New MacBook case leaks question FireWire's future

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  • Reply 121 of 321
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    Who's going to care or notice? Many places, sadly, still use VGA, thus you have to use an adaptor anyway. Many PC laptops only have VGA connections and of course, display sharing and mirroring isn't nearly as smooth in Windows as it is in Mac OS X.



    Apple's Mini DVI and Micro DVI connectors are proprietary to Apple. This is not 1995 anymore. Apple should use industry standard connectors whenever possible. Here is a Mini HDMI connector which is industry standard, and appears to be even smaller than Apple's Mini DVI or Micro DVI



    http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/mini.aspx
  • Reply 122 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    To back you your claim, they are working on getting 1000BASE-T to 1000BASE-T, or go from 1Gbps to 10Gbps.
    Surely, there is a certain freedom to having wireless standards but the structure of wired connectivity will probably reign king for many a year to come.



    Especially for those who consider security to be paramount. Go ahead, sit outside of my joint and try to wirelessly break in to my wired network!
  • Reply 122 of 321
    wobegonwobegon Posts: 764member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zinfella View Post


    WRONG, Kimosabe! The 15" MacBook pro has two USB 2 ports, and the 17" has three.



    You're misunderstanding my comment. I said, All MacBooks are identical, all Airs are identical, all MacBook Pros are identical.



    Each separate computer (MacBook, MacBook Pro, MacBook Air) has multiple SKUs (the entry-level $1100 2.1GHz MacBook, the $1300 2.4GHz MacBook, etc.), yet all the ports of each model's SKUs are the same.
  • Reply 124 of 321
    Oh dear Apple you are doing it again.



    Makes it hard to trust you.



    We users keep picking up the tab for all the dumped hardware, software and compatibility issues you create, whilst driving down the technology highway.
  • Reply 125 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    You're misunderstanding my comment. I said, All MacBooks are identical, all Air's are identical, all MacBook Pros are identical. The aluminum PowerBooks and plastic iBooks were the same.



    Each separate computer (MacBook, MacBook Pro, MacBook Air) has multiple SKUs (the entry-level $1100 2.1GHz MacBook, the $1300 2.4GHz MacBook, etc.), yet all the ports are the same.



    The ports on the 15" and the 17" MacBook pro's are not the same, the 17" has one more USB 2 port than the 15". Moreover, the 17" can be had with a high resolution display, another difference. That does not fit the meaning of the word identical in my dictionary.
  • Reply 126 of 321
    The beauty of these photos includes the fact no one is even questioning whether this is a prototype that was scrapped for another design.



    There are no timestamp/manufacturering stamp dates on the photos to indicate how far in the production cycle these test cases reside.



    You will not see Gigabit Ethernet [wired] being dropped. Anyone thinking of using these in enterprises for development platforms while not needing more Final Cut Pro features in the Macbook Pro aren't going to convince their clients to switch to wireless networks for their in-house development.



    DisplayPort offering both Video and Audio makes sense to have moving foward.



    Unless Nvidia or AMD are upgrading their Laptop line of cards, by Oct 14, we are seeing dedicated DVI-I port being on the system for the MacBook Pro.



    Moving the MacBook Pro to have a combo FW3200/800 and dropping FW 400, but offering a third party add-on to use FW400 makes sense.



    This image:



    [CENTER][/CENTER]



    gives the impression the DVI-I port is the far-left point, down below the keyboard to give space for more airflow and thus a cooler system.



    [CENTER][/CENTER]
  • Reply 127 of 321
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DaNkKnD View Post


    I've been thinking of ways apple could potentially make a dock for the MBP... obviously they wont slap a port on the bottom like IBM does so I believe they might go for dock where you place the MBP on top and connect a big fat cable in the side.



    Could this be the use of that "unknown" port?









    Newer HP laptops and docks already do this. The laptop sits on top of the dock and connects from the side. But instead of a "big fat cable in the side", the HP dock has a retractable connector that is engaged by moving a switch on the dock.
  • Reply 128 of 321
    Regarding the size differences between the MB and the MBP to musicians, I guess the issue is paranoia, not reality.



    The fact remains that the MBP is...what...10% larger? Probably not even, but then again, if you desperately want to believe something, then you can.



    Carrying around an extra .4lb and barely 1"x1" is not a big deal for those of us who are...um...not 80lb teens.







    Look at THAT difference! I'm sorry, but the size argument is ridiculous to most rational people.



    THIS is size difference:



  • Reply 129 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zinfella View Post


    The ports on the 15" and the 17" MacBook pro's are not the same, the 17" has one more USB 2 port than the 15". Moreover, the 17" can be had with a high resolution display, another difference. That does not fit the meaning of the word identical in my dictionary.



    You continue to misunderstand, or perhaps you're just being pedantic for the heck of it.



    Obviously, Wobegon means that all 15" MBPs are the same; all 17" MBPs are the same, all MBs the same, etc.
  • Reply 130 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    Who's going to care or notice? Many places, sadly, still use VGA, thus you have to use an adaptor anyway. Many PC laptops only have VGA connections and of course, display sharing and mirroring isn't nearly as smooth in Windows as it is in Mac OS X.



    So now we will need several adaptors? None of them cheap either. The reason I haven't bothered connecting my Macs up to our TVs is that we will need 4 different very pricey cables, plus the separate audio cables, which will probably become rapidly redundant.



    Apple has always made life difficult with monitor connections. I've lost track of how many different plugs and cables they've used.



    I have learnt to not even try.
  • Reply 131 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    What? The MacBook didn't have FW 800 in the first place! It's Apple's budget, entry-level laptop. Why were you expecting or anticipating the inclusion of FW 800 at all?



    Pro photographers, more often than not, go with the laptop designed with them in mind: the MacBook Pro, which does come with FW 800.



    Is that like a news flash? do you think that you're the only one that knows that the MacBook never had FW800? Is there some reason that I can't want Apple to have a FW800 port on the yet to be released Macbook? Here's a clue for you, most pro photogs don't use laptops to edit images because they aren't up to the task ,unless you add a quality external display. However, they are fine for field work to peek at the images, and do a fast transfer of CF cards, check email, browse the web, etc. Later the images are edited on a desktop, or at least using an decent external display.
  • Reply 132 of 321
    wobegonwobegon Posts: 764member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zinfella View Post


    The ports on the 15" and the 17" MacBook pro's are not the same, the 17" has one more USB 2 port than the 15". Moreover, the 17" can be had with a high resolution display, another difference. That does not fit the meaning of the word identical in my dictionary.



    Ugh, I see where I led you astray.



    The 15" and 17" are two separate models. Obviously one is the scaled up or down version of the other, but they are different computers, with different cases. I did not mean to imply all MacBook Pros are the same, I simply was in the mindset of thinking about the MacBook (which has only ever come in one 13" model), the MacBook Air (which has only ever come in one 13" model), the iBook (which has only ever come in one 13" model).



    There are multiple SKUs of the 15" model and multiple SKUs of the 17" model. In terms of ports, all the 15" SKUs are the same. In terms of ports, all the 17" SKUs are the same.



    Hope that clears everything up.



    EDIT



    @ applebook,



    Thank you. I thought I was going out of my mind.
  • Reply 133 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mikeylast View Post


    video professionals (me for one) will mostly favour pro models over standard macbooks, so wont be losing too much sleep over firewire port cutbacks in entry level macbooks - primarily because screen resolution/real estate is essential for using final cut/ pro apps. although - i do rather like to firewire a camera through the 400 port while the 800 takes care of higher speed external hdd data transfer. will chaining multiple firewire devices create issues perhaps? hmm..



    looks a lot thinner - i'll be at the front of the queue! very excited>>>



    In your dreams. Since the FW 400 and FW 800 ports are on the same bus, all connected FW devices are restricted to FW 400 speeds as long as there is a device running on the FW 400 port. You absolutely lose FW 800 speeds when using both ports at once. HTH
  • Reply 134 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    Ugh, I see where I led you astray.



    The 15" and 17" are two separate models. Obviously one is the scaled up or down version of the other, but they are different computers, with different cases. I did not mean to imply all MacBook Pros are the same, I simply was in the mindset of thinking about the MacBook (which has only ever come in one 13" model), the MacBook Air (which has only ever come in one 13" model), the iBook (which has only ever come in one 13" model).



    There are multiple SKUs of the 15" model and multiple SKUs of the 17" model. In terms of ports, all the 15" SKUs are the same. In terms of ports, all the 17" SKUs are the same.



    Hope that clears everything up.



    EDIT



    @ applebook,



    Thank you. I thought I was going out of my mind.



    You're welcome, but if we ever meet, you owe me a cold one!
  • Reply 135 of 321
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by applebook View Post






    I freaking LOVE that ASUS EeePC.
  • Reply 136 of 321
    wobegonwobegon Posts: 764member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Haggar View Post


    Apple's Mini DVI and Micro DVI connectors are proprietary to Apple. This is not 1995 anymore. Apple should use industry standard connectors whenever possible. Here is a Mini HDMI connector which is industry standard, and appears to be even smaller than Apple's Mini DVI or Micro DVI



    http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/mini.aspx



    I issue was not really about industry standard vs. proprietary, but Apple laptops vs. PC laptops running Windows. More often than not, Windows laptops only have VGA, not DVI. As for Apple's laptops connecting to projectors, many places still use VGA projectors, thus you end up needing an adaptor anyway.



    Apple's likely going with mini-DVI on MacBook Pros now because while they're designed to be portable powerhouses, many mainstream consumers are attracted to the larger screen of the MBP and Apple's likely finding that few mainstream users are actually hooking up their MBPs to external displays. So for now, they're switching to mini-DVI until they can drop something else to fit a better connector. Remember (and I've brought this up multiple times in this thread, as have others) that Apple dropped FW 800 in the first MacBook Pro and then brought it back in the next revision. The same think could happen to dual link DVI or they could move to HDMI.



    I'd say the next thing on the cutting board is the internal SuperDrive. Once they remove this, Apple could potentially offer even more ports than they have now, instead of having to replace one type of cable for another.
  • Reply 137 of 321
    People,



    I seriously doubt apple are going to drop firewire completely for the next few years at least. Besdides, the photos from the asain sites have been wrong before, what is to say that they were just protypes or even photoshopped. Only time will tell but apple isn't that dumb to not know that people are still using firewire. On the other hand, apples future seems to be all wireless, and not many/ports buttons. Take the macbook air for example. I reckont the only reason they put the usb,headphone jack and video out on the machine is because people aren't used to being in that wireless sort of world just yet. I'm sure in the future as wireless usb hubs become cheaper they will eliminate usb completely from the macbook air, and they probably will develop technology for wireless video output, therefore eliminating the need for that as well. But the fact is apple is probably 50 years ahead of the industry, and people like mac newbies/ recnt convert from windows type of thing and also other people, just aren't ready for it yet. At the moment ethernet is soooo much faster than wireless. And for all you prosumers out there, apple isn't going to leave you out of the cold. Wi-fi, while great for just kicking up on the couch with a laptop, it isn't practical for big internet usage people, say people who want to upload stuff onto the net.



    as they say



    Think different.



    Apple isn't as dumb as people set to make out.
  • Reply 138 of 321
    rolorolo Posts: 686member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zinfella View Post


    You don't know what the fuss is about? Then obviously you are not aware of the speed difference between FW 800 and USB 2. That becomes a serious issue with external hard drives, and when using a card reader to download several hundred images as Pro photographers do every day!



    Try doing a cloned backup to an external drive using USB 2, and then FW 800. If you can't see the difference, then you're blind. Same for downloading CF cards with a really fast reader like the Sandisk Extreme IV hooked up to FW 800.



    No Firewire 800, means no sale for me. I was really hoping that Apple would extend FW 800 to the MacBook, I don't need the features of a MacBook Pro, as long as the Macbook has FW 800.



    Any pro doing video or photography would use a MBP, not a MB. If you're doing casual photo and video work and need FireWire 400, it's no problem on the new MB via an adapter. The existing MB only has one FW400 port anyway so if you need FW800, you can only get that on a MBP to start with.



    So, yes, I don't know what the freaking fuss is about.
  • Reply 139 of 321
    haggarhaggar Posts: 1,568member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    So for now, they're switching to mini-DVI until they can drop something else to fit a better connector. Remember (and I've brought this up multiple times in this thread, as have others) that Apple dropped FW 800 in the first MacBook Pro and then brought it back in the next revision. The same think could happen to dual link DVI or they could move to HDMI.



    I'd say the next thing on the cutting board is the internal SuperDrive. Once they remove this, Apple could potentially offer even more ports than they have now, instead of having to replace one type of cable for another.



    It would be stupid to continue using Mini DVI or Micro DVI now that MIni HDMI is available, is industry standard, and seems to be smaller than Apple's proprietary connectors:



    http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/mini.aspx



    But then again, Apple might try to introduce another proprietary connector like "Nano HDMI" or "Micro DisplayPort".



    The optical drive should be made removable so users can take it out and put in other accessories like a second battery or second hard drive.
  • Reply 140 of 321
    msnlymsnly Posts: 378member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wobegon View Post


    I simply was in the mindset of thinking about the MacBook (which has only ever come in one 13" model), the MacBook Air (which has only ever come in one 13" model), the iBook (which has only ever come in one 13" model).



    The iBook came in 12" and 14" models.



    I know because one is sitting on the floor in front of me.
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