I find this story hard to believe. If Apple were so concerned about letting people use their current monitors, they'd throw in a Mini DisplayPort-to-DVI (or Dual-Link DVI). The Mac mini has never had multiple video outputs and I don't see that changing now.
I am thrilled that the Mac-mini can be used as a door stop in the future, but what about the appearance of the 17" Mac Book Pro at MWSF? I can't believe we haven't heard any rumors about it.
As has been reported elsewhere, the display port on the new Macbook's is DRM "enabled", restricting the ability to play DVDs, or instance, on an external display.
If this is the case on the new Mac Mini, one of the prime uses for the mini as a media center will go away.
The DRM you are talking about is HDCP. It does not (or shouldn't) restrict playing dvd or any other SD media. Having HDCP gives the mini the chance to have a blu-ray drive added, or itunes HD movies to be played, both of which would enhance the mini as an entertainment device.
HDCP may be stupid, but if you want high definition video, your hardware has to support it, as the studios wont let you watch it any other way.
I wonder if Apple will switch the power connector to a Magsafe so customers could use the magsafe built into the LED Cinema Display? That would also give customers an iSight cam, more USB ports, and speakers as well.
This would be my expectation. Otherwise Apple went to a lot of effort on the current display design, if it could not also power the Mini. I would fully expect the new mini to visually complement the new display as well, otherwise Apple is smoking something...
How many mini DisplayPort monitors are on the market? The Mac Mini is targeted to people that have existing displays (and mice and keyboards). The Mini DVI is to serve that need, and the DisplayPort is there to allow use of such a monitor in the future, yielding flexibility in monitor choice. This makes perfect sense. Whether this will support two displays being driven at the same time is a separate feature.
It's a simple cable adapter to get you a DVI-out from mini Display Port. Probably not get you dual-DVI though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin
The Mini is used in a huge variety of applications and a great number of those require analog video. Putting mini-dp into VGA, component or s-video would be near impossible. However, people will also need to drive high-end Cinema displays so having both covers all options and there is enough room.
There is also a simple cable adapter to get you analog outputs, at least for VGA. I wouldn't be surprised if the analog circuitry could do analog TV outputs too, it may be a matter of enabling support and getting a cable adapter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling
DisplayPort supports multiple monitors by means of daisy-chaining, so this is clearly aimed at comforting switchers rather than enabling dual monitor support.
I don't know about comforting switchers, though it's one nice side-effect. I wonder how many people that would buy a $600 computer would be going dual-head. I know I would but I'd think I would be in the minority. Apple's current display doesn't support chaining that I can tell, so I wonder what will be done.
From what I read - I don't have a new Macbook / Pro - that people that had an external monitor hooked up to prior generation Macbooks/Pros, when they went to the new one, the exact same setup would not allow the playing of DVDs to the external monitor, which worked with the prior, non-DRM enabled DVI port. The display port-DVI adaptor does not go around this "feature.
I have no first hand knowledge of this, however. Does anyone out there have this info? I think it would be a critical issue in moving to a display port enabled computer.
Don't bet on dual displays. The Power Mac G4 once had dual connectors but only one could be used at a time.
I think DisplayPort copy protection will allow iTunes to offer HD movies on the Mac, which are currently only on the AppleTV which has copy-protected HDMI. Apple has updated Quicktime to not impose copy protection on standard-definition video output.
I wonder if Apple will switch the power connector to a Magsafe so customers could use the magsafe built into the LED Cinema Display? That would also give customers an iSight cam, more USB ports, and speakers as well.
How much power does the current Mac Mini draw? Pairing the new Mac Mini with the new display would be ideal as the current Mac Mini power-brick is external, and will likely still remain external if Apple does wish to keep the size done. It also pushes the combo purchase. I suspect we'll see a smaller and larger display show up at this final MWSF.
Note: If a MagSafe connector (or an adapter for a MagSafe connector) is not included with the new Mac Mini, that the speakers, iSight, Mic, and additional USB port would still work as those are separate plugs.
PS: Is the consensus that FW400 will be dropped from the Mac Mini, left how it is, are we to assume that FW800 will be included instead of FW400?
This would be my expectation. Otherwise Apple went to a lot of effort on the current display design, if it could not also power the Mini. I would fully expect the new mini to visually complement the new display as well, otherwise Apple is smoking something...
Would you really want a MagSafe adapter on your Mini though? The laptops are battery powered - if the power cable comes out they keep going. If your Mini's power cable is disconnected, you lose what you're working on and potentially fry your hard disk.
(on a side note: now that MagSafe has been invented, I don't trip over my power cable like I used to. I always trip over USB and Ethernet cables instead, meaning the machine still ends up crashing to the ground)
Don't bet on dual displays. The Power Mac G4 once had dual connectors but only one could be used at a time.
I have 2 Powermac G4 mirror door machines - one single, one dual processor, with the ATI video card with 2 connectors, the ADC, and a DVI. Both of these machines are hooked up to dual displays - and Apple studio monitor, and a 19 inch LCD. It works perfectly.
I find this story hard to believe. If Apple were so concerned about letting people use their current monitors, they'd throw in a Mini DisplayPort-to-DVI (or Dual-Link DVI). The Mac mini has never had multiple video outputs and I don't see that changing now.
While they might want their cheapest Mac to be more transitional with other monitors, an adapter is all that is needed and Apple is not a company that encourages you to use to old hat equipment. DisplayPort supports multiple monitors so even a single port on the back of the Mini could be used for dual displays.
The only way this rings true for me is if Apple is repositioning the Mac Mini to target a separate market segment. That would probably mean that the price would go up considerably if they are really focusing on customers who want small desktops that can run 2x30" displays, but I can't think of any that would be big enough to warrant Apple's attention.
(on a side note: now that MagSafe has been invented, I don't trip over my power cable like I used to. I always trip over USB and Ethernet cables instead, meaning the machine still ends up crashing to the ground)
You must have long USB cables. Why are you using Ethernet when you have WiFi?
If Firewire goes away, has anyone come up with an alternative to Target Disk Mode? I have had to use target disk mode many times, particularly on development machines, to recover from some screw up. Time machine is a poor substitute, as you can't boot from TM. Carbon Copy Cloner, Superduper and iBackup, all allow the creation of bootable backups, but can you keep these bootable images current? I guess you would need to do both TM and a disk image to account for lack of Firewire. Target disk mode is just such a powerful tool, it is a shame that it does away with Firewire, and has no replacement.
As the Macbook sans Firewire has been out there a couple months, has anyone addressed this limitation??
Would you really want a MagSafe adapter on your Mini though? The laptops are battery powered - if the power cable comes out they keep going. If your Mini's power cable is disconnected, you lose what you're working on and potentially fry your hard disk.
(on a side note: now that MagSafe has been invented, I don't trip over my power cable like I used to. I always trip over USB and Ethernet cables instead, meaning the machine still ends up crashing to the ground)
It would only a very simple clip over the MagSafe to keep it firmly attached. The use of the MagSafe would be to encourage more ADC sales to simplfy setup; the use of the actual magnet is irrelevant. However, I think Apple would be more likely to use a normal power connector port and then offer or include an adapter that would secure the Magsafe connector to the adapter, which is attached to the Mac Mini.
One other note: USB is NOT a fully functional replacement for Firewire. It is kinda like the difference between ATA and SCSI drive interfaces - they both allow data transfer, but one is dumb, and the other has a great deal of intelligence.
USB is a non-intelligent interface - compared to Firewire. The control capabilities of a Firewire interface are why that almost every camcorder has a FW interface, that works, regardless of the software. USB camcorders require specific software written for the camcorder to deal with the lack of intelligence in the interface.
Users look at basic specs. USB specs faster, but real world testing always show Firewire to support faster data transfer. Intelligence counts, in both Firewire and SCSI, and the decline of both will be a step backwards for technology flexibility and usability.
As the Macbook sans Firewire has been out there a couple months, has anyone addressed this limitation??
While nowhere near as simple, all you need is to remove the now very easy HDDs from the new Mac notebooks, sans the MBA and then mount the drives on a working machine. I think the MB has one screw and the MBP four screws. More tedious and you need to have both the cable and an external enclosure or connector.
...are why that almost every camcorder has a FW interface...
We've found that not to be true after the loss of FW on new MacBooks and Jobs reply to an angry Mac user. While this is true for DV cams, they show to be fading away in favour of tapeless recorders.
Comments
So where's the surprise?
As has been reported elsewhere, the display port on the new Macbook's is DRM "enabled", restricting the ability to play DVDs, or instance, on an external display.
If this is the case on the new Mac Mini, one of the prime uses for the mini as a media center will go away.
The DRM you are talking about is HDCP. It does not (or shouldn't) restrict playing dvd or any other SD media. Having HDCP gives the mini the chance to have a blu-ray drive added, or itunes HD movies to be played, both of which would enhance the mini as an entertainment device.
HDCP may be stupid, but if you want high definition video, your hardware has to support it, as the studios wont let you watch it any other way.
I wonder if Apple will switch the power connector to a Magsafe so customers could use the magsafe built into the LED Cinema Display? That would also give customers an iSight cam, more USB ports, and speakers as well.
This would be my expectation. Otherwise Apple went to a lot of effort on the current display design, if it could not also power the Mini. I would fully expect the new mini to visually complement the new display as well, otherwise Apple is smoking something...
How many mini DisplayPort monitors are on the market? The Mac Mini is targeted to people that have existing displays (and mice and keyboards). The Mini DVI is to serve that need, and the DisplayPort is there to allow use of such a monitor in the future, yielding flexibility in monitor choice. This makes perfect sense. Whether this will support two displays being driven at the same time is a separate feature.
It's a simple cable adapter to get you a DVI-out from mini Display Port. Probably not get you dual-DVI though.
The Mini is used in a huge variety of applications and a great number of those require analog video. Putting mini-dp into VGA, component or s-video would be near impossible. However, people will also need to drive high-end Cinema displays so having both covers all options and there is enough room.
There is also a simple cable adapter to get you analog outputs, at least for VGA. I wouldn't be surprised if the analog circuitry could do analog TV outputs too, it may be a matter of enabling support and getting a cable adapter.
DisplayPort supports multiple monitors by means of daisy-chaining, so this is clearly aimed at comforting switchers rather than enabling dual monitor support.
I don't know about comforting switchers, though it's one nice side-effect. I wonder how many people that would buy a $600 computer would be going dual-head. I know I would but I'd think I would be in the minority. Apple's current display doesn't support chaining that I can tell, so I wonder what will be done.
I have no first hand knowledge of this, however. Does anyone out there have this info? I think it would be a critical issue in moving to a display port enabled computer.
I think DisplayPort copy protection will allow iTunes to offer HD movies on the Mac, which are currently only on the AppleTV which has copy-protected HDMI. Apple has updated Quicktime to not impose copy protection on standard-definition video output.
I wonder if Apple will switch the power connector to a Magsafe so customers could use the magsafe built into the LED Cinema Display? That would also give customers an iSight cam, more USB ports, and speakers as well.
How much power does the current Mac Mini draw? Pairing the new Mac Mini with the new display would be ideal as the current Mac Mini power-brick is external, and will likely still remain external if Apple does wish to keep the size done. It also pushes the combo purchase. I suspect we'll see a smaller and larger display show up at this final MWSF.
Note: If a MagSafe connector (or an adapter for a MagSafe connector) is not included with the new Mac Mini, that the speakers, iSight, Mic, and additional USB port would still work as those are separate plugs.
PS: Is the consensus that FW400 will be dropped from the Mac Mini, left how it is, are we to assume that FW800 will be included instead of FW400?
This would be my expectation. Otherwise Apple went to a lot of effort on the current display design, if it could not also power the Mini. I would fully expect the new mini to visually complement the new display as well, otherwise Apple is smoking something...
Would you really want a MagSafe adapter on your Mini though? The laptops are battery powered - if the power cable comes out they keep going. If your Mini's power cable is disconnected, you lose what you're working on and potentially fry your hard disk.
(on a side note: now that MagSafe has been invented, I don't trip over my power cable like I used to. I always trip over USB and Ethernet cables instead, meaning the machine still ends up crashing to the ground)
Don't bet on dual displays. The Power Mac G4 once had dual connectors but only one could be used at a time.
I have 2 Powermac G4 mirror door machines - one single, one dual processor, with the ATI video card with 2 connectors, the ADC, and a DVI. Both of these machines are hooked up to dual displays - and Apple studio monitor, and a 19 inch LCD. It works perfectly.
Apple is not one for doing such a thing. If they were to do anything like this, it would be 2 mini-display ports for maximum accessory add-on.
I find this story hard to believe. If Apple were so concerned about letting people use their current monitors, they'd throw in a Mini DisplayPort-to-DVI (or Dual-Link DVI). The Mac mini has never had multiple video outputs and I don't see that changing now.
While they might want their cheapest Mac to be more transitional with other monitors, an adapter is all that is needed and Apple is not a company that encourages you to use to old hat equipment. DisplayPort supports multiple monitors so even a single port on the back of the Mini could be used for dual displays.
The only way this rings true for me is if Apple is repositioning the Mac Mini to target a separate market segment. That would probably mean that the price would go up considerably if they are really focusing on customers who want small desktops that can run 2x30" displays, but I can't think of any that would be big enough to warrant Apple's attention.
(on a side note: now that MagSafe has been invented, I don't trip over my power cable like I used to. I always trip over USB and Ethernet cables instead, meaning the machine still ends up crashing to the ground)
You must have long USB cables. Why are you using Ethernet when you have WiFi?
As the Macbook sans Firewire has been out there a couple months, has anyone addressed this limitation??
Would you really want a MagSafe adapter on your Mini though? The laptops are battery powered - if the power cable comes out they keep going. If your Mini's power cable is disconnected, you lose what you're working on and potentially fry your hard disk.
(on a side note: now that MagSafe has been invented, I don't trip over my power cable like I used to. I always trip over USB and Ethernet cables instead, meaning the machine still ends up crashing to the ground)
It would only a very simple clip over the MagSafe to keep it firmly attached. The use of the MagSafe would be to encourage more ADC sales to simplfy setup; the use of the actual magnet is irrelevant. However, I think Apple would be more likely to use a normal power connector port and then offer or include an adapter that would secure the Magsafe connector to the adapter, which is attached to the Mac Mini.
USB is a non-intelligent interface - compared to Firewire. The control capabilities of a Firewire interface are why that almost every camcorder has a FW interface, that works, regardless of the software. USB camcorders require specific software written for the camcorder to deal with the lack of intelligence in the interface.
Users look at basic specs. USB specs faster, but real world testing always show Firewire to support faster data transfer. Intelligence counts, in both Firewire and SCSI, and the decline of both will be a step backwards for technology flexibility and usability.
As the Macbook sans Firewire has been out there a couple months, has anyone addressed this limitation??
While nowhere near as simple, all you need is to remove the now very easy HDDs from the new Mac notebooks, sans the MBA and then mount the drives on a working machine. I think the MB has one screw and the MBP four screws. More tedious and you need to have both the cable and an external enclosure or connector.
...are why that almost every camcorder has a FW interface...
We've found that not to be true after the loss of FW on new MacBooks and Jobs reply to an angry Mac user. While this is true for DV cams, they show to be fading away in favour of tapeless recorders.