Andy Ihnatko's rumor might be true after all..

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  • Reply 61 of 487
    dave k.dave k. Posts: 1,306member
    Beyond the rumor sites. Way beyond...



    This is all a bunch of crap guys... Andy probably get excited over the new iLife packaging. There is nothing here that hasn't been discussed before. Even if Apple does come out with something really cool, it will cost a bundle...
  • Reply 62 of 487
    I respectfully disagree. Ebooks have very limited market penetration and newspapers are dying a slow, painful, agonizing death. Jobs and Apple are too forward looking to embrace old media.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hassan i Sabbah View Post


    Ebook / ejournal reader. Books store. Deals with newspapers.



    If I am right I am a genius.



  • Reply 63 of 487
    phongphong Posts: 219member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    The real problem (for the Mac fan base, at least) is that Apple isn't judged by what they actually do but by how far they fall short of completely baseless imagining.



    An updated Mac Mini or other decent headless Mac is not baseless. It's the very definition of base. That's why I said, if they can't do it, nothing else matters.



    Quote:

    So we've got a bunch of "Apple enthusiasts" who are forever in a state of semi-outrage that Apple "refused" to make made up product x, or is "falling hopelessly behind" because they didn't jump into product segment y (despite the fact that we were very clear that we really wanted them to!), or is "resting on their laurels" because some product refresh hasn't occurred when the internet decides it should.



    This may have been the case with previous Macworlds, but significantly less so with this one. I haven't accused Apple of any of these things. They're clearly busy, creating tremendous value for people who like using mobile computers and devices. The IMacs are still decent and even the Mac Pros are not so bad after a year. Pro buyers usually find a way to get special configurations. The Mini on the other hand has not been updated during the length of time where now the same amount of money should buy two Mini's.



    Set aside the nearly decade-long vacancy of any mid-range headless Mac, something that before Jobs was the company's bread and butter. When was the last one, the G4 cube? Maybe it doesn't have as a big a market as the iMacs. Maybe the market has changed since then, with the fact that now every HDTV is a computer monitor. Whatever. Whether it's low, mid, or hi range, the company doesn't seem interested in making headless Macs anymore. That used to be practically all they made.



    If you ask me, Apple's crazier than your depiction of its fan base.
  • Reply 64 of 487
    murkmurk Posts: 935member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    All I have to say right here is I heard some info that Apple will deliver something amazing.






    Oh my God! They've leaked to Marvin, too!
  • Reply 65 of 487
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,665member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Phong View Post


    An updated Mac Mini or other decent headless Mac is not baseless. It's the very definition of base. That's why I said, if they can't do it, nothing else matters.







    This may have been the case with previous Macworlds, but significantly less so with this one. I haven't accused Apple of any of these things. They're clearly busy, creating tremendous value for people who like using mobile computers and devices. The IMacs are still decent and even the Mac Pros are not so bad after a year. Pro buyers usually find a way to get special configurations. The Mini on the other hand has not been updated during the length of time where now the same amount of money should buy two Mini's.



    Set aside the nearly decade-long vacancy of any mid-range headless Mac, something that before Jobs was the company's bread and butter. When was the last one, the G4 cube? Maybe it doesn't have as a big a market as the iMacs. Maybe the market has changed since then, with the fact that now every HDTV is a computer monitor. Whatever. Whether it's low, mid, or hi range, the company doesn't seem interested in making headless Macs anymore. That used to be practically all they made.



    If you ask me, Apple's crazier than your depiction of its fan base.



    I wasn't specifically rebutting you, by any means.



    And I would make a distinction between the perennial, and perfectly reasonable, things that a good number of long term Apple users pine away for (Xmac, a real replacement for the 12" Powerbook, an easy to upgrade Mini, etc.) and the kind of "I thought Apple was supposed to be releasing super cool new thing at this Macworld/WWDC/event, but they didn't, now I'm bummed, WTF, Apple?" thinking I'm talking about.



    Hope springs eternal, and Apple may or may not get around to fulfilling the desires of some of its users. Whether or not Apple is making a serious mistake by not offering an Xmac is a long standing debate, and there will always be good arguments on either side as to why or why not that would be the right thing to do; but that's a different order of business from latching onto highly unlikely blue-sky thinking (which is what this thread is all about, after all) and then being mad at Apple when they don't amaze us with something completely new.



    Which, after all, they only do once in a blue moon. The rest is incremental advancements on the existing product line, or largely cosmetic form factor changes. Which, outside of the demands of the semi-crazed, isn't really that bad a thing.
  • Reply 66 of 487
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FuturePastNow View Post


    I don't know if he's accurate or not, but the sound of his voice (on the Macbreak Weekly podcast) makes me want to punch him.



    Yes, he's verbose, but he's also in tune with the Apple community.
  • Reply 67 of 487
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 15,358moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by murk View Post


    Oh my God! They've leaked to Marvin, too!



    Yeah but keep the zero information that I've given under your hat, what I was told was top secret. All I'll say is that you'll know when it comes. The way that you'll know when it's arrived is that something will arrive during the time you are expecting something.



    Plus if it turns out to be what you've been waiting for then you'll be glad you waited for it.



    I think I'm going to start writing horoscopes.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Phong


    Whether it's low, mid, or hi range, the company doesn't seem interested in making headless Macs anymore. That used to be practically all they made.



    I think this is the problem though. Back then, they weren't doing so well. They made the changes and now they are doing much better. I don't think it's the strategy change that has made the difference but Apple can't seem to look past the sales figures. Perhaps they needed the gimmicks at first to get people on board but now they are well established with a stable product catalog. Right now, they don't need the gimmicks any more and people are starting to look for more value in the brand for serious work and find it lacking. Companies like Psystar know this and are trying to capitalize on it.



    The iphone has similar issues. It had that initial wow factor like the iMac but people are trying to use it for business and they find no copy/paste, some sluggish performance. They are minor things by contrast but they are things that it's in Apple's best interests to improve and they haven't done it yet despite the simplicity.



    Macs need to move into businesses at some point in time. It doesn't matter how slim they make the machines, AIOs with isight cameras aren't going to work and businesses cannot buy every worker a Mac Pro. As I've said before, the mini-tower Dell computers sell very well in businesses. Very easy to service and are cost-effective. The Mini is the computer to do it but it just needs to be designed better for this purpose. If that means a different model then that's what needs to be made.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox


    a real replacement for the 12" Powerbook



    I saw the aluminium Macbook recently and I'd almost strike that off the list. With a matte option like the 17" model, I'd be happy with one of those having owned a 12" powerbook.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox


    The rest is incremental advancements on the existing product line



    That's what we've been expecting though and they haven't come through on that so the possibility is there for them to be listening to what we want. Our expectations likely won't be met as usual. I use an analogy:



    Burns: I suggest you leave immediately.



    Homer: Or what? You’ll release the dogs, or the bees, or the dogs with bees in their mouths and when they bark they shoot bees at you? Well, go ahead—do your worst!



    Homer: He locked the door! I’ll show him—rings the doorbell and runs away




    Apple have shown that they will do what they want when they want no matter how underwhelming and annoying. If it's intentional then it's a stupid attitude to take as Sony have discovered. Fortunately for them, Apple seem to do things in such a way that people keep coming back for more pain and they just give a little boost of goodness every few years.



    1984 Mac boost ...... fading ..... 1998 Jobs + iMac boost ..... fading ..... 2001 ipod boost ..... fading ..... 2007 iphone boost



    Right now they are still riding the iphone wave but as technology reaches saturation point, the waves die down more quickly. Nowadays you can't just do one amazing thing every few years. Look at Sony's last expo. They've realized they need to start delivering the goods and they had loads of stuff to demo. Despite not having any intention of buying Sony products soon, my interest in them is higher right now than with Apple. I've reached a point where I'm bored waiting on them to do something without telling anyone.
  • Reply 68 of 487
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,665member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    That's what we've been expecting though and they haven't come through on that so the possibility is there for them to be listening to what we want. Our expectations likely won't be met as usual. I use an analogy:



    Burns: I suggest you leave immediately.



    Homer: Or what? You?ll release the dogs, or the bees, or the dogs with bees in their mouths and when they bark they shoot bees at you? Well, go ahead?do your worst!



    Homer: He locked the door! I?ll show him?rings the doorbell and runs away




    One of my favorite exchanges on the Simpsons of all time.



    Quote:

    Apple have shown that they will do what they want when they want no matter how underwhelming and annoying. If it's intentional then it's a stupid attitude to take as Sony have discovered. Fortunately for them, Apple seem to do things in such a way that people keep coming back for more pain and they just give a little boost of goodness every few years.



    1984 Mac boost ...... fading ..... 1998 Jobs + iMac boost ..... fading ..... 2001 ipod boost ..... fading ..... 2007 iphone boost



    Right now they are still riding the iphone wave but as technology reaches saturation point, the waves die down more quickly. Nowadays you can't just do one amazing thing every few years. Look at Sony's last expo. They've realized they need to start delivering the goods and they had loads of stuff to demo. Despite not having any intention of buying Sony products soon, my interest in them is higher right now than with Apple. I've reached a point where I'm bored waiting on them to do something without telling anyone.



    Maybe, but you have to distinguish between internet buzz and sales. By sales measures, Apple appears to be doing everything right.



    Now it's possible that they've peaked, or entered a period of slow decline, or have lost the mojo, or gotten arrogant and out of touch, or something. I guess we'll see over the next year or so. Lower sales overall won't be a good measure, though, because the entire industry is contracting, so we'll have to continue to watch market share.



    My feeling, though, is that Apple is playing a long game, and that that sometimes runs counter to the expectations of tech enthusiasts, who always want the new hotness yesterday, or believe that manufacturers must adopt the features they want or face ruin.



    I don't think most computer and CE consumers think in terms of being "bored" with a company that isn't constantly cranking out wonders. They go shopping for what they need or want when they need or want it, and see what's available. Apple has done a great job of increasing their mindshare, so more and more people are likely to check out what they have to offer.



    What they don't do is say "well, this iMac here, or iPhone, or whatever, hasn't been radically changed in a while, how tedious, who else has something to sell?" Most folks don't even compare specs, beyond some basic buzz word compliance.



    If you're already a Mac user, it's fairly unlikely that the lack of a refreshed Mini at the time you were looking to buy is going to send you PC-wards, although I'm sure that happens sometimes. I just don't think it happens enough to put a dent in Apples sales.
  • Reply 69 of 487
    vineavinea Posts: 5,585member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    I've reached a point where I'm bored waiting on them to do something without telling anyone.



    So bored you're a moderator on an apple rumor site with 4000 posts in a thread about a rumor so vague is could cover anything from Apple releasing a new pair of headphones (whatever makes Andy grin) to acquiring $12B worth of tech company.



    "The mod doth protest too much, methinks."



    AppleInsider Act 3, scene 2, line 230
  • Reply 70 of 487
    phongphong Posts: 219member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


    I think this is the problem though. Back then, they weren't doing so well.



    There were a lot of reasons why they weren't doing so well, but compared to the following era, perhaps the biggest reason was that there was no such thing as a consumer laptop. When the iBook was released, that's when the Mac started appearing mainstream. Didn't Jobs say back in October that more low-end Macbooks have been sold than any other Mac in history? The other big volume sellers are also consumer mobile devices.



    So maybe there's a paradigm shift in the way computing is done and Apple was able to grow by being there with the best products at the best price. Maybe jobs is suspicious of the headless Mac as being an older paradigm. In a world of mobile computing, the Mac was the digital hub, and digital hubs have to have their own dedicated monitors.



    I don't know... I just want to be able to choose my own monitor. That's all. Why is that somehow more important to me and not to a bazillion other people.



    Instead of physical mobility, I want "monitor-mobility." I want to be able to hook it up to whatever I want. A 12" Cintiq for when I'm working and then the 52" Samsung when I'm not. Why not just get a MacBook, you say. Why spend another thousand dollars for a display I don't need, I say.



    I know, not everyone is a starving artist insatiable media enthusiast green product buyer living in a studio apartment, but however many there are in this world must surely be Mac users.
  • Reply 71 of 487
    MarvinMarvin Posts: 15,358moderator
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    My feeling, though, is that Apple is playing a long game, and that that sometimes runs counter to the expectations of tech enthusiasts, who always want the new hotness yesterday, or believe that manufacturers must adopt the features they want or face ruin.



    That does seem to be the case and it's quite obvious that computers will reach a point where the smaller computers are good enough. The current Macbook is probably good enough for most consumer use. The longer time goes on, the more that becomes true. For the past 2 years though, it hasn't been and the prices are still high.



    Right now, PC towers make Apple's deals look terrible. Quad cores including display and dedicated graphics for 2/3rds the cost of a base dual core iMac. The only thing I've bought from Apple in 3 years is an iphone. I've been saving up for a mid-range desktop and they won't get the money until they offer one. So although I'm a Mac user, Apple are technically losing a sale.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    If you're already a Mac user, it's fairly unlikely that the lack of a refreshed Mini at the time you were looking to buy is going to send you PC-wards, although I'm sure that happens sometimes. I just don't think it happens enough to put a dent in Apples sales.



    I don't know because it's very hard to count a non-sale. If Apple don't offer the products that some people want, they won't buy them and Apple will never know the sales they lose.



    The PC market will be making very cheap Core i7 desktop boxes, if they aren't already cheap. If all that comes out soon is Core 2 duo Minis with 9400M and Core 2 quad iMacs and Gainestown Mac Pros at the same price points as now, I will be looking at ways to buy an off-the-shelf Core i7 PC and put OS X on it. If they are too expensive like the Dell ones, I'll stick with the Mini and still pine for a quad version.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vinea


    So bored you're a moderator on an apple rumor site with 4000 posts in a thread about a rumor so vague is could cover anything from Apple releasing a new pair of headphones (whatever makes Andy grin) to acquiring $12B worth of tech company.



    I've become bored over the past 3 years. My interest was at its peak when they made the Intel switch and finally delivered great hardware. For the past 2 years, I've been venting my frustration at them ignoring their best computer model.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Phong


    Maybe jobs is suspicious of the headless Mac as being an older paradigm.



    Could be but they seem to love their Mac Pro. That's what I don't understand. They say it's an AIO world but their most premium machine is headless.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Phong


    I know, not everyone is a starving artist insatiable media enthusiast green product buyer living in a studio apartment, but however many there are in this world must surely be Mac users.



    Most probably want to be Mac users but Apple doesn't cater for them.



    The Cintiq is an interesting example. Another situation for someone who needs more power than the current Mini but without having to pay for the display bundled with the iMac as well as keeping the desktop clear. Those people can probably afford the Mac Pro but so can I. I've been saving up so long, I can afford to buy a Mac Pro and a 21" Cintiq and more. But I'm not going to because I don't want a workstation at home.



    The Shuttle products are where I'd like to see Apple expand to but obviously much nicer looking. Their Core i7 Cube would be nice for Apple to match but a Core 2 quad would be enough.
  • Reply 72 of 487
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by tsukurite View Post


    I respectfully disagree. Ebooks have very limited market penetration and newspapers are dying a slow, painful, agonizing death. Jobs and Apple are too forward looking to embrace old media.



    Of course newspapers are dying, they have failed to grasp new technology and marketing methods. But that reality doesn't mean news its self will die. We will see something fill the void left by the old tech business. That may very well be news delivered on Apple tablets through subscriptions on app store.



    The problem of course is that news isn't free, at least the delivery of such isn't. So to replace ordinary newspapers we need a business model that can continue to pay the reporters, and keep the infrastructure to handle that news in place. Local news is the area where the national operations like Yahoo really fall down, thus I believe this is where the opportunity is.



    Dave
  • Reply 73 of 487
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,839member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Hudson1 View Post


    I'm having a hard time believing all of this "jaw-dropping" device stuff. If this is such an incredible thing and so secretly guarded, why would Apple see that a couple of outside people were told about it (a journalist no less)? If this really happened it wouldn't still be a secret.



    Its not uncommon for Apple to purposely throw out fake rumors. Its been done before...
  • Reply 74 of 487
    irelandireland Posts: 17,798member
    I have figured out what the big secret is!
  • Reply 75 of 487
    dave k.dave k. Posts: 1,306member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    I have figured out what the big secret is!



    I'll bite. What is it?
  • Reply 76 of 487
    irelandireland Posts: 17,798member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    I'll bite. What is it?



    I don't know if I should say, I'm only 95% sure. I think I'll wait to see how the Steve Jobs news plays out with the stock. Let's just say I'm going to be paying close attention to the stock first.
  • Reply 77 of 487
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post


    I'll bite. What is it?



    Iphone TINY



    It works by employing gamma frequency emitted from the human brain.



    So if you think about your mother for 10 sec, she will call. If you think your sister, she will call. Your ex and so on and so on.



    This will massively reduce our phone bill and be jaw dropping. SMASHING BABY
  • Reply 78 of 487
    irelandireland Posts: 17,798member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by haryanto2007 View Post


    Iphone TINY



    It's not an iPhone.
  • Reply 79 of 487
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    It's not an iPhone.



    New ITunes then....



    Macbook Mini , Macbook Tiny......





    All I can say is that our current predictions are all bogus.



    Somehow Apple knew that we wrote this rumors and play it against us.






    Called it Paranoia...We just become laughing stocks to Apple's team....
  • Reply 80 of 487
    irelandireland Posts: 17,798member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by haryanto2007 View Post


    Somehow Apple knew that we wrote this rumors and play it against us.



    Call it Paranoia...We just become laughing stocks to Apple's team....



    It is paranoia, you're were right there when you said that.
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