for the announcement of Final Cut Studio 3, I don't think Apple will announce it at NAB 2009 (since they did not participate in NAB 2008). I would bet on January 2009.



    My personal thoughts:



    I think it would be absurd for Apple to sell their Pro apps. Final Cut Studio, Logic Studio et al comprise Professional apps that leverage the power of Quicktime. Without them Quicktime is simply a player/framework that no one would care about (VLC anyone?)



    At times Apple seems like the ADD child that cannot remain focused on products or initiatives for a substantial amount of time. The iPod is not going to last forever.



    However I'm positive that were are just entering a transition phase that is more thorny than I would have guessed. Apple needs to transition to Cocoa. Cocoa needs to fully ascend to the top and cancelling 64-bit Carbon does just that.



    iTunes can be so much more. Apple needs to own this path from the creative tools all the way through to distribution. I'm worried that they're getting a bit too cozy with large distributors. I'd love to see Apple extend a branch to Independents and promote Apple Pro apps as tools to further a Revolution.



    It's clear now that Leopard more of a transition OS than I had initially believed. I'm happy with the performance but we're far from seeing the grand vision of Apple. Carbon must go so that Cocoa can live.



    Another problem is an over reliance on Jobs. Apple needs to change focus on the company. Find a compelling pitchman for Audio/Video. Find a pitchman for Business/Creative stuff. Apple should be a multiheaded Hydra with a collection of superstars. I want to see Apple excited about being in markets. Don't get old and stodgy on us too fast.
  • Reply 16 of 40
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,946member
    I'm a bit skeptical that Apple would sell its pro apps. It's possible, but it sounds a little off. Right now, they're offering something for just about every stage of life for a given piece of media, production, post production (Final Cut, etc), distribution (iTunes store & client) and use (iDevices).



    I don't see what advantage Adobe would get out of the pro apps other than to pay their competitor to quit the market. Then there's another problem, I think Apple makes the pro apps to get media pros to buy the machines. With the competition, you don't have to get a Mac to run the software, a lot of the competition support Mac and Windows.
  • Reply 17 of 40
    northgatenorthgate Posts: 4,461member
    I have no idea how profitable the ProApps are for Apple. And I'm not really clear how many resources are required to keep them cutting edge and competitive.



    Adobe has already consolidated too much control with their acquisition of Macromedia. The LAST thing I want is for them to have complete control over the Audio/Video world.



    Alsoi, Adobe would have zero interest in keeping them Apple-centric and would quickly migrate them to be Windows-centric with Mac port afterthoughts like their CS lineup. Ugh. Talk about instability problems trying to make the apps both Quicktime AND Windows Media compatible. Oy.



    I pray that Apple doesn't sell them off. I don't think they will.
  • Reply 18 of 40
    hmurchisonhmurchison Posts: 12,273member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Northgate View Post


    I have no idea how profitable the ProApps are for Apple. And I'm not really clear how many resources are required to keep them cutting edge and competitive.



    Adobe has already consolidated too much control with their acquisition of Macromedia. The LAST thing I want is for them to have complete control over the Audio/Video world.



    Alsoi, Adobe would have zero interest in keeping them Apple-centric and would quickly migrate them to be Windows-centric with Mac port afterthoughts like their CS lineup. Ugh. Talk about instability problems trying to make the apps both Quicktime AND Windows Media compatible. Oy.



    I pray that Apple doesn't sell them off. I don't think they will.



    If Apple sold the Pro Apps they may as well be selling the Mac Pro because the sales numbers would die off like plague victims. Plus Quicktime as a media architecture would take a serious hit as well.



    I think the rumor is a pretty unlikely one. iPods are simply not "that" sustainable a business unit to count on say 5 years from now. Apple needs to be that cool computer platform for creative types. The company ethos has always centered around that.



    Doing spreadsheets and Presentations is something you think about being PC dominated. Doing Audio or Video is something you think of as a Mac strongsuit.
  • Reply 19 of 40
    thegarthegar Posts: 92member
    Also, look at the Mac Pro and the Pro apps as the image building and R&D of Apple. Something like the Formula 1 is for Porsche, Ferrari. Honda, Renault, Mercedes and the like.
  • Reply 20 of 40
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,304member
    Apple is not selling their pro apps. Anyone in that camp is smoking too much of something bad for the brainpan.
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