I agree. If they were trying to show the difference, they would have split it down the middle and said something about it.
I was also wondering when someone would say something about the glare on the screen. That's what everyone complains about with the glossy screen, and Apple actually put it on there to show it off, not hide it.
Thanks guys, for once I've been able to spark some conversation on here. Makes me feel good. Really, thanks. Yes, they do indeed like show off the glare at Apple. That photo with the line across the screen was a screenshot directly from Apple's new Macbook video. Not to get too philosophical, but I think perhaps this is a good indication of our recent preferences of form over function. I personally think people are much more vain (fashionable, etc) than they once were. And having a pretty, shiny screen, Apple is appealing to vanity.
I've all but given up on Apple for now... until they right the ship and get back to appealing to pros again, not only with screens and ports, but all things in general.
They just seem to not care about the pros who are in the trenches and use their equipment 12 hours a day.
I am actively looking at Ebay for deals on Penryn 17s with matte screens. I figure I might as well get the latest and greatest now, because it looks to be awhile (if ever) for Apple to come back again and offer a pro-level machine that is worth a damn. (This would mean Nehalem at the least, which won't likely be out until this time next year )
Hopefully, they've learned their mistakes with the ports and screen issues by then too!
I've all but given up on Apple for now... until they right the ship and get back to appealing to pros again, not only with screens and ports, but all things in general.
They just seem to not care about the pros who are in the trenches and use their equipment 12 hours a day.
I am actively looking at Ebay for deals on Penryn 17s with matte screens. I figure I might as well get the latest and greatest now, because it looks to be awhile (if ever) for Apple to come back again and offer a pro-level machine that is worth a damn. (This would mean Nehalem at the least, which won't likely be out until this time next year )
Hopefully, they've learned their mistakes with the ports and screen issues by then too!
I've all but given up on Apple for now... until they right the ship and get back to appealing to pros again, not only with screens and ports, but all things in general.
They just seem to not care about the pros who are in the trenches and use their equipment 12 hours a day.
I am actively looking at Ebay for deals on Penryn 17s with matte screens. I figure I might as well get the latest and greatest now, because it looks to be awhile (if ever) for Apple to come back again and offer a pro-level machine that is worth a damn. (This would mean Nehalem at the least, which won't likely be out until this time next year )
Hopefully, they've learned their mistakes with the ports and screen issues by then too!
I can't give up of the simplicity and efectiveness of Mac OS X, so i can't switch to PC's. But i think we are watching Apple becoming less Apple and more crapy PC style. Producing PRO hardware without taking in consideration, the needs of the pros is to say the least VERY STUPID. I now that the option of anti-glare ad costs because of the logistics, but there are a lot of people like me that won't pay the premium price of a top notebook to get stuck with a lousy glossy display.
The specs of the new macbook pro 17'' should be (hipotetical because price factor):
- Led backlight 1920x1200px (10bits) with GLOSSY OR ANTI-GLARE display
- Quad core 2.8 Ghz L2 12MB (several options)
- Blu ray drive
- 4 or 8 Gb 1066 Mhz DDR3
- SSD Drive 256 GB or Hard Disk 500 GB or 1TB 7200rpm
- Graphic Card based on Nvidia Quadro with 1GB GDDR3
- Slots: 3x USB 3.0 / 2x Firewire 3200 / MiniDisplay / Ethernet 10/100/1000 / Audio IN and OUT / Express Card
- Teclado OLED + Trackpad multitouch
- Airport (802.11 N) + GPS (optional) + Bluetooth 2.1
- Better Sound Speakers
- Battery Ultracapacitor (at least providing 24 Hours of autonomy).
Hey, if you're not a pro, and you're happy with the way things are going for consumers, then by all means, be happy.
We, who use our machines for a living and need to get things done - demand more. If you want to surf your myspace page all day and write tweets and emails, then buy your glossy, port-less piece of crap with a smile.
Forgive me, but we're not lemmings willing to follow Apple off the cliff of "ooh shiny".
Hey, if you're not a pro, and you're happy with the way things are going for consumers, then by all means, be happy.
We, who use our machines for a living and need to get things done - demand more. If you want to surf your myspace page all day and write tweets and emails, then buy your glossy, port-less piece of crap with a smile.
Forgive me, but we're not lemmings willing to follow Apple off the cliff of "ooh shiny".
By the way, I just put my money where my mouth is:
I refuse to pay Apple for their current offerings - so instead, just 20 minutes ago, I purchased a brand new, sealed-box 2.6ghz 17" Penryn high res MATTE finish on Ebay for $2299.00.
When Apple gets their shit together and comes out with a new machine that is worthy of the "pro" moniker, then I'll be ready to buy that from Apple directly.
Much of the technology you list is either extremely expensive, barley available, or doesn't even yet exist. Would you really pay for this $10,000 machine you want Apple to make?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SalPombo
- Led backlight 1920x1200px (10bits) with GLOSSY OR ANTI-GLARE display
We know the anti-glare isn't going to happen. Don't waste hope on that.
Quote:
- Quad core 2.8 Ghz L2 12MB (several options)
The current Quad core chipsets can be used in the iMac.
But they use too much energy for the MacBook Pro.
Quote:
- Blu ray drive
Not going to happen right now.
Quote:
- 4 or 8 Gb 1066 Mhz DDR3
8GB should be possible when 4GB RAM chips
are available.
Quote:
- SSD Drive 256 GB or Hard Disk 500 GB or 1TB 7200rpm
You can use any HDD/ SSD you want that can fit the 9" slot.
Quote:
- Graphic Card based on Nvidia Quadro with 1GB GDDR3
Requires too much energy.
Quote:
- Slots: 3x USB 3.0 / 2x Firewire 3200 / MiniDisplay / Ethernet 10/100/1000 / Audio IN and OUT / Express Card
USB 3 or Firewire 3200 don't yet exist and won't in a couple of months.
Quote:
- Teclado OLED + Trackpad multitouch
Too expensive. What function does a monitor have on the trackpad?
When Apple gets their shit together and comes out with a new machine that is worthy of the "pro" moniker, then I'll be ready to buy that from Apple directly.
You really feel that comfortable in speaking for millions of other people and having the definitive definition of a "Pro" notebook?
Like i said most of the components in the comimg new 17'' macbook pro is hipotetical because of the price, but still if you look at Lenovo W700 you cant stop wandering that Apple should make an effort to include more pro components as an option
Options should include besides the starting components (more mainstream and less expensive)
- Anti-glare option (I hope that apple understands that a riot is going to happen if they dont include it)
- Quad Processor 2.53 Ghz.
- Nvidia Quadro FX 3700M 128-core CUDA parallel computing processor 1GB (dedicated).
- Blu ray.
- USB 3.0 is not ready but Firewire 3200 is.
- Integrated wacom tablet and color calibrator.
- The oled keyboard as nothing to do with the trackpad.
Like i said most of the components in the comimg new 17'' macbook pro is hipotetical because of the price, but still if you look at Lenovo W700 you cant stop wandering that Apple should make an effort to include more pro components as an option
The Lenovo notebook you are talking about violates much of Apple's design philosophy. Its big, heavy, with terrible battery life, and very expensive. This machine is for a niche market.
It appeared as though you were making a blanket statement.
I apologize. I might have. However, I was trying to make the point that there are tons of people who feel similar about these issues (I called them pros) and that are upset about lack of options and the general direction that Apple is taking. My point continued in that if you do not feel the same way, then that if fine, but it IS still a valid concern for others.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell
The Lenovo notebook you are talking about violates much of Apple's design philosophy. Its big, heavy, with terrible battery life, and very expensive. This machine is for a niche market.
I would absolutely love it if Apple would classify a new product in the "mobile workstation" category. Something like a 19" or 20" with quad-cores, dual graphics cards, dual HD - raid options, etc... Something along the lines of an x-serve but in a pretty case.
I know lots of people who work in the field or multiple locations that only use laptops so they can use one system in multiple locations, easily. Why not cater to that crowd? That segment of the market would be at least as big as the x-serve market or even the MBA market, I guarantee it.
I apologize. I might have. However, I was trying to make the point that there are tons of people who feel similar about these issues (I called them pros) and that are upset about lack of options and the general direction that Apple is taking. My point continued in that if you do not feel the same way, then that if fine, but it IS still a valid concern for others.
No problem. I think we on boards like this begin to think people out in the general world value what we talk about here.
I work in an industry dominated by Macs. A lot of people around me use MBP. Really none of them spend any time or energy pouring over computers specs. They live life and use the computer as it is designed.
Quote:
I would absolutely love it if Apple would classify a new product in the "mobile workstation" category. Something like a 19" or 20" with quad-cores, dual graphics cards, dual HD - raid options, etc... Something along the lines of an x-serve but in a pretty case.
I'm sure sales of such a machine would be so low as to not really be worth it.
I agree with you that the Lenovo W700 is a terrible example of Industrial Design, but mainly because of a lack of interest in Design by the majority of PC Hardware makers. You only have to look to a lot of PC's out there with the same components that Apple notebooks have and they still look uglier and bigger (but not heavier due to the wheight of the crappy plastic they use).
- First thing I don't validate using 2 Hard Drives in a notebook because of the size considerations (unless you remove the optical drive to put an extra HD, like the new MacBook Pro allows to do).
- 2th the quad core still ocupies only 1 die, the only thing is that probably needs a better ventilation.
- The graphic chip of Nvidia would have to be redesigned to be acomodated, but is not very complicated because of the size of the 17'' case.
- Putting the Blu ray drive instead of the current optical drive is simple.
- The only thing more complicated to do is to acommodate a A6 wacom tablet in the notebook, but with the allocation of the optical drive in the side of the case it would be possible to do it.
- The Oled keyboard is not very realistic to incorporate in the comming model, but the technology exists (Optimus Keyboard - +-250$) and maybe Apple should start testing it to incorporate it in future models.
- Like I previous had said this top components would be optional. The base model would be a 2.6 Ghz Dual core with a average and afordable top graphic card, superdrive, no wacom tablet and no calibrator (but the number of slots is the ones that I had previous mentioned).
In the terms of the price of this kind of top machine I don´t see a reason to be more than 5000$ unless Apple do like they do with the prices of the memory that they sell, that no one understands why so much greed.
Realistically, is it worth waiting for the MBP 17"?
Will the specs be that much better than what's available on the 15"? Will the new 17" be a worse deal given it'll probably lose FW400 and be no choice glossy screen?
Realistically, is it worth waiting for the MBP 17"?
Will the specs be that much better than what's available on the 15"? Will the new 17" be a worse deal given it'll probably lose FW400 and be no choice glossy screen?
We don't know about FW400 for sure. The 17" of the same overall architecture should support at least one more port than the current 15", but if only one more, then Apple has to decide between two FW and two USB, or one FW and three USB.
Unless Apple is working on a way to make a matte version that didn't make it in time for the introduction, the current model may very well be the end of the line for Apple matte screens.
Maybe one thing you can do is wait until the new version is announced. If you still want the old one, they will probably be available as a clearance item for a while.
I see that Amazon has some pretty good deals on the 17-inch MacBook Pro for
$2,319. Also as far as the glossy/matte display issue, I see no reason Apple couldn't offer a matte display with the current design. The display looks identical in structure to that of the Air. The Air has the old style glossy, and by extension was the same style glossy display finish as the previous MacBook Pro. Therefore the new unibody-style MacBooks and Macbook Pros could be easily offered in a matte version.
Any reason to NOT expect the 17" unibody MBP in January? The lack of chatter has me wondering if Jobs has decided to phase-out the big guy. Paranoid thought I know, but I've been waiting for a very long time....
Comments
I agree. If they were trying to show the difference, they would have split it down the middle and said something about it.
I was also wondering when someone would say something about the glare on the screen. That's what everyone complains about with the glossy screen, and Apple actually put it on there to show it off, not hide it.
Thanks guys, for once I've been able to spark some conversation on here. Makes me feel good. Really, thanks. Yes, they do indeed like show off the glare at Apple. That photo with the line across the screen was a screenshot directly from Apple's new Macbook video. Not to get too philosophical, but I think perhaps this is a good indication of our recent preferences of form over function. I personally think people are much more vain (fashionable, etc) than they once were. And having a pretty, shiny screen, Apple is appealing to vanity.
They just seem to not care about the pros who are in the trenches and use their equipment 12 hours a day.
I am actively looking at Ebay for deals on Penryn 17s with matte screens. I figure I might as well get the latest and greatest now, because it looks to be awhile (if ever) for Apple to come back again and offer a pro-level machine that is worth a damn. (This would mean Nehalem at the least, which won't likely be out until this time next year )
Hopefully, they've learned their mistakes with the ports and screen issues by then too!
I've all but given up on Apple for now... until they right the ship and get back to appealing to pros again, not only with screens and ports, but all things in general.
They just seem to not care about the pros who are in the trenches and use their equipment 12 hours a day.
I am actively looking at Ebay for deals on Penryn 17s with matte screens. I figure I might as well get the latest and greatest now, because it looks to be awhile (if ever) for Apple to come back again and offer a pro-level machine that is worth a damn. (This would mean Nehalem at the least, which won't likely be out until this time next year )
Hopefully, they've learned their mistakes with the ports and screen issues by then too!
Apple isn't going to change. Get over it.
I've all but given up on Apple for now... until they right the ship and get back to appealing to pros again, not only with screens and ports, but all things in general.
They just seem to not care about the pros who are in the trenches and use their equipment 12 hours a day.
I am actively looking at Ebay for deals on Penryn 17s with matte screens. I figure I might as well get the latest and greatest now, because it looks to be awhile (if ever) for Apple to come back again and offer a pro-level machine that is worth a damn. (This would mean Nehalem at the least, which won't likely be out until this time next year )
Hopefully, they've learned their mistakes with the ports and screen issues by then too!
I can't give up of the simplicity and efectiveness of Mac OS X, so i can't switch to PC's. But i think we are watching Apple becoming less Apple and more crapy PC style. Producing PRO hardware without taking in consideration, the needs of the pros is to say the least VERY STUPID. I now that the option of anti-glare ad costs because of the logistics, but there are a lot of people like me that won't pay the premium price of a top notebook to get stuck with a lousy glossy display.
The specs of the new macbook pro 17'' should be (hipotetical because price factor):
- Led backlight 1920x1200px (10bits) with GLOSSY OR ANTI-GLARE display
- Quad core 2.8 Ghz L2 12MB (several options)
- Blu ray drive
- 4 or 8 Gb 1066 Mhz DDR3
- SSD Drive 256 GB or Hard Disk 500 GB or 1TB 7200rpm
- Graphic Card based on Nvidia Quadro with 1GB GDDR3
- Slots: 3x USB 3.0 / 2x Firewire 3200 / MiniDisplay / Ethernet 10/100/1000 / Audio IN and OUT / Express Card
- Teclado OLED + Trackpad multitouch
- Airport (802.11 N) + GPS (optional) + Bluetooth 2.1
- Better Sound Speakers
- Battery Ultracapacitor (at least providing 24 Hours of autonomy).
- Less wheight
Apple isn't going to change. Get over it.
Hey, if you're not a pro, and you're happy with the way things are going for consumers, then by all means, be happy.
We, who use our machines for a living and need to get things done - demand more. If you want to surf your myspace page all day and write tweets and emails, then buy your glossy, port-less piece of crap with a smile.
Forgive me, but we're not lemmings willing to follow Apple off the cliff of "ooh shiny".
Hey, if you're not a pro, and you're happy with the way things are going for consumers, then by all means, be happy.
We, who use our machines for a living and need to get things done - demand more. If you want to surf your myspace page all day and write tweets and emails, then buy your glossy, port-less piece of crap with a smile.
Forgive me, but we're not lemmings willing to follow Apple off the cliff of "ooh shiny".
Very well said
I refuse to pay Apple for their current offerings - so instead, just 20 minutes ago, I purchased a brand new, sealed-box 2.6ghz 17" Penryn high res MATTE finish on Ebay for $2299.00.
When Apple gets their shit together and comes out with a new machine that is worthy of the "pro" moniker, then I'll be ready to buy that from Apple directly.
- Led backlight 1920x1200px (10bits) with GLOSSY OR ANTI-GLARE display
We know the anti-glare isn't going to happen. Don't waste hope on that.
- Quad core 2.8 Ghz L2 12MB (several options)
The current Quad core chipsets can be used in the iMac.
But they use too much energy for the MacBook Pro.
- Blu ray drive
Not going to happen right now.
- 4 or 8 Gb 1066 Mhz DDR3
8GB should be possible when 4GB RAM chips
are available.
- SSD Drive 256 GB or Hard Disk 500 GB or 1TB 7200rpm
You can use any HDD/ SSD you want that can fit the 9" slot.
- Graphic Card based on Nvidia Quadro with 1GB GDDR3
Requires too much energy.
- Slots: 3x USB 3.0 / 2x Firewire 3200 / MiniDisplay / Ethernet 10/100/1000 / Audio IN and OUT / Express Card
USB 3 or Firewire 3200 don't yet exist and won't in a couple of months.
- Teclado OLED + Trackpad multitouch
Too expensive. What function does a monitor have on the trackpad?
- Less wheight
You want more in the case and less weight.
When Apple gets their shit together and comes out with a new machine that is worthy of the "pro" moniker, then I'll be ready to buy that from Apple directly.
You really feel that comfortable in speaking for millions of other people and having the definitive definition of a "Pro" notebook?
You really feel that comfortable in speaking for millions of other people and having the definitive definition of a "Pro" notebook?
I fail to see where I was speaking for anyone other than "I"?
Options should include besides the starting components (more mainstream and less expensive)
- Anti-glare option (I hope that apple understands that a riot is going to happen if they dont include it)
- Quad Processor 2.53 Ghz.
- Nvidia Quadro FX 3700M 128-core CUDA parallel computing processor 1GB (dedicated).
- Blu ray.
- USB 3.0 is not ready but Firewire 3200 is.
- Integrated wacom tablet and color calibrator.
- The oled keyboard as nothing to do with the trackpad.
Like i said most of the components in the comimg new 17'' macbook pro is hipotetical because of the price, but still if you look at Lenovo W700 you cant stop wandering that Apple should make an effort to include more pro components as an option
The Lenovo notebook you are talking about violates much of Apple's design philosophy. Its big, heavy, with terrible battery life, and very expensive. This machine is for a niche market.
I fail to see where I was speaking for anyone other than "I"?
It appeared as though you were making a blanket statement.
It appeared as though you were making a blanket statement.
I apologize. I might have. However, I was trying to make the point that there are tons of people who feel similar about these issues (I called them pros) and that are upset about lack of options and the general direction that Apple is taking. My point continued in that if you do not feel the same way, then that if fine, but it IS still a valid concern for others.
The Lenovo notebook you are talking about violates much of Apple's design philosophy. Its big, heavy, with terrible battery life, and very expensive. This machine is for a niche market.
I would absolutely love it if Apple would classify a new product in the "mobile workstation" category. Something like a 19" or 20" with quad-cores, dual graphics cards, dual HD - raid options, etc... Something along the lines of an x-serve but in a pretty case.
I know lots of people who work in the field or multiple locations that only use laptops so they can use one system in multiple locations, easily. Why not cater to that crowd? That segment of the market would be at least as big as the x-serve market or even the MBA market, I guarantee it.
Ah, one can dream, eh?
I apologize. I might have. However, I was trying to make the point that there are tons of people who feel similar about these issues (I called them pros) and that are upset about lack of options and the general direction that Apple is taking. My point continued in that if you do not feel the same way, then that if fine, but it IS still a valid concern for others.
No problem. I think we on boards like this begin to think people out in the general world value what we talk about here.
I work in an industry dominated by Macs. A lot of people around me use MBP. Really none of them spend any time or energy pouring over computers specs. They live life and use the computer as it is designed.
I would absolutely love it if Apple would classify a new product in the "mobile workstation" category. Something like a 19" or 20" with quad-cores, dual graphics cards, dual HD - raid options, etc... Something along the lines of an x-serve but in a pretty case.
I'm sure sales of such a machine would be so low as to not really be worth it.
- First thing I don't validate using 2 Hard Drives in a notebook because of the size considerations (unless you remove the optical drive to put an extra HD, like the new MacBook Pro allows to do).
- 2th the quad core still ocupies only 1 die, the only thing is that probably needs a better ventilation.
- The graphic chip of Nvidia would have to be redesigned to be acomodated, but is not very complicated because of the size of the 17'' case.
- Putting the Blu ray drive instead of the current optical drive is simple.
- The only thing more complicated to do is to acommodate a A6 wacom tablet in the notebook, but with the allocation of the optical drive in the side of the case it would be possible to do it.
- The Oled keyboard is not very realistic to incorporate in the comming model, but the technology exists (Optimus Keyboard - +-250$) and maybe Apple should start testing it to incorporate it in future models.
- Like I previous had said this top components would be optional. The base model would be a 2.6 Ghz Dual core with a average and afordable top graphic card, superdrive, no wacom tablet and no calibrator (but the number of slots is the ones that I had previous mentioned).
In the terms of the price of this kind of top machine I don´t see a reason to be more than 5000$ unless Apple do like they do with the prices of the memory that they sell, that no one understands why so much greed.
Will the specs be that much better than what's available on the 15"? Will the new 17" be a worse deal given it'll probably lose FW400 and be no choice glossy screen?
Realistically, is it worth waiting for the MBP 17"?
Will the specs be that much better than what's available on the 15"? Will the new 17" be a worse deal given it'll probably lose FW400 and be no choice glossy screen?
We don't know about FW400 for sure. The 17" of the same overall architecture should support at least one more port than the current 15", but if only one more, then Apple has to decide between two FW and two USB, or one FW and three USB.
Unless Apple is working on a way to make a matte version that didn't make it in time for the introduction, the current model may very well be the end of the line for Apple matte screens.
Maybe one thing you can do is wait until the new version is announced. If you still want the old one, they will probably be available as a clearance item for a while.
$2,319. Also as far as the glossy/matte display issue, I see no reason Apple couldn't offer a matte display with the current design. The display looks identical in structure to that of the Air. The Air has the old style glossy, and by extension was the same style glossy display finish as the previous MacBook Pro. Therefore the new unibody-style MacBooks and Macbook Pros could be easily offered in a matte version.