OSX only Boot In New year, What are Disk utils going to do?

Posted:
in macOS edited January 2014
So from (sometime in) January all new Mac's are only going to be able to boot OSX, no OS9 booting at all. What is going to happen to commercial disk utils like Norton and Disk Warrior? These apps require to be booted from a separate drive to do there disk repair activities. They currently ship with OS9 booting disks, but when OS9 boot is disabled, in hardware by Apple this is no longer going to be possible. Will apple create a special OSX for them (like boot's on the install disk), or will they be allowed to create there own? They can't expect users to create there own, via some util (not all users will have a CDR drive).
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 22
    chuckerchucker Posts: 5,089member
    Disk Warrior will be OS X soon, I've heard.
  • Reply 2 of 22
    [quote]Originally posted by Chucker:

    <strong>Disk Warrior will be OS X soon, I've heard.</strong><hr></blockquote>



    Noton Disk Doc will already run in OSX, but you can only repair Non Boot drives, to repair the boot disk you have to start up using the Norton CD. This boot's in OS9 (a cut down with minimal extensions etc. created by Norton) This won't be able to happen with OSX only Mac's
  • Reply 3 of 22
    aquaticaquatic Posts: 5,602member
    And that's all you need besides Data Rescue which is already on OS X.
  • Reply 4 of 22
    ast3r3xast3r3x Posts: 5,012member
    it would be nice if apple shipped ever computer with atleast a combo drive and made it so you could boot off a DVD
  • Reply 5 of 22
    defiantdefiant Posts: 4,876member
    what apple didn't tell you that OS 9 is still able to boot from a CD. it's just not able to boot from the harddisk. :cool:
  • Reply 6 of 22
    Where did you hear that, Defiant?
  • Reply 7 of 22
    defiantdefiant Posts: 4,876member
    uh, I believe it was either somewhere here on the forums or over at MacNN. dunno.
  • Reply 8 of 22
    wmfwmf Posts: 1,164member
    [quote]Originally posted by Defiant:

    <strong>what apple didn't tell you that OS 9 is still able to boot from a CD. it's just not able to boot from the harddisk. :cool: </strong><hr></blockquote>



    That doesn't make any sense. Future Macs are going to require new drivers, and Apple is not going to write those drivers for OS 9. It doesn't matter what you're booting from; if you don't have drivers it's not going to work.
  • Reply 9 of 22
    defiantdefiant Posts: 4,876member
    you don't make any sense, but we'll see.
  • Reply 10 of 22
    powerdocpowerdoc Posts: 8,123member
    If the next mac won' t about to boot from the HD i doubt that they will about to boot from a CD. I think they will add something in the bios who will prevent to boot OS 9.

    However i am not an engineer. We will see in just one month.



    Defiant : how is your PC ?
  • Reply 11 of 22
    amorphamorph Posts: 7,112member
    The first anyone had heard of it, as far as I can determine, was from a <a href="http://macintouch.com/"; target="_blank">MacInTouch</a> reader who had <a href="http://www.macintouch.com/mosxreader10.2pt34.html#nov13"; target="_blank">written in</a> saying he'd heard it from no less a source than Apple Tech Support. So there you go.



    I'm not sure how the logistics work either, unless the disabling is merely in Open Firmware, with an exception granted if the person's booting from CD. That should be well within OF's capabilities. That means no radical architectural changes right off the bat if it's true.



    If it's not true, then we can only hope that Apple has figured out a way to stuff a bootable OS X onto a CD with room for an application. It's not enough for the disk repair utilities to be OS X native - they have to be able to boot off an alternate drive in case the internal HDD is kaput.



    Or maybe Apple expects people to boot off of FW HDDs instead of CDs? I so, I wish them luck with that shift in strategy. They're going to need it.



    [ 12-08-2002: Message edited by: Amorph ]</p>
  • Reply 12 of 22
    defiantdefiant Posts: 4,876member
    [quote]Originally posted by Powerdoc:

    <strong>(...) Defiant : how is your PC ?</strong><hr></blockquote>



    more or less alive: he crashed on the first day I had it, and I found out that I'm not as productive at home as at work.
  • Reply 13 of 22
    defiantdefiant Posts: 4,876member
    [quote]Originally posted by Amorph:

    <strong>(...) Apple has figured out a way to stuff a bootable OS X onto a CD with room for an application. </strong><hr></blockquote>



    they have. look at Drive 10 from Micromat (drive10.com)
  • Reply 14 of 22
    aquaticaquatic Posts: 5,602member
    I'm excited for DiskWarrior 3
  • Reply 15 of 22
    amorphamorph Posts: 7,112member
    [quote]Originally posted by Defiant:

    <strong>



    they have. look at Drive 10 from Micromat (drive10.com)</strong><hr></blockquote>



    Ah. Good news. That takes care of that, then.



    Thanks for the heads up.
  • Reply 16 of 22
    bungebunge Posts: 7,329member
    The Xserve boots headless by automatically loading generic drivers that work with a number of peripherals. A CD could do the same (as well as a HDD) but would offer less functionality than true drivers. That would keep booting into OS 9 from being useful even if it could still happen. They wouldn't/won't be included with next year's machines, but if someone wanted to find the generic drivers and load them in the old System Folder I imagine even next year's machines will technically be able to boot into OS 9.
  • Reply 17 of 22
    [quote]Originally posted by bunge:

    <strong> I imagine even next year's machines will technically be able to boot into OS 9.</strong><hr></blockquote>



    Not if Apple does some sort of firmware hack to stop OS9 even being recognized as a boot volume.



    But if drive 10 comes on a OSX bootable CD it must have been solved.

    There is a util that will create a boot CD but it uses all sorts of ugly 'ram disk' hacks for the folders that need to be write enabled.
  • Reply 18 of 22
    quickquick Posts: 227member
    For the nostalgic souls among us, someone will eventually write an emulator to run OS9 in the not so distant future. This will not solve the problems with disk repair tools I guess, but this way you could still use the legacy OS.
  • Reply 19 of 22
    dfilerdfiler Posts: 3,420member
    [quote]Originally posted by Mediaman:

    <strong>... They currently ship with OS9 booting disks, but when OS9 boot is disabled, in hardware by Apple this is no longer going to be possible. </strong><hr></blockquote>



    'disabled'? heheh

    This will be done by 'them'. You know, the bad people who are out to get you.



    Did you also hate it when they 'disabled' support for leaded gasoline in passenger cars? Damn them! How dare they disable leaded gasoline in hardware!

  • Reply 20 of 22
    You guys are forgetting one very important thing: the PPC970 is going to be released mid-2003.



    Doesn't is seem more likely that OS9 will not run on new models (note the wording of the original announcement) because of a more significant architecture change? If you think OS9 will run on the PPC970 without any changes to the code, explain to me why it is that System 7 will not boot natively on my dual G4. Support for the CPU has to exist in the system software and development for OS9 has ended. In case you missed the eulogy, OS9 is dead for Apple's developers. Apple won't have to do any kinds of firmware hacks to stop OS9 from booting on the PPC970; it simply won't boot anyway.



    For the products that won't be getting the PPC970, sure, Apple may fiddle with the firmware.



    That said, yes, it is already possible to boot OSX on a CD. After all, the installer does. As mentioned, so does Drive 10. Also, Alsoft is rumored to release an update to DiskWarrior this month that will be completely OSX-native. You can even create your own OSX boot CD with a working Finder. Charles (the guy that made Pacifist) wrote <a href="http://www.charlessoft.com/"; target="_blank">BootCD</a> to do this.



    I don't really see this being a major problem.
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