Report: Hon Hai to build Apple tablets as soon as September

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  • Reply 81 of 202
    isaidsoisaidso Posts: 750member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post






    Real production model might have a 'slight' bezel-size increase on both sides. But basically if the screen is 10.1", and I believe it will be, the device will be roughly this tall and wide. 14/15 mm thickness in the center, tapering outward slightly, with tough smooth rubber-ish grips on the rear right and left. And of course the oft-mentioned (by me) rear pop-out stand, for when at a desk for example.



    How do you hold this?
  • Reply 82 of 202
    jeffharrisjeffharris Posts: 555member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    I'm saying "nay" to things that make no sense from the Apple perspective. Using an iPhone app on a larger device is a big nay.



    I seriously doubt that Apple suffers from such limited thinking in regard to the iPhone OS.



    From what I've read about iPhone app programming, apps are NOT tied to a specific screen resolution (320 x 480). That means, if properly written they should scale nicely to different sized screens.



    If you're a developer and want your app to support different screen pixel-dimensions, you update it, or add a note saying what it will or won't run on. That would be similar to apps that require the specific hardware on an iPhone 3GS or iPod touch 2G, for instance.



    I envision that eventually, you'll be able to run iPhone apps directly on your Mac, via iTunes or some kind of MacClassic-like virtual machine.... double-click and go. Eventually, I could see them running on an Apple TV as well.



    Clearly Apple has a plan and there are lots of different parts in place that could mesh together very nicely over time.
  • Reply 83 of 202
    galleygalley Posts: 971member
    A Word document with standard margins on 8-1/2" x 11" paper has 9.7" of text, measured diagonally. That screen size makes total sense if they are going after the e-book market.
  • Reply 84 of 202
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,860member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    Hey Ireland, (and maybe wizard69, teckstud and a few others)



    do y'all remember when the tablet was a crazy insane idea and it was only us in a future hardware section thread that would discuss it?



    As I remember it we all had different ideas about what this device would be like. Ireland was always for the ten incher while I still have preferences for a smaller device. Others have also been vocal in their opinion.

    Quote:

    Every once in a while the occasional naysayer would stop by the thread just to make fun of us weird kooks talking about a product Apple would never....ever consider producing? For two long years this has been going on.



    I became a believer with Touch & iPhone. The portability of those devices is why I prefer a smaller tablet. Even a ten inch device could have it's appeal if the aspect ratio is wide enough to support wide screen movies, 16:9 would be good but some of the cine ratios better. This would tend to make for a shorter and wider device that actually might remain useful as a portable device.



    You see the big problem with a ten inch device is that you won't be using it hand held in the same way you can use an iPhone. This is why I still see a big appeal in a handheld Touch / iPhone MAXI. Something with a 5 to 7 inch screen.

    Quote:



    Now look. Now everybody and their grandmother can't wait to buy it. Who's da man now hmm naysayers? PWNED!



    I wouldn't get to excited yet as Apple could blow this project just like they did with AIR. Get the feature set wrong and many people will be very put off be the device. Here is a list of things they could do to screw it up:

    1.

    Make it to heavy.

    2.

    Not enough computational power.

    3.

    Not enough secondary storage. This is actually my biggest fear as they may think of it as a network centric streaming device. I actually want bleeding edge, state of the art storage ideally starting at 256GB. At the rate things are going that would likely be low end as that can be had in a USB dongle.

    4.

    Short battery life. This of course operates against item #1 above. But we really need a run time that lasts beyound twelve hours.

    5.

    Lack of industry standard ports. No micro USB connectors or other crap. I want at least two standard USB ports on the device. I might settle for other ports like Firewire but I'm not sure they have a place on tablets. The trick of course is finding the right balance.

    6.

    No GPS or other navigating features. I'd say this would be a deal breaker for many.

    7.

    To little RAM. 1GB ought to be minimal.

    8.

    No SD slot. I think Apple is up to something here so this is likely a shoe in. An internal slot that goes with the external would be nice.

    9.

    It would be nice if the unit had a supplemental charging port beyound the traditional USB/ iPod port. The idea here is for a receptical that accepts a nominal 12VDC to allow for recharge from that volatge standard. We aren't taliking just cars here but solar panels and other 12 volt sources.

    10.

    No unencumbered model. That is one without a contract.



    Ok so the above is of variable importance but each item means something to the potential user. The point is Apple could have a great concept and blow it just like they did with AIR. There is a vast difference between the concept and the implementation.

    Quote:



    EDIT: I'm not sure about techstud now that I think about it. Weren't you one of the naysayers techstud?



    I don't know about techstud as I rarely concern myself with who has posted what. But let's just say people have raised valid concerns here. For example having the device completely tied to a service provider will kill it for many uses. In fact I went back and added it as item ten to my list. If I remember correctly techstud had valid concerns about iPhone / Touch too.



    The thing here is I'm not convinced that the device we seem to be hearing about is a natural winner. There are many ifs and buts to consider. It wouldn't be to hard for Apple to deliver a device that people reject for the most part. It could be like AIR all over again, huge sale to early adopters and Apple fan boys for two or three months and then sales tank.



    It all depends upon Apple hitting the right mixture of hardware and software features along with proper marketing. Like AIR they can get so close that it actually hurts.



    I'm excited and hopeful but reserved because I've seen Apple blow it before. Plus I'm seeing a lot of unreasonable expectations in this forum.





    Dave
  • Reply 85 of 202
    jeffharrisjeffharris Posts: 555member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by isaidso View Post


    How do you hold this?



    No kidding. It's too big to hold with one hand and too small to comfortably lock between wrist and elbow, which would be awkward anyway. Let's not even begin talking about ergonomic issues!



    I was just playing around with Vectorworks...

    Scaling up, using the same proportions as my iPod touch (dimensions rounded a bit)...



    6" screen: 7.4" x 4" (retaining roughly the same width as current iPod touch)

    6.5" screen: 8" x 4.25"

    7" screen: 8 1/2" x 4 1/2"

    7.5" screen: 9.1" x 5"

    8" screen: 9.75" x 5.3"



    7" or 7.5" looks like a pretty reasonable size. Easy to handle and pocketable.

    If the pixel density were higher than the current iPhone/iPod touch (163±), say 200, it could be damn nice.



    Ahh, but who knows. We're all pipe dreaming, no?
  • Reply 86 of 202
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    An elephant me.



    Hmm? I don't get that.
  • Reply 87 of 202
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,860member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    Baloney. Graphics created for the iPhone are recommended to be .PNGs, which are resolution specific. They are not vector graphics, which WOULD be resolution independent. If you use Adobe Illustrator you will recognize the difference.



    You need to look into the SDK a bit as there is more to apps than pictures. You have heard of quartz haven't you. For that matter you have read about finding the screen resolution in the SDK. Frankly pictures have little to do with apps and even if important can either be scaled or supplied in different resolutions.



    So open up the SDK documentation and if nothing else look at the examples.



    Dave
  • Reply 88 of 202
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    I'm saying "nay" to things that make no sense from the Apple perspective. Using an iPhone app on a larger device is a big nay.



    *sigh* Sorry Spam. I'm afraid your going to be one of the ones left behind. The rocket ship is about to launch and escape the planet about to explode.



    *SpamSandwich screams "WAIT!!" as ship leaves orbit*



    ......poor guy.
  • Reply 89 of 202
    hattighattig Posts: 830member
    I would have thought that the simple solution - double the screen diagonal, increase the resolution to 960x640 (2x in each dimension) - would have been easiest.



    However I would suspect that Apple might play with a 16:9 screen for media playback purposes, i.e., a different aspect ratio. Let's imagine a ~10" display with a 1366x768 (or 1280x720) display.



    It must include a GPS chip and a front-facing camera.



    It must also surely come with a stand/dock.



    It had better support bluetooth keyboards!



    But I still worry about convenience. It needs some form of grip for holding, even if Apple keep the weight under a pound.
  • Reply 90 of 202
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    As I remember it we all had different ideas about what this device would be like. Ireland was always for the ten incher while I still have preferences for a smaller device. Others have also been vocal in their opinion.



    I became a believer with Touch & iPhone. The portability of those devices is why I prefer a smaller tablet. Even a ten inch device could have it's appeal if the aspect ratio is wide enough to support wide screen movies, 16:9 would be good but some of the cine ratios better. This would tend to make for a shorter and wider device that actually might remain useful as a portable device.



    You see the big problem with a ten inch device is that you won't be using it hand held in the same way you can use an iPhone. This is why I still see a big appeal in a handheld Touch / iPhone MAXI. Something with a 5 to 7 inch screen.



    I wouldn't get to excited yet as Apple could blow this project just like they did with AIR. Get the feature set wrong and many people will be very put off be the device. Here is a list of things they could do to screw it up:

    1.

    Make it to heavy.

    2.

    Not enough computational power.

    3.

    Not enough secondary storage. This is actually my biggest fear as they may think of it as a network centric streaming device. I actually want bleeding edge, state of the art storage ideally starting at 256GB. At the rate things are going that would likely be low end as that can be had in a USB dongle.

    4.

    Short battery life. This of course operates against item #1 above. But we really need a run time that lasts beyound twelve hours.

    5.

    Lack of industry standard ports. No micro USB connectors or other crap. I want at least two standard USB ports on the device. I might settle for other ports like Firewire but I'm not sure they have a place on tablets. The trick of course is finding the right balance.

    6.

    No GPS or other navigating features. I'd say this would be a deal breaker for many.

    7.

    To little RAM. 1GB ought to be minimal.

    8.

    No SD slot. I think Apple is up to something here so this is likely a shoe in. An internal slot that goes with the external would be nice.

    9.

    It would be nice if the unit had a supplemental charging port beyound the traditional USB/ iPod port. The idea here is for a receptical that accepts a nominal 12VDC to allow for recharge from that volatge standard. We aren't taliking just cars here but solar panels and other 12 volt sources.

    10.

    No unencumbered model. That is one without a contract.



    Ok so the above is of variable importance but each item means something to the potential user. The point is Apple could have a great concept and blow it just like they did with AIR. There is a vast difference between the concept and the implementation.





    I don't know about techstud as I rarely concern myself with who has posted what. But let's just say people have raised valid concerns here. For example having the device completely tied to a service provider will kill it for many uses. In fact I went back and added it as item ten to my list. If I remember correctly techstud had valid concerns about iPhone / Touch too.



    The thing here is I'm not convinced that the device we seem to be hearing about is a natural winner. There are many ifs and buts to consider. It wouldn't be to hard for Apple to deliver a device that people reject for the most part. It could be like AIR all over again, huge sale to early adopters and Apple fan boys for two or three months and then sales tank.



    It all depends upon Apple hitting the right mixture of hardware and software features along with proper marketing. Like AIR they can get so close that it actually hurts.



    I'm excited and hopeful but reserved because I've seen Apple blow it before. Plus I'm seeing a lot of unreasonable expectations in this forum.





    Dave



    Your right. All the elements have to be just...right for the product to take off. And I'm aware of ALL the elements. Something tells me though that Steve Jobs has it right. He's been slaving away on this project and he seems to have been utterly meticulous about the details as he is with any project he takes seriously.



    And about the air, I don't think it was blown. The first time I saw it I got the impression that it was an exploratory type of device so that certain technologies and form factors could be tested.



    Now that all of that is done here comes the knock out blow from Apple.



    EDIT: The one element that worries me the most though is how open this device will be. If it is more like a mac then you can install mostly the apps you want. But if it's only going to be draconian approved apps that take months to get approved if at all then it is going to be a problem. It may be ok for a cell phone but not for more of a personal computing device.
  • Reply 91 of 202
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 12,860member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Drow_Swordsman View Post


    Didn't Appleinsider post a lot of reasons why a tablet is more likely to run Snow Leopard than iPhone OS? I'd rather it run OSX, so its not so restricted. If iPhone and iPod Touch users are losing really innovative apps to Appstore Restrictions, why would you buy a full fledged (sort of, anyway) computer with those same software restrictions?



    I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.



    Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environmet makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.



    Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.



    Dave
  • Reply 92 of 202
    olternautolternaut Posts: 1,376member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.



    Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environmet makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.



    Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.



    Dave



    I've said it before and I'll say it again...



    I'll betcha the OS is going to be a hybrid just watch!
  • Reply 93 of 202
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.



    Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environmet makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.



    Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.



    Dave



    For the most part I agree with you, just for me personally I would have no interest in a tablet running a phone OS, even if iPhone OS is a very good one. While not being the most restrictive OS in the world, it certainly doesn't give me the feeling (though admittedly, I've only used iPod Touches, I've never owned one) that "I can do whatever I want on this device", that typically owning any full fledged computer (Mac or PC) gives me. But if people want it, they'll buy it!
  • Reply 94 of 202
    jeffharrisjeffharris Posts: 555member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    I'm not sure why iPhone OS is looked upon this way. It is not a restrictive platform to evolve an OS from. Rather it is a clean slate. A slate by the way that offers real advantages to the average user and developer. Frankly app store is huge for both users and developers.



    Besides the real innovation in apps is actually happening on these devices. It is all about the fact that the environment makes it possible for developers to be succcessful. This possibility for success drives app development that benefits the user greatly.



    Absolutely!

    The possibility of success for someone with talent and a good idea and NOT be some zillion dollar corporation is MASSIVE. There are some extremely cool, beautifully designed apps cooked up by one or two people or a small team that do well (ConvertBot, UpNext, iHandy Carpenter, Perpetuum, Brushes). Hopefully that will inspire others who want to produce something exceptional, rather than just make money with fart or cute girl apps.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post


    Is Apple perfect here, no but no company is or can be. Impart problems develop around Apple trying to slow developers down before they implement tech that isn't ready. Augmented reality is one example where Apple sees a future but needs to slow developers down until the APIs are stable and debugged.



    Apple has a reputation to keep up: seamlessness, elegance and "It just works".

    If something doesn't live up to Apple's own hype (the Newton debacle) or is kludgy and sortof works (the entire Windows universe) then no matter HOW GOOD it is (or the idea behind it), once a product gets a bad rep (the Cube), that's it. DOOM.
  • Reply 95 of 202
    teckstudteckstud Posts: 6,476member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Olternaut View Post


    EDIT: I'm not sure about techstud now that I think about it. Weren't you one of the naysayers techstud?



    No- not at all. I've always thought this would be Apple's answer to the small formed netbook/ ultra portable ever since I saw a Kindle. I never thought much of the MBA and think this will kill it but that it(MBA) helped in the R&D for this as other have noted. I'm very excited about it- I am now going to hold off on my 13"MBP purchase until after the Sept announcements. The smaller the form the better for me. I've wanted something between 7"- 12" for a very long time from Apple.

    Does anyone think we'll be able to boot up Windows on it? Run parallels/bootcamp on it?
  • Reply 96 of 202
    virgil-tb2virgil-tb2 Posts: 1,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by brucep View Post


    DEAR virgil do you own an iphone ??



    Not sure what you mean by that comment, but yes, since the very first day it was available to me I have had an iPhone. But that rather validates everything I said above (that you so cryptically responded to), not the reverse if that's indeed what you are thinking.



  • Reply 97 of 202
    cmf2cmf2 Posts: 1,427member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jeffharris View Post


    No kidding. It's too big to hold with one hand and too small to comfortably lock between wrist and elbow, which would be awkward anyway. Let's not even begin talking about ergonomic issues!



    I was just playing around with Vectorworks...

    Scaling up, using the same proportions as my iPod touch (dimensions rounded a bit)...



    6" screen: 7.4" x 4" (retaining roughly the same width as current iPod touch)

    6.5" screen: 8" x 4.25"

    7" screen: 8 1/2" x 4 1/2"

    7.5" screen: 9.1" x 5"

    8" screen: 9.75" x 5.3"



    7" or 7.5" looks like a pretty reasonable size. Easy to handle and pocketable.

    If the pixel density were higher than the current iPhone/iPod touch (163±), say 200, it could be damn nice.



    Ahh, but who knows. We're all pipe dreaming, no?



    Where are you getting the dimensions from? You can't scale up the touch dimensions or you are going to have 2 inch+ bezels. Why would Apple do that?



    You say the 7.5" screen would be alright. You could almost squeeze a device with a 10 inch screen into those dimensions (keeping the aspect ratio the same as that as the touch, a 10" screen would be 8.32" x 5.55"). Therefore, a device with a 10 inch screen with similar dimensions should be just fine by your standards, assuming that the longer dimension is what concerns you the most.



    None of us have a clue what Apple is doing though.
  • Reply 98 of 202
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 31,780member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    I don't believe it. If this imaginary device is to run App Store apps, none of them will work because they're all written for the wrong display size. If it is to run regular old OSX, then maybe.



    I've read that for some time, Apple has told developers not to do that, but to write with the assumption that the rez may change. True or not, I don't know.



    But most apps wouldn't have a difficult time of it, and the rest could get updates over a short time.
  • Reply 99 of 202
    kpluckkpluck Posts: 500member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by macosxp View Post


    Apple schedules a conference hall for September 25, 2009.



    *The meeting starts*



    "Announcing your insanely great CEO, Steve Jobs!"



    Steve Jobs walks on stage.



    "Hello."



    *crowd cheers*



    "Snow Leopard is the next great thing. And it goes on sale, today."



    WOOOOOOOOO



    "One more thing."



    *cheers*



    "We have been looking at the iPhone, and we've been looking at the MacBook, and we've been wondering, 'People are taking these two portable devices with them everywhere. Is there some way we can put them together?' So we thought about it, and this is what we came up with. It's called the Apple MacBook Wave."



    *cheers*



    "It comes pre-loaded with Snow Leopard, and built-in GPS and 4G cellular capabilities. And it's going on sale today, for just $799. The most inexpensive MacBook ever."



    BOOM



    WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOO



    Doubt it.



    First, Apple won't release a device that replaces other devices that they want you to buy. The tablet/pad/whatever will be a new category. Apple will have something up its sleeve to make this thing much more than a large iPhone/iPod touch or a touch screen MacBook.



    Plus, "Steve walks out on stage" need to be changes to "Steve wheels himself out on stage."



    -kpluck
  • Reply 100 of 202
    virgil-tb2virgil-tb2 Posts: 1,416member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post


    What I was trying to say that it may not be physically possible to thumb type in portrait mode on such a large device. As your thumbs can't rest on the screen and your fingers wouldn't extend beyond the devices center of mass on the back side, the device would literally flip out of your hands if you tried to type. The only solution to that problem, as far as I can see is to bring the keyboard up higher, but then you lose the advantage of having extra screen real estate.



    Whatever the case, I'm sure the input method will be fine, Apple wouldn't release it if it wasn't easy and intuitive to use.



    I also wish there was better text editing software for the iphone.



    Agreed. And I completely agree with the part I highlighted also, which is why I find the tablet news so confusing. A 10" screen would seem on the face of it to be a bad size for a device of this type, but it's unlikely Apple would make such a dumb mistake.



    There is definitely something about the whole business that we don't know or can't see from the perspective of those not in the know about the device. Either it's not what we think it is, or it's multiple products, or there's some kind of magical UI or something. The facts just don't add up as it is right now.
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