It seems that these days we we have to patent everything just in case. I am doing a research for the federal government and currently developing new methods and ideas for building a particular "thing". I really hope no one patent my designs before I publish them!!
Too late, I've already patented "things"
Edit: Oh, and I've also just patented "methods for making things", too! ("A method is a means of defining a process for making things. This patent defines the concept of using an orderly system of tasks and activities to be implemented for the purpose of creating things.")
the hands depicted in the pictogram were clearly not human, therefore i believe that whatever Apple does with this patent, it is not destined for use on our watery planet.
How about the old NeXTSTEP Dock where the command-double-click autohides all other apps hidden but the application you're double clicking. The pasteboard is always there.
I never had Window Garbage with NeXTSTEP/Openstep.
You mean like the Mac's Command-Option-H, "Hide Others"?
But doesn't a notification count as an update to that window in which case it wouldn't be transparent? Also, the point of a notification is that you notice it so if it is transparent, you might not notice it.
I don't really ever use these kind of apps that notify you of events. Some of the people I work with use Entourage and it has popups when you get an email but they appear and then go away - they aren't really disruptive. I use apps with floating palettes but if I need to say work on something behind the palette (e.g an image in Photoshop), I'm going to need to move the panel anyway so I can see the right colors.
I still don't see the problem this particular solution is supposed to solve. I can't really think of a real-world instance where I'd actually use it. Same deal with Spaces for me though. I just use command-h and click another app.
Well if you never use an app with notifications, you'll never run into this kind of issue, and you'll likely never run into a use for this patent.
But say I'm at work, typing away in Eclipse, when suddenly Lotus Notes pops a notification in front of me. I wasn't working in Notes at the time, I was in Eclipse, but I'm getting a Notes notification... so no, it's not an update to the window I was already in. What should happen instead is that I get a notification that doesn't steal my keyboard focus (which means I won't accidentally dismiss the notification before I'm ready, and it won't interrupt my train of thought while I'm typing in Eclipse). More than that, many notifications could easily get by as partially transparent. For instance, a dark gray but see-through background and white text. Easy to read, very noticeable, but not disruptive to your workflow because you can still see through it and you can still click on things under it without having to manually close the notification window first.
Another example: System notifications. On my Mac, I have Growl set up to tell me when I get new email (with a bit of a preview), or when iTunes starts playing a new song (with information about the song). These are informational things that I can either pay attention to or ignore, but they're transparent and don't steal keyboard or mouse focus. They just pop up for a few seconds and then disappear, and I can pay as much or as little attention to them as I want.
On the other hand, my Windows machine at work is constantly in my face and stopping me from working. It's more the particular apps I'm using, rather than Windows itself, but it's an example of notifications done wrong. For instance, the network management software on my work machine (mandated by my employer) is constantly alerting me to its connection status. Disconnected! Connecting! Connected! Hey look over here, everything's okay and I've got nothing useful to tell you but I'm still gonna bug you about it!!! It tells me about this stuff with system tray notifications that stay up for way too long. If I need to access something else in the tray, or see something in the corner of my screen near the tray, I have to manually close that notification because it's opaque and it blocks everything underneath it. Worse, if I lose my connection and it tries to reconnect, it pops a progress window up to tell me what it's doing. This window is opaque, so it blocks what's going on underneath it, it floats so I can't just click another window in front of it, and it steals keyboard focus so it interrupts what I'm typing if I was in the middle of something. Yes, I know that a lot of this is purely the fault of just seriously stupid developers and that it could be made a lot better even without transparency... but mundane notifications like that would best be dealt with by a translucent, non-focus-grabbing window. It's noticeable if I care about it, but if I don't care, it won't get in my way.
Edit: Oh, and I've also just patented "methods for making things", too! ("A method is a means of defining a process for making things. This patent defines the concept of using an orderly system of tasks and activities to be implemented for the purpose of creating things.")
Ouch.. I guess I have to start over or go ahead and hope you don't file a lawsuit in Marshall, Texas
You mean like the Mac's Command-Option-H, "Hide Others"?
Nope. That was a go-between solution to appease the Mac faithful of the past and to piss off the NeXT Engineers and NeXT lovers of the present and future.
The dock on NeXTSTEP was the right side. It included the Clock and any docked application ready to be double-clicked and started [three dots denoting an active app].
The applications not in the dock and startered were launch and aligned left to right at the footer of the Display View.
Command-H-double-click any active application will auto-hide all view and make key/order front the application you are clicking on.
Assume you have XCode running with 8 views open.
At the footer or dock on the side there is an active application called, Eclipse.app.
Command-double-click on Eclipse.app icon and it's active state autohides all views, from all applications and makes key/order front the last save state you left Eclipse in.
Do this with an inactive Eclipse.app and it will restore the views you last had open before you killed the application.
With floating Menus and submenu tear-offs for NeXTSTEP this was extremely handy.
OS X doesn't come close to duplicating the efficiency it could if we dropped the Menu Top bar and accentuated the NeXT behavior with some modern additions.
See below:
[CENTER][/CENTER]
Take a look at another application, TIFFany:
[CENTER][/CENTER]
To auto-hide any application just command-double-click-h and your presets for that app are restored and only that app is visible.
There is none of this Show->Hide with Finder who can get lost and you still have views to hide but the Hide is grayed out.
If I wanted to get hide Mathematica and launch TextEdit.app all I had to do was command-double-click-H and only the floating TextEdit menu and a single empty document was ready to roll.
I could go on but it should be obvious that if one has 20 applications running this approach is quick, concise, consistent and never fails.
They're still drawing MacOS windows even though MacOS has been dead for over ten years. They really have to give it up or hand in their resignations. I never ran MacOS and I couldn't care less about it. I want a stable, secure, modern system and I don't want to be reminded that the company that made my computer used to produce the exact opposite.
it's not an update to the window I was already in. What should happen instead is that I get a notification that doesn't steal my keyboard focus
But isn't it an update to the notification window in which case it should become fully opaque?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorD
Another example: System notifications. On my Mac, I have Growl set up to tell me when I get new email (with a bit of a preview), or when iTunes starts playing a new song (with information about the song). These are informational things that I can either pay attention to or ignore, but they're transparent and don't steal keyboard or mouse focus. They just pop up for a few seconds and then disappear, and I can pay as much or as little attention to them as I want.
Doesn't this mean it's not a problem though? You already have notifications that don't get in your way. This means that application developers can already do things either way if they choose. Perhaps this patent will just prevent apps from stealing focus if the user chooses to override them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorD
It tells me about this stuff with system tray notifications that stay up for way too long. If I need to access something else in the tray, or see something in the corner of my screen near the tray, I have to manually close that notification because it's opaque and it blocks everything underneath it.
You can disable those balloons with a registry key. They are probably the most annoying thing about Windows for me:
Nope. That was a go-between solution to appease the Mac faithful of the past and to piss off the NeXT Engineers and NeXT lovers of the present and future.
I'll stop you there and point you to 'Command-Option-Click' on dock items which launches an app and hides the other apps. Surely that's the same as NeXT's 'Command-H-Double-click' and a lot easier to use?
This is a silly patent. I can interactively adjust the opacity of a window using the stock version of Compiz that comes with Ubuntu. It is also both obvious and trivial to make a defocused window fade out over an extended period of time and resolidify when you click on it. There's even a GUI program for configuring the behavior (or just about any other behavior you want.) I call 'prior art!'
If you really want a cutting edge solution to the window overlap problem, the Metisse project is furthest along imho.
I'll stop you there and point you to 'Command-Option-Click' on dock items which launches an app and hides the other apps. Surely that's the same as NeXT's 'Command-H-Double-click' and a lot easier to use?
You aren't getting it. command-H-dble-click doesn't duplicate NeXTSTEP bahavior. In fact on Tiger I'm sitting here doing it only pull's Finder forward and finds the docked application [running or not] pathway in Finder.
From what I see Command-Alt-H-Double-click is working for me to mimick this behavior but missing the benefit of:
Tear-off submenus and the fact applications have a waste of main document view littered with duplicate list views to those deeply listed in their top menu bar.
The entire thing is a go-between.
Sorry but contorting my hand in a three key sequence followed by a double-click mouse, several dozens if not a hundred times a day between applications is an absolute ergonomic nightmare and pointless.
Transparent and translucent windows have been around for ages.
What I can't figure out is: do Apple engineers simply don't know what has been done in the industry, or do they just not care?
Either way, these invalid patent filings are a real nuisance, because they will get rubber-stamped by the patent office, and then it will take a lot of effort to defeat each one of them should Apple try to assert them.
Transparent and translucent windows have been around for ages.
What I can't figure out is: do Apple engineers simply don't know what has been done in the industry, or do they just not care?
Either way, these invalid patent filings are a real nuisance, because they will get rubber-stamped by the patent office, and then it will take a lot of effort to defeat each one of them should Apple try to assert them.
Apple's been using transparent/translucent windows for ages as well (such as in iPhoto/Aperture). The patent just talks about a very specific behavior where it becomes more transparent over time. Apple just likes to file patents on almost everything, even if they don't apply them in the real world
Perhaps I'm not getting what you're getting mdriftmeyer.
Command-Option-Click launches a dock item and hides the others. No need to hold down H or double click. If you've got fat thumbs you can hold down Command and Option with one thumb.
Comments
Tree Frog Man is back!!!
Look ma, no palms!
It seems that these days we we have to patent everything just in case. I am doing a research for the federal government and currently developing new methods and ideas for building a particular "thing". I really hope no one patent my designs before I publish them!!
Too late, I've already patented "things"
Edit: Oh, and I've also just patented "methods for making things", too! ("A method is a means of defining a process for making things. This patent defines the concept of using an orderly system of tasks and activities to be implemented for the purpose of creating things.")
How about the old NeXTSTEP Dock where the command-double-click autohides all other apps hidden but the application you're double clicking. The pasteboard is always there.
I never had Window Garbage with NeXTSTEP/Openstep.
You mean like the Mac's Command-Option-H, "Hide Others"?
But doesn't a notification count as an update to that window in which case it wouldn't be transparent? Also, the point of a notification is that you notice it so if it is transparent, you might not notice it.
I don't really ever use these kind of apps that notify you of events. Some of the people I work with use Entourage and it has popups when you get an email but they appear and then go away - they aren't really disruptive. I use apps with floating palettes but if I need to say work on something behind the palette (e.g an image in Photoshop), I'm going to need to move the panel anyway so I can see the right colors.
I still don't see the problem this particular solution is supposed to solve. I can't really think of a real-world instance where I'd actually use it. Same deal with Spaces for me though. I just use command-h and click another app.
Well if you never use an app with notifications, you'll never run into this kind of issue, and you'll likely never run into a use for this patent.
But say I'm at work, typing away in Eclipse, when suddenly Lotus Notes pops a notification in front of me. I wasn't working in Notes at the time, I was in Eclipse, but I'm getting a Notes notification... so no, it's not an update to the window I was already in. What should happen instead is that I get a notification that doesn't steal my keyboard focus (which means I won't accidentally dismiss the notification before I'm ready, and it won't interrupt my train of thought while I'm typing in Eclipse). More than that, many notifications could easily get by as partially transparent. For instance, a dark gray but see-through background and white text. Easy to read, very noticeable, but not disruptive to your workflow because you can still see through it and you can still click on things under it without having to manually close the notification window first.
Another example: System notifications. On my Mac, I have Growl set up to tell me when I get new email (with a bit of a preview), or when iTunes starts playing a new song (with information about the song). These are informational things that I can either pay attention to or ignore, but they're transparent and don't steal keyboard or mouse focus. They just pop up for a few seconds and then disappear, and I can pay as much or as little attention to them as I want.
On the other hand, my Windows machine at work is constantly in my face and stopping me from working. It's more the particular apps I'm using, rather than Windows itself, but it's an example of notifications done wrong. For instance, the network management software on my work machine (mandated by my employer) is constantly alerting me to its connection status. Disconnected! Connecting! Connected! Hey look over here, everything's okay and I've got nothing useful to tell you but I'm still gonna bug you about it!!! It tells me about this stuff with system tray notifications that stay up for way too long. If I need to access something else in the tray, or see something in the corner of my screen near the tray, I have to manually close that notification because it's opaque and it blocks everything underneath it. Worse, if I lose my connection and it tries to reconnect, it pops a progress window up to tell me what it's doing. This window is opaque, so it blocks what's going on underneath it, it floats so I can't just click another window in front of it, and it steals keyboard focus so it interrupts what I'm typing if I was in the middle of something. Yes, I know that a lot of this is purely the fault of just seriously stupid developers and that it could be made a lot better even without transparency... but mundane notifications like that would best be dealt with by a translucent, non-focus-grabbing window. It's noticeable if I care about it, but if I don't care, it won't get in my way.
Too late, I've already patented "things"
Edit: Oh, and I've also just patented "methods for making things", too! ("A method is a means of defining a process for making things. This patent defines the concept of using an orderly system of tasks and activities to be implemented for the purpose of creating things.")
Ouch.. I guess I have to start over or go ahead and hope you don't file a lawsuit in Marshall, Texas
Ouch.. I guess I have to start over or go ahead and hope you don't file a lawsuit in Marshall, Texas
I have a patent on filing lawsuits in Marshall, Texas. You think the lawyer charge a lot? Wait until you get my bill!
You mean like the Mac's Command-Option-H, "Hide Others"?
Nope. That was a go-between solution to appease the Mac faithful of the past and to piss off the NeXT Engineers and NeXT lovers of the present and future.
The dock on NeXTSTEP was the right side. It included the Clock and any docked application ready to be double-clicked and started [three dots denoting an active app].
The applications not in the dock and startered were launch and aligned left to right at the footer of the Display View.
Command-H-double-click any active application will auto-hide all view and make key/order front the application you are clicking on.
Assume you have XCode running with 8 views open.
At the footer or dock on the side there is an active application called, Eclipse.app.
Command-double-click on Eclipse.app icon and it's active state autohides all views, from all applications and makes key/order front the last save state you left Eclipse in.
Do this with an inactive Eclipse.app and it will restore the views you last had open before you killed the application.
With floating Menus and submenu tear-offs for NeXTSTEP this was extremely handy.
OS X doesn't come close to duplicating the efficiency it could if we dropped the Menu Top bar and accentuated the NeXT behavior with some modern additions.
See below:
[CENTER]
Take a look at another application, TIFFany:
[CENTER]
To auto-hide any application just command-double-click-h and your presets for that app are restored and only that app is visible.
There is none of this Show->Hide with Finder who can get lost and you still have views to hide but the Hide is grayed out.
If I wanted to get hide Mathematica and launch TextEdit.app all I had to do was command-double-click-H and only the floating TextEdit menu and a single empty document was ready to roll.
I could go on but it should be obvious that if one has 20 applications running this approach is quick, concise, consistent and never fails.
it's not an update to the window I was already in. What should happen instead is that I get a notification that doesn't steal my keyboard focus
But isn't it an update to the notification window in which case it should become fully opaque?
Another example: System notifications. On my Mac, I have Growl set up to tell me when I get new email (with a bit of a preview), or when iTunes starts playing a new song (with information about the song). These are informational things that I can either pay attention to or ignore, but they're transparent and don't steal keyboard or mouse focus. They just pop up for a few seconds and then disappear, and I can pay as much or as little attention to them as I want.
Doesn't this mean it's not a problem though? You already have notifications that don't get in your way. This means that application developers can already do things either way if they choose. Perhaps this patent will just prevent apps from stealing focus if the user chooses to override them.
It tells me about this stuff with system tray notifications that stay up for way too long. If I need to access something else in the tray, or see something in the corner of my screen near the tray, I have to manually close that notification because it's opaque and it blocks everything underneath it.
You can disable those balloons with a registry key. They are probably the most annoying thing about Windows for me:
http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windo...alloons-in-xp/
Nope. That was a go-between solution to appease the Mac faithful of the past and to piss off the NeXT Engineers and NeXT lovers of the present and future.
I'll stop you there and point you to 'Command-Option-Click' on dock items which launches an app and hides the other apps. Surely that's the same as NeXT's 'Command-H-Double-click' and a lot easier to use?
If you really want a cutting edge solution to the window overlap problem, the Metisse project is furthest along imho.
I'll stop you there and point you to 'Command-Option-Click' on dock items which launches an app and hides the other apps. Surely that's the same as NeXT's 'Command-H-Double-click' and a lot easier to use?
You aren't getting it. command-H-dble-click doesn't duplicate NeXTSTEP bahavior. In fact on Tiger I'm sitting here doing it only pull's Finder forward and finds the docked application [running or not] pathway in Finder.
From what I see Command-Alt-H-Double-click is working for me to mimick this behavior but missing the benefit of:
Tear-off submenus and the fact applications have a waste of main document view littered with duplicate list views to those deeply listed in their top menu bar.
The entire thing is a go-between.
Sorry but contorting my hand in a three key sequence followed by a double-click mouse, several dozens if not a hundred times a day between applications is an absolute ergonomic nightmare and pointless.
What I can't figure out is: do Apple engineers simply don't know what has been done in the industry, or do they just not care?
Either way, these invalid patent filings are a real nuisance, because they will get rubber-stamped by the patent office, and then it will take a lot of effort to defeat each one of them should Apple try to assert them.
Transparent and translucent windows have been around for ages.
What I can't figure out is: do Apple engineers simply don't know what has been done in the industry, or do they just not care?
Either way, these invalid patent filings are a real nuisance, because they will get rubber-stamped by the patent office, and then it will take a lot of effort to defeat each one of them should Apple try to assert them.
Apple's been using transparent/translucent windows for ages as well (such as in iPhoto/Aperture). The patent just talks about a very specific behavior where it becomes more transparent over time. Apple just likes to file patents on almost everything, even if they don't apply them in the real world
Command-Option-Click launches a dock item and hides the others. No need to hold down H or double click. If you've got fat thumbs you can hold down Command and Option with one thumb.
Here's the official list...
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.h.../cdb_dcks.html
It's the same in Leopard as Tiger.
edit: double-clicking items in the dock does nothing - the first click is enough.