May now the voices of reason begin to cry out over the insanity of Apple's MACK-truck-flattened abominations they call "keyboards." Bring back tactile feedback and keys that sink down more than 3mm when you tap on them. Apple, stop trying to bring us back to 1984 with a standard keyboard that has the numeric keypad hacked off (yes, I am aware you can get the keypad for free as an optional choice, but only via Apple's store). Apple used to make excellent keyboards. They now are trying to get us all into the iPhone groove. Indeed, I have little doubt that Jobs and Ive both want a 100% non-mechanical keyboard in the future, with recent keyboards from Apple acting as mere stepping-stones to a truly horrific tomorrow. (And yes, I am well aware of the availability of 3rd party keyboards. But some of us would rather not pay extra. And one must also admit that most of those 3rd party keyboards are for Windows users. It's all about What Apple Offers, not about what 3rd parties may bring us.)
Good luck with that! Most people (myself included) think the current keyboard action is the best they have ever used. I hate typing in an old style keyboard after being spoiled by the new design.
I insisted I would never buy a glossy screen. I ordered a 13" MBP and Power Support matt film on the same day (so I could rationalize my glossy screen purchase) . To my surprise the glossy screen, which has a good antiglare coating, is terrific. I applied the matt film and promptly removed it. I am now a glossy screen fan.
Indeed, I have little doubt that Jobs and Ive both want a 100% non-mechanical keyboard in the future
I would love a 100% non-mechanical keyboard with haptic feedback. One that is the size of the now standard keyboard, without the numeric keypad, actually displays the character you will get when pressed, will display a numeric keypad when you want it, and even allow applications to display their own keyboards -- think calculator in scientific mode.
I also hope the backtrack to matte screens is only a "quick fix" and what we'll have in the future will be glass anti-glare, anti-reflective screens.
Total bullshit. Check out the photos in this post. To me, the matte looks a hell of a lot more usable outside than does the glossy. If either of you would care to provide photographs to back up your claims, I'd like to see them.
Forget the photography. Anybody can setup or control the image, as is evidenced in the linked pics.
Just take them outside and test them side by side. And do yourself a favor. Try it on a word processing document or even viewing a web page such as here or Macworld. White pages don't produce a reflection or glare.
Worse is the comparative pics displayed in the article. Anybody who has studied physics in high school knows why one is more reflective than the other just by looking at the photo.
And for those that like matte, our Apple stores sell matte overlay screens. Not selling much, but they are there on the shelf to choose from.
Yay! It's about time. I've carried a 15" inch MBP and Powerbook since 2001. For me it's the perfect size. This year I was forced to switch to the 17" because there was no Matte option in the 15" MBP Line..
To make matters worse, I decided that I would go ahead and get the glossy screen, since that is where the industry is going and Apple decided that all laptops in their lines come with glossy screens I thought that I would purchase glossy and learn to love it.
I will admit the glossy screen is beautiful. Color saturation and accuracy are exactly as Apple and other industry leaders describe them. However, two days after I purchased my new MBP I was sick. I could not use my computer in half of the environments that I normally did. I found myself having headaches from the reflection on the screen.
I returned to Apple and paid the 230 dollar restocking fee, the additional charge for the 17-inch (still 2799 at the time) and the extra 50 dollars for the matte. Total: 680 dollars plus tax to learn I hate glossy.
I am very excited that Apple has chosen to add matte back to the 15" line of notebooks.
At least there are manufactures left in the world that realize that every decision might not be the best. Bravo Apple.
Why? Because it proves you wrong? That photo is of a unibody MacBook Pro with glossy at full brightness, and a unibody MacBook Pro with matte at full brightness. The glossy reflects like crazy and the matte doesn't. Surely if glossy beats matte hands-down outside, a photograph wouldn't show the opposite? The photos are not taken at weird angles, but at what looks to me to be normal viewing position.
I (via someone else's photos) have provided evidence that matte beats glossy outside, you have nothing to back up your waffling.
Part of me is happy at matte coming back -- but the other half wishes at least that the http://macmatte.wordpress.com site might have at least gotten 500 comments. I guess the site continues to soldier on until matte comes back to iMacs and Cinema Displays, and even ... gasp .. the 13".
Okay I'm F..... PIST, This is bullshit on Apple's part, I made the purchase in December with knowledge this was my only choice. As an FCP Editor I HATE glossy , 6 months later Apple back peddles because the ear full they got fro the professional industry. DO I have another $3000 to drop on a Macbook Pro? NO. Well there is no other company like Apple out there, they need to just F.... offering antiglare displays on all there new products.
Nice. Too bad that it uses a grey bezel though. That makes no sense. A matte black bezel frames the image so much nicer. That's passive-aggressive Apple though, no matter what they give you, they always insist on taking something away at the same time.
The return of Firewire AND Matte. Wow. Is this because of Jobs or because he hasn't been around much till recently (is he still working from home some days?)...
Nice. Too bad that it uses a grey bezel though. That makes no sense. A matte black bezel frames the image so much nicer. That's passive-aggressive Apple though, no matter what they give you, they always insist on taking something away at the same time.
Just like no matter what Apple does, people still insist on bitching about it. Were all just gonna have to realize that Apple cannot make everyone 100% happy with every product release. What looks cool to 10 million people may look like shit for 2 million people. If you don't like it, don't buy it. Or, go find something else that suits your needs, whether its another Apple product or even another brand.
Apple would say it's because most people buy glossy. They have to buy matte screens in lower stocks. The $50 covers the cost.
See I was under the impression it was the other way around, where more people wanted matte. They have the numbers though I guess. If it was the other way around, it would really appear as though they were taking advantage of that and getting some extra cash from everyone for the most logical choice in the two.
The iVisor costs like 35 bucks. I guess an extra 15 to have it actually part of the screen aint too bad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macxpress
Because its not free for Apple to re-engineer a way to securely put a matte panel in it?
Jesus people! Apple gives people what they want and people are STILL BITCHING!!!! Do you want Apple to just give you the damn laptop?
Amazing. I simply ask why it cost so much, looking for an honest response, and I'm told that I'm bitching and I expect a free laptop.
Yeah that's it. I think Apple should give us free laptops because this matte screen business costs too much.
Why? Because it proves you wrong? That photo is of a unibody MacBook Pro with glossy at full brightness, and a unibody MacBook Pro with matte at full brightness. The glossy reflects like crazy and the matte doesn't. Surely if glossy beats matte hands-down outside, a photograph wouldn't show the opposite? The photos are not taken at weird angles, but at what looks to me to be normal viewing position.
I (via someone else's photos) have provided evidence that matte beats glossy outside, you have nothing to back up your waffling.
The objects are not in the exact same place, the camera is not in the same positions, the lighting in the background varies, etc.
Of course the glossy will reflect more than the matte.
But the matte has drawbacks as well. In most cases, we don't work on applications or documents most of the time with black or dark backgrounds. Pure white backgrounds as one uses in word processing, vs the extreme to black, doesn't cause reflection or glare.
Using the MacBook Pro (glossy) on the boat is a hell of a lot better than our mattes.
By the way, matte does reflect. We just tested the Museum Glass and it reflects as well. Everything does in the right position. As everything doesn't in the right position.
Bottom line. As I suggested, take them both out into the daylight before you make a decision. Many have changed their minds, i.e., "the gloss doesn't bother me as much as I thought it would," "The gloss is so much more vibrant, it works better for me," to "I like the matte better because I don't get any glare."
But to unilaterally hate glossy because of what others have said and not make the final judgement yourself under your ideal conditions is ludicrous.
Everybody has the choice now, why not let them decide for themselves?
Comments
May now the voices of reason begin to cry out over the insanity of Apple's MACK-truck-flattened abominations they call "keyboards." Bring back tactile feedback and keys that sink down more than 3mm when you tap on them. Apple, stop trying to bring us back to 1984 with a standard keyboard that has the numeric keypad hacked off (yes, I am aware you can get the keypad for free as an optional choice, but only via Apple's store). Apple used to make excellent keyboards. They now are trying to get us all into the iPhone groove. Indeed, I have little doubt that Jobs and Ive both want a 100% non-mechanical keyboard in the future, with recent keyboards from Apple acting as mere stepping-stones to a truly horrific tomorrow. (And yes, I am well aware of the availability of 3rd party keyboards. But some of us would rather not pay extra. And one must also admit that most of those 3rd party keyboards are for Windows users. It's all about What Apple Offers, not about what 3rd parties may bring us.)
Good luck with that! Most people (myself included) think the current keyboard action is the best they have ever used. I hate typing in an old style keyboard after being spoiled by the new design.
Indeed, I have little doubt that Jobs and Ive both want a 100% non-mechanical keyboard in the future
I would love a 100% non-mechanical keyboard with haptic feedback. One that is the size of the now standard keyboard, without the numeric keypad, actually displays the character you will get when pressed, will display a numeric keypad when you want it, and even allow applications to display their own keyboards -- think calculator in scientific mode.
I also hope the backtrack to matte screens is only a "quick fix" and what we'll have in the future will be glass anti-glare, anti-reflective screens.
Total bullshit. Check out the photos in this post. To me, the matte looks a hell of a lot more usable outside than does the glossy. If either of you would care to provide photographs to back up your claims, I'd like to see them.
Forget the photography. Anybody can setup or control the image, as is evidenced in the linked pics.
Just take them outside and test them side by side. And do yourself a favor. Try it on a word processing document or even viewing a web page such as here or Macworld. White pages don't produce a reflection or glare.
Worse is the comparative pics displayed in the article. Anybody who has studied physics in high school knows why one is more reflective than the other just by looking at the photo.
And for those that like matte, our Apple stores sell matte overlay screens. Not selling much, but they are there on the shelf to choose from.
To make matters worse, I decided that I would go ahead and get the glossy screen, since that is where the industry is going and Apple decided that all laptops in their lines come with glossy screens I thought that I would purchase glossy and learn to love it.
I will admit the glossy screen is beautiful. Color saturation and accuracy are exactly as Apple and other industry leaders describe them. However, two days after I purchased my new MBP I was sick. I could not use my computer in half of the environments that I normally did. I found myself having headaches from the reflection on the screen.
I returned to Apple and paid the 230 dollar restocking fee, the additional charge for the 17-inch (still 2799 at the time) and the extra 50 dollars for the matte. Total: 680 dollars plus tax to learn I hate glossy.
I am very excited that Apple has chosen to add matte back to the 15" line of notebooks.
At least there are manufactures left in the world that realize that every decision might not be the best. Bravo Apple.
Forget the photography.
Why? Because it proves you wrong? That photo is of a unibody MacBook Pro with glossy at full brightness, and a unibody MacBook Pro with matte at full brightness. The glossy reflects like crazy and the matte doesn't. Surely if glossy beats matte hands-down outside, a photograph wouldn't show the opposite? The photos are not taken at weird angles, but at what looks to me to be normal viewing position.
I (via someone else's photos) have provided evidence that matte beats glossy outside, you have nothing to back up your waffling.
Is the matte display still glass or is it like the old displays?
Old Displays. No extra glass. You made me wonder, is my anti-glare MBP lighter than a stock MBP?
Agree completely. Apple can do whatever they like, just let me choose and I will pay for it.
Can I have my verizon iPhone now please?
Can someone explain why it's $50?
Can someone explain why it's $50?
Because its not free for Apple to re-engineer a way to securely put a matte panel in it?
Jesus people! Apple gives people what they want and people are STILL BITCHING!!!! Do you want Apple to just give you the damn laptop?
Nice. Too bad that it uses a grey bezel though. That makes no sense. A matte black bezel frames the image so much nicer. That's passive-aggressive Apple though, no matter what they give you, they always insist on taking something away at the same time.
Just like no matter what Apple does, people still insist on bitching about it. Were all just gonna have to realize that Apple cannot make everyone 100% happy with every product release. What looks cool to 10 million people may look like shit for 2 million people. If you don't like it, don't buy it. Or, go find something else that suits your needs, whether its another Apple product or even another brand.
Apple would say it's because most people buy glossy. They have to buy matte screens in lower stocks. The $50 covers the cost.
See I was under the impression it was the other way around, where more people wanted matte. They have the numbers though I guess. If it was the other way around, it would really appear as though they were taking advantage of that and getting some extra cash from everyone for the most logical choice in the two.
The iVisor costs like 35 bucks. I guess an extra 15 to have it actually part of the screen aint too bad.
Because its not free for Apple to re-engineer a way to securely put a matte panel in it?
Jesus people! Apple gives people what they want and people are STILL BITCHING!!!! Do you want Apple to just give you the damn laptop?
Amazing. I simply ask why it cost so much, looking for an honest response, and I'm told that I'm bitching and I expect a free laptop.
Yeah that's it. I think Apple should give us free laptops because this matte screen business costs too much.
Why? Because it proves you wrong? That photo is of a unibody MacBook Pro with glossy at full brightness, and a unibody MacBook Pro with matte at full brightness. The glossy reflects like crazy and the matte doesn't. Surely if glossy beats matte hands-down outside, a photograph wouldn't show the opposite? The photos are not taken at weird angles, but at what looks to me to be normal viewing position.
I (via someone else's photos) have provided evidence that matte beats glossy outside, you have nothing to back up your waffling.
The objects are not in the exact same place, the camera is not in the same positions, the lighting in the background varies, etc.
Of course the glossy will reflect more than the matte.
But the matte has drawbacks as well. In most cases, we don't work on applications or documents most of the time with black or dark backgrounds. Pure white backgrounds as one uses in word processing, vs the extreme to black, doesn't cause reflection or glare.
Using the MacBook Pro (glossy) on the boat is a hell of a lot better than our mattes.
By the way, matte does reflect. We just tested the Museum Glass and it reflects as well. Everything does in the right position. As everything doesn't in the right position.
Bottom line. As I suggested, take them both out into the daylight before you make a decision. Many have changed their minds, i.e., "the gloss doesn't bother me as much as I thought it would," "The gloss is so much more vibrant, it works better for me," to "I like the matte better because I don't get any glare."
But to unilaterally hate glossy because of what others have said and not make the final judgement yourself under your ideal conditions is ludicrous.
Everybody has the choice now, why not let them decide for themselves?