yes jimmac it is my view, but I see many people think the same. Some just bare with it and others are fed up with it.
Regarding OS 7 and 6, etc (and yes there was 7.5.5, its even freely downloadable from Apple), you have to admit one other thing... there was no competition. Win95 was just out when 7.5.5 was around. Today we have the likes of XP and the various Linux flavors with Gnome and the like. While having the type of fubars we have today in OS X could have been, lets say, acceptable, back in 95, today it means the life and death of a company.
Apple's current situation isnt the bst its ever been through. Hardware, besides the ultra high end, is at a pretty pathetic state (a round of applause to Moto for helping there), we are seeing price increases (yes yes ram tft bla bla), and just to top it off, a glitchy OS.
The combination of all these factors isn't good for Apple.
Glitchy OS? Have you used Windows XP? OR any Windows for that matter?
Yes, Linux is great if you know what to do with it, but OS X compared to Windows, at least with all my experiences, is by far less buggy and more reliable to get your work done.
XP: "Oops! I crashed! Hehe. Here, I'll just restart automatically so it looks like nothing happened...." <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Switch to the PC side? Hehe, I have been using PCs for years and currently using a Win2000 Sony Vaio replacement laptop my friend lent to me while my iBook is being repaired (oh what wonderful quality).
Its not a speed demon but for a 2 year old machine its noticably faster than OS X and it only has 128MB ram and a crappy intel 2mb vram. I havent had a single problem with it except that it gets slooooow if you leave it on for 2-3 days. The ram has to be purged or something.
I can switch from one platform to another without problems... just the keyboard shortcuts take a few minutes to readjust to.
If I were forced as some ultimate torture to have to use Winblows for the rest of my life, I would survive. I wouldnt necessarily like it, but I get around just fine with Windoze too.
Fact is, I want to see OS X dominate and truly become the awesome OS it promises to be.
<strong>Regarding OS 7 and 6, etc (and yes there was 7.5.5, its even freely downloadable from Apple), you have to admit one other thing... there was no competition. Win95 was just out when 7.5.5 was around.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, and the combination of Windows 95 and System *crash* 7 *freeze* 5 drove Apple out of business and higher ed quickly and completely.
Systems 7.1 - 7.5.x were so bad that I held on to my LCD II running 7.0.1 for 6 years, waiting with increasing despair for an OS "upgrade" that didn't result in waves of complaints in the comp.sys.mac.* newsgroups and day after day of bad news for the platform, and wondering why Apple was touting and then killing all these random technologies instead of doing the systems engineering that the underlying OS so desperately needed. The day 7.6.1 was released, to a bruised, decimated and retrenched audience, I ordered a $3000 PowerMac (and it arrived 9 months later - I really don't miss the old Apple).
[quote]<strong>Today we have the likes of XP and the various Linux flavors with Gnome and the like. While having the type of fubars we have today in OS X could have been, lets say, acceptable, back in 95, today it means the life and death of a company.</strong><hr></blockquote>
This is 100% wrong. System 7.5 nearly killed Apple in 1995. Literally. I was there. I saw the Macs just... vanish... from the university here (there are still a few pockets in the college of medicine, but that's it). Whatever OS X's flaws, it's leaps and bounds better than the alternatives in the areas that really matter (stability, security, reliability, compatibility), it is significantly more user friendly than OS 9 in a number of ways, and it's held in much higher regard by the same people who got rid of Macs in 1995.
I wouldn't even dare to compare Gnome on Linux to Aqua on OS X. There are very sound reasons why Linux has failed as a client OS (how'd you like to recompile Darwin every time you installed a new driver on your iBook?). As for XP, its turd might be polished while OS X's diamond is still rough, but between MS' bad attitude, the Death By A Thousand Wizards that passes for user friendliness, and constantly decreasing performance and compatibility, OS X looks better to the other side than any Mac OS I can remember since, oh System 6.
[quote]<strong>Apple's current situation isnt the bst its ever been through.</strong><hr></blockquote>
[quote]Today we have the likes of XP and the various Linux flavors with Gnome and the like.<hr></blockquote>
XP is definitely a big competitor to OS X, wizards and all, but not Linux. While I admire Linux's speed and versatility, I'm infuriated by its disgustingly poor GUI options. Gnome and Nautilus look nice in some parts, but work horribly. KDE looks horrible and works poorly. Allow me to pronounce Linux dead on the desktop until someone develops the guts to overhaul the whole system.
Fortunately when you read the polls and the articles. Look at the sales, many ( when you measure the whole ) means a few.
Those who are hopelessly stuck in the past.
Oh well.
I could tell you what my view is ( and yes I just stated it's my view ) is that in the years to come OS X will become so powerful, so viable, ( and people will be used to it by then ) that this argument will be all but forgotten.
But that's after they declare it reaching maturity.
It makes me wonder what are you comparing OS X to? It's only real competition ( Windows XP ) took years to get to where it's at. As did Mac Classic. Apple's letting you use it now. In order to get your feedback. To make it a better OS. Now you may call that beta but, if so it's the best beta I've ever used.
So if it's too slow for you or buggy, tell Apple!
That's the whole point. Coming here and whining does no good.
Jimmac, Gambit, did you ever see that "OS X Police" article, on OSOpinion or somewhere (yes, OSOpinion, I know, but...)
ZO and I are not whining. We are NOT switching to Windows, either, are we? (ZO, I know you're not Right? <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" /> )
Amorph said:
[quote]
As for XP, its turd might be polished while OS X's diamond is still rough
<hr></blockquote>
Exactly. I know OS X will eventually be the mechanism through which Apple eventually climbs back up to 10-15% market share, and from there, who knows?
MacOS X is what Linux wants (wanted?) to be. Every time I hear crap from a Radio Shack or Staples kid, I have to mention this. It starts out like this: I mention a Mac, and I get some smartass remark like "Macs cause cancer!" Haha. I ask them, what would you RUN on a PC? What would you do with it? Windows? They respond, almost too quickly, "Linux!"
Linux is a server. Maybe a development platform, for a masochist REALBasic and Cocoa sure spank Linux. If you want emacs, or hey, even ed??? Terminal. Inside, I know Windoids who now try justify and defend their PC existence, immediately bark: Linux! Well, besides YDL, PPC Linux, and some other quality distros on PPC, MacOS X absolutely spanks Linux in terms of being a "real" OS. But this isn't saying much, and neither is being better than Windows. Remember that quote "Even if you are on the right track, you can get run over if you just sit there".
Granted, Amorph, Windows does improve in jumps, and the "Critical Updates" for my Win98 seem to do more harm than good (really, security on WinDOwS, why even try anyway?, lol)
Yet, ZO is seeing what many of you refuse to see. Ack! You are at risk of sounding almost as blind as a Windoid. Wait, sorry, that was harsh. But you know what I mean
This discussion is interesting. Besides, I learn a lot from people here, jimmac. And usually it's fun!
Sidenote: Jeez, isn't Bluetooth cool! I am leaning toward BUYING that! Now that it's actually a reality, I am excited! This is the kind of stuff that makes Apple, well, Apple!
AirSluf, I hear you, and I know exactly what you are saying. We are VERY spoiled
But why is the ability to copy a volume in the Finder "<exalted>", exactly?
I never had problems with 7.5.3, on my Color Classic, acually. But I did go 7.6.1 when it came out.
Apple has *talent*. iTunes/QuickTime/iStuff vs. WiMP and the copycat M$ stuff, just for example. Once MacOS X becomes polished, I know I'll never look back. But it sure isn't polished, yet. In the past few weeks, I've gotten to like it, but not as much as OS 9, yet.
<strong>Yet, ZO is seeing what many of you refuse to see.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That goes both ways.
I understand that some people have legitimate gripes with OS X. I know that there are huge gaps left, and things that are genuinely incomplete and unpolished, which make it unusable for certain applications and maddening for others. That's why I dived right in, but I'm simultaneously watching for an upgrade that I consider totally Mom-proof.
What I object to is the generalization of experience to "Mac users" or to "everyone," or that this is a sign of Apple abandoning content creators(!!!) instead of a necessarily awkward transition. For the purposes of this particular longtime loyal Apple user, OS X has been better than OS 9 since 10.0.0. For the purposes of a sizable number of people, OS X is a leap forward in usability over OS 9 (and from Windows, I need hardly add) right now, gaps and glitches notwithstanding. Look at the attention and praise it's getting outside the Mac presses. The only really serious mistake, IMO, was shipping OS X standard with the modem/PPP bug. But even given that, it's a good thing.
Some of it, I think, is psychological. For example, (just to pick on poor ZO ) ZO said at one point that remembering command-SHIFT-n for "New Folder" was maddening, and at another point that going between Mac and Windows keyboard shortcuts was effortless (I can't remember what all the Windows ways of creating a new folder, but all the ones that come to mind were significantly more painful than remembering to press the SHIFT key). That in and of itself is justification for the new interface - imagine how confusing OS X would be if it looked like OS 9 but had different shortcuts!
A rehash of what's already been said here in simpler terms: Yes, there are things about OS X that bug me or the " what did it just do " ? But, I realize what's going on here. Like Amorph said it's an " awkward transition ".
I've been through it before when Apple was trying to polish Classic back in the system 7 days. I found some those " upgrades " far more annoying ( like bringing my whole system down ) than this.
Once again I'm much more concerned with the state of the hardware this is running on.
While it still does everything I ask of it fairly well ( and my G4 is a couple of years old now ) I realize to the new buyer out there the Speed gap ( not just the Mhz ) has increased not decreased ( compared to say, a year ago ). This concerns me and it should concern Apple. This is what needs attention and soon.
Of course if a new faster CPU like a G5 or what ever comes along the OS will have to upgraded to accomodate it. This may cause more " awkward transition " problems.
My 'effortlessness' at switching between a Mac and PC keyboard is the fruit of 6 years of working with both (and even making a sticker of an apple and putting it on the CTRL buttons of the PC keyboards I used to remember that its basically our equivalent).
Im used to not even thinking of pressing Apple+N for a new folder seeing that I have been using Macs for about 8 years now. I do follow your explanation for WHY they changed it, but it doent make me any happier. I have learned now and thats that, but it still pissed me off.
Im at least happy to say that I got my iBook back after 10days repair... and it hasnt gotten any faster
To be honest it sorta feels like Im using the Vaio still because its about as sluggish... but the Vaio is 2 years old. Oops.
I also have to agree with the arguement one has to make when they mention Macs to PC weenies and Mac haters in general. The always (I mean ALWAYS) instinctively say "oh, Macs suck". I always have a 2 second 'ha-ha' laugh with them and say that I use Macs and love them much more than Windows... and 'did you know that the new MacOS X is based on Unix so you can have a nice DOS-like terminal and hack around with it?' That usually shuts them up a little and they half consider it. I always conclude with saying that it doesnt really matter in the end because, and this is true, its just a matter of habit. I think 90% of all PC users that say Macs suck is because its different and they just dont want to learn a new system. I also think thats about right for Mac users. I used to hate PCs while I didnt even know that much about them. But in time I learned that 'in order to defeat your enemy, you must know him'. And so that is what I have done and now know what I can appreciate and not on both platforms.
Jeeez, I really want 10.2 to come out soon... the slowness of this OS is making me go nuts.
<strong> I think 90% of all PC users that say Macs suck is because its different and they just dont want to learn a new system. I also think thats about right for Mac users. I used to hate PCs while I didnt even know that much about them. But in time I learned that 'in order to defeat your enemy, you must know him'. And so that is what I have done and now know what I can appreciate and not on both platforms</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, I think 90% of all OS 9 users who complain about X say X sucks because it's different and they don't want to learn a new system.
What I think you should do is rethink the way you approach OS X. I think you should learn that in order to defeat your enemy, you should get to know them first. That way, you might actually appreciate all X has to offer, both good and bad.
I don't like Windows because it's not laid out as well ( the way Windows Explorer works ). Also I don't like the way the GUI was " innovated " ( ripped off ). This process is still going on. Pretty good for a company who's already been found guilty of illegal practices. That's why I don't have any problem with Windows elements in OS X.
The concept of NET makes me want to gag.
When PC advocates start spouting nonsense I just take them down memory lane.
" Didn't Apple do the same to Xerox " no, they bought the GUI from Xerox. Xerox knew what they where doing and they didn't want it. Apple on the other hand was tricked into letting MS use the GUI and later tried to sue but, it was too late.
The whole tradition that Windows is based on is wrong and they shouldn't be allowed to get get away with it. As with many things in this strange new world we live in they probably will. Just like OJ and anyone else who has enough power and money. But, that still doesn't make it right.
If you support Windows you are supporting a future that insures we will have a lot less control over not just computer products but almost every kind of media.
Well, I think 90% of all OS 9 users who complain about X say X sucks because it's different and they don't want to learn a new system.
What I think you should do is rethink the way you approach OS X. I think you should learn that in order to defeat your enemy, you should get to know them first. That way, you might actually appreciate all X has to offer, both good and bad.
I think I'm done.</strong><hr></blockquote>
ehh, I disagree. Most OS 9 users that dislike OS X have usually used OS X for at least a short period of time.
Now, I'm sure one could argue that one needs to use OS X for an extended period of time in order to fully appreciate this operating system. However OS X has a TON of usability problems, and those do not take extended weeks to show. You see them right away.
As a professional web developer and interface designer I tend to run in to 2 different types of people. anyone that I know though geekie development work typically loves OS X and its Next Step genes. However, they'll spend half there time looking at the TCSH command line.
Anyone that I work with in the design industry is typically not too exited about OS X right now. These poor folks run into a lot of road blocks that don't interfere with developers that much. First off, OS X is usually slower then OS 9. It benches slower then OS 9 in both OpenGL and 2D performance. OS X also lacks support for 2D hardware acceleration... and this becomes VERY apparent in professional design apps when one is dealing with a large project. Scrolling is saaaalllooooooow....and I have a Dual g4 system.
Aqua is also a huge hinderance. White and grey lines, no solid window boarders, gradients galore, and menus at 90% opacity do not make a UI functional. Anyone that has tried to layout a big project in OS X, with light colors and tons of open windows, probably wants to kill themselfs. It's a pain. I've been using OS X since DP4 and I can still navigate OS 9 and Windows faster in professional design apps. These OSs have neutral UIs that have been tested by PSYCHOLOGISTS and put in front of FOCUS GROUPS.
Err... but I guess my machine has never been more stable.
Comments
Regarding OS 7 and 6, etc (and yes there was 7.5.5, its even freely downloadable from Apple), you have to admit one other thing... there was no competition. Win95 was just out when 7.5.5 was around. Today we have the likes of XP and the various Linux flavors with Gnome and the like. While having the type of fubars we have today in OS X could have been, lets say, acceptable, back in 95, today it means the life and death of a company.
Apple's current situation isnt the bst its ever been through. Hardware, besides the ultra high end, is at a pretty pathetic state (a round of applause to Moto for helping there), we are seeing price increases (yes yes ram tft bla bla), and just to top it off, a glitchy OS.
The combination of all these factors isn't good for Apple.
Go see that site !
<a href="http://www.wpi.edu/~phoenix/macosx/dock.html"; target="_blank">http://www.wpi.edu/~phoenix/macosx/dock.html</a>;
Yes, Linux is great if you know what to do with it, but OS X compared to Windows, at least with all my experiences, is by far less buggy and more reliable to get your work done.
XP: "Oops! I crashed! Hehe. Here, I'll just restart automatically so it looks like nothing happened...." <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
Its not a speed demon but for a 2 year old machine its noticably faster than OS X and it only has 128MB ram and a crappy intel 2mb vram. I havent had a single problem with it except that it gets slooooow if you leave it on for 2-3 days. The ram has to be purged or something.
I can switch from one platform to another without problems... just the keyboard shortcuts take a few minutes to readjust to.
If I were forced as some ultimate torture to have to use Winblows for the rest of my life, I would survive. I wouldnt necessarily like it, but I get around just fine with Windoze too.
Fact is, I want to see OS X dominate and truly become the awesome OS it promises to be.
[ 03-22-2002: Message edited by: ZO ]</p>
<strong>Regarding OS 7 and 6, etc (and yes there was 7.5.5, its even freely downloadable from Apple), you have to admit one other thing... there was no competition. Win95 was just out when 7.5.5 was around.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yes, and the combination of Windows 95 and System *crash* 7 *freeze* 5 drove Apple out of business and higher ed quickly and completely.
Systems 7.1 - 7.5.x were so bad that I held on to my LCD II running 7.0.1 for 6 years, waiting with increasing despair for an OS "upgrade" that didn't result in waves of complaints in the comp.sys.mac.* newsgroups and day after day of bad news for the platform, and wondering why Apple was touting and then killing all these random technologies instead of doing the systems engineering that the underlying OS so desperately needed. The day 7.6.1 was released, to a bruised, decimated and retrenched audience, I ordered a $3000 PowerMac (and it arrived 9 months later - I really don't miss the old Apple).
[quote]<strong>Today we have the likes of XP and the various Linux flavors with Gnome and the like. While having the type of fubars we have today in OS X could have been, lets say, acceptable, back in 95, today it means the life and death of a company.</strong><hr></blockquote>
This is 100% wrong. System 7.5 nearly killed Apple in 1995. Literally. I was there. I saw the Macs just... vanish... from the university here (there are still a few pockets in the college of medicine, but that's it). Whatever OS X's flaws, it's leaps and bounds better than the alternatives in the areas that really matter (stability, security, reliability, compatibility), it is significantly more user friendly than OS 9 in a number of ways, and it's held in much higher regard by the same people who got rid of Macs in 1995.
I wouldn't even dare to compare Gnome on Linux to Aqua on OS X. There are very sound reasons why Linux has failed as a client OS (how'd you like to recompile Darwin every time you installed a new driver on your iBook?). As for XP, its turd might be polished while OS X's diamond is still rough, but between MS' bad attitude, the Death By A Thousand Wizards that passes for user friendliness, and constantly decreasing performance and compatibility, OS X looks better to the other side than any Mac OS I can remember since, oh System 6.
[quote]<strong>Apple's current situation isnt the bst its ever been through.</strong><hr></blockquote>
But it's a whole lot better than it was.
[ 03-22-2002: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
XP is definitely a big competitor to OS X, wizards and all, but not Linux. While I admire Linux's speed and versatility, I'm infuriated by its disgustingly poor GUI options. Gnome and Nautilus look nice in some parts, but work horribly. KDE looks horrible and works poorly. Allow me to pronounce Linux dead on the desktop until someone develops the guts to overhaul the whole system.
Fortunately when you read the polls and the articles. Look at the sales, many ( when you measure the whole ) means a few.
Those who are hopelessly stuck in the past.
Oh well.
I could tell you what my view is ( and yes I just stated it's my view ) is that in the years to come OS X will become so powerful, so viable, ( and people will be used to it by then ) that this argument will be all but forgotten.
But that's after they declare it reaching maturity.
It makes me wonder what are you comparing OS X to? It's only real competition ( Windows XP ) took years to get to where it's at. As did Mac Classic. Apple's letting you use it now. In order to get your feedback. To make it a better OS. Now you may call that beta but, if so it's the best beta I've ever used.
So if it's too slow for you or buggy, tell Apple!
That's the whole point. Coming here and whining does no good.
[ 03-22-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>
ZO and I are not whining. We are NOT switching to Windows, either, are we? (ZO, I know you're not
Amorph said:
[quote]
As for XP, its turd might be polished while OS X's diamond is still rough
<hr></blockquote>
Exactly. I know OS X will eventually be the mechanism through which Apple eventually climbs back up to 10-15% market share, and from there, who knows?
MacOS X is what Linux wants (wanted?) to be. Every time I hear crap from a Radio Shack or Staples kid, I have to mention this. It starts out like this: I mention a Mac, and I get some smartass remark like "Macs cause cancer!" Haha. I ask them, what would you RUN on a PC? What would you do with it? Windows? They respond, almost too quickly, "Linux!"
Linux is a server. Maybe a development platform, for a masochist
Granted, Amorph, Windows does improve in jumps, and the "Critical Updates" for my Win98 seem to do more harm than good (really, security on WinDOwS, why even try anyway?, lol)
Yet, ZO is seeing what many of you refuse to see. Ack! You are at risk of sounding almost as blind as a Windoid. Wait, sorry, that was harsh. But you know what I mean
This discussion is interesting. Besides, I learn a lot from people here, jimmac. And usually it's fun!
Sidenote: Jeez, isn't Bluetooth cool! I am leaning toward BUYING that! Now that it's actually a reality, I am excited! This is the kind of stuff that makes Apple, well, Apple!
AirSluf, I hear you, and I know exactly what you are saying. We are VERY spoiled
But why is the ability to copy a volume in the Finder "<exalted>", exactly?
I never had problems with 7.5.3, on my Color Classic, acually. But I did go 7.6.1 when it came out.
Apple has *talent*. iTunes/QuickTime/iStuff vs. WiMP and the copycat M$ stuff, just for example. Once MacOS X becomes polished, I know I'll never look back. But it sure isn't polished, yet. In the past few weeks, I've gotten to like it, but not as much as OS 9, yet.
<strong>Yet, ZO is seeing what many of you refuse to see.</strong><hr></blockquote>
That goes both ways.
I understand that some people have legitimate gripes with OS X. I know that there are huge gaps left, and things that are genuinely incomplete and unpolished, which make it unusable for certain applications and maddening for others. That's why I dived right in, but I'm simultaneously watching for an upgrade that I consider totally Mom-proof.
What I object to is the generalization of experience to "Mac users" or to "everyone," or that this is a sign of Apple abandoning content creators(!!!) instead of a necessarily awkward transition. For the purposes of this particular longtime loyal Apple user, OS X has been better than OS 9 since 10.0.0. For the purposes of a sizable number of people, OS X is a leap forward in usability over OS 9 (and from Windows, I need hardly add) right now, gaps and glitches notwithstanding. Look at the attention and praise it's getting outside the Mac presses. The only really serious mistake, IMO, was shipping OS X standard with the modem/PPP bug. But even given that, it's a good thing.
Some of it, I think, is psychological. For example, (just to pick on poor ZO
[ 03-23-2002: Message edited by: Amorph ]
[ 03-23-2002: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
I've been through it before when Apple was trying to polish Classic back in the system 7 days. I found some those " upgrades " far more annoying ( like bringing my whole system down ) than this.
Once again I'm much more concerned with the state of the hardware this is running on.
While it still does everything I ask of it fairly well ( and my G4 is a couple of years old now ) I realize to the new buyer out there the Speed gap ( not just the Mhz ) has increased not decreased ( compared to say, a year ago ). This concerns me and it should concern Apple. This is what needs attention and soon.
Of course if a new faster CPU like a G5 or what ever comes along the OS will have to upgraded to accomodate it. This may cause more " awkward transition " problems.
[ 03-26-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>
My 'effortlessness' at switching between a Mac and PC keyboard is the fruit of 6 years of working with both (and even making a sticker of an apple and putting it on the CTRL buttons of the PC keyboards I used to remember that its basically our equivalent).
Im used to not even thinking of pressing Apple+N for a new folder seeing that I have been using Macs for about 8 years now. I do follow your explanation for WHY they changed it, but it doent make me any happier. I have learned now and thats that, but it still pissed me off.
Im at least happy to say that I got my iBook back after 10days repair... and it hasnt gotten any faster
To be honest it sorta feels like Im using the Vaio still because its about as sluggish... but the Vaio is 2 years old. Oops.
I also have to agree with the arguement one has to make when they mention Macs to PC weenies and Mac haters in general. The always (I mean ALWAYS) instinctively say "oh, Macs suck". I always have a 2 second 'ha-ha' laugh with them and say that I use Macs and love them much more than Windows... and 'did you know that the new MacOS X is based on Unix so you can have a nice DOS-like terminal and hack around with it?' That usually shuts them up a little and they half consider it. I always conclude with saying that it doesnt really matter in the end because, and this is true, its just a matter of habit. I think 90% of all PC users that say Macs suck is because its different and they just dont want to learn a new system. I also think thats about right for Mac users. I used to hate PCs while I didnt even know that much about them. But in time I learned that 'in order to defeat your enemy, you must know him'. And so that is what I have done and now know what I can appreciate and not on both platforms.
Jeeez, I really want 10.2 to come out soon... the slowness of this OS is making me go nuts.
<strong> I think 90% of all PC users that say Macs suck is because its different and they just dont want to learn a new system. I also think thats about right for Mac users. I used to hate PCs while I didnt even know that much about them. But in time I learned that 'in order to defeat your enemy, you must know him'. And so that is what I have done and now know what I can appreciate and not on both platforms</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, I think 90% of all OS 9 users who complain about X say X sucks because it's different and they don't want to learn a new system.
What I think you should do is rethink the way you approach OS X. I think you should learn that in order to defeat your enemy, you should get to know them first. That way, you might actually appreciate all X has to offer, both good and bad.
I think I'm done.
The concept of NET makes me want to gag.
When PC advocates start spouting nonsense I just take them down memory lane.
" Didn't Apple do the same to Xerox " no, they bought the GUI from Xerox. Xerox knew what they where doing and they didn't want it. Apple on the other hand was tricked into letting MS use the GUI and later tried to sue but, it was too late.
The whole tradition that Windows is based on is wrong and they shouldn't be allowed to get get away with it. As with many things in this strange new world we live in they probably will. Just like OJ and anyone else who has enough power and money. But, that still doesn't make it right.
If you support Windows you are supporting a future that insures we will have a lot less control over not just computer products but almost every kind of media.
Microsoft will be happy to control it for you.
Where do you want to go today?
[ 03-27-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>
<a href="http://forums.macnn.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=46&t=005162"; target="_blank">http://forums.macnn.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=46&t=005162</a>;
<a href="http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenTopic/page?a=tpc&s=50009562&f=8300945231&m=3720951324"; target="_blank">http://arstechnica.infopop.net/OpenTopic/page?a=tpc&s=50009562&f=8300945231&m=3720951324</a>;
<strong>
Well, I think 90% of all OS 9 users who complain about X say X sucks because it's different and they don't want to learn a new system.
What I think you should do is rethink the way you approach OS X. I think you should learn that in order to defeat your enemy, you should get to know them first. That way, you might actually appreciate all X has to offer, both good and bad.
I think I'm done.</strong><hr></blockquote>
ehh, I disagree. Most OS 9 users that dislike OS X have usually used OS X for at least a short period of time.
Now, I'm sure one could argue that one needs to use OS X for an extended period of time in order to fully appreciate this operating system. However OS X has a TON of usability problems, and those do not take extended weeks to show. You see them right away.
As a professional web developer and interface designer I tend to run in to 2 different types of people. anyone that I know though geekie development work typically loves OS X and its Next Step genes. However, they'll spend half there time looking at the TCSH command line.
Anyone that I work with in the design industry is typically not too exited about OS X right now. These poor folks run into a lot of road blocks that don't interfere with developers that much. First off, OS X is usually slower then OS 9. It benches slower then OS 9 in both OpenGL and 2D performance. OS X also lacks support for 2D hardware acceleration... and this becomes VERY apparent in professional design apps when one is dealing with a large project. Scrolling is saaaalllooooooow....and I have a Dual g4 system.
Aqua is also a huge hinderance. White and grey lines, no solid window boarders, gradients galore, and menus at 90% opacity do not make a UI functional. Anyone that has tried to layout a big project in OS X, with light colors and tons of open windows, probably wants to kill themselfs. It's a pain. I've been using OS X since DP4 and I can still navigate OS 9 and Windows faster in professional design apps. These OSs have neutral UIs that have been tested by PSYCHOLOGISTS and put in front of FOCUS GROUPS.
Err... but I guess my machine has never been more stable.