Having nothing to hide doesn't mean it's their business to listen or track without a warrant.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
I say....while there be any speed increase with existing, 1st generation iPhones?
EDGE is maxed out @ approx. 200kbit/sec, since the iphone we own right now can not be upgraded hardware wise everything regarding the iphone 3G is limited to the iphone 3G...
I say....while there be any speed increase with existing, 1st generation iPhones?
There will surely be some performance increases with the OS in each version. And as Apple improves battery management they may also increase the processor speed which is highly underclocked.
As for data rate speeds, that depends mostly on the carrier increasing throughput for EDGE, if it's not already at its limit.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
Right, and the government would never just do things for their own political advantage, so they should be able to do what ever they like whenever they like, above the law and the constitution. There's no way a government could be untrustworthy, is there?
Edit: for those wondering why the server went down, it was because they detected criticism of Bush and ordered it destroyed. The backup machine is now running.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
An unchecked government is more dangerous than random nutjobs. Most of the security done now is just theatrics, not actual security.
I find it interesting that some who decry Google taking a picture of their face or license plate on a public street (where courts have ruled they have no expectation of privacy) have no problem with a government listening in on their private communications (where courts have ruled that they do have a reasonable expectation of privacy).
I have always thought that the following quote which was used as the motto on the title page of An Historical Review of the Constitution and Government of Pennsylvania (1759) best sums it up: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
A more contemporary version is even more to the point: "People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."
I find it interesting that some who decry Google taking a picture of their face or license plate on a public street (where courts have ruled they have no expectation of privacy) have no problem with a government listening in on their private communications (where courts have ruled that they do have a reasonable expectation of privacy).
I have always thought that the following quote which was used as the motto on the title page of An Historical Review of the Constitution and Government of Pennsylvania (1759) best sums it up: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
A more contemporary version is even more to the point: "People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."
well said!
we all know what can happen if we don't object to such questionable interpretations of the constitution... just look at germany pre 1933... and what came out of it... most people forget that germany was a democracy pre 1933. the nazis didn't have the majority in parliament. i don't want to compare the neo-cons to the nazi-party of 1933-1945. but we all have to be very concerned when civil liberties get flushed down the toilet....!!!
First of all, I want to get it out of the way, by saying that I disagree with the Bush administration about the warrant-less wiretapping. There is a court to allow emergency wiretaps, so that is no excuse. Over the years, the court has proved itself to be properly responsive to security needs, which is why it was set up. There was no need to go around that, except that this administration wants to do everything in complete secret, even things that have traditionally be done in the open.
Having said that so it's known where I stand on it, I'd just like to say that the wiretapping that most people think is going on is not.
What's happening it that NSA computers check words and key phrases. This goes on 24 hours a day, every day. Just a very small fraction of those calls are ever flagged. Estimates I've seen (not by the administration), judge that perhaps one in a million calls, or less, are actually flagged, and then listened to. This is a very small number, even with the huge number of calls made every day. Only a very small percentage of those are thought to require further follow ups, and are then tapped. Most of those fail the tests for further continuance, and are dropped.
If what so many people thought was true, we would need a million people listening to phone calls. Perhaps in China they do that, but not here.
First of all, I want to get it out of the way, by saying that I disagree with the Bush administration about the warrant-less wiretapping. There is a court to allow emergency wiretaps, so that is no excuse. Over the years, the court has proved itself to be properly responsive to security needs, which is why it was set up. There was no need to go around that, except that this administration wants to do everything in complete secret, even things that have traditionally be done in the open.
Having said that so it's known where I stand on it, I'd just like to say that the wiretapping that most people think is going on is not.
What's happening it that NSA computers check words and key phrases. This goes on 24 hours a day, every day. Just a very small fraction of those calls are ever flagged. Estimates I've seen (not by the administration), judge that perhaps one in a million calls, or less, are actually flagged, and then listened to. This is a very small number, even with the huge number of calls made every day. Only a very small percentage of those are thought to require further follow ups, and are then tapped. Most of those fail the tests for further continuance, and are dropped.
If what so many people thought was true, we would need a million people listening to phone calls. Perhaps in China they do that, but not here.
Have you seen any estimates about how many terrorists have been caught
Have you seen any estimates about how many terrorists have been caught
by this method?
It depends on who you speak to. Supposedly, it led to the capture of that guy a couple of years ago trying to come in through Canada.
But, as this is all secret, we only know what they want to tell us about any possible results.
Personally, I doubt it's done very much that's been helpful. Most security experts say that while it's probably led them to a few people who should be watched, and a couple of arrests like that guy I mentioned, if a terrorist group really wants to stay under the radar they could. The opposite to that is said that if this wasn't publicized, terrorists wouldn't know about it, and so wouldn't avoid it.
Since when is it Liberal to be concerned about our constitution rights?
And there IS wholesale eavesdropping on private citizens.
Perhaps your neocon complacency needs awakening.
Citizens should be free of monitoring of their conversations, safari browsing, instant messaging, SMS texting and picture taking via their 1.0 or 2.0 iPhones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orangeoutsider
Have you got something to talk about on the phone that would make you a suspected terrorist?
There is no wholesale eavesdropping on private citizens. Give your lib paranoia a rest.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
What makes NOW any different? Giving up your basic rights so that you live in the equivalent of Stalinist Russia in the name of "security" is foolish. Would you go for Fascism as well, because they made the trains run on time?
We expend blood and treasure not to give the government more power and citizens less rights. Perhaps you might want to look at the statistical probability of a terrorist attack actually happening. It is not like 24, where they have endless plans upon plans and access to the latest technology and traiterous americans.
There has been a wholesale power grab by this administration and too much intrusion into our lives. Warrants serve a purpose, the FISA courts are there to streamline the process for this.
What makes NOW any different? Giving up your basic rights so that you live in the equivalent of Stalinist Russia in the name of "security" is foolish. Would you go for Fascism as well, because they made the trains run on time?
We expend blood and treasure not to give the government more power and citizens less rights. Perhaps you might want to look at the statistical probability of a terrorist attack actually happening. It is not like 24, where they have endless plans upon plans and access to the latest technology and traiterous americans.
There has been a wholesale power grab by this administration and too much intrusion into our lives. Warrants serve a purpose, the FISA courts are there to streamline the process for this.
don't forget that iraq and the torturing of prisoners by the CIA and all those things a lot of people that had a moderated view on things actually changed their mind and were pushed into the terrorist direction... this is the typical thing, repressive regimes actually create their own enemies...
i hope those government officials have to endure "water boarding" once in their life...
water boarding was considered a war crime in WWII, and japanese soldiers actually got convicted by american military courts for committing those atrocities... but now it's OK to use it on others... what perverse logic is behind that??? i don't get it...
water boarding was considered a war crime in WWII, and japanese soldiers actually got convicted by american military courts for committing those atrocities... but now it's OK to use it on others... what perverse logic is behind that??? i don't get it...
We use soft water, they used hard water. Much more humane.
Comments
will this effect anything with the current iphone's? or just the new ones? seems like it would just be useful for new 3g iphoneZ right?
whot?
Having nothing to hide doesn't mean it's their business to listen or track without a warrant.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
whot?
I say....while there be any speed increase with existing, 1st generation iPhones?
I say....while there be any speed increase with existing, 1st generation iPhones?
EDGE is maxed out @ approx. 200kbit/sec, since the iphone we own right now can not be upgraded hardware wise everything regarding the iphone 3G is limited to the iphone 3G...
I say....while there be any speed increase with existing, 1st generation iPhones?
There will surely be some performance increases with the OS in each version. And as Apple improves battery management they may also increase the processor speed which is highly underclocked.
As for data rate speeds, that depends mostly on the carrier increasing throughput for EDGE, if it's not already at its limit.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
Right, and the government would never just do things for their own political advantage, so they should be able to do what ever they like whenever they like, above the law and the constitution. There's no way a government could be untrustworthy, is there?
Edit: for those wondering why the server went down, it was because they detected criticism of Bush and ordered it destroyed. The backup machine is now running.
has anyone heard if they are going to boost the EDGE network? i know they did the same thing last year, about 20%.
A large EDGE improvement would be the best option for iphone customers right now, not another iphone - as cool as iHope it will be.
-ThunkDifferent.com!
Here is a nice presentation by AI poster Winterspan...
Thanks Solipsism and Winterspan. That is an informative chart!
I was always able to get the gyst of things reading the articles as I have over the past few months, but this helps put it all together!
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
An unchecked government is more dangerous than random nutjobs. Most of the security done now is just theatrics, not actual security.
I have always thought that the following quote which was used as the motto on the title page of An Historical Review of the Constitution and Government of Pennsylvania (1759) best sums it up: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
A more contemporary version is even more to the point: "People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."
I find it interesting that some who decry Google taking a picture of their face or license plate on a public street (where courts have ruled they have no expectation of privacy) have no problem with a government listening in on their private communications (where courts have ruled that they do have a reasonable expectation of privacy).
I have always thought that the following quote which was used as the motto on the title page of An Historical Review of the Constitution and Government of Pennsylvania (1759) best sums it up: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
A more contemporary version is even more to the point: "People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both."
well said!
we all know what can happen if we don't object to such questionable interpretations of the constitution... just look at germany pre 1933... and what came out of it... most people forget that germany was a democracy pre 1933. the nazis didn't have the majority in parliament. i don't want to compare the neo-cons to the nazi-party of 1933-1945. but we all have to be very concerned when civil liberties get flushed down the toilet....!!!
Having said that so it's known where I stand on it, I'd just like to say that the wiretapping that most people think is going on is not.
What's happening it that NSA computers check words and key phrases. This goes on 24 hours a day, every day. Just a very small fraction of those calls are ever flagged. Estimates I've seen (not by the administration), judge that perhaps one in a million calls, or less, are actually flagged, and then listened to. This is a very small number, even with the huge number of calls made every day. Only a very small percentage of those are thought to require further follow ups, and are then tapped. Most of those fail the tests for further continuance, and are dropped.
If what so many people thought was true, we would need a million people listening to phone calls. Perhaps in China they do that, but not here.
First of all, I want to get it out of the way, by saying that I disagree with the Bush administration about the warrant-less wiretapping. There is a court to allow emergency wiretaps, so that is no excuse. Over the years, the court has proved itself to be properly responsive to security needs, which is why it was set up. There was no need to go around that, except that this administration wants to do everything in complete secret, even things that have traditionally be done in the open.
Having said that so it's known where I stand on it, I'd just like to say that the wiretapping that most people think is going on is not.
What's happening it that NSA computers check words and key phrases. This goes on 24 hours a day, every day. Just a very small fraction of those calls are ever flagged. Estimates I've seen (not by the administration), judge that perhaps one in a million calls, or less, are actually flagged, and then listened to. This is a very small number, even with the huge number of calls made every day. Only a very small percentage of those are thought to require further follow ups, and are then tapped. Most of those fail the tests for further continuance, and are dropped.
If what so many people thought was true, we would need a million people listening to phone calls. Perhaps in China they do that, but not here.
Have you seen any estimates about how many terrorists have been caught
by this method?
Have you seen any estimates about how many terrorists have been caught
by this method?
It depends on who you speak to. Supposedly, it led to the capture of that guy a couple of years ago trying to come in through Canada.
But, as this is all secret, we only know what they want to tell us about any possible results.
Personally, I doubt it's done very much that's been helpful. Most security experts say that while it's probably led them to a few people who should be watched, and a couple of arrests like that guy I mentioned, if a terrorist group really wants to stay under the radar they could. The opposite to that is said that if this wasn't publicized, terrorists wouldn't know about it, and so wouldn't avoid it.
Six of one, half a dozen of the other.
And there IS wholesale eavesdropping on private citizens.
Perhaps your neocon complacency needs awakening.
Citizens should be free of monitoring of their conversations, safari browsing, instant messaging, SMS texting and picture taking via their 1.0 or 2.0 iPhones.
Have you got something to talk about on the phone that would make you a suspected terrorist?
There is no wholesale eavesdropping on private citizens. Give your lib paranoia a rest.
F warrants. It's my opinion that the government can do whatever is necessary, warrant or not, to protect the population from the nut jobs we're dealing with now and tomorrow. If a bomb goes off and the excuse for not stopping it was we were waiting for a warrant, then I hope everyone with the "government is watching me while I'm on the can" is happy.
What makes NOW any different? Giving up your basic rights so that you live in the equivalent of Stalinist Russia in the name of "security" is foolish. Would you go for Fascism as well, because they made the trains run on time?
We expend blood and treasure not to give the government more power and citizens less rights. Perhaps you might want to look at the statistical probability of a terrorist attack actually happening. It is not like 24, where they have endless plans upon plans and access to the latest technology and traiterous americans.
There has been a wholesale power grab by this administration and too much intrusion into our lives. Warrants serve a purpose, the FISA courts are there to streamline the process for this.
What makes NOW any different? Giving up your basic rights so that you live in the equivalent of Stalinist Russia in the name of "security" is foolish. Would you go for Fascism as well, because they made the trains run on time?
We expend blood and treasure not to give the government more power and citizens less rights. Perhaps you might want to look at the statistical probability of a terrorist attack actually happening. It is not like 24, where they have endless plans upon plans and access to the latest technology and traiterous americans.
There has been a wholesale power grab by this administration and too much intrusion into our lives. Warrants serve a purpose, the FISA courts are there to streamline the process for this.
don't forget that iraq and the torturing of prisoners by the CIA and all those things a lot of people that had a moderated view on things actually changed their mind and were pushed into the terrorist direction... this is the typical thing, repressive regimes actually create their own enemies...
i hope those government officials have to endure "water boarding" once in their life...
water boarding was considered a war crime in WWII, and japanese soldiers actually got convicted by american military courts for committing those atrocities... but now it's OK to use it on others... what perverse logic is behind that??? i don't get it...
water boarding was considered a war crime in WWII, and japanese soldiers actually got convicted by american military courts for committing those atrocities... but now it's OK to use it on others... what perverse logic is behind that??? i don't get it...
We use soft water, they used hard water. Much more humane.