It's true they probably won't survive this, but they aren't "stealing property". At worst they have committed copyright infringement, but that's not stealing. Ask someone who's actually had their car stolen if they think copying a record is the same thing.
Physical property and intellectual property are both property. The fact that stealing music is easier to do and harder to catch do not make it any more legal than walking into BestBuy and snagging a CD. The OS that Psystar is installing on their machines is coming from the OSx86 Project, most likely from a torrent site. The inclusion of the software disc for the sale is just lip service to Apple to help prevent this inevitable day. Having one does not permit you to steal another.
.... Just because Apple's business model is to sell a cheap OS and make money on the hardware doesn't give Apple the right to dictate what someone can do with a legally purchased copy of the OS.
This appears to be a fertile source of confusion. Apple doesn't "sell a cheap OS" just to make money on the hardware. It sells you the hardware with an OS installed, and the price covers both, or they would be out of business by now. Every other version you buy in a shrink-wrapped box is an upgrade. That's why it's $129 instead of $400 or whatever Vista Ultimate is. If Psystar wins, and everybody and his dog can start selling computers with OS X installed, then Apple will have to start charging full price for every upgrade. Does anybody really want that?
Anyway, this is their business model; they're entitled to have one, just as Microsoft is entitled to the drug dealer model they use: the cheap upgrade price that make it illegal to sell or transfer a copy of Windows to a new computer. You should deal with the company whose business model you support. Myself, I'll take Apple's, but to each their own.
Physical property with intellectual property are both property. The fact that stealing music is easier to do and harder to catch do not make it any more legal than walking into BestBuy and snagging a CD. The OS that Psystar is installing on their machines is coming from the OSx86 Project, most likely from a torrent site. The inclusion of the software disc for the sale is just lip service to Apple to help prevent this inevitable day. Having one does not permit you to steal another.
i have to say, i think some people are taking a pretty crazy, high and mighty attitude with respect to the whole intellectual property thing. the idea that copying a song is stealing it... i know that lots of people are going around saying this sort of thing, but i just can't see it. i know that the RIAA is big on spreading this type of idea, but...
copying a song is not the same as stealing intellectual property. to my mind, true intellectual property theft would be performing the song as if it was your own. (which actually happens quite often, with no consequences). the only time you hear about consequences from that sort of thing is if someone were to put it on an album and sell it. otherwise, bands do cover tunes all the time. if all you are doing is listening to something, i just think it is crazy to call that stealing. if you are selling it and making money, that is one thing,...
i just think the corporations are driven by greed. actually, that is a given. we know they are. that's how the system works. it is all about expanding profits. for a true artist, it isn't about getting every little penny (never mind that most of those pennies actually go to the corporations, not the artists)... it is about getting your art seen/heard/experienced.
anyway, i think some people just need to chill out. zaphod, for one. he seems a little overly emotionally-invested in this whole thing. he is even bringing in the whole liberal-bashing thing. dude... let the courts handle it. chill out. have a beer. stop typing.
It's not "Complicated"..... what they are doing is Illegal...
You're really over-thinking this.
IMO you're seriously under-thinking this. In my world, that is a much sadder problem.
Quote:
Whatever parts they Modified is a straw dog. The point still stands that they HAD NO RIGHT TO DO THAT to make OSX work on their shit machines. This IS NOT LINUX... it's OSX. Yes it's built on UNIX but that is also another moot point.
Because OS X incorporates some OSS licensed software, they don't have the legal right to prevent modification of certain components of the software. In fact, Apple has published a contract which includes explicit permission for certain parts of the OS to be modified. That makes this point very much a relevant part of the discussion.
If, in fact, the portions of the OS that they modified were not covered by OSS licenses (and this is a very real possibility) then they were guilty of copyright violations for having done that.
Quote:
Pystar is wrong....and will pay dearly.
Psystar installed OS X on a computer that was not manufactured by Apple. That is an EULA violation. Apple did not sue them for this violation, probably because they figured it wasn't a slam-dunk case.
Psystar recently started duplicating and redistributing downloadable sfotware updates. That is much more of a slam-dunk case of copyright violation, for which Psystar has a serious chance of being found guilty.
But if you don't like the price, then you don't have to buy one. You have a choice. There's always Vista.
Not to single you out, but I'm sick of hearing this argument. The fact of the matter is that not everybody can choose. For instance, if you have to run Final Cut Pro (which is gradually overtaking Avid as the industry standard in DNLE's), then you must buy a Mac. No, there isn't "always Vista."
On the other hand, Avid Media Composer and all of the Adobe applications run on both Mac and WIndows. Users of those applications DO have a choice. But like I said, when it comes to DNLE's, fewer and fewer people in the lower-budget realm of film are using Avid anymore; in order to remain relevant, you have have Final Cut Pro. As a result, editors are in the same situation that most consumers found themselves in back in the mid '90's with Windows: you either use the operating system, or you don't use anything at all. (Meaning, you're screwed.)
In this sense, Apple has the same death grip over lower-budget (and even medium-budget) filmmakers that Windows used to have over the average consumer. Now, most people like Apple, so I don't know many people who are complaining about this. But, I just helped my brother buy a Sony Vaio laptop the other day, and it cost $1,200 versus $1,800 for a similarly-equipped MacBook. It made me wonder just how much I overpaid for my Mac Pro. (I really don't want to look into it.)
On a relevant note, consider the iPod. If I decided I wanted a Walkman, or Creative (which I could get since I run Windows in Boot Camp) to replace my iPod, I suddenly wouldn't be able to listen to my MP3's in the car anymore, since my Alpine is only iPod-compatible (like pretty much all car audio systems these days). I'd also have to get rid of my Harman Kardon Go + Play. In other words, it would be a MAJOR pain in the A$$ to abandon the iPod due to the monopoly Apple has established in the digital music player market, so Apple would have to screw up pretty badly with future incarnations to motivate the switch.
Is all this fair? Do we REALLY want Apple to have so much power? I mean, I love Apple, and I understand the whole "clone makers might screw up the innovation due to compatibility issues" argument, but it's very conceivable that Apple WILL become the next Microsoft as it continues to gain market share like crazy.
They are STEALING an OS they have NO RIGHT TO RESELL!!!!! aka... they are CRIMINALS!!!
They are not stealing anything, they have legally bought the OS and are just selling it on their hardware.
Like I said before, there are too many Apple Fan Boys here. If Microsoft was doing this same thing, everyone would be scorning them. But Apple do it and they are PRAISED for it! Simply unbelievable. You fan boys are pathetic.
I bought an iPhone 3G because it is an excellent device. I'd give it 10 points, with the next smart phone being maybe 4 at best. There is nothing currently on the market that comes close to this. However, the iPhone would score double points if Apple would stop restricting what it can do and let developers truly do what they want (and the iStore does not do this - so far the apps are boring as hell, and with Apple's controlling hands it in, it will stay that way).
Why can't I copy a file onto the device anywhere I want? Why can't I have a terminal with SSH? Why can't I record video? Why can't I use a SIP/VoIP client? The list goes on. All these things are entirely possible TODAY with a hacked iPhone. I can't wait until a hack comes out for the 3G so I can immediately free my device and use it to its full potential.
Of course, Apple will probably stop me doing this - stop me using a device I bought how I damn well want to. No, I have to use iTunes (possibly the worst bit of software ever written) and buy everything through their store so they can rip me off to the limit. No doubt you all support Apple on this one too?
And I'm sure everyone just LOVES how they are restricted in what carrier they can use the iPhone with. This has never happened before with any phone anywhere in the world as I know it. Another restrictive first for Apple.
I say screw Apple. They are probably the most inovative company in the tech field today but their restrictive practices are bad for the consumer. The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
I hope that by some fluke Pystar wins on this one and gives the big f*ck off finger to Apple.
On a relevant note, consider the iPod. If I decided I wanted a Walkman, or Creative (which I could get since I run Windows in Boot Camp) to replace my iPod, I suddenly wouldn't be able to listen to my MP3's in the car anymore, since my Alpine is only iPod-compatible (like pretty much all car audio systems these days). I'd also have to get rid of my Harman Kardon Go + Play. In other words, it would be a MAJOR pain in the A$$ to abandon the iPod due to the monopoly Apple has established in the digital music player market, so Apple would have to screw up pretty badly with future incarnations to motivate the switch.
I don't think that is any type of monopoly. You are the one making the choice to enter Apple's system by using iTunes. You are making a choice. You don't have to buy from iTunes and it is hardly a monopoly for Apple to require their software for their hardware. That or put your own software on an iPod but now Apple won't support it. That is what is going on here.
Apple could let these guys keep producing machines using legally purchased copies of OSX but would never have to support them. Psystar using Apples altered updates seems to be the crux of the issue!
I don't think that is any type of monopoly. You are the one making the choice to enter Apple's system by using iTunes. You are making a choice. You don't have to buy from iTunes and it is hardly a monopoly for Apple to require their software for their hardware. That or put your own software on an iPod but now Apple won't support it. That is what is going on here.
Apple could let these guys keep producing machines using legally purchased copies of OSX but would never have to support them. Psystar using Apples altered updates seems to be the crux of the issue!
Monopoly, or not, being one does not mean you are doing anything illegal.
They are not stealing anything, they have legally bought the OS and are just selling it on their hardware.
Like I said before, there are too many Apple Fan Boys here. If Microsoft was doing this same thing, everyone would be scorning them. But Apple do it and they are PRAISED for it! Simply unbelievable. You fan boys are pathetic.
I bought an iPhone 3G because it is an excellent device. I'd give it 10 points, with the next smart phone being maybe 4 at best. There is nothing currently on the market that comes close to this. However, the iPhone would score double points if Apple would stop restricting what it can do and let developers truly do what they want (and the iStore does not do this - so far the apps are boring as hell, and with Apple's controlling hands it in, it will stay that way).
Why can't I copy a file onto the device anywhere I want? Why can't I have a terminal with SSH? Why can't I record video? Why can't I use a SIP/VoIP client? The list goes on. All these things are entirely possible TODAY with a hacked iPhone. I can't wait until a hack comes out for the 3G so I can immediately free my device and use it to its full potential.
Of course, Apple will probably stop me doing this - stop me using a device I bought how I damn well want to. No, I have to use iTunes (possibly the worst bit of software ever written) and buy everything through their store so they can rip me off to the limit. No doubt you all support Apple on this one too?
I say screw Apple. They are probably the most inovative company in the tech field today but their restrictive practices are bad for the consumer. The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
I hope that by some fluke Pystar wins on this one and gives the big f*ck off finger to Apple.
You knew all of that before you bought the iPhone, and if you didn't, then you made an uninformed purchase. Now go cry yourself to sleep.
This guy is an idiot, and his logic is seriously flawed:
"What if Microsoft said you could only install Windows on Dell computers?," he said. "What if Honda said that, after you buy their car, you could only drive it on the roads they said you could?"
I wouldn't buy Windows and I wouldn't buy Honda... their market share goes down, the system works. Unless I deemed their service as the best for ME. This is standard business practice, and a standard capitalistic endeavor.
If someone doesn't want to buy a Mac, then they do not have to. If they can't afford one, they also will not buy one.
You knew all of that before you bought the iPhone, and if you didn't, then you made an uninformed purchase. Now go cry yourself to sleep.
I'm not crying, I knew it full well and made the purchase because it is such an outstanding device. Apple's restrictive methods however are not something we should put up with, let alone praise like the majority here!
People have to get a grip. The company makes some excellent devices. That doesn't mean you have to go to bed with them. There are plenty of things the company does that deserve critizism and this is one of them.
The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
Again, they are only getting paid the upgrade price for this software. Seeing what Microsoft does (or threatens to do) to anyone who tries to "do what they want" with a copy of Windows that they've only paid the upgrade price for, I hardly think Apple is the bad guy here.
I think it would be a good idea for a moderator to remove any posts with the word "fanboy" in them as well. I'm certainly not a mindless Apple supporter. There are many of the directions they're taking that I disagree wholeheartedly with, starting with their diskless, crappy heavily-compressed-download-only future of television. I DO, however, support their desire to have full control over their hardware and software in order to avoid the instability nightmare that Microsoft offers.
At the end of the day Apple make the products I love and Psystar are just trying to make a quick buck in a less than legal fashion, I know which one I support.
Look at all the apple fan boys in here. What apple is doing is in no way good for the consumer. They are just trying to protect their business of selling overpriced hardware to their customers.
You're on an apple forum... Their consumers are doing just fine with their product, hence the massive growth in the last year. If you don't like what they're pushin don't buy it.
They are not stealing anything, they have legally bought the OS and are just selling it on their hardware.
Like I said before, there are too many Apple Fan Boys here. If Microsoft was doing this same thing, everyone would be scorning them. But Apple do it and they are PRAISED for it! Simply unbelievable. You fan boys are pathetic.
Um, no. If Microsoft all of a sudden said that it would only run on Dells, then your point would stand, but that's not what Apple is doing. Not to mention that outside of a few years in the "dark" sans Jobs era, Apple has always done this. You also have to realize that Microsoft is a software company, and Apple is a hardware company. That difference is HUGE. Suggesting that they both follow the same business model shows how dumb you really are.
Quote:
Why can't I copy a file onto the device anywhere I want? Why can't I have a terminal with SSH? Why can't I record video? Why can't I use a SIP/VoIP client? The list goes on. All these things are entirely possible TODAY with a hacked iPhone. I can't wait until a hack comes out for the 3G so I can immediately free my device and use it to its full potential.
Because that's Apple's entire business model. Make it easy for everyone. 99% of what you stated you wanted to do, 99% of the iPhone users wouldn't even know what you were talking about. It's a moot point. Again, the market will speak. If everyone wanted an open device, prone to more points of failure, not in Apple's control, then they wouldn't sell very many. Done. Now, go and take a look at the software available for the iPhone. http://www.apple.com/webapps/index.html I could just seem my mom saying "Why can't I get any more email?" After filling up her iPhone with video of her cat... you completely overestimate the average consumer. Apple doesn't.
Quote:
Of course, Apple will probably stop me doing this - stop me using a device I bought how I damn well want to. No, I have to use iTunes (possibly the worst bit of software ever written) and buy everything through their store so they can rip me off to the limit. No doubt you all support Apple on this one too?
Again dummy, you knew this before buying it... so why again did you buy it? Not to mention that you still have plenty of options to put music that didn't originate from iTunes, on your shiny new iPhone. Ever hear of actually going into a store and purchasing a CD? *gasp!* But seriously, asking Apple to allow other music downloads aside from their own iTunes would be silly. Their entire board would be fired in a second. Go back to business school.
Quote:
And I'm sure everyone just LOVES how they are restricted in what carrier they can use the iPhone with. This has never happened before with any phone anywhere in the world as I know it. Another restrictive first for Apple.
And? Again, this was known. If you don't like it don't buy it. The deal made the most sense for Apple, and selling 1 million in it's first weekend shows that it doesn't matter much. Who cares?
Quote:
I say screw Apple. They are probably the most inovative company in the tech field today but their restrictive practices are bad for the consumer. The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
You are completely insane dude. Once again, Apple is a hardware company. Get that through your thick skull. Not to mention that selling their OS to be installed on any POS machine will not only wipe away their business model (again, say it with me HARDWARE COMPANY), but their OS would lose it's entire appeal. The "issues" that would arise from them not being able to control the hardware it ran on would all of a sudden make OS X NOT "just work". Apple's entire business model is to create things that simply work. They create devices and computers/OS that are powerful and easy to use for 95% of the "consumers" that use computers. And, have I mentioned yet that Apple's is in the business of selling hardware, using OS X and iLife as the "hook". Oh wait... I might have.
Quote:
I hope that by some fluke Pystar wins on this one and gives the big f*ck off finger to Apple.
Riiight.
Or, you could just not by any more Apple products. Or would you not have anything to complain about then? Is that the issue?
Comments
There's always Vista.
Except that Vista cost more than OS X, as well as most comparable machines from various vendors.
It's true they probably won't survive this, but they aren't "stealing property". At worst they have committed copyright infringement, but that's not stealing. Ask someone who's actually had their car stolen if they think copying a record is the same thing.
Physical property and intellectual property are both property. The fact that stealing music is easier to do and harder to catch do not make it any more legal than walking into BestBuy and snagging a CD. The OS that Psystar is installing on their machines is coming from the OSx86 Project, most likely from a torrent site. The inclusion of the software disc for the sale is just lip service to Apple to help prevent this inevitable day. Having one does not permit you to steal another.
.... Just because Apple's business model is to sell a cheap OS and make money on the hardware doesn't give Apple the right to dictate what someone can do with a legally purchased copy of the OS.
This appears to be a fertile source of confusion. Apple doesn't "sell a cheap OS" just to make money on the hardware. It sells you the hardware with an OS installed, and the price covers both, or they would be out of business by now. Every other version you buy in a shrink-wrapped box is an upgrade. That's why it's $129 instead of $400 or whatever Vista Ultimate is. If Psystar wins, and everybody and his dog can start selling computers with OS X installed, then Apple will have to start charging full price for every upgrade. Does anybody really want that?
Anyway, this is their business model; they're entitled to have one, just as Microsoft is entitled to the drug dealer model they use: the cheap upgrade price that make it illegal to sell or transfer a copy of Windows to a new computer. You should deal with the company whose business model you support. Myself, I'll take Apple's, but to each their own.
Physical property with intellectual property are both property. The fact that stealing music is easier to do and harder to catch do not make it any more legal than walking into BestBuy and snagging a CD. The OS that Psystar is installing on their machines is coming from the OSx86 Project, most likely from a torrent site. The inclusion of the software disc for the sale is just lip service to Apple to help prevent this inevitable day. Having one does not permit you to steal another.
i have to say, i think some people are taking a pretty crazy, high and mighty attitude with respect to the whole intellectual property thing. the idea that copying a song is stealing it... i know that lots of people are going around saying this sort of thing, but i just can't see it. i know that the RIAA is big on spreading this type of idea, but...
copying a song is not the same as stealing intellectual property. to my mind, true intellectual property theft would be performing the song as if it was your own. (which actually happens quite often, with no consequences). the only time you hear about consequences from that sort of thing is if someone were to put it on an album and sell it. otherwise, bands do cover tunes all the time. if all you are doing is listening to something, i just think it is crazy to call that stealing. if you are selling it and making money, that is one thing,...
i just think the corporations are driven by greed. actually, that is a given. we know they are. that's how the system works. it is all about expanding profits. for a true artist, it isn't about getting every little penny (never mind that most of those pennies actually go to the corporations, not the artists)... it is about getting your art seen/heard/experienced.
anyway, i think some people just need to chill out. zaphod, for one. he seems a little overly emotionally-invested in this whole thing. he is even bringing in the whole liberal-bashing thing. dude... let the courts handle it. chill out. have a beer. stop typing.
It's not "Complicated"..... what they are doing is Illegal...
You're really over-thinking this.
IMO you're seriously under-thinking this. In my world, that is a much sadder problem.
Whatever parts they Modified is a straw dog. The point still stands that they HAD NO RIGHT TO DO THAT to make OSX work on their shit machines. This IS NOT LINUX... it's OSX. Yes it's built on UNIX but that is also another moot point.
Because OS X incorporates some OSS licensed software, they don't have the legal right to prevent modification of certain components of the software. In fact, Apple has published a contract which includes explicit permission for certain parts of the OS to be modified. That makes this point very much a relevant part of the discussion.
If, in fact, the portions of the OS that they modified were not covered by OSS licenses (and this is a very real possibility) then they were guilty of copyright violations for having done that.
Pystar is wrong....and will pay dearly.
Psystar installed OS X on a computer that was not manufactured by Apple. That is an EULA violation. Apple did not sue them for this violation, probably because they figured it wasn't a slam-dunk case.
Psystar recently started duplicating and redistributing downloadable sfotware updates. That is much more of a slam-dunk case of copyright violation, for which Psystar has a serious chance of being found guilty.
But if you don't like the price, then you don't have to buy one. You have a choice. There's always Vista.
Not to single you out, but I'm sick of hearing this argument. The fact of the matter is that not everybody can choose. For instance, if you have to run Final Cut Pro (which is gradually overtaking Avid as the industry standard in DNLE's), then you must buy a Mac. No, there isn't "always Vista."
On the other hand, Avid Media Composer and all of the Adobe applications run on both Mac and WIndows. Users of those applications DO have a choice. But like I said, when it comes to DNLE's, fewer and fewer people in the lower-budget realm of film are using Avid anymore; in order to remain relevant, you have have Final Cut Pro. As a result, editors are in the same situation that most consumers found themselves in back in the mid '90's with Windows: you either use the operating system, or you don't use anything at all. (Meaning, you're screwed.)
In this sense, Apple has the same death grip over lower-budget (and even medium-budget) filmmakers that Windows used to have over the average consumer. Now, most people like Apple, so I don't know many people who are complaining about this. But, I just helped my brother buy a Sony Vaio laptop the other day, and it cost $1,200 versus $1,800 for a similarly-equipped MacBook. It made me wonder just how much I overpaid for my Mac Pro. (I really don't want to look into it.)
On a relevant note, consider the iPod. If I decided I wanted a Walkman, or Creative (which I could get since I run Windows in Boot Camp) to replace my iPod, I suddenly wouldn't be able to listen to my MP3's in the car anymore, since my Alpine is only iPod-compatible (like pretty much all car audio systems these days). I'd also have to get rid of my Harman Kardon Go + Play. In other words, it would be a MAJOR pain in the A$$ to abandon the iPod due to the monopoly Apple has established in the digital music player market, so Apple would have to screw up pretty badly with future incarnations to motivate the switch.
Is all this fair? Do we REALLY want Apple to have so much power? I mean, I love Apple, and I understand the whole "clone makers might screw up the innovation due to compatibility issues" argument, but it's very conceivable that Apple WILL become the next Microsoft as it continues to gain market share like crazy.
They are STEALING an OS they have NO RIGHT TO RESELL!!!!! aka... they are CRIMINALS!!!
They are not stealing anything, they have legally bought the OS and are just selling it on their hardware.
Like I said before, there are too many Apple Fan Boys here. If Microsoft was doing this same thing, everyone would be scorning them. But Apple do it and they are PRAISED for it! Simply unbelievable. You fan boys are pathetic.
I bought an iPhone 3G because it is an excellent device. I'd give it 10 points, with the next smart phone being maybe 4 at best. There is nothing currently on the market that comes close to this. However, the iPhone would score double points if Apple would stop restricting what it can do and let developers truly do what they want (and the iStore does not do this - so far the apps are boring as hell, and with Apple's controlling hands it in, it will stay that way).
Why can't I copy a file onto the device anywhere I want? Why can't I have a terminal with SSH? Why can't I record video? Why can't I use a SIP/VoIP client? The list goes on. All these things are entirely possible TODAY with a hacked iPhone. I can't wait until a hack comes out for the 3G so I can immediately free my device and use it to its full potential.
Of course, Apple will probably stop me doing this - stop me using a device I bought how I damn well want to. No, I have to use iTunes (possibly the worst bit of software ever written) and buy everything through their store so they can rip me off to the limit. No doubt you all support Apple on this one too?
And I'm sure everyone just LOVES how they are restricted in what carrier they can use the iPhone with. This has never happened before with any phone anywhere in the world as I know it. Another restrictive first for Apple.
I say screw Apple. They are probably the most inovative company in the tech field today but their restrictive practices are bad for the consumer. The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
I hope that by some fluke Pystar wins on this one and gives the big f*ck off finger to Apple.
On a relevant note, consider the iPod. If I decided I wanted a Walkman, or Creative (which I could get since I run Windows in Boot Camp) to replace my iPod, I suddenly wouldn't be able to listen to my MP3's in the car anymore, since my Alpine is only iPod-compatible (like pretty much all car audio systems these days). I'd also have to get rid of my Harman Kardon Go + Play. In other words, it would be a MAJOR pain in the A$$ to abandon the iPod due to the monopoly Apple has established in the digital music player market, so Apple would have to screw up pretty badly with future incarnations to motivate the switch.
I don't think that is any type of monopoly. You are the one making the choice to enter Apple's system by using iTunes. You are making a choice. You don't have to buy from iTunes and it is hardly a monopoly for Apple to require their software for their hardware. That or put your own software on an iPod but now Apple won't support it. That is what is going on here.
Apple could let these guys keep producing machines using legally purchased copies of OSX but would never have to support them. Psystar using Apples altered updates seems to be the crux of the issue!
I don't think that is any type of monopoly. You are the one making the choice to enter Apple's system by using iTunes. You are making a choice. You don't have to buy from iTunes and it is hardly a monopoly for Apple to require their software for their hardware. That or put your own software on an iPod but now Apple won't support it. That is what is going on here.
Apple could let these guys keep producing machines using legally purchased copies of OSX but would never have to support them. Psystar using Apples altered updates seems to be the crux of the issue!
Monopoly, or not, being one does not mean you are doing anything illegal.
They are not stealing anything, they have legally bought the OS and are just selling it on their hardware.
Like I said before, there are too many Apple Fan Boys here. If Microsoft was doing this same thing, everyone would be scorning them. But Apple do it and they are PRAISED for it! Simply unbelievable. You fan boys are pathetic.
I bought an iPhone 3G because it is an excellent device. I'd give it 10 points, with the next smart phone being maybe 4 at best. There is nothing currently on the market that comes close to this. However, the iPhone would score double points if Apple would stop restricting what it can do and let developers truly do what they want (and the iStore does not do this - so far the apps are boring as hell, and with Apple's controlling hands it in, it will stay that way).
Why can't I copy a file onto the device anywhere I want? Why can't I have a terminal with SSH? Why can't I record video? Why can't I use a SIP/VoIP client? The list goes on. All these things are entirely possible TODAY with a hacked iPhone. I can't wait until a hack comes out for the 3G so I can immediately free my device and use it to its full potential.
Of course, Apple will probably stop me doing this - stop me using a device I bought how I damn well want to. No, I have to use iTunes (possibly the worst bit of software ever written) and buy everything through their store so they can rip me off to the limit. No doubt you all support Apple on this one too?
I say screw Apple. They are probably the most inovative company in the tech field today but their restrictive practices are bad for the consumer. The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
I hope that by some fluke Pystar wins on this one and gives the big f*ck off finger to Apple.
You knew all of that before you bought the iPhone, and if you didn't, then you made an uninformed purchase. Now go cry yourself to sleep.
"What if Microsoft said you could only install Windows on Dell computers?," he said. "What if Honda said that, after you buy their car, you could only drive it on the roads they said you could?"
I wouldn't buy Windows and I wouldn't buy Honda... their market share goes down, the system works. Unless I deemed their service as the best for ME. This is standard business practice, and a standard capitalistic endeavor.
If someone doesn't want to buy a Mac, then they do not have to. If they can't afford one, they also will not buy one.
End of story.
"Robert" is toast. This will be an epic fail...
You knew all of that before you bought the iPhone, and if you didn't, then you made an uninformed purchase. Now go cry yourself to sleep.
I'm not crying, I knew it full well and made the purchase because it is such an outstanding device. Apple's restrictive methods however are not something we should put up with, let alone praise like the majority here!
People have to get a grip. The company makes some excellent devices. That doesn't mean you have to go to bed with them. There are plenty of things the company does that deserve critizism and this is one of them.
The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
Again, they are only getting paid the upgrade price for this software. Seeing what Microsoft does (or threatens to do) to anyone who tries to "do what they want" with a copy of Windows that they've only paid the upgrade price for, I hardly think Apple is the bad guy here.
I think it would be a good idea for a moderator to remove any posts with the word "fanboy" in them as well. I'm certainly not a mindless Apple supporter. There are many of the directions they're taking that I disagree wholeheartedly with, starting with their diskless, crappy heavily-compressed-download-only future of television. I DO, however, support their desire to have full control over their hardware and software in order to avoid the instability nightmare that Microsoft offers.
I think when you click "I Accept" When prompted with the terms and conditions of the license agreement you enter a legally binding contract.
Not if the 'legally binding contract' is illegal.
I should imagine that most of the people buying the 3rd party hardware would much rather own and offical, fully supported, mid-range xMac?
What if you are a minor or if you are mentally incompetent? These are two groups of people that can not legally enter into contracts.
In most cases where a minor or mentally incompetent clicks the "accept" button, the machine was purchased by someone of legal age.
Look at all the apple fan boys in here. What apple is doing is in no way good for the consumer. They are just trying to protect their business of selling overpriced hardware to their customers.
You're on an apple forum... Their consumers are doing just fine with their product, hence the massive growth in the last year. If you don't like what they're pushin don't buy it.
They are not stealing anything, they have legally bought the OS and are just selling it on their hardware.
Like I said before, there are too many Apple Fan Boys here. If Microsoft was doing this same thing, everyone would be scorning them. But Apple do it and they are PRAISED for it! Simply unbelievable. You fan boys are pathetic.
Um, no. If Microsoft all of a sudden said that it would only run on Dells, then your point would stand, but that's not what Apple is doing. Not to mention that outside of a few years in the "dark" sans Jobs era, Apple has always done this. You also have to realize that Microsoft is a software company, and Apple is a hardware company. That difference is HUGE. Suggesting that they both follow the same business model shows how dumb you really are.
Why can't I copy a file onto the device anywhere I want? Why can't I have a terminal with SSH? Why can't I record video? Why can't I use a SIP/VoIP client? The list goes on. All these things are entirely possible TODAY with a hacked iPhone. I can't wait until a hack comes out for the 3G so I can immediately free my device and use it to its full potential.
Because that's Apple's entire business model. Make it easy for everyone. 99% of what you stated you wanted to do, 99% of the iPhone users wouldn't even know what you were talking about. It's a moot point. Again, the market will speak. If everyone wanted an open device, prone to more points of failure, not in Apple's control, then they wouldn't sell very many. Done. Now, go and take a look at the software available for the iPhone. http://www.apple.com/webapps/index.html I could just seem my mom saying "Why can't I get any more email?" After filling up her iPhone with video of her cat... you completely overestimate the average consumer. Apple doesn't.
Of course, Apple will probably stop me doing this - stop me using a device I bought how I damn well want to. No, I have to use iTunes (possibly the worst bit of software ever written) and buy everything through their store so they can rip me off to the limit. No doubt you all support Apple on this one too?
Again dummy, you knew this before buying it... so why again did you buy it? Not to mention that you still have plenty of options to put music that didn't originate from iTunes, on your shiny new iPhone. Ever hear of actually going into a store and purchasing a CD? *gasp!* But seriously, asking Apple to allow other music downloads aside from their own iTunes would be silly. Their entire board would be fired in a second. Go back to business school.
And I'm sure everyone just LOVES how they are restricted in what carrier they can use the iPhone with. This has never happened before with any phone anywhere in the world as I know it. Another restrictive first for Apple.
And? Again, this was known. If you don't like it don't buy it. The deal made the most sense for Apple, and selling 1 million in it's first weekend shows that it doesn't matter much. Who cares?
I say screw Apple. They are probably the most inovative company in the tech field today but their restrictive practices are bad for the consumer. The fact they won't let another company sell hardware with their software on it (that they are getting paid for) is BAD for us and only good for those with millions of Apple shares.
You are completely insane dude. Once again, Apple is a hardware company. Get that through your thick skull. Not to mention that selling their OS to be installed on any POS machine will not only wipe away their business model (again, say it with me HARDWARE COMPANY), but their OS would lose it's entire appeal. The "issues" that would arise from them not being able to control the hardware it ran on would all of a sudden make OS X NOT "just work". Apple's entire business model is to create things that simply work. They create devices and computers/OS that are powerful and easy to use for 95% of the "consumers" that use computers. And, have I mentioned yet that Apple's is in the business of selling hardware, using OS X and iLife as the "hook". Oh wait... I might have.
I hope that by some fluke Pystar wins on this one and gives the big f*ck off finger to Apple.
Riiight.
Or, you could just not by any more Apple products. Or would you not have anything to complain about then? Is that the issue?
Using phrases like "What Apple is doing is in no way good for the consumer" just makes you sound like a closet socialist.
And using phrases like 'closet socialist' (as if socialism was a bad thing) just makes you sound like a free-market fundamentalist.
Although don't get me wrong, I'm not on Psystar's side here at all.