trying to get a higher post count? try adding something into the conversation next time. this adds nothing but noting that you are an apple fanboy, something htis site has plenty of (which is understandable, but still sad) not all sites that are designed to follow a single product have to be fanboy sites, i like the ones that are both critical and supportive personally.
It is interesting that when MS decides to make an DAP that is touch-based, such a vocal group of iPodders go into fanatic mode and bash them. YET, Cowon recently introduced their S9 and barely a peep was heard. Sony is about to release a similar device and again and I doubt anyone will go over-the-top in their complaints about Sony.
I really don't think this is about the Zune, but instead it is about MS. If someone else made the Zune, most folks who bash it wouldn't care, much less take the time to post about it.
I have owned iPods since my first 5GB model. I have also owned several other players: Zune, Cowon, Sony mp3, Sony minidisc, Sony HiMD, etc. All of these over the last 8 years. The simple fact is that they were all well built, they all played music well. Each had its strengths and weaknesses. What do I use now? A iPod Touch 16GB, a Sony A808 8GB flash, iPod Photo 60GB and a Zune 80GB.
Every one of these players is an excellent choice for a music lover. You may prefer a particular company, which is reasonable, but to bash another product and make baseless claims because you are a fanboy is not reasonable.
Will I get the Zune HD. Probably not, since MS has yet to add East Asian font support to the Zune. If they do, we will see. The Sony new X-series is next on my list simply because the Sony still sounds better than all the other players I have ever listened to (from the headphone jack).
For the time being, Apple has a 70%+ market share in portable music players with iPods and a 10%-15% (?) market share in smart phones with iPhones.
You might want to qualify that statement with "...in the U.S. ..." The iPod doesn't have the same following elsewhere in the U.S. Japan and Korea are prime examples.
It is interesting that when MS decides to make an DAP that is touch-based, such a vocal group of iPodders go into fanatic mode and bash them. YET, Cowon recently introduced their S9 and barely a peep was heard.
Probably because it's already been done, and done very well. At least well enough for the average consumer to not really care about them.
OK, just out of curiosity, what the fuck are you picture of a rectangle fans even talking about?
Fanboys "bashing" MS for their product? What product? If I don't agree that the picture of a rectangle is probably going to be awesome, it makes me an Apple apologist, or something?
The entire conversation is surreal, and seems to be mostly based on animosity towards Apple enthusiasts having the balls to be enthusiastic about Apple products on an Apple enthusiast site.
OK, look, sorry. I agree. The picture of a rectangle is amazing. If I weren't so caught up in my mindless Apple boosterism, that would be clear. The only reason I haven't been posting about what a great phone/MP3 player/secret mystery segment destroyer the picture of a rectangle is is because I'm terrified that MS is going to make the touch screen product they were always inevitably going to make, eventually, and have it run the non-touch friendly and not very popular and increasingly dated looking Windows Mobile, but, you know, with some Zune stuff on there which will obviously be totally awesome, on account of the bigger fonts, and sell it for Verizon, which very obviously will be hugely popular.
And then, at some point, it can run WinMob 7 which is obviously awesome and will be amazing and Apple had better watch out and I can barely go on, on account of the fear.
Changed around the dock connectors? How did they change around the dock connectors? I have a charge adapter from a 2004 iPod Mini (considered ancient by many at this point) and I use it interchangeably in my car with my iPhone.
They did something with the pins with last year's iDevices. There are plenty of reports of accessories not working. Some do and others don't. The 30-pin-to-FW400 cables no longer worked either. I had these lying around from old iPods and used them to charge at various places.
I don't know why they changed the pin system so that some chargers don't work, but they did. I do disagree with the previous poster that thinks it was some secret initiative by Apple to help sell accessories, which would really just help out 3rd-parties. Even Apple's own, older iPod accessories, like the iPod Hi-Fi, don't work with the iPhone 3G or new iPods.
THOSE are actually the keys to its astounding (as in a record $11 billion quarter with about $28 billion cash on hand) success. As it stands now, Apple has MORE cash on hand than MS. .
So, let me see, you are saying that the reason apple has billions in the bank is solely because they do not allow OSX on other computers and tehir margin on theri computers.
So the ipods and iphone etc have made apple no bank at all?
MS is never really "first" . . . at anything. That's the problem. They don't take risks. That's why from the get-go their products are usually suspect.
So, let me see, you are saying that the reason apple has billions in the bank is solely because they do not allow OSX on other computers and tehir margin on theri computers.
So the ipods and iphone etc have made apple no bank at all?
1) stating something as 'key', as the OP did, and stating something as 'solely', as you did, are not even close to the same thing.
2) OS X is on some on the iPhone and one type of iPod.
3) The iPod OS is not licensed, so it would fall under the same reasoning the OP made about a complete widget having benefit over other business models.
4) Balmer has stated that Apple needs to open their OS if they want to achieve more than a a small percentage of the market. I found this comment ironic for a couple reasons. One, the percentage he stated was well above the marketshare Apple publicly stated they wanted to achieve and, second, With less than 2 years on the market in many less countries, on less providers and only one premium handset type with two capacities for storage, they are about to over take them, despite the many years MS has been at it.
5) When you think that Apple makes money on the HW and SW, comparing them to only a company that only makes SW for a compared device to see which platform is more valuable is a bit daft. On the mobile or PC-side, MS has to sell a lot more their SW to equal the profit from one iPhone or Mac sale. This makes the whole OS marketshare thing pointless, especially now that Apple has more than enough to be viable to 3rd-party app developers and that the openness of the internet has made many things OS-agnostic.
If we use a simple term like not being first to enter a market with a product", then Apple and MS are pretty similar, but that is where the similarities end.
trying to get a higher post count? try adding something into the conversation next time. this adds nothing but noting that you are an apple fanboy, something htis site has plenty of (which is understandable, but still sad) not all sites that are designed to follow a single product have to be fanboy sites, i like the ones that are both critical and supportive personally.
You write a near incomprehensible post and end it by suggesting that any idiot could "figure it out".
Maybe you should calm down a little? Take a little time to think things through before you post? Perhaps then the people, who are not idiots, could figure it out too.
OK, just out of curiosity, what the fuck are you picture of a rectangle fans even talking about?
Fanboys "bashing" MS for their product? What product? If I don't agree that the picture of a rectangle is probably going to be awesome, it makes me an Apple apologist, or something?
The entire conversation is surreal, and seems to be mostly based on animosity towards Apple enthusiasts having the balls to be enthusiastic about Apple products on an Apple enthusiast site.
OK, look, sorry. I agree. The picture of a rectangle is amazing. If I weren't so caught up in my mindless Apple boosterism, that would be clear. The only reason I haven't been posting about what a great phone/MP3 player/secret mystery segment destroyer the picture of a rectangle is is because I'm terrified that MS is going to make the touch screen product they were always inevitably going to make, eventually, and have it run the non-touch friendly and not very popular and increasingly dated looking Windows Mobile, but, you know, with some Zune stuff on there which will obviously be totally awesome, on account of the bigger fonts, and sell it for Verizon, which very obviously will be hugely popular.
And then, at some point, it can run WinMob 7 which is obviously awesome and will be amazing and Apple had better watch out and I can barely go on, on account of the fear.
We good?
side step the question, back track, and try and make us look like the ones that started pushing the "fanboy" talk.... nice try. doesn't change what you/i wrote.
as for everything else? how old are you? you are acting like a child. i simply show hope that some company can create better competition in the marketplace and you somehow change this into a flamefest against MS/Myself, despite the fact that my previous posts in this thread and others, show that i am a proud supporter of apple products.
I recently read a few Apple related entires on Engadget, I find it amusing that everyone seems to LOATHE Apple so much. Even the comments referring to Apple individuals as "fanboys" from rapid M$ "fanboys" made me chuckle. Oi.
You write a near incomprehensible post and end it by suggesting that any idiot could "figure it out".
Maybe you should calm down a little? Take a little time to think things through before you post? Perhaps then the people, who are not idiots, could figure it out too.
im sorry, can i help you out, what did you not comprehend? how can i clarify it for you?
this adds nothing but noting that you are an apple fanboy, something htis site has plenty of (which is understandable, but still sad) not all sites that are designed to follow a single product have to be fanboy sites
First, any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be an Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument (this isn't play school).
Second, why are you visiting APPLEInsider if you [seem to] loathe Apple so vehemently? This isn't MICROSOFTInsider, or ELECTRONICSInsider.
Microsoft clients who loathe Apple need to stop baiting people on Apple sites (AppleInsider, MacRumors are their latest victims), it's getting extremely tired.
First, any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be a Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument (this isn't play school).
Second, why are you visiting APPLEInsider if you [seem] to loathe Apple so vehemently? This isn't MICROSOFTInsider, or ELECTRONICSInsider.
Microsoft clients who loathe Apple need to stop baiting people on Apple sites (AppleInsider, MacRumors are their latest victims), it's getting extremely tired.
oh and i normally would never use it, in fact i make it a point not to. however i KNEW one of you would make this EXACT statement, as i have heard it (and used it) on many occasions.
then why did i use it you ask? well because someone actually called ME the fanboy first, and therefor you read THAT reply first, however which person did you decide to single out and tell that they had "already lost their argument"? me. Why? because i am not on your side, which simply means that you are only using the "any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be a Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument" when it is convenient to you. thank you for making my point for me.
go back and read the posts that you CLEARLY read, im not at all "loathing" apple, i love them, as stated in posts you again already read, i own more Apple software/hardware than i do MS. what i am loathing right now however is the people that are posting how horrible this product is before we know any real information about it. and if this product is even REAL. now if it is real just by looking at it you have to assume it will be decent, MS is not in the habit of releasing BAD hardware/software. maybe not always my cup of tea, but the Xbox is good, the Zune is good (when compared to anything but the iPhone/iPod Touch), and most MS accessories are good. why would this suddenly be "bad"?
thats the point im making. and it has nothing to do with apple making a single "bad product" in fact, like ive said (3 times in this single thread and countless other times) Apple makes AMAZING products, both Software and Hardware.
oh and i normally would never use it, in fact i make it a point not to. however i KNEW one of you would make this EXACT statement, as i have heard it (and used it) on many occasions.
then why did i use it you ask? well because someone actually called ME the fanboy first, and therefor you read THAT reply first, however which person did you decide to single out and tell that they had "already lost their argument"? me. Why? because i am not on your side, which simply means that you are only using the "any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be a Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument" when it is convenient to you. thank you for making my point for me.
go back and read the posts that you CLEARLY read, im not at all "loathing" apple, i love them, as stated in posts you again already read, i own more Apple software/hardware than i do MS. what i am loathing right now however is the people that are posting how horrible this product is before we know any real information about it. and if this product is even REAL. now if it is real just by looking at it you have to assume it will be decent, MS is not in the habit of releasing BAD hardware/software. maybe not always my cup of tea, but the Xbox is good, the Zune is good (when compared to anything but the iPhone/iPod Touch), and most MS accessories are good. why would this suddenly be "bad"?
thats the point im making. and it has nothing to do with apple making a single "bad product" in fact, like ive said (3 times in this single thread and countless other times) Apple makes AMAZING products, both Software and Hardware.
Comments
An idiot could write it.
trying to get a higher post count? try adding something into the conversation next time. this adds nothing but noting that you are an apple fanboy, something htis site has plenty of (which is understandable, but still sad) not all sites that are designed to follow a single product have to be fanboy sites, i like the ones that are both critical and supportive personally.
I really don't think this is about the Zune, but instead it is about MS. If someone else made the Zune, most folks who bash it wouldn't care, much less take the time to post about it.
I have owned iPods since my first 5GB model. I have also owned several other players: Zune, Cowon, Sony mp3, Sony minidisc, Sony HiMD, etc. All of these over the last 8 years. The simple fact is that they were all well built, they all played music well. Each had its strengths and weaknesses. What do I use now? A iPod Touch 16GB, a Sony A808 8GB flash, iPod Photo 60GB and a Zune 80GB.
Every one of these players is an excellent choice for a music lover. You may prefer a particular company, which is reasonable, but to bash another product and make baseless claims because you are a fanboy is not reasonable.
Will I get the Zune HD. Probably not, since MS has yet to add East Asian font support to the Zune. If they do, we will see. The Sony new X-series is next on my list simply because the Sony still sounds better than all the other players I have ever listened to (from the headphone jack).
For the time being, Apple has a 70%+ market share in portable music players with iPods and a 10%-15% (?) market share in smart phones with iPhones.
You might want to qualify that statement with "...in the U.S. ..." The iPod doesn't have the same following elsewhere in the U.S. Japan and Korea are prime examples.
It is interesting that when MS decides to make an DAP that is touch-based, such a vocal group of iPodders go into fanatic mode and bash them. YET, Cowon recently introduced their S9 and barely a peep was heard.
Probably because it's already been done, and done very well. At least well enough for the average consumer to not really care about them.
Fanboys "bashing" MS for their product? What product? If I don't agree that the picture of a rectangle is probably going to be awesome, it makes me an Apple apologist, or something?
The entire conversation is surreal, and seems to be mostly based on animosity towards Apple enthusiasts having the balls to be enthusiastic about Apple products on an Apple enthusiast site.
OK, look, sorry. I agree. The picture of a rectangle is amazing. If I weren't so caught up in my mindless Apple boosterism, that would be clear. The only reason I haven't been posting about what a great phone/MP3 player/secret mystery segment destroyer the picture of a rectangle is is because I'm terrified that MS is going to make the touch screen product they were always inevitably going to make, eventually, and have it run the non-touch friendly and not very popular and increasingly dated looking Windows Mobile, but, you know, with some Zune stuff on there which will obviously be totally awesome, on account of the bigger fonts, and sell it for Verizon, which very obviously will be hugely popular.
And then, at some point, it can run WinMob 7 which is obviously awesome and will be amazing and Apple had better watch out and I can barely go on, on account of the fear.
We good?
Changed around the dock connectors? How did they change around the dock connectors? I have a charge adapter from a 2004 iPod Mini (considered ancient by many at this point) and I use it interchangeably in my car with my iPhone.
They did something with the pins with last year's iDevices. There are plenty of reports of accessories not working. Some do and others don't. The 30-pin-to-FW400 cables no longer worked either. I had these lying around from old iPods and used them to charge at various places.
I don't know why they changed the pin system so that some chargers don't work, but they did. I do disagree with the previous poster that thinks it was some secret initiative by Apple to help sell accessories, which would really just help out 3rd-parties. Even Apple's own, older iPod accessories, like the iPod Hi-Fi, don't work with the iPhone 3G or new iPods.
THOSE are actually the keys to its astounding (as in a record $11 billion quarter with about $28 billion cash on hand) success. As it stands now, Apple has MORE cash on hand than MS. .
So, let me see, you are saying that the reason apple has billions in the bank is solely because they do not allow OSX on other computers and tehir margin on theri computers.
So the ipods and iphone etc have made apple no bank at all?
MS is never really "first" . . . at anything. That's the problem. They don't take risks. That's why from the get-go their products are usually suspect.
So MS is just like apple?
So, let me see, you are saying that the reason apple has billions in the bank is solely because they do not allow OSX on other computers and tehir margin on theri computers.
So the ipods and iphone etc have made apple no bank at all?
1) stating something as 'key', as the OP did, and stating something as 'solely', as you did, are not even close to the same thing.
2) OS X is on some on the iPhone and one type of iPod.
3) The iPod OS is not licensed, so it would fall under the same reasoning the OP made about a complete widget having benefit over other business models.
4) Balmer has stated that Apple needs to open their OS if they want to achieve more than a a small percentage of the market. I found this comment ironic for a couple reasons. One, the percentage he stated was well above the marketshare Apple publicly stated they wanted to achieve and, second, With less than 2 years on the market in many less countries, on less providers and only one premium handset type with two capacities for storage, they are about to over take them, despite the many years MS has been at it.
5) When you think that Apple makes money on the HW and SW, comparing them to only a company that only makes SW for a compared device to see which platform is more valuable is a bit daft. On the mobile or PC-side, MS has to sell a lot more their SW to equal the profit from one iPhone or Mac sale. This makes the whole OS marketshare thing pointless, especially now that Apple has more than enough to be viable to 3rd-party app developers and that the openness of the internet has made many things OS-agnostic.
So MS is just like apple?
If we use a simple term like not being first to enter a market with a product", then Apple and MS are pretty similar, but that is where the similarities end.
trying to get a higher post count? try adding something into the conversation next time. this adds nothing but noting that you are an apple fanboy, something htis site has plenty of (which is understandable, but still sad) not all sites that are designed to follow a single product have to be fanboy sites, i like the ones that are both critical and supportive personally.
You write a near incomprehensible post and end it by suggesting that any idiot could "figure it out".
Maybe you should calm down a little? Take a little time to think things through before you post? Perhaps then the people, who are not idiots, could figure it out too.
OK, just out of curiosity, what the fuck are you picture of a rectangle fans even talking about?
Fanboys "bashing" MS for their product? What product? If I don't agree that the picture of a rectangle is probably going to be awesome, it makes me an Apple apologist, or something?
The entire conversation is surreal, and seems to be mostly based on animosity towards Apple enthusiasts having the balls to be enthusiastic about Apple products on an Apple enthusiast site.
OK, look, sorry. I agree. The picture of a rectangle is amazing. If I weren't so caught up in my mindless Apple boosterism, that would be clear. The only reason I haven't been posting about what a great phone/MP3 player/secret mystery segment destroyer the picture of a rectangle is is because I'm terrified that MS is going to make the touch screen product they were always inevitably going to make, eventually, and have it run the non-touch friendly and not very popular and increasingly dated looking Windows Mobile, but, you know, with some Zune stuff on there which will obviously be totally awesome, on account of the bigger fonts, and sell it for Verizon, which very obviously will be hugely popular.
And then, at some point, it can run WinMob 7 which is obviously awesome and will be amazing and Apple had better watch out and I can barely go on, on account of the fear.
We good?
side step the question, back track, and try and make us look like the ones that started pushing the "fanboy" talk.... nice try. doesn't change what you/i wrote.
as for everything else? how old are you? you are acting like a child. i simply show hope that some company can create better competition in the marketplace and you somehow change this into a flamefest against MS/Myself, despite the fact that my previous posts in this thread and others, show that i am a proud supporter of apple products.
"superhobo @ Apr 11th 2009 3:02PM
If anyone sees this, writers like this butthead (link below) are the reason Apple haters exist. They insult the intelligence of ants.
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...s_zune_hd.html "
I recently read a few Apple related entires on Engadget, I find it amusing that everyone seems to LOATHE Apple so much. Even the comments referring to Apple individuals as "fanboys" from rapid M$ "fanboys" made me chuckle. Oi.
You write a near incomprehensible post and end it by suggesting that any idiot could "figure it out".
Maybe you should calm down a little? Take a little time to think things through before you post? Perhaps then the people, who are not idiots, could figure it out too.
im sorry, can i help you out, what did you not comprehend? how can i clarify it for you?
And all the Ballmer Youth shout "Sieg Heil".
as much as i think Ballmer is a complete jackass, are you seriously comparing him to Hitler?
this adds nothing but noting that you are an apple fanboy, something htis site has plenty of (which is understandable, but still sad) not all sites that are designed to follow a single product have to be fanboy sites
First, any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be an Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument (this isn't play school).
Second, why are you visiting APPLEInsider if you [seem to] loathe Apple so vehemently? This isn't MICROSOFTInsider, or ELECTRONICSInsider.
Microsoft clients who loathe Apple need to stop baiting people on Apple sites (AppleInsider, MacRumors are their latest victims), it's getting extremely tired.
First, any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be a Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument (this isn't play school).
Second, why are you visiting APPLEInsider if you [seem] to loathe Apple so vehemently? This isn't MICROSOFTInsider, or ELECTRONICSInsider.
Microsoft clients who loathe Apple need to stop baiting people on Apple sites (AppleInsider, MacRumors are their latest victims), it's getting extremely tired.
oh and i normally would never use it, in fact i make it a point not to. however i KNEW one of you would make this EXACT statement, as i have heard it (and used it) on many occasions.
then why did i use it you ask? well because someone actually called ME the fanboy first, and therefor you read THAT reply first, however which person did you decide to single out and tell that they had "already lost their argument"? me. Why? because i am not on your side, which simply means that you are only using the "any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be a Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument" when it is convenient to you. thank you for making my point for me.
go back and read the posts that you CLEARLY read, im not at all "loathing" apple, i love them, as stated in posts you again already read, i own more Apple software/hardware than i do MS. what i am loathing right now however is the people that are posting how horrible this product is before we know any real information about it. and if this product is even REAL. now if it is real just by looking at it you have to assume it will be decent, MS is not in the habit of releasing BAD hardware/software. maybe not always my cup of tea, but the Xbox is good, the Zune is good (when compared to anything but the iPhone/iPod Touch), and most MS accessories are good. why would this suddenly be "bad"?
thats the point im making. and it has nothing to do with apple making a single "bad product" in fact, like ive said (3 times in this single thread and countless other times) Apple makes AMAZING products, both Software and Hardware.
oh and i normally would never use it, in fact i make it a point not to. however i KNEW one of you would make this EXACT statement, as i have heard it (and used it) on many occasions.
then why did i use it you ask? well because someone actually called ME the fanboy first, and therefor you read THAT reply first, however which person did you decide to single out and tell that they had "already lost their argument"? me. Why? because i am not on your side, which simply means that you are only using the "any time any one uses "fanboy" to describe anyone (may it be a Apple or Windows client) you have lost your argument" when it is convenient to you. thank you for making my point for me.
go back and read the posts that you CLEARLY read, im not at all "loathing" apple, i love them, as stated in posts you again already read, i own more Apple software/hardware than i do MS. what i am loathing right now however is the people that are posting how horrible this product is before we know any real information about it. and if this product is even REAL. now if it is real just by looking at it you have to assume it will be decent, MS is not in the habit of releasing BAD hardware/software. maybe not always my cup of tea, but the Xbox is good, the Zune is good (when compared to anything but the iPhone/iPod Touch), and most MS accessories are good. why would this suddenly be "bad"?
thats the point im making. and it has nothing to do with apple making a single "bad product" in fact, like ive said (3 times in this single thread and countless other times) Apple makes AMAZING products, both Software and Hardware.
Wow. You need to calm down. Seriously. Please.