Road to Snow Leopard: Twice the RAM, half the price, 64-bits

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  • Reply 81 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Superbass View Post


    Remember how much of a big deal AppleInsider made of the fact that lots of PC users with slower machines wanted Windows XP after Vista came out?



    I wondering if AI will also make a big deal of the fact that Apple will stop selling 10.5 when 10.6 comes out, thus screwing non-Intel C2D users...



    This doesn't make sense. A copy of OS X (generally the latest at time of shipping) is included with every mac. So, Apple only sells OS upgrades to it's qualified (by qualified i mean users owning a recent enough machine) users.



    I'm sure PPC and CoreDuo users will have 10.5 security updates for years to come.
  • Reply 82 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ByronVanArsdale View Post


    Crysis in the apple world means waiting for MBP upgrade Jan 08 only to find it still not out at June 08.



    Crysis is the pc world is heaven on earth



    I doubt Crysis will ever be out for Apple. SJ has never been big on gaming. Even the 8800gs card would have a problem runnign Crysis.



    Well maybe on a MBP is could with a lower res, it would never run well on a 24" iMac if you tried to run it in full 1920x1200
  • Reply 83 of 147
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I really don't think that's a key reason. I don't think that's even relevent. I would suggest that if they drop PPC, the real reason would be that there's not enough of them out there to justify the work needed to make them run the new OS. Only iMac G5s and PowerMac G5s can run 64 bit PPC code, and their relevance is fading pretty quickly. Only the towers can address more than 2.5GB of memory, all the base models except the dual core ones are effectively limited to 4GB based on memory board availability.



    I agree that the reason here is the number of users compared to Intel-based Macs, but I think it's a key reason as to why they are doing it now with Snow Leopard as opposed to doing it with Leopard, which one could construe as an initial key reason or secondary key reason.





    Anyone want to figure out what percentage of Macs will be PPC by the time SL comes out? (image is hyperlinked)



  • Reply 84 of 147
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JesseDegenerate View Post


    This doesn't make sense. A copy of OS X (generally the latest at time of shipping) is included with every mac. So, Apple only sells OS upgrades to it's qualified (by qualified i mean users owning a recent enough machine) users.



    I'm sure PPC and CoreDuo users will have 10.5 security updates for years to come.



    Apple did offer point updates to System 9 for about 10 months after OS X came out. The situation is different since Apple was well into selling PPC-based Macs which OS X would install on, but I think Apple will continue with point updates for Leopard, perhaps even adding some aspects of Snow Leopard to the Leopard updates, until a full 36 months of support has passed.
  • Reply 85 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JesseDegenerate View Post


    Did you give yourself a boner there? I've been in IT for about 10 years, but either way, you should know that 1) WoW is not the same system to system, depends heavily on your plugin level, Rez, etc. 2) amp emulation is processor intensive and 3, your not replying to the point i was making.



    I was saying that you *should not* be excited your computer can multi-task. It should be like this.



    Welcome to 2008, old guy.



    also:



    *As a vista64 guy you should really not make arguments about drivers being compatible. Ask mac users how many times this is an issue for them.



    *I have 8 iphone's sync'ing to my company's Exchange 2003 server, (I am one of them) No problems from any users. (feature requests yes, dropped calls, no) Personally i think it's cause were in NYC, which doesn't have the best, but far from the worst 3g coverage.



    *I build my own machine's too. I have 2 Hackintosh's (one callaway one 10.4 one) A Fiesty Fawn machine and a XP sp2 box. (for orb, and old windows games) 2 are AMD x2's (before the coreduo line was released) one is a Pentium D, the last a Core2. I use a MBP as a laptop cause it's really well designed. If you built your own laptop ( i got the 2.6ghz model) with similar features, then i'm impressed.



    *People who troll forums looking for grammatical errors. Really. You must be fun as hell at a party.



    Your posts have no purpose you are just trying to be an ass for no reason.



    I have not made a single comment regarding any errors. We come to this forum to attempt civil debates and share information, you are doing neither.



    In any case the fact that you are even talking about iPhones and PC's and Servers tells me right theres tells me the number on my W2 is will out of your reach. In my world systems cost 30 million just to start.
  • Reply 86 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post


    Your posts have no purpose you are just trying to be an ass for no reason.



    I have not made a single comment regarding any errors. We come to this forum to attempt civil debates and share information, you are doing neither.



    In any case the fact that you are even talking about iPhones and PC's and Servers tells me right theres tells me the number on my W2 is will out of your reach. In my world systems cost 30 million just to start.





    You were smugly touting how great Vista 64 was at doing mundane tasks. I pointed out how any machine should be able to do that. You went off on random tangents, (iphones and comparing a stock parts home built pc to a laptop?) that i had fun responding to. I've used forums before, thanks.



    why don't u go "encode" some "extreme skating" old guy.
  • Reply 87 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JesseDegenerate View Post


    Dude, when i'm trying to get a thought out, I'm less inclined to care about my proper apostrophes. I'm going back now, to revel in my "mediocrity" that i've placed myself in due to my lack of compassion for the english language.



    Thanks for showing me the light.



    /asshole



    Shouldn't the "e" in "english" be capitalized, i.e. English?

    \
  • Reply 88 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JesseDegenerate View Post


    You were smugly touting how great Vista 64 was at doing mundane tasks. I pointed out how any machine should be able to do that. You went off on random tangents, (iphones and comparing a stock parts home built pc to a laptop?) that i had fun responding to. I've used forums before, thanks.



    why don't u go "encode" some "extreme skating" old guy.



    You really must be some kid living in his mom's basement. It's the only thing I can think of seeing you are hung up on a guy in his 30's being old.



    I am sure you have used forums before, if your big event for the night is your syncing iPhones clearly you aren't getting laid all that often.



    Okay now go tell your mom your going to play with your Wii for 15 mins and then go to bed.
  • Reply 89 of 147
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wbrasington View Post


    A little more on topic.....



    I'll probably only be using it for another couple years and it'll finally die for me.

    Still, it's got built in blue-tooth, and wi-fi, lots of disk speed and pretty good power. Had it three years, will have it over five years and that's a good value.




    My old Dell desktop lasted me for 7 years and was still going strong (as far as my needs went...mainly browsing, some Word & Excel). It was maintained well with regular scandisks, defragmenting, very minimum 3rd party apps, etc. No hardware issues till the end. Finally I got bored of it and can't contain my excitement at the prospect of owning a new Apple...so gave it away to my domestic help and am now the owner of a recent macbook pro ;-)



    point is...only 5 years life expectancy for a mac??
  • Reply 90 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by franksargent View Post


    Depends 3GB came with my PC laptop. Ditched that and got 2x2GB for like $70 (total delivered cost), moved over to 64-bit Vista.



    Now If I'd have stayed with 32-bit Vista, single app see's 2GB maximum, OS see's all 3GB but loses some RAM due either to integrated graphics (mine is dedicated) or 32-bit Window's addressing issues. The best case 32-bit Windows is ~3.2GB usable application RAM.



    So the way I see it, at best you've overspent by $35 for 2GB or $17.50 for 1GB. In other words pocket change for a $1000 computer/laptop.



    Also this is another AI POS article, a current Mac memory penalty resolved in 10.6 brings both OS'es to the same level of parity. In other words all Mac's currently have the problem that 64-bit/32-bit Vista currently doesn't have.



    As to the ignorance of Mac versus PC end users, both are on average the same, but the community of knowledgeable PC users undoubtedly outnumbers the entire Mac OS X user community. That's a given. Heck the PC gaming community vastly outnumbers the entire Mac OS X community for that matter, and they're all gearhead's to boot.



    I would even argue that Mac users are on average more clueless, since that's the main selling point of OS X, the seemless end user experience.



    Signed,

    A former three time Mac owner



    PS - I might buy a Mac mini if an upgrade is in the pipeline, but it depends on if it has HDMI, eSATA, nos-soldered CPU/RAM. Not very likely. Because that's all that I could afford right now on my current fixed income.



    The article pointed out, quite rightly, that when buying a gaming system with one of the new 1GB cards only 2.3 GB is available. This is quite true.



    Your experience is different. You don't have a high end machine. It's ironic, isn't it, when a lower end machine can use more memory than a high end machine?



    Quote:

    a current Mac memory penalty resolved in 10.6 brings both OS's to the same level of parity. In other words all Mac's currently have the problem that 64-bit/32-bit Vista currently doesn't have.



    You will have to explain this.
  • Reply 91 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by merdhead View Post


    Having more registers is nice but not a huge win. You have to recompile software and the compiler has to be smart enough to allocate the registers efficiently. The number of registers is just of of many of x86's flaws, all of which contribute to the lack of performance.



    Also there is a difference between architectural registers and physical registers. The processor aliases registers and there are many more physical registers than 8. This is a better solution which is why Intel implemented it. If registers were so critical Intel would have added them long ago, it's not like they are short of transistors. I don't know why having wider registers is going to make much difference except in a few cases (multiply?).



    As I said, it's hype. You're "well understood" claim isn't very convincing.



    It's convincing when you understand it.
  • Reply 92 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by stonefree View Post


    No mention of Apple yanking away 64 bit Carbon support at the last minute after previously promising it leaving developers with hundreds (thousands?) of hours of work down the toilet? Who knows how long the decision was made before announcing it at WWDC, but Apple kept it under wraps because things can only be announced at a big event in Appleland.



    How about all the features promised for Longhorn, er Vista, that were pulled, one by one?
  • Reply 93 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mr. H View Post


    Good grief. Ajmas explained it and you still don't get it. Writing in all-caps implies that a word is an acronym, therefore MAC = Medium Access Control, not short for Macintosh. Mac is short for Macintosh.







    Make that all forums, not just this one.



    I think what happens sometimes, is that with simple things like this, say the spelling and capitalization of Mac - MAC, is that when it's pointed out, instead of saying "oops!", there is embarrassment, and instead, the spelling is insisted upon.



    There is overmuch concern about this.



    If he wants to write MAC, fine, let him. We all know what he means.
  • Reply 94 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Mr. H View Post


    Sent from an iPhone, I presume?



    I don't think so. Just not paying attention.



    That's embarrassing!
  • Reply 95 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ByronVanArsdale View Post


    Crysis in the apple world means waiting for MBP upgrade Jan 08 only to find it still not out at June 08.



    Crysis is the pc world is heaven on earth



    Crysis is the game that no PC player can ever play at high resolution with all features on, and still get decent frame rates.



    Anyone who claims (s)he can, is BSing.
  • Reply 96 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JesseDegenerate View Post


    do you get a t-shirt with those "higher standards? "



    and does the ? go before or after the quotations?



    It's what he does. Get used to it. We all have.



    You can always correct your post after you write it.



    I work at that too, but mess up sometimes.



    I hate writing like a slob. It makes the point less presentable, and believable.
  • Reply 97 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    The 50 megapixel sensor at 16 bpp would mean 100 MB file uncompressed. Not that big of a deal for single files, unless you plan to have 20 of them open at the same time, I don't know if each file could get its own 2GB/4GB space or not.



    Megapixels are old hat anyway, the latest hot high end cameras have about half the pixels of its flagship competitor, it's hot because it's producing fantastic pictures in low light, offering more shooting possibilities in the dark than ever previously thought possible.



    The 50 MP sensor from Canon is just a rumor, based on remarks from a canon person who was talking about possibilities down the road.



    Nikon came out with a 12.1 MP sensor because this is the first high quality sensor the did by themselves designwise. You must walk before you run. They were getting killed by Canon, and decided to concentrate on noise levels first, which is much easier to do on a low MP sensor such as the one they came up with (which they don't actually make themselves).



    I guarantee you that Nikon will have a higher pixel sensor. Possibly the 24+ MP one Sony will announce shortly in a new camera.



    The MP race has not ended by a long shot. This has given Nikon some short term breathing room.



    Canon will come close in noise with its newer cameras, if not equal it, with higher pixel counts, which ARE important.
  • Reply 98 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Superbass View Post


    I wondering if AI will also make a big deal of the fact that Apple will stop selling 10.5 when 10.6 comes out, thus screwing non-Intel C2D users...



    Why would that screw anyone? I would hope that by the time 10.6 comes out, that people who wanted to, will have upgraded already.



    If not, they can buy new copies at a very good discount at various places which usually sell older versions, at least for some time after they've been discontinued.
  • Reply 99 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I really don't think that's a key reason. I don't think that's even relevent. I would suggest that if they drop PPC, the real reason would be that there's not enough of them out there to justify the work needed to make them run the new OS. Only iMac G5s and PowerMac G5s can run 64 bit PPC code, and their relevance is fading pretty quickly. Only the towers can address more than 2.5GB of memory, all the base models except the dual core ones are effectively limited to 4GB based on memory board availability.



    I don't believe that there won't be features that others won't want.



    Even though jobs did say that this isn't going to be a feature upgrade version, I don't see anyone really believing that there won't be at least, the coming out of some features that we've been seeing included in the OS now, but not implemented for the general user, such as resolution independence.



    Plenty of people will really want that. That's a minimum.
  • Reply 100 of 147
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,233member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post


    You really must be some kid living in his mom's basement. It's the only thing I can think of seeing you are hung up on a guy in his 30's being old.



    I am sure you have used forums before, if your big event for the night is your syncing iPhones clearly you aren't getting laid all that often.



    Okay now go tell your mom your going to play with your Wii for 15 mins and then go to bed.



    While I'm not taking side on this argument (enough problems with my own), but didn't you say that you were in IT for 21+ years? You started when you were how old?
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