I agree, considering that the iphone/ipod touch, is one of their biggest breakthroughs I doubt there will let them hang out to dry. Just the app store alone created a whole new world, for what a phone can do.
Create a place where developers can sell their games.
The iPhone is a gaming toy and has no practical business solutions.
Trust me I'm a 1st and 2nd Gen owner.
MS knows what business users want and that's where they will have the advantage.
Steve is still trying to figure out ME.com.
Give us background Push for apps.
What pratical business solutions are wanted on a mobile phone?
Most that I can think of, I would want a laptop or desktop.
I do hope to see flash update soon. And i could see a Word type program.
It's interesting that while Microsoft is teaming up with nVidia just as nVidia and Apple are getting cosy. This likely means that Apple has seen what nVidia has in the pipes and can act accordingly to have PA Semi stay one step ahead.
The Tegra APX 2500 seems to be part of the ARM11 family just like the CPU in the current iPhones and Touch. The major advantage seems to be dual - multicore support and an OpenGL ES 2.0 GPU.
I think a good Apple response would be to move to a dual core Cortex solution. Specifically, with Apple's focus on Clang and Just-In-Time compilation, which seems to be the basis of Grand Central, the Cortex-A9 conveniently offers ThumbEE which offers better support for Just-In-Time compilation. Clock it at ~600MHz with an OpenCL capable PowerVR SGX solution, it'll pack quite a punch. Of course, cherry-picking fast components is easy, while implementing them is harder. It'll be interesting to see what PA Semi has up their sleeves.
Hopefully though an Microsoft phone won't pressure Apple to take their focus off Snow Leopard and devote resources to a new iPhone like what happened with Leopard.
Everyone knows windows mobiles is terrible but check out the capability of this hardware platform. Wonder who developed this OS for the demo. Nvidia has a winner here
Since their is precedence with Apple teaming with Nvidia, Apple does care about video and games on the iPhone/Touch, I don't think it's out of the question to expect Apple to use these chips, too, if their P.A. Semi efforts aren't up to par. At least this gives us so exciting things to expect in HWfor next year.
"What pratical business solutions are wanted on a mobile phone?
Most that I can think of, I would want a laptop or desktop.
I do hope to see flash update soon. And i could see a Word type program."
sorry bout the formatting.
I think the iphone in the current state is far ahead of of any other phone currently, yes some nice features are missing, but I hope they are added soon.
Compared to Android's obscurity and the iPhone's Objective-C oddball nature, developing games on this thing is going to feel like a breath of fresh air to a lot of developers. Don't underestimate that...
I've developed software for Windows, Mac, and various flavours of UNIX using C/C++/Java/Objective-C and a multitude of APIs. I can honestly say that developing for Windows has never been a breath of fresh air.
It's funny how many developers I encounter who've only taken the time to fully learn one API/platform, and then shoot their mouth off about how much better it is than all the rest. How can they possibly have an educated opinion if they've never really taken the time to learn and use anything else? It's akin to people who've only lived in one country shooting their mouth off about how much better it is than all the others.
Objective-C is only oddball if you expect the world to look like C or C++. It's certainly no more oddball than C# or Java. Once you've gone through 3 or 4 programming languages, syntax differences don't even matter anymore. Except for Perl of course -- now that's what I call oddball!
"What do you get if you take an iPhone, remove the clean UI, user friendliness, nice industrial design, battery life, cachet, functional OS, and in general everything else that makes it worthwhile?," writes the Inquirer. "The new Microsoft phone, powered by NVIDIA."
Battery life?
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE
If this is true then MS will kill what's left of Windows Mobile. Once they start optimizing their software to run on their hardware, phone manufacturer who uses WinMo will look at the alternative (Android).
Totally agree.
And, as more phone makers turn to Android, more carriers will turn into dumb pipes. --Including AT&T. That's reason enough to hope MS makes a good phone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimDreamworx
First the OS, then the MP3 player, now the phone...
Don't forget MS' ripoff of the Pippin--what's it called, the x-box or something?
I'm pretty sure MicroSoft doesn't understand much of anything anymore, let alone developers on a phone platform.
They have been pushing for YEARS, a platform they felt could rule the world.
Most serious developers won't go NEAR windows mobile, so one of the things I'm laughing at is YOU.
I agree about Windows Mobile from a user's point of view... but from a developer's point of view it's a different story. There are an awful lot of XBox games out there, and if Microsoft can make them easy to port to a phone they've got an advantage (since a modern phone like the iPhone has about the same horsepower as the original XBox). Apple doesn't have a game console to build game developer goodwill, and they're not exactly doing a great job with mobile developer goodwill lately, either.
To come to your conclusions you are using some currently unknown assumptions and ignoring certain realities.
You make the assumption about the commonality of a mobile OS from MS will have with the XBox. It may and it may not. You make the assumption that XBox games will be ported to this mobile OS. Perhaps but that can be based on a lot of other factors other than the ease of development. Essentially anything from MS at this point is theoretical, while Apple's situation is reality.
Apple has a robust developer community for the Mac. Its not much of a leap to go from developing for the Mac to developing for the iPhone. Their are nearly 3,000 web apps for the iPhone, 639 which are games. Their are over 10,000 native apps for the iPhone, 2,409 of which are games. Thus far MS has been in the mobile market for 10 years and has not accomplished these results.
Seeing as Apple has gone from no apps for the iPhone to around 13,000 within a year and half. How do you figure Apple has no good will from developers?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booga
I agree about Windows Mobile from a user's point of view... but from a developer's point of view it's a different story. There are an awful lot of XBox games out there, and if Microsoft can make them easy to port to a phone they've got an advantage (since a modern phone like the iPhone has about the same horsepower as the original XBox). Apple doesn't have a game console to build game developer goodwill, and they're not exactly doing a great job with mobile developer goodwill lately, either.
Their are over 10,000 native apps for the iPhone, 2,409 of which are games.
Seeing as Apple has gone from no apps for the iPhone to around 13,000 within a year and half. How do you figure Apple has no good will from developers?
I am amazed at how many native apps their are so far after a little over 4 months since the App Store launch. I think I had a bet with someone on this forum that the App Store would trump the number of apps for any phone within the first 6 months. Oh well.
I said over 10,000 to be conservative in case of over lap between categories. If you take the raw numbers from iTunes their are 15,976 native apps.
What number of apps were you using for the iPhone to beat other platforms?
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism
I am amazed at how many native apps their are so far after a little over 4 months since the App Store launch. I think I had a bet with someone on this forum that the App Store would trump the number of apps for any phone within the first 6 months. Oh well.
I said over 10,000 to be conservative in case of over lap between categories. If you take the raw numbers from iTunes their are 15,976 native apps.
That is even more impressive. I have stopped looking for apps but every now and then I'll read about one that catches my interest. At this point, I think that is how most people find new apps if their is nothing specific they are looking for.
Quote:
What number of apps were you using for the iPhone to beat other platforms?
I think it was 3k, based on the total number found on Nokia's app site, but they don't list all the apps since they aren't controlled through the store, so I think I wrote it to refer to a single device's available apps, since many of the apps listed are different from carrier and device and country.
Let's see... Microsoft first had WindowsCE. That was a steaming pile.
Next, they had (or renamed it to) Windows Mobile. That was really a joke.
Now, let's take what we learned from the previous two attempts and add phone functionality on top of that... we have a winner!
Nothing to see here folks... move along.
What do you mean move along, isn't that the steaming pile of Microsoft worth looking at... I think I'll take a pass on anything MS puts out, I can just hear the headlines 6 weeks after the phone is introduced that a one thousand phone have a virus
I want one if Apple can't or won't revise the iPhone specifications. There is no point on spending good money for an iPhone if it doesn't match what competitors offer.
i think it's long been established that apple does not play the featuritis/tech spec game. both appeal to the geek market only. we want usability, not a specifications pissing contest.
that doesn't mean i'm not all for faster/bigger/better, but that's not what apples success is built on. competition is a good thing - it keeps apple on their toes. i just don't think iphone progress is going to based on hardware comparisons.
Comments
Originally Posted by MissionGrey View Post
I agree, considering that the iphone/ipod touch, is one of their biggest breakthroughs I doubt there will let them hang out to dry. Just the app store alone created a whole new world, for what a phone can do.
Create a place where developers can sell their games.
The iPhone is a gaming toy and has no practical business solutions.
Trust me I'm a 1st and 2nd Gen owner.
MS knows what business users want and that's where they will have the advantage.
Steve is still trying to figure out ME.com.
Give us background Push for apps.
What pratical business solutions are wanted on a mobile phone?
Most that I can think of, I would want a laptop or desktop.
I do hope to see flash update soon. And i could see a Word type program.
The Tegra APX 2500 seems to be part of the ARM11 family just like the CPU in the current iPhones and Touch. The major advantage seems to be dual - multicore support and an OpenGL ES 2.0 GPU.
I think a good Apple response would be to move to a dual core Cortex solution. Specifically, with Apple's focus on Clang and Just-In-Time compilation, which seems to be the basis of Grand Central, the Cortex-A9 conveniently offers ThumbEE which offers better support for Just-In-Time compilation. Clock it at ~600MHz with an OpenCL capable PowerVR SGX solution, it'll pack quite a punch. Of course, cherry-picking fast components is easy, while implementing them is harder. It'll be interesting to see what PA Semi has up their sleeves.
Hopefully though an Microsoft phone won't pressure Apple to take their focus off Snow Leopard and devote resources to a new iPhone like what happened with Leopard.
As has been said, no third party is going to bother with WinMobile now. It will be as dead as Plays For Sure.
When will MSFT start designing their own PCs?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQa9n...eature=related
Next, they had (or renamed it to) Windows Mobile. That was really a joke.
Now, let's take what we learned from the previous two attempts and add phone functionality on top of that... we have a winner!
Nothing to see here folks... move along.
The iPhone is a gaming toy and has no practical business solutions.
Trust me I'm a 1st and 2nd Gen owner.
MS knows what business users want and that's where they will have the advantage.
Are you looking at how well Windows Mobile has done in business as you evidence of this?
I asked him,
"What pratical business solutions are wanted on a mobile phone?
Most that I can think of, I would want a laptop or desktop.
I do hope to see flash update soon. And i could see a Word type program."
sorry bout the formatting.
I think the iphone in the current state is far ahead of of any other phone currently, yes some nice features are missing, but I hope they are added soon.
Compared to Android's obscurity and the iPhone's Objective-C oddball nature, developing games on this thing is going to feel like a breath of fresh air to a lot of developers. Don't underestimate that...
I've developed software for Windows, Mac, and various flavours of UNIX using C/C++/Java/Objective-C and a multitude of APIs. I can honestly say that developing for Windows has never been a breath of fresh air.
It's funny how many developers I encounter who've only taken the time to fully learn one API/platform, and then shoot their mouth off about how much better it is than all the rest. How can they possibly have an educated opinion if they've never really taken the time to learn and use anything else? It's akin to people who've only lived in one country shooting their mouth off about how much better it is than all the others.
Objective-C is only oddball if you expect the world to look like C or C++. It's certainly no more oddball than C# or Java. Once you've gone through 3 or 4 programming languages, syntax differences don't even matter anymore. Except for Perl of course -- now that's what I call oddball!
"What do you get if you take an iPhone, remove the clean UI, user friendliness, nice industrial design, battery life, cachet, functional OS, and in general everything else that makes it worthwhile?," writes the Inquirer. "The new Microsoft phone, powered by NVIDIA."
Battery life?
If this is true then MS will kill what's left of Windows Mobile. Once they start optimizing their software to run on their hardware, phone manufacturer who uses WinMo will look at the alternative (Android).
Totally agree.
And, as more phone makers turn to Android, more carriers will turn into dumb pipes. --Including AT&T. That's reason enough to hope MS makes a good phone.
First the OS, then the MP3 player, now the phone...
Don't forget MS' ripoff of the Pippin--what's it called, the x-box or something?
I'm pretty sure MicroSoft doesn't understand much of anything anymore, let alone developers on a phone platform.
They have been pushing for YEARS, a platform they felt could rule the world.
Most serious developers won't go NEAR windows mobile, so one of the things I'm laughing at is YOU.
I agree about Windows Mobile from a user's point of view... but from a developer's point of view it's a different story. There are an awful lot of XBox games out there, and if Microsoft can make them easy to port to a phone they've got an advantage (since a modern phone like the iPhone has about the same horsepower as the original XBox). Apple doesn't have a game console to build game developer goodwill, and they're not exactly doing a great job with mobile developer goodwill lately, either.
"What the hell is that thing? Set your iphones to stun"
QUOTE]
Battery life is where this hardware excels.
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2008/06...-smartphones/1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvsbo...hoo-new-leader
Branded:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIk4qTKmKzE
You make the assumption about the commonality of a mobile OS from MS will have with the XBox. It may and it may not. You make the assumption that XBox games will be ported to this mobile OS. Perhaps but that can be based on a lot of other factors other than the ease of development. Essentially anything from MS at this point is theoretical, while Apple's situation is reality.
Apple has a robust developer community for the Mac. Its not much of a leap to go from developing for the Mac to developing for the iPhone. Their are nearly 3,000 web apps for the iPhone, 639 which are games. Their are over 10,000 native apps for the iPhone, 2,409 of which are games. Thus far MS has been in the mobile market for 10 years and has not accomplished these results.
Seeing as Apple has gone from no apps for the iPhone to around 13,000 within a year and half. How do you figure Apple has no good will from developers?
I agree about Windows Mobile from a user's point of view... but from a developer's point of view it's a different story. There are an awful lot of XBox games out there, and if Microsoft can make them easy to port to a phone they've got an advantage (since a modern phone like the iPhone has about the same horsepower as the original XBox). Apple doesn't have a game console to build game developer goodwill, and they're not exactly doing a great job with mobile developer goodwill lately, either.
Their are over 10,000 native apps for the iPhone, 2,409 of which are games.
Seeing as Apple has gone from no apps for the iPhone to around 13,000 within a year and half. How do you figure Apple has no good will from developers?
I am amazed at how many native apps their are so far after a little over 4 months since the App Store launch. I think I had a bet with someone on this forum that the App Store would trump the number of apps for any phone within the first 6 months. Oh well.
What number of apps were you using for the iPhone to beat other platforms?
I am amazed at how many native apps their are so far after a little over 4 months since the App Store launch. I think I had a bet with someone on this forum that the App Store would trump the number of apps for any phone within the first 6 months. Oh well.
I said over 10,000 to be conservative in case of over lap between categories. If you take the raw numbers from iTunes their are 15,976 native apps.
That is even more impressive. I have stopped looking for apps but every now and then I'll read about one that catches my interest. At this point, I think that is how most people find new apps if their is nothing specific they are looking for.
What number of apps were you using for the iPhone to beat other platforms?
I think it was 3k, based on the total number found on Nokia's app site, but they don't list all the apps since they aren't controlled through the store, so I think I wrote it to refer to a single device's available apps, since many of the apps listed are different from carrier and device and country.
Let's see... Microsoft first had WindowsCE. That was a steaming pile.
Next, they had (or renamed it to) Windows Mobile. That was really a joke.
Now, let's take what we learned from the previous two attempts and add phone functionality on top of that... we have a winner!
Nothing to see here folks... move along.
What do you mean move along, isn't that the steaming pile of Microsoft worth looking at...
I want one if Apple can't or won't revise the iPhone specifications. There is no point on spending good money for an iPhone if it doesn't match what competitors offer.
i think it's long been established that apple does not play the featuritis/tech spec game. both appeal to the geek market only. we want usability, not a specifications pissing contest.
that doesn't mean i'm not all for faster/bigger/better, but that's not what apples success is built on. competition is a good thing - it keeps apple on their toes. i just don't think iphone progress is going to based on hardware comparisons.
just my two cents...