If they follow this model, I don't think they will succeed. But I don't think it takes a tech guy to make a successful tech company. Steve Jobs doesn't seem to be any more of a tech guy than Ballmer but has operated two successful tech companies. I think the difference is a certain kind of business savvy that Ballmer will never acquire.
Clearly they will have to come up with a model that will pay for the service. Microsoft's take per product is less than Apple's that they will either have to charge for it or try to push things on people they don't need to fix the problem.
If it's real, I don't see why it's a joke. I do see this as likely just one of many concepts under consideration, hopefully it's been abandoned for something that's different.
If that's the case, why did they need those slides with mock-ups showing Microsoft brand cut & paste substitutions?
Why not? Just tell me where is the Microsoft originality is here. I don't see how this would be anything but a tacit admission that Microsoft is a follower, not a leader. And a wholesale rip-off of someone else's design.
First, explain Microsoft's hypocrisy in claiming innovation while just substituting their own names and logos in this concept. If it were an academic paper or a book, this would be called plagiarism.
That would be nice, but they have to be converted into production units first.
If surface is not in production then how did the att stores get them?
Who cares if microsoft is copying apple. Apple copies also so bashing microsoft for copying when apple does it is being a hypocrite.
The one thing microsoft is missing is tech who clearly know the product and can solve problems in person. I dont get why people state microsoft having this is a bad idea while apple doing the same exact thing is a good idea?
If surface is not in production then how did the att stores get them?
Now many of them have it? The article I found is basically prototype scale, something like a dozen or so made. Can you buy one? Surface looks very nice, but having one on the floor has to pay for itself and its space somehow.
Quote:
Who cares if microsoft is copying apple. Apple copies also so bashing microsoft for copying when apple does it is being a hypocrite.
Name some specifics and we'll have a discussion. Usually when people name specifics, the reality isn't what they thought it was.
Quote:
The one thing microsoft is missing is tech who clearly know the product and can solve problems in person. I dont get why people state microsoft having this is a bad idea while apple doing the same exact thing is a good idea?
One key difference is that it's highly unlikely that MS will implement it well.
Can i ask a question. IF the microsoft store matches an apple store why is it that you guys bash the microsoft store and not the apple store.
I don' think anyone here is saying the Apple Store idea is a bad one. We're complaining that Microsoft is planning on making a near exact copy of that idea.
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom1981
My personal opinion is that this could help microsoft i na big way. The number one complaint i get as a pc tech outside of work is about not having a store to go to for help (i dont mean best buy).
Have you been reading the replies? A lot of people asking just how Microsoft Stores will help customers. Microsoft doesn't make the hardware so it's unlikely they will have robust hardware support. Software wise, they can only help with OS and Office issues. Apple Stores on the other hand can with just about anything on the Mac because they make it. Hardware, OS, iPhoto, iTunes, GarageBand, iWeb, iMovie, iDVD, Mobile Me, Pages, Numbers, Keynote, iChat and on and on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom1981
But my main thing is why are you guys being hypocrites about this?
Ps I thin kthe Microsoft surface and Project Natal being in every store could be one advantage over the apple stores.
As I think I've shown, no one is being hypocritical. We're upset and saddened that Microsoft is choosing to copy another company instead of coming up with it's own unique ideas. We also have serious questions about how this venture will make money and help the customers.
As for Surface and Natal, well Surface is not a consumer product and won't be for quite a while and Natal is not scheduled for release until spring 2010. So basically these technologies while maybe fun to play around with are nothing a consumer can buy and won't help their bottom line. At best they can generate hype and a reason to visit the store. Not the worst idea, but not the best either.
Customers could even set aside parts of the store for paid private events, such as custom group training or, oddly enough, birthday parties.
SNIP
ms bob could add a touch of ronald mcdonald! classy!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
SNIP
Where Microsoft would differentiate itself is in the technology behind the shopping experience. Instead of static graphics, a giant store-length display would advertise new products and change with the season or with major launches.
Giant BSOD as a backdrop...
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider
SNIP
Company executives have previously sworn that the stores wouldn't echo Apple "in the long term" ... SNIP
that's probably a true statement...
...they will be shut down after ballmer gets fired
Who cares if microsoft is copying apple. Apple copies also so bashing microsoft for copying when apple does it is being a hypocrite.
Sure, everyone copies, borrows or adapts other ideas, including Apple. That's how progress occurs.
The DIFFERENCE is that Microsoft has often tried to claim that they are the originators of ideas that clearly originated elsewhere.
When you use others' ideas and then try to claim that idea as wholly your own, THAT is STEALING.
THAT is what Microsoft has done historically. They do this and try to claim that this somehow makes them an "innovative" company with "fresh ideas", while the exact opposite is true. Microsoft is a MARKETING company, NOT a creative company.
One can say that Apple "stole" many original concepts from Xerox PARC. Apple admits that they used, adapted, developed and brought to market many concepts, but they don't claim the original concepts as theirs alone.
The DIFFERENCE is that Microsoft has often tried to claim that they are the originators of ideas that clearly originated elsewhere.
In this case they clearly are not pretending anything other than that they are basing their 'retail' efforts on Apple's very successful efforts. I think it is a calculated risk. They will be slated for copying apple briefly, and then critics will move on to assess what the store is actually like and what the user experience is like. In the future all PC stores will be based on whatever Apple does. In other words Apple has redefined the PC shopping experience for all, not just for Apple shoppers. Whether MS can make the concept work for them (Guru Bar) is another story to unfold. I, like most people her, would like to think not, but who knows. Copying successful innovators is nothing new for MS not for others, Apple included. I wouldn't be surprised if Dell does the same thing. As far as the general public is concerned I am sure they will flock to the MS store (Bing Store?) if MS can make a reasonable go of it.
original article mention sony style as well, the post here (as usual) fail to mention anything other then apple.
I worked on the original Sony Style store and Sony Wonder at 550 Madison Avenue, NYC back in 1993, for the display company... engineering, prototyping and installing all the display fixtures. Lots of steel fabrications and a very cool and pretty fun project (except for the assholes I worked for). Edwin Schlossberg Design (Caroline Kennedy's husband) was the design firm.
original article mention sony style as well, the post here (as usual) fail to mention anything other then apple.
You mean Gizmodo's article? The AI article did mention Sony's, Nike's and AT&T's stores, though in just one or two sentences. AI's article does mention things that they didn't show the related slides.
It looks like a marketing company's work, so it may be a little unfair to rag on Microsoft, but still, they had to hire an outside company to do something that they should have been able to do in house.
A perfect example. But listen to Jobs . . . "culture", "taste", "beautiful fonts", "beautiful books", learning from the art of typesetting, etc.
These things were UNHEARD OF in the industry once upon a time. And now everyone is trying grab or evolve their own share of these things. But even then, there is really a standard when it comes to these things. And Apple is in tune with them in a big way. It's all about priorities. All about your attitude about how the user is supposed to interact with tech.
Apple treats devices like an extension of lifestyle. They are not mere tools, but a statement of an IDEAL. A deliberate reflection of the values and attitudes of the company that makes them, and a suggestion that tech doesn't have to be "technical" or cold; that tech doesn't have to be "learned" or "understood." It should function and feel as natural as possible.
This is why Apple has grown to be the guiding light of the entire tech industry. When you hear Jobs talk the way he did on that video, does Apple's success come as any surprise? And Jobs' ideas have penetrated deep into the entire culture at Apple. Jobs was out of the picture but the entire team did full justice to the Apple ideal. Bertrand Serlet came on stage and confidently said that Apple approaches the idea of tech "from a totally different place." There you go.
And Ballmer . . . he just seems like a middle-management salesguy who got promoted and is in the habit of making excuses. He's an embarrassment. The exact opposite of Jobs. And that's why MS is in the situation it's in. No vision and truly shitty leadership.
And that Steve Ballmer clip was done quite a while ago. And he's saying "just you watch, just you watch", etc.
Yeah, we saw. Vista. Windows Mobile. Zune. The list goes on. Yes, Ballmer, we saw. His tripe meant nothing then and seems to mean nothing now.
This "concept" is a 100% copy of an Apple Store! Oh, gee, they changed the labels and use different typefaces. How original. Even the design of the tables is nearly an exact copy.
How exactly are the tables supposed to be different then, make them circular instead of rectangular? The only thing that looks like a direct copy is the guru bar, but what good is a computer store without computer specialists?
Quote:
Who would actually go into one of these stores? And why?
I probably would. Just to see what it's like and it actually looks pretty cool. Looks like there are many more things to do in the Microsoft store than the Apple store.
Next week it is expected that Mr Balmer will hold a media event announcing and presenting MicroSoft's new concept for their upcoming stores. They may as well go whole hog and claim it all.
I am an Apple user and the surprising thing is I am not angry at this. I just know this organization is a parasite on society and the industry. The question is will they succeed killing their host or will their host take steps to control this parasite.
Respectfully submitted
HT
AND Steve Balmer will be wearing a black turtle neck and jeans.
Unfortunately, his belly will be hanging out from underneath the turtle neck and spill over the jeans, making the imitation/impersonation look only as good as the quality of his products....
Comments
This is unbelievable . . . has Microsoft ever had a truly original idea?
This is what i mean about hypocrites apple does the same thing.
If they follow this model, I don't think they will succeed. But I don't think it takes a tech guy to make a successful tech company. Steve Jobs doesn't seem to be any more of a tech guy than Ballmer but has operated two successful tech companies. I think the difference is a certain kind of business savvy that Ballmer will never acquire.
Clearly they will have to come up with a model that will pay for the service. Microsoft's take per product is less than Apple's that they will either have to charge for it or try to push things on people they don't need to fix the problem.
If it's real, I don't see why it's a joke. I do see this as likely just one of many concepts under consideration, hopefully it's been abandoned for something that's different.
If that's the case, why did they need those slides with mock-ups showing Microsoft brand cut & paste substitutions?
Why not? Just tell me where is the Microsoft originality is here. I don't see how this would be anything but a tacit admission that Microsoft is a follower, not a leader. And a wholesale rip-off of someone else's design.
First, explain Microsoft's hypocrisy in claiming innovation while just substituting their own names and logos in this concept. If it were an academic paper or a book, this would be called plagiarism.
That would be nice, but they have to be converted into production units first.
If surface is not in production then how did the att stores get them?
Who cares if microsoft is copying apple. Apple copies also so bashing microsoft for copying when apple does it is being a hypocrite.
The one thing microsoft is missing is tech who clearly know the product and can solve problems in person. I dont get why people state microsoft having this is a bad idea while apple doing the same exact thing is a good idea?
If surface is not in production then how did the att stores get them?
Now many of them have it? The article I found is basically prototype scale, something like a dozen or so made. Can you buy one? Surface looks very nice, but having one on the floor has to pay for itself and its space somehow.
Who cares if microsoft is copying apple. Apple copies also so bashing microsoft for copying when apple does it is being a hypocrite.
Name some specifics and we'll have a discussion. Usually when people name specifics, the reality isn't what they thought it was.
The one thing microsoft is missing is tech who clearly know the product and can solve problems in person. I dont get why people state microsoft having this is a bad idea while apple doing the same exact thing is a good idea?
One key difference is that it's highly unlikely that MS will implement it well.
Can i ask a question. IF the microsoft store matches an apple store why is it that you guys bash the microsoft store and not the apple store.
I don' think anyone here is saying the Apple Store idea is a bad one. We're complaining that Microsoft is planning on making a near exact copy of that idea.
My personal opinion is that this could help microsoft i na big way. The number one complaint i get as a pc tech outside of work is about not having a store to go to for help (i dont mean best buy).
Have you been reading the replies? A lot of people asking just how Microsoft Stores will help customers. Microsoft doesn't make the hardware so it's unlikely they will have robust hardware support. Software wise, they can only help with OS and Office issues. Apple Stores on the other hand can with just about anything on the Mac because they make it. Hardware, OS, iPhoto, iTunes, GarageBand, iWeb, iMovie, iDVD, Mobile Me, Pages, Numbers, Keynote, iChat and on and on.
But my main thing is why are you guys being hypocrites about this?
Ps I thin kthe Microsoft surface and Project Natal being in every store could be one advantage over the apple stores.
As I think I've shown, no one is being hypocritical. We're upset and saddened that Microsoft is choosing to copy another company instead of coming up with it's own unique ideas. We also have serious questions about how this venture will make money and help the customers.
As for Surface and Natal, well Surface is not a consumer product and won't be for quite a while and Natal is not scheduled for release until spring 2010. So basically these technologies while maybe fun to play around with are nothing a consumer can buy and won't help their bottom line. At best they can generate hype and a reason to visit the store. Not the worst idea, but not the best either.
SNIP
Customers could even set aside parts of the store for paid private events, such as custom group training or, oddly enough, birthday parties.
SNIP
ms bob could add a touch of ronald mcdonald! classy!
SNIP
Where Microsoft would differentiate itself is in the technology behind the shopping experience. Instead of static graphics, a giant store-length display would advertise new products and change with the season or with major launches.
Giant BSOD as a backdrop...
SNIP
Company executives have previously sworn that the stores wouldn't echo Apple "in the long term" ... SNIP
that's probably a true statement...
...they will be shut down after ballmer gets fired
Who cares if microsoft is copying apple. Apple copies also so bashing microsoft for copying when apple does it is being a hypocrite.
Sure, everyone copies, borrows or adapts other ideas, including Apple. That's how progress occurs.
The DIFFERENCE is that Microsoft has often tried to claim that they are the originators of ideas that clearly originated elsewhere.
When you use others' ideas and then try to claim that idea as wholly your own, THAT is STEALING.
THAT is what Microsoft has done historically. They do this and try to claim that this somehow makes them an "innovative" company with "fresh ideas", while the exact opposite is true. Microsoft is a MARKETING company, NOT a creative company.
One can say that Apple "stole" many original concepts from Xerox PARC. Apple admits that they used, adapted, developed and brought to market many concepts, but they don't claim the original concepts as theirs alone.
Microsoft is a MARKETING company, NOT a creative company.
very true, they marketing geniuses; how they put sh*t on 80 some % of the computers is beyond me. M$ always looked to me as a used car sales agent.
The DIFFERENCE is that Microsoft has often tried to claim that they are the originators of ideas that clearly originated elsewhere.
In this case they clearly are not pretending anything other than that they are basing their 'retail' efforts on Apple's very successful efforts. I think it is a calculated risk. They will be slated for copying apple briefly, and then critics will move on to assess what the store is actually like and what the user experience is like. In the future all PC stores will be based on whatever Apple does. In other words Apple has redefined the PC shopping experience for all, not just for Apple shoppers. Whether MS can make the concept work for them (Guru Bar) is another story to unfold. I, like most people her, would like to think not, but who knows. Copying successful innovators is nothing new for MS not for others, Apple included. I wouldn't be surprised if Dell does the same thing. As far as the general public is concerned I am sure they will flock to the MS store (Bing Store?) if MS can make a reasonable go of it.
original article mention sony style as well, the post here (as usual) fail to mention anything other then apple.
I worked on the original Sony Style store and Sony Wonder at 550 Madison Avenue, NYC back in 1993, for the display company... engineering, prototyping and installing all the display fixtures. Lots of steel fabrications and a very cool and pretty fun project (except for the assholes I worked for). Edwin Schlossberg Design (Caroline Kennedy's husband) was the design firm.
original article mention sony style as well, the post here (as usual) fail to mention anything other then apple.
You mean Gizmodo's article? The AI article did mention Sony's, Nike's and AT&T's stores, though in just one or two sentences. AI's article does mention things that they didn't show the related slides.
It looks like a marketing company's work, so it may be a little unfair to rag on Microsoft, but still, they had to hire an outside company to do something that they should have been able to do in house.
microsoft bob?
Hehe, was just about to say that myself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dR8SAFRBmcU
Wow - I think Steve Jobs said it best...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dR8SAFRBmcU
A perfect example. But listen to Jobs . . . "culture", "taste", "beautiful fonts", "beautiful books", learning from the art of typesetting, etc.
These things were UNHEARD OF in the industry once upon a time. And now everyone is trying grab or evolve their own share of these things. But even then, there is really a standard when it comes to these things. And Apple is in tune with them in a big way. It's all about priorities. All about your attitude about how the user is supposed to interact with tech.
Apple treats devices like an extension of lifestyle. They are not mere tools, but a statement of an IDEAL. A deliberate reflection of the values and attitudes of the company that makes them, and a suggestion that tech doesn't have to be "technical" or cold; that tech doesn't have to be "learned" or "understood." It should function and feel as natural as possible.
This is why Apple has grown to be the guiding light of the entire tech industry. When you hear Jobs talk the way he did on that video, does Apple's success come as any surprise? And Jobs' ideas have penetrated deep into the entire culture at Apple. Jobs was out of the picture but the entire team did full justice to the Apple ideal. Bertrand Serlet came on stage and confidently said that Apple approaches the idea of tech "from a totally different place." There you go.
And Ballmer . . . he just seems like a middle-management salesguy who got promoted and is in the habit of making excuses. He's an embarrassment. The exact opposite of Jobs. And that's why MS is in the situation it's in. No vision and truly shitty leadership.
And that Steve Ballmer clip was done quite a while ago. And he's saying "just you watch, just you watch", etc.
Yeah, we saw. Vista. Windows Mobile. Zune. The list goes on. Yes, Ballmer, we saw. His tripe meant nothing then and seems to mean nothing now.
.
Better than to point out how Microsoft is... now how did Obama phrase it?, oh yeah... "acting stupidly"!
Don't PC companies like MS have anything better to do then not innovate?
This "concept" is a 100% copy of an Apple Store! Oh, gee, they changed the labels and use different typefaces. How original. Even the design of the tables is nearly an exact copy.
How exactly are the tables supposed to be different then, make them circular instead of rectangular?
Who would actually go into one of these stores? And why?
I probably would. Just to see what it's like and it actually looks pretty cool. Looks like there are many more things to do in the Microsoft store than the Apple store.
Customers could even set aside parts of the store for paid private events, such as custom group training or, oddly enough, birthday parties.
like Chuck E Cheese's?
The Highest form of praise is Imitation.
Next week it is expected that Mr Balmer will hold a media event announcing and presenting MicroSoft's new concept for their upcoming stores. They may as well go whole hog and claim it all.
I am an Apple user and the surprising thing is I am not angry at this. I just know this organization is a parasite on society and the industry. The question is will they succeed killing their host or will their host take steps to control this parasite.
Respectfully submitted
HT
AND Steve Balmer will be wearing a black turtle neck and jeans.
Unfortunately, his belly will be hanging out from underneath the turtle neck and spill over the jeans, making the imitation/impersonation look only as good as the quality of his products....
like Chuck E Cheese's?
The first image I got was an animatronic Ballmer. I didn't need that. Rawr! Rawr! Rawwwwrrrrr! among squeaking noises.