Yep, that's what you call freedom. People died for the few freedoms we have left; at the very least we should be willing to fight as well. I wish one of these big companies would get a bit patriotic and fight the government for once. They all just seem to bend over and take everything. Ever heard of the rights to the fruits of your labor?
Um, yeah, it's the corporations that have had to "bend over and take everything" lately. Especially the past eight years, thanks to Bush and his dreadful anti-corporate policies.
To equate Apple's wish to have another concrete and glass store with the freedoms our soldiers died for is insulting to their memory.
As for the lack of a Georgetown Metro station... it's probably a mix of logistical concerns and subtle racism/class bias at the time. I've read that they sure wish they had a Metro stop these days though. Their only hope of getting one is to move the Blue line north to also include places like National Cathedral, but that would take 20 years if they started the process today.
Yep, that's what you call freedom. People died for the few freedoms we have left; at the very least we should be willing to fight as well. I wish one of these big companies would get a bit patriotic and fight the government for once. They all just seem to bend over and take everything. Ever heard of the rights to the fruits of your labor?
how is this different to saying i wish the public would get a bit patriotic and fight the big companies for once, this is a LOCAL government who want to protect their interests from anyone who tries to change it, especially big lookalike corporate entities.
i think the freedoms you speak of are exactly what the local board is excersizing.
isn't it usually the public bending over and taking everything when big companies move in?
your argument seems quite in favour of the local board having their say against a big company.
It's a community - THEY decide what their interests are.
As a previous poster noted, this is the community that prevented a Metro stop from being built. The upshot of that is that not just their community is affected, but all the people for 10-30 miles around who get to be stuck in traffic a little longer each morning and evening behind Georgetown commuters who would have taken mass transit but could not. That is a prime example of local selfish interests affecting people far away. And that is why local communities should NOT always be allowed to decide what their interests are--they literally do not always know or do what is best.
And that is why local communities should NOT always be allowed to decide what their interests are--they literally do not always know or do what is best.
If I were Apple I'd just sell the building higher than you bought it for and take their potential tax dollars elsewhere. Its not like Apple doesn't have any stores in the DC area anyways. Piss on DC...that area blows anyways!
They want Apple to pay taxes on a building that they won't let them do what they want? I'm sure the taxes will be paid once Apple gets its way with what it wants to do with it. Its nice to know you can own land and not be able to do what you want with it... Makes be proud to live in America! *end sarcasm*
So Apple is trying to blackmail the city into accepting their plans? That's what I'd be disturbed about. Seems like the city should have recourse to compulsorily acquire their rates somehow. For a corporation with billions of cash there's just no excuse from Apple.
I love Apple but I think we should all be aware of "Apple evangelists" that blindly side with Apple no matter what they do. It gives the rest of us fans a bad name. We need to demand the best from Apple in exchange for our loyalty and not tolerate malpractice.
Couldn't agree with you more. I doubt Georgetown really cares about bending to make Apple happy. Plenty of other very high end stores there have blended in. I'm sure failing to pay their taxes hasn't greased any skids either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetzel1517
The U.S. is in an economic downturn, but Georgetown isn't. It's very affluent and populated by DC's old money and a bunch of trust fund-fed college students -- a retailers' dream. So the community has no incentive to lower its standards for Apple or anyone else. (Besides that, I don't think anyone is blaming the economic downturn on land use and zoning regulations, so it's a non sequiter argument anyway.)
Georgetown has a very distinctive look -- even the freaking Johnny Rockets looks like it belongs there. I don't see why Apple couldn't just do what it did with the SoHo store: keep the architecture in theme with the surroundings and hang an Apple sign off the doorway. Not everything has to be a concrete and glass cube with a big glowing white Apple.
So Apple is trying to blackmail the city into accepting their plans
They have been to the board three times. Sounds like they are trying to adapt their plans.
Quote:
Seems like the city should have recourse to compulsorily acquire their rates somehow.
If they really wanted to, the city could file a lien against the property or even sue. However, they are not that shortsighted or hard up for cash. They know the store will likely be be built and generate a lot of revenue for the city.
This (getting rejected first few times) is pretty common for companies moving into very well established (eg: upscale and old) areas.
This country was founded on freedom and liberty. Property rights are a big part of that. A group of land owners has no claim to someone else's property. They don't own it. If they want a say in what is done with it, they should buy it. So the people of Georgetown may loose out on having an apple store. And as far as what somebody said about developing countries communities looking bad and nonuniform, that's your opinion as a third party observer. But each one of those home owners fixed their home the way they wanted it. They own it. It's theirs now yours. That train of thought; third parities preempting individuals preferences is socialism. The only reason we have apple is capitalism. I hope they drop the store in Georgetown and walk away.
On the lower end of Cape Cod Mass., committees won't allow a McDonalds or any other chain. The only exception that I can think of is a Dunkin' Donuts that was established a few years ago in Eastham. DD had to fight for years to get the smallest DD location I've ever been too (its literally a hole in the wall), and is the only DD not allowed to cook anything, ANYTHING. (No toasted bagel for you!) I'm surprised they allow them to serve hot coffee! Nevertheless, being raised on the lower Cape (my parents still have their home there) I would hate to see it's character and vibe wrecked by not having any oversight.
That being said, Apple did manage to get approval and then built an awesome building that I think looks very nice on historical Boylston Street in Boston.
This is NOT Apple's first DC-area store, just the first one in DC. The first DC-area store was at Tyson's Corner, which opened in 2001. The others are at Fair Oaks Mall, Pentagon City Mall, Montgomery Mall, Bethesda Row, Columbia Mall, and on Clarendon Blvd in Arlington. The store in DC will be the eighth DC-area store, not the first.
DC is one of the worst areas for NIMBYs that I have ever lived in. I am not at all surprised that some of the "I'm scared" crowd in Georgetown is afraid of a building that doesn't look like all the other buildings.
As a previous poster noted, this is the community that prevented a Metro stop from being built. The upshot of that is that not just their community is affected, but all the people for 10-30 miles around who get to be stuck in traffic a little longer each morning and evening behind Georgetown commuters who would have taken mass transit but could not. That is a prime example of local selfish interests affecting people far away. And that is why local communities should NOT always be allowed to decide what their interests are--they literally do not always know or do what is best.
Can we put an end to this myth that Georgetown killed Metro to Georgetown. Metro killed Metro to Georgetown before Georgetown even say a thing. It would have been way expensive to build a station in that hilly area right next to the Potomac, without wrecking the many historic buildings, but with little gain for what people originally envisioned that subway to be, a commuter light rail taking people from the far suburbs to the Federal and Downtown core. Building a station in Georgetown probably would have made it harder to build stations in the Golden Triangle, which is a big employment district. (Farragut Square, McPherson Square, with K Street being there). Georgetown then was essentially a rich suburb that was in DC limits. You can argue that that was a big mistake, but that was the Metro planner's mistake. Not Georgetown's.
I think the real reason why there is no metro station in Georgetown is that the construction of the tunnel and the station, as well as the vibration from the trains, combined with the local geology, would have caused too much structural damage to the buildings. Of course, if you are Kevin Kostner in the movie No Way Out, you can use the fictitious metro station in the Georgetown Mall.
Panu beat me to the punch on this, but the book The Great Society Subway goes into greater detail.
If Georgetown did manage to get a station cancelled (I think the book is wrong on this), the location would probably something closer to the Watergate complex than actual Georgetown.
I wonder if anybody else sees the irony here with some of us criticizing Georgetown for wanting to uphold a consistent look and feel for buildings in their district, when we argue that this is one of the greatest strengths of Apple software itself.
There was a very wealthy old lady in georgetown that wanted a swimming pool. She couldn't have one because of the strict zoning there, so she hired people to quietly dig one in her basement by hand, bag by bag of dirt. An instance of the mega rich buying their way around regulations intended to keep the tasteless newly rich from crudding up an old-money neighborhood.
Georgetowners also didn't care to have the plebians arriving by public transport so they didn't allow a metro to be built. It's kept their area very elite, but horribly traffic congested, which is the law of unintended consequences. Georgetown is beautiful and quiet off of M street, which is a wasteland of chain stores shoehorned into tasteful georgian (red brick, white trim) buildings.
I do think that Apple should respect the character of the area, silly as it is.
Comments
Yep, that's what you call freedom. People died for the few freedoms we have left; at the very least we should be willing to fight as well. I wish one of these big companies would get a bit patriotic and fight the government for once. They all just seem to bend over and take everything. Ever heard of the rights to the fruits of your labor?
http://www.carolinaliberty.com
Um, yeah, it's the corporations that have had to "bend over and take everything" lately. Especially the past eight years, thanks to Bush and his dreadful anti-corporate policies.
To equate Apple's wish to have another concrete and glass store with the freedoms our soldiers died for is insulting to their memory.
As for the lack of a Georgetown Metro station... it's probably a mix of logistical concerns and subtle racism/class bias at the time. I've read that they sure wish they had a Metro stop these days though. Their only hope of getting one is to move the Blue line north to also include places like National Cathedral, but that would take 20 years if they started the process today.
Yep, that's what you call freedom. People died for the few freedoms we have left; at the very least we should be willing to fight as well. I wish one of these big companies would get a bit patriotic and fight the government for once. They all just seem to bend over and take everything. Ever heard of the rights to the fruits of your labor?
how is this different to saying i wish the public would get a bit patriotic and fight the big companies for once, this is a LOCAL government who want to protect their interests from anyone who tries to change it, especially big lookalike corporate entities.
i think the freedoms you speak of are exactly what the local board is excersizing.
isn't it usually the public bending over and taking everything when big companies move in?
your argument seems quite in favour of the local board having their say against a big company.
It's a community - THEY decide what their interests are.
As a previous poster noted, this is the community that prevented a Metro stop from being built. The upshot of that is that not just their community is affected, but all the people for 10-30 miles around who get to be stuck in traffic a little longer each morning and evening behind Georgetown commuters who would have taken mass transit but could not. That is a prime example of local selfish interests affecting people far away. And that is why local communities should NOT always be allowed to decide what their interests are--they literally do not always know or do what is best.
And that is why local communities should NOT always be allowed to decide what their interests are--they literally do not always know or do what is best.
while this is true what is the alternative?
They want Apple to pay taxes on a building that they won't let them do what they want? I'm sure the taxes will be paid once Apple gets its way with what it wants to do with it. Its nice to know you can own land and not be able to do what you want with it... Makes be proud to live in America! *end sarcasm*
So Apple is trying to blackmail the city into accepting their plans? That's what I'd be disturbed about. Seems like the city should have recourse to compulsorily acquire their rates somehow. For a corporation with billions of cash there's just no excuse from Apple.
I love Apple but I think we should all be aware of "Apple evangelists" that blindly side with Apple no matter what they do. It gives the rest of us fans a bad name. We need to demand the best from Apple in exchange for our loyalty and not tolerate malpractice.
The U.S. is in an economic downturn, but Georgetown isn't. It's very affluent and populated by DC's old money and a bunch of trust fund-fed college students -- a retailers' dream. So the community has no incentive to lower its standards for Apple or anyone else. (Besides that, I don't think anyone is blaming the economic downturn on land use and zoning regulations, so it's a non sequiter argument anyway.)
Georgetown has a very distinctive look -- even the freaking Johnny Rockets looks like it belongs there. I don't see why Apple couldn't just do what it did with the SoHo store: keep the architecture in theme with the surroundings and hang an Apple sign off the doorway. Not everything has to be a concrete and glass cube with a big glowing white Apple.
So Apple is trying to blackmail the city into accepting their plans
They have been to the board three times. Sounds like they are trying to adapt their plans.
Seems like the city should have recourse to compulsorily acquire their rates somehow.
If they really wanted to, the city could file a lien against the property or even sue. However, they are not that shortsighted or hard up for cash. They know the store will likely be be built and generate a lot of revenue for the city.
This (getting rejected first few times) is pretty common for companies moving into very well established (eg: upscale and old) areas.
That being said, Apple did manage to get approval and then built an awesome building that I think looks very nice on historical Boylston Street in Boston.
This is NOT Apple's first DC-area store, just the first one in DC. The first DC-area store was at Tyson's Corner, which opened in 2001. The others are at Fair Oaks Mall, Pentagon City Mall, Montgomery Mall, Bethesda Row, Columbia Mall, and on Clarendon Blvd in Arlington. The store in DC will be the eighth DC-area store, not the first.
I want the right to force all ugly people to get plastic surgery (on their dime, to my beauty specifications).
Guess you better make an appointment with a plastic surgeon then.....
As a previous poster noted, this is the community that prevented a Metro stop from being built. The upshot of that is that not just their community is affected, but all the people for 10-30 miles around who get to be stuck in traffic a little longer each morning and evening behind Georgetown commuters who would have taken mass transit but could not. That is a prime example of local selfish interests affecting people far away. And that is why local communities should NOT always be allowed to decide what their interests are--they literally do not always know or do what is best.
Can we put an end to this myth that Georgetown killed Metro to Georgetown. Metro killed Metro to Georgetown before Georgetown even say a thing. It would have been way expensive to build a station in that hilly area right next to the Potomac, without wrecking the many historic buildings, but with little gain for what people originally envisioned that subway to be, a commuter light rail taking people from the far suburbs to the Federal and Downtown core. Building a station in Georgetown probably would have made it harder to build stations in the Golden Triangle, which is a big employment district. (Farragut Square, McPherson Square, with K Street being there). Georgetown then was essentially a rich suburb that was in DC limits. You can argue that that was a big mistake, but that was the Metro planner's mistake. Not Georgetown's.
I think the real reason why there is no metro station in Georgetown is that the construction of the tunnel and the station, as well as the vibration from the trains, combined with the local geology, would have caused too much structural damage to the buildings. Of course, if you are Kevin Kostner in the movie No Way Out, you can use the fictitious metro station in the Georgetown Mall.
Panu beat me to the punch on this, but the book The Great Society Subway goes into greater detail.
If Georgetown did manage to get a station cancelled (I think the book is wrong on this), the location would probably something closer to the Watergate complex than actual Georgetown.
Georgetowners also didn't care to have the plebians arriving by public transport so they didn't allow a metro to be built. It's kept their area very elite, but horribly traffic congested, which is the law of unintended consequences. Georgetown is beautiful and quiet off of M street, which is a wasteland of chain stores shoehorned into tasteful georgian (red brick, white trim) buildings.
I do think that Apple should respect the character of the area, silly as it is.