I think it's an eBook reader, nothing more. They will start to sell eBooks on iTunes at the same time.
seems way too specific of a use for something as costly as a 10" Touch Screen. The only way they could sell just a reader, like the kindle would be to sell it for $200. There has to be more to the rumored device.
They would never design the keyboard to only appear within the little app window (even if the apps were really borrowed from the iPhone) - they'd be adapted to have the keyboard appear in a larger area so you could actually use it on a screen that large.
That probably won't fall into your price range given the fact that the archos 7 costs $349, does not have a full OS, uses the same processor and less ram than the 3GS.
Considering the biggest OLED screen you can currently buy is 11" and that is going for $1000's does anybody seriously believe that apple is going to release a 10" OLED product that is affordable in this climate?
It would be nice, but it's simply not going to happen. The ipod touch maybe as smaller screens OLEDS are already competitive.
So anything else he has said has lost all credibility for me
I scrolled through all of the posts to see if someone had noticed this.
Yes, this would be a pretty big OLED screen for this point in time.
Now, unless Apple could guarantee a large sales number, say hundreds of thousands, this would add a lot to the cost.
So, the Sony listed for $2,500, but can now be had for $1,800 with an 11" screen. But Sony has only sold a few thousand around the world since it first came out.
Apple would do better.
If this is an OLED screen, than the $900 price could be right.
The real question is whether enough people would be willing to spend the extra hundred or two for the privilege of getting the first device of a new line of products that costs extra, because of that screen.
If this device is more than a giant iPod, its quite possible, but I think the price, OLED or not, would have to be $800 or lower.
seems way too specific of a use for something as costly as a 10" Touch Screen. The only way they could sell just a reader, like the kindle would be to sell it for $200. There has to be more to the rumored device.
Maybe the books (and potentially other iTunes content: songs, movies..) will come in the form of Cocoa Touch programs. I mean, in the same way a DVD or Blu-ray value-adds, but even more so.
A media-interactity device, a way to touch your songs as well as just hear them, the iMedia?
I can't think of a single Apple product in the "post-beleaguered era" that didn't sell enough not only to cover costs but make a handy profit. To think that they will push something out without thinking of it's saleability is like betting against the wind.
The Mac Cube, AppleTV, MacBook Air.
While I wouldn't call any of these unsuccessful and I'm sure they make a profit, they are hardly prime examples of success, either. Based purely on the rumors we've heard so far, if this is the device that's coming I think it would fall into the same category of success as these other products (ie, lukewarm, at best).
[Note, I have no idea what the sales figures for the MBA are. I'm including it here only because I've never heard of it having high sales numbers other than when it first came out.]
PS: Apple, please just give me my 6" iPod touch. Thanks.
My money says that the "tablet" will be branded as the new iBook which will run just as the myriad of rumors say it will. Apple already owns every aspect of the iBook trademark and this device will prove to actually be the reason that every laptop was branded under the MacBook name. EXCEPT....the major marketing angle will the "Book" in iBOOK. A bookstore will be added to iTunes utilizing the open 'eBook' standard (just like Barnes and Noble is committed to). A high res full color - hopefully OLED - touchpad ebook aimed directly at kicking the shit out of Amazon just like the iPhone is kicking Palm, RIM, Nokia, PSP, and DS.
Apple already has portable devices that will run Snow Leopard, they're called "laptops." The have built in keyboards and touch pads around which the entire UI is built.
If, as is being broadly assumed, Apple brings a touch tablet to market, then it must have a UI optimized for such a device. Such a UI would bear little resemblance to Snow Leopard, which has evolved from over 20 years of keyboard/mouse UI conventions.
That doesn't mean that a tablet from Apple couldn't have computational heft far beyond what an iPhone can muster, but an iPhone has the UI it has because of constrained screen real estate, not compromised computing power. A more powerful touch based device would still need an optimized UI, but that wouldn't necessarily make it less a real computer than a laptop, just one with a different set of assumptions about how the user interacts with it.
So in that sense it likely could be running "Snow Leopard", which is to say a larger subset of the OS X underpinnings that power all of Apple's machines.
What matters is what software this device will be compatible with. If the version of Snow Leopard running on it is compatible with a wide range of software, then the device has some value. If, on the other hand, Apple creates a device that cannot run any apps other than those created specifically for it, there is no chance of this thing going anywhere if Apple also expects customers to pay significantly more for it than a typical laptop.
Also, I see no indication that this thing is in any way, shape or form a response to the netbook. I bought a netbook recently, despite being a long-time Apple user (before that it was the Amiga). The reason is that I am going overseas for a trip and plan on shooting lots of HD footage. My camera needs a 16Gb SDHC card to store 48 minutes of video. It was cheaper to buy the netbook rather than just keep on stockpiling SDHC cards which in their Class 6 form, which my HD camera calls for, are still quite expensive. Now that I have the netbook, I'm having fun with the thing, surfing the net, etc.
Netbooks sell well because they're so inexpensive and they are a good solution in a lot of situations where costlier devices just don't get it done. Heading overseas, I like the idea of a compact little laptop that will be helpful in storing my video footage.
What exactly is the purpose of this tablet Mac? Certainly that is a question that Apple execs have no doubt been asking themselves as opposed to building the thing if only because they can. What Apple has done in the past and what they are likely to do in this instance is bring to market a product that taken as a whole enhances the lives of customers in a manner that no other product can. A really costly "netbook" does no such thing. A device that requires a whole new set of software apps doesn't cut it either. I'm sure that once the product comes to market, we'll all understand and the company will have another success on its hands. It can't just be a pitch like, "Our tablet is better than their netbooks because it's cooler. Line up and pay a premium." If this device is coming to market, it means Apple has found a way to implement a device that adds something of substance to the party. Otherwise, with profits continuing to roll in and an already diversified product mix giving Apple plenty of means to acquire still more wealth, there's no reason for Apple to spawn a pointless, overpriced toy with a few neat little gimmicks to amuse us with. That's more in line with what the competition tends to do.
Not at all. My price-point is based on applicability and comparability to similar devices. My opinion is in no way based on some miserly crankyness about the profitability of big business.
Let's look at the two theories about this rumored device:
Theory #1: it's like a jumbo iPod Touch with Multi-tasking and faster processor. Given the only thing that's even close to an Apple tablet-like device is the Archos 7 - 160 Gb (which retails for $349). Look it up. This is the most likely option for Apple since a tablet PC would be too tedious to operate completely on touch (even the best tablets out there still have the swivel keyboard)
Theory #2: It's more like a full OS X based tablet computer (like a tablet MB Air) the only things that really comes close to that is a tablet PC (which don't even come in a 10" screen) retails for around $1,099 (Lenovo Thinkpad X200). This is probably more the fans' dream than a reality. but then $899 sounds very feasible for this theory.
So that said, my price-range thought of $349 -$499 is based more the theory #1. But, if any part of theory #2 is correct, I gave the price range the upper end to compete with the most fully-equipped Dell 10" Netbook (which was around $500).
just thought i'd clarify. If Apple wants this product to compete, they need to stay within a range. Knowing Apple though, I'd say they typically price themselves higher than everyone else. So maybe $399-$599 (based on storage capacity).
Happy?
considering the iphone without a contract is $600.... your on another planet
My money says that the "tablet" will be branded as the new iBook which will run just as the myriad of rumors say it will. Apple already owns every aspect of the iBook trademark and this device will prove to actually be the reason that every laptop was branded under the MacBook name. EXCEPT....the major marketing angle will the "Book" in iBOOK. A bookstore will be added to iTunes utilizing the open 'eBook' standard (just like Barnes and Noble is committed to). A high res full color - hopefully OLED - touchpad ebook aimed directly at kicking the shit out of Amazon just like the iPhone is kicking Palm, RIM, Nokia, PSP, and DS.
I tend to agree with this, and think the fact that Apple moved its entire notebook line (with the exception of the legacy white plastic model) to the "Macbook Pro" nomenclature suggests they were clearing the "MacBook/iBook" space for something different.
My suspicion is the new device will take the "MacBook" slot in the line up, intended for people who want an inexpensive notebook that's fun and easy to use, for the things most people want a small portable for: listening to music, watching video, surfing, social networking, email and some light duty productivity app stuff. The MacBook Pro line will be for, well, "pros", people who need more power and flexibility to run a broader range of apps.
Of course, people will complain that it's too expensive, because they'll insist on comparing it to cheap netbooks or "a big iPod", but as usual such people will be missing the point. Nobody yet has figure out how to make a touch tablet that lots of people actually want to use, if Apple can do that they've created a new category and price comparisons to existing categories are irrelevant. People will pay for something they want, and an Apple designed touch tablet in the $800 dollar range could be very desirable.
What matters is what software this device will be compatible with. If the version of Snow Leopard running on it is compatible with a wide range of software, then the device has some value. If, on the other hand, Apple creates a device that cannot run any apps other than those created specifically for it, there is no chance of this thing going anywhere if Apple also expects customers to pay significantly more for it than a typical laptop.
I agree that the purpose of such a device has not been well argued. Without a "killer app” the device has no purpose, but it certainly can’t be Mac OS X or iPhone OS X because neither one works well for that size and type device.
Where I don’t agree with you is that if it doesn’t run Mac OS X apps then it’s an automatic fail. The iPhone doesn’t do Mac apps and when it came out it didn’t even have an app store, and it costs more than the low end Mac Mini and the average price for non-Mac notebooks, which are bother considerably more powerful than it. With such a device being a hybrid between the iPhone and a notebook in many ways and the legwork for many of the frameworks and UI already figured out for iPhone OS X I don’t think it’s impossible to think of Apple making a 3rd SDK designed for their tablet apps.
One “killer app” option is that they can also make a book store and have periodical subscriptions in a way that may actually save the dying newspapers and magazine industries.
Considering the biggest OLED screen you can currently buy is 11" and that is going for $1000's does anybody seriously believe that apple is going to release a 10" OLED product that is affordable in this climate?
Really the selling price generally has nothing to do with the cost to produce something. You certainly want to more than break even but that isn't a problem. Apple should be able to get a 10 inch screen into this device for about $125. That is likely stiff too and depends upon quality and what is integrated into the screen.
As for this economic climate if you repeat often enough that it is awful, then you will start to believe it. Worst you will start to behave like the end is near and just create more problems for you and the economy. Heck where I work we are actually adding workers and brng production back from overseas. It is not all dark and gloomy.
Quote:
It would be nice, but it's simply not going to happen. The ipod touch maybe as smaller screens OLEDS are already competitive.
Every bit of information I have indicates that OLED of any size should be much cheaper to produce, than LCD's, in the long run. The current hold ups have more to do with stability of the organics and refinements of other components.
Quote:
So anything else he has said has lost all credibility for me
Well great for you, you dismiss other people based on your own misconceptions. It would be nice if you analyzed what is happening out there right now and then make you decision. A 10" OLED screen doesn't have to be cheap. More importantly Apple is exactly what a manufacture needs to ramp up a new production line for such displays. It means volume sales to justify competitive pricing and expenditures for highly automated production lines.
... I can't think of a single Apple product in the "post-beleaguered era" that didn't sell enough not only to cover costs but make a handy profit. To think that they will push something out without thinking of it's saleability is like betting against the wind.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin
The Mac Cube, AppleTV, MacBook Air. ...
These were all sucessful, and all turned a profit.
- The Cube was really popular, but had a lot of engineering problems. Apple discontinued it for that reason despite it's popularity. People were generally pissed off that it was cancelled at the time.
- AppleTV, despite all the techies saying (over and over and over again), that they can "do the same thing with a mini" is also a very popular device that continues to sell very well.
- MacBook Air, despite the fact that some techies don't like it, is actually *wildly* successful and hugely popular.
There's a big difference between how a product is received on the tech blogs and the real world reception it gets. When the Air debuted it was roundly criticised, but it was so popular Apple literally couldn't make them fast enough. It's still popular today although if you ask the local tech dude he'll say it's a "girls computer" or "underpowered" or some such (ironically, even as he types on his Dell mini 9.) This is more to do with the techie version of machismo than any reall assessment of product success or design.
The most important thing anyway, (and in fact the point I was making), is that Apple doesn't just release crap without thinking about sales and everything they release is released because they think it will sell at the price that they want to sell it at. They have something between a 95% and 100% sucess rate at this sort of thing and that's why I was saying all the comments about "it won't sell at that price" are dumb.
I agree that the purpose of such a device has not been well argued. Without a "killer app? the device has no purpose, but it certainly can?t be Mac OS X or iPhone OS X because neither one works well for that size and type device.
Where I don?t agree with you is that if it doesn?t run Mac OS X apps then it?s an automatic fail....
One rumor that is pretty consistent in regards to this tablet device is that it'll be powered by an ARM cpu. There hasn't been any rumors at all, that I'm aware of, where Atom is mentioned.
If that's the case it'll most likely be iPhone OS or a variant. SL removes all ability to run on RISC cpus, so that make's full Mac OSX unlikely in my book.
With that in mind I have two unanswered questions:
What's the killer App?
Will it run flash video?
A tablet that can't play flash video would seem to be a DOA product. I can't see a lot of people paying $900 and not getting the 'full' internet experience. Likewise, what productivity apps will there be fro this device. Again at the rumored price of $900, I really want to do more than surf the web and check email.
They would never design the keyboard to only appear within the little app window (even if the apps were really borrowed from the iPhone) - they'd be adapted to have the keyboard appear in a larger area so you could actually use it on a screen that large.
There is good reason to keep iPhone apps operating like iPhone apps. Number one is the issue of focus and associated keyboard. Second is that a iPhone sized keyboard in some instances will be a faster and better solution.
Think about it a bit and imagine a touch screen keyboard stretched across the screen and a bunch of little iPhone programs multitasking on the screen. Also imagine that the bottom of the screen contains a dock, but this is a dock that is amped up to be a central point of interaction between the user and executing programs. Keyboards across the bottom of the screen may not make sense at all if you are dealing with a bunch of smaller apps.
Now this doesn't preclude a larger keyboard for the device just that your complaints are not well thought out about the support of iPhone apps. Think of iphone apps as a level of compatibility that is eclipsed with enhanced API's to better leverage the larger screen. If this is in fact what we are getting then I really think it is a smart move on Apples part. It means lots of apps right out of the gate and plenty of time for developers to leverage the machine with newer software updates. Think of this as a bridging feature.
Hi, i've followed the speculations about the upcoming tablet a long time and am quite enthusiastic about it. But I don't believe the videos....things just don't add up.
The screen in the video is definetifly not oled. When he presses the app button in the dock, you'll see those small waves or fluctouations or call it whatever you want. That wouldn't happen to an oled screen, cause there are no liquids, like in liquid crystal displays.
Recently Apple gives all its new products, iphone, new macbooks, screens a hard glass cover, this would prevent this formations on an lcd screen.
So, concidering that he neglected to demonstrate a multi touch feature whatsoever, that could differentiate this touch screen from the mass, i think we saw just an ordinary touchscreen device.
My money says that the "tablet" will be branded as the new iBook which will run just as the myriad of rumors say it will. Apple already owns every aspect of the iBook trademark and this device will prove to actually be the reason that every laptop was branded under the MacBook name. EXCEPT....the major marketing angle will the "Book" in iBOOK. A bookstore will be added to iTunes utilizing the open 'eBook' standard (just like Barnes and Noble is committed to). A high res full color - hopefully OLED - touchpad ebook aimed directly at kicking the shit out of Amazon just like the iPhone is kicking Palm, RIM, Nokia, PSP, and DS.
I've said before that I agree with this rebranding idea (even though I was not the first to suggest it)... if there even is one, iBook will be the new iPad/iTablet/whatever.
A tablet that can't play flash video would seem to be a DOA product. I can't see a lot of people paying $900 and not getting the 'full' internet experience. Likewise, what productivity apps will there be fro this device. Again at the rumored price of $900, I really want to do more than surf the web and check email.
IMO, the killer app would be Keynote. In fact I'd go as far as to say, if they don't get Keynote running on this device, then I probably won't want one. If they do, then it replaces my old PowerBook. If they don't, it doesn't.
One rumor that is pretty consistent in regards to this tablet device is that it'll be powered by an ARM cpu. There hasn't been any rumors at all, that I'm aware of, where Atom is mentioned.
If that's the case it'll most likely be iPhone OS or a variant. SL removes all ability to run on RISC cpus, so that make's full Mac OSX unlikely in my book.
With that in mind I have two unanswered questions:
What's the killer App?
Will it run flash video?
A tablet that can't play flash video would seem to be a DOA product. I can't see a lot of people paying $900 and not getting the 'full' internet experience. Likewise, what productivity apps will there be fro this device. Again at the rumored price of $900, I really want to do more than surf the web and check email.
My guess is that it would ship with a touch optimized version of iLife. The recent UI changes to iMovie have been suspiciously touch friendly, and it's easy to imaging a multi-touch iPhoto and Garage Band with finger friendly sliders for adjustments.
The iWork apps would be tougher to modify, but then again a tablet like this wouldn't really be designed for heavy duty world processing or number crunching, any more than netbooks are. Keynote, on the other hand would be a natural for the touch treatment, and I can imagine modifications to the UI that would make it a completely killer presentation tool on a tablet (flick to advance a slide, real time pinch zooming, etc.).
At any rate, I would bet that Apple has been devoting a fair amount of development time to getting a full set of apps that work really, really well in this form factor. Some people think it would be too much to create yet another UI that blends Snow Leopard with the iPhone, but I wonder if such a UI might not be, in fact, the "killer app."
As has been pointed out, the iPhone UI was a revelation, even before the App Store. Imagine a 10" tablet with that kind of wow factor but far more capability. Imagine Spaces being incorporated as part of the experience, so that your entire app environment is never more than a flick away. Cover Flow letting you literally thumb through docs and media, with Quick Look just a tap away. Accelerometer based screen reorientation. And whither Inkwell? Has Apple possibly been slaving away on top notch handwriting recognition?
When you think about some of the things Apple has been doing with their desktop UI for that last few years, and we hear about how long this device has been in development, it makes you wonder if Apple hasn't been laying the groundwork for a different kind of computing paradigm for a while.
IMO, the killer app would be Keynote. In fact I'd go as far as to say, if they don't get Keynote running on this device, then I probably won't want one. If they do, then it replaces my old PowerBook. If they don't, it doesn't.
Comments
I think it's an eBook reader, nothing more. They will start to sell eBooks on iTunes at the same time.
seems way too specific of a use for something as costly as a 10" Touch Screen. The only way they could sell just a reader, like the kindle would be to sell it for $200. There has to be more to the rumored device.
or this...but the Apple Version...http://www.archos.com/products/nb/ar...try=us&lang=en
That probably won't fall into your price range given the fact that the archos 7 costs $349, does not have a full OS, uses the same processor and less ram than the 3GS.
Edit: it looks like it will be in the $700 - $800 range, at least based on UK prices http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/04/a...ced-in-the-uk/
Considering the biggest OLED screen you can currently buy is 11" and that is going for $1000's does anybody seriously believe that apple is going to release a 10" OLED product that is affordable in this climate?
It would be nice, but it's simply not going to happen. The ipod touch maybe as smaller screens OLEDS are already competitive.
So anything else he has said has lost all credibility for me
I scrolled through all of the posts to see if someone had noticed this.
Yes, this would be a pretty big OLED screen for this point in time.
Now, unless Apple could guarantee a large sales number, say hundreds of thousands, this would add a lot to the cost.
So, the Sony listed for $2,500, but can now be had for $1,800 with an 11" screen. But Sony has only sold a few thousand around the world since it first came out.
Apple would do better.
If this is an OLED screen, than the $900 price could be right.
The real question is whether enough people would be willing to spend the extra hundred or two for the privilege of getting the first device of a new line of products that costs extra, because of that screen.
If this device is more than a giant iPod, its quite possible, but I think the price, OLED or not, would have to be $800 or lower.
seems way too specific of a use for something as costly as a 10" Touch Screen. The only way they could sell just a reader, like the kindle would be to sell it for $200. There has to be more to the rumored device.
Maybe the books (and potentially other iTunes content: songs, movies..) will come in the form of Cocoa Touch programs. I mean, in the same way a DVD or Blu-ray value-adds, but even more so.
A media-interactity device, a way to touch your songs as well as just hear them, the iMedia?
I can't think of a single Apple product in the "post-beleaguered era" that didn't sell enough not only to cover costs but make a handy profit. To think that they will push something out without thinking of it's saleability is like betting against the wind.
The Mac Cube, AppleTV, MacBook Air.
While I wouldn't call any of these unsuccessful and I'm sure they make a profit, they are hardly prime examples of success, either. Based purely on the rumors we've heard so far, if this is the device that's coming I think it would fall into the same category of success as these other products (ie, lukewarm, at best).
[Note, I have no idea what the sales figures for the MBA are. I'm including it here only because I've never heard of it having high sales numbers other than when it first came out.]
PS: Apple, please just give me my 6" iPod touch. Thanks.
If by "Snow Leopard" you mean the UI, then no.
Apple already has portable devices that will run Snow Leopard, they're called "laptops." The have built in keyboards and touch pads around which the entire UI is built.
If, as is being broadly assumed, Apple brings a touch tablet to market, then it must have a UI optimized for such a device. Such a UI would bear little resemblance to Snow Leopard, which has evolved from over 20 years of keyboard/mouse UI conventions.
That doesn't mean that a tablet from Apple couldn't have computational heft far beyond what an iPhone can muster, but an iPhone has the UI it has because of constrained screen real estate, not compromised computing power. A more powerful touch based device would still need an optimized UI, but that wouldn't necessarily make it less a real computer than a laptop, just one with a different set of assumptions about how the user interacts with it.
So in that sense it likely could be running "Snow Leopard", which is to say a larger subset of the OS X underpinnings that power all of Apple's machines.
What matters is what software this device will be compatible with. If the version of Snow Leopard running on it is compatible with a wide range of software, then the device has some value. If, on the other hand, Apple creates a device that cannot run any apps other than those created specifically for it, there is no chance of this thing going anywhere if Apple also expects customers to pay significantly more for it than a typical laptop.
Also, I see no indication that this thing is in any way, shape or form a response to the netbook. I bought a netbook recently, despite being a long-time Apple user (before that it was the Amiga). The reason is that I am going overseas for a trip and plan on shooting lots of HD footage. My camera needs a 16Gb SDHC card to store 48 minutes of video. It was cheaper to buy the netbook rather than just keep on stockpiling SDHC cards which in their Class 6 form, which my HD camera calls for, are still quite expensive. Now that I have the netbook, I'm having fun with the thing, surfing the net, etc.
Netbooks sell well because they're so inexpensive and they are a good solution in a lot of situations where costlier devices just don't get it done. Heading overseas, I like the idea of a compact little laptop that will be helpful in storing my video footage.
What exactly is the purpose of this tablet Mac? Certainly that is a question that Apple execs have no doubt been asking themselves as opposed to building the thing if only because they can. What Apple has done in the past and what they are likely to do in this instance is bring to market a product that taken as a whole enhances the lives of customers in a manner that no other product can. A really costly "netbook" does no such thing. A device that requires a whole new set of software apps doesn't cut it either. I'm sure that once the product comes to market, we'll all understand and the company will have another success on its hands. It can't just be a pitch like, "Our tablet is better than their netbooks because it's cooler. Line up and pay a premium." If this device is coming to market, it means Apple has found a way to implement a device that adds something of substance to the party. Otherwise, with profits continuing to roll in and an already diversified product mix giving Apple plenty of means to acquire still more wealth, there's no reason for Apple to spawn a pointless, overpriced toy with a few neat little gimmicks to amuse us with. That's more in line with what the competition tends to do.
Not at all. My price-point is based on applicability and comparability to similar devices. My opinion is in no way based on some miserly crankyness about the profitability of big business.
Let's look at the two theories about this rumored device:
Theory #1: it's like a jumbo iPod Touch with Multi-tasking and faster processor. Given the only thing that's even close to an Apple tablet-like device is the Archos 7 - 160 Gb (which retails for $349). Look it up. This is the most likely option for Apple since a tablet PC would be too tedious to operate completely on touch (even the best tablets out there still have the swivel keyboard)
Theory #2: It's more like a full OS X based tablet computer (like a tablet MB Air) the only things that really comes close to that is a tablet PC (which don't even come in a 10" screen) retails for around $1,099 (Lenovo Thinkpad X200). This is probably more the fans' dream than a reality. but then $899 sounds very feasible for this theory.
So that said, my price-range thought of $349 -$499 is based more the theory #1. But, if any part of theory #2 is correct, I gave the price range the upper end to compete with the most fully-equipped Dell 10" Netbook (which was around $500).
just thought i'd clarify. If Apple wants this product to compete, they need to stay within a range. Knowing Apple though, I'd say they typically price themselves higher than everyone else. So maybe $399-$599 (based on storage capacity).
Happy?
considering the iphone without a contract is $600.... your on another planet
My money says that the "tablet" will be branded as the new iBook which will run just as the myriad of rumors say it will. Apple already owns every aspect of the iBook trademark and this device will prove to actually be the reason that every laptop was branded under the MacBook name. EXCEPT....the major marketing angle will the "Book" in iBOOK. A bookstore will be added to iTunes utilizing the open 'eBook' standard (just like Barnes and Noble is committed to). A high res full color - hopefully OLED - touchpad ebook aimed directly at kicking the shit out of Amazon just like the iPhone is kicking Palm, RIM, Nokia, PSP, and DS.
I tend to agree with this, and think the fact that Apple moved its entire notebook line (with the exception of the legacy white plastic model) to the "Macbook Pro" nomenclature suggests they were clearing the "MacBook/iBook" space for something different.
My suspicion is the new device will take the "MacBook" slot in the line up, intended for people who want an inexpensive notebook that's fun and easy to use, for the things most people want a small portable for: listening to music, watching video, surfing, social networking, email and some light duty productivity app stuff. The MacBook Pro line will be for, well, "pros", people who need more power and flexibility to run a broader range of apps.
Of course, people will complain that it's too expensive, because they'll insist on comparing it to cheap netbooks or "a big iPod", but as usual such people will be missing the point. Nobody yet has figure out how to make a touch tablet that lots of people actually want to use, if Apple can do that they've created a new category and price comparisons to existing categories are irrelevant. People will pay for something they want, and an Apple designed touch tablet in the $800 dollar range could be very desirable.
What matters is what software this device will be compatible with. If the version of Snow Leopard running on it is compatible with a wide range of software, then the device has some value. If, on the other hand, Apple creates a device that cannot run any apps other than those created specifically for it, there is no chance of this thing going anywhere if Apple also expects customers to pay significantly more for it than a typical laptop.
I agree that the purpose of such a device has not been well argued. Without a "killer app” the device has no purpose, but it certainly can’t be Mac OS X or iPhone OS X because neither one works well for that size and type device.
Where I don’t agree with you is that if it doesn’t run Mac OS X apps then it’s an automatic fail. The iPhone doesn’t do Mac apps and when it came out it didn’t even have an app store, and it costs more than the low end Mac Mini and the average price for non-Mac notebooks, which are bother considerably more powerful than it. With such a device being a hybrid between the iPhone and a notebook in many ways and the legwork for many of the frameworks and UI already figured out for iPhone OS X I don’t think it’s impossible to think of Apple making a 3rd SDK designed for their tablet apps.
One “killer app” option is that they can also make a book store and have periodical subscriptions in a way that may actually save the dying newspapers and magazine industries.
Considering the biggest OLED screen you can currently buy is 11" and that is going for $1000's does anybody seriously believe that apple is going to release a 10" OLED product that is affordable in this climate?
Really the selling price generally has nothing to do with the cost to produce something. You certainly want to more than break even but that isn't a problem. Apple should be able to get a 10 inch screen into this device for about $125. That is likely stiff too and depends upon quality and what is integrated into the screen.
As for this economic climate if you repeat often enough that it is awful, then you will start to believe it. Worst you will start to behave like the end is near and just create more problems for you and the economy. Heck where I work we are actually adding workers and brng production back from overseas. It is not all dark and gloomy.
It would be nice, but it's simply not going to happen. The ipod touch maybe as smaller screens OLEDS are already competitive.
Every bit of information I have indicates that OLED of any size should be much cheaper to produce, than LCD's, in the long run. The current hold ups have more to do with stability of the organics and refinements of other components.
So anything else he has said has lost all credibility for me
Well great for you, you dismiss other people based on your own misconceptions. It would be nice if you analyzed what is happening out there right now and then make you decision. A 10" OLED screen doesn't have to be cheap. More importantly Apple is exactly what a manufacture needs to ramp up a new production line for such displays. It means volume sales to justify competitive pricing and expenditures for highly automated production lines.
Dave
... I can't think of a single Apple product in the "post-beleaguered era" that didn't sell enough not only to cover costs but make a handy profit. To think that they will push something out without thinking of it's saleability is like betting against the wind.
The Mac Cube, AppleTV, MacBook Air. ...
These were all sucessful, and all turned a profit.
- The Cube was really popular, but had a lot of engineering problems. Apple discontinued it for that reason despite it's popularity. People were generally pissed off that it was cancelled at the time.
- AppleTV, despite all the techies saying (over and over and over again), that they can "do the same thing with a mini" is also a very popular device that continues to sell very well.
- MacBook Air, despite the fact that some techies don't like it, is actually *wildly* successful and hugely popular.
There's a big difference between how a product is received on the tech blogs and the real world reception it gets. When the Air debuted it was roundly criticised, but it was so popular Apple literally couldn't make them fast enough. It's still popular today although if you ask the local tech dude he'll say it's a "girls computer" or "underpowered" or some such (ironically, even as he types on his Dell mini 9.) This is more to do with the techie version of machismo than any reall assessment of product success or design.
The most important thing anyway, (and in fact the point I was making), is that Apple doesn't just release crap without thinking about sales and everything they release is released because they think it will sell at the price that they want to sell it at. They have something between a 95% and 100% sucess rate at this sort of thing and that's why I was saying all the comments about "it won't sell at that price" are dumb.
I agree that the purpose of such a device has not been well argued. Without a "killer app? the device has no purpose, but it certainly can?t be Mac OS X or iPhone OS X because neither one works well for that size and type device.
Where I don?t agree with you is that if it doesn?t run Mac OS X apps then it?s an automatic fail....
One rumor that is pretty consistent in regards to this tablet device is that it'll be powered by an ARM cpu. There hasn't been any rumors at all, that I'm aware of, where Atom is mentioned.
If that's the case it'll most likely be iPhone OS or a variant. SL removes all ability to run on RISC cpus, so that make's full Mac OSX unlikely in my book.
With that in mind I have two unanswered questions:
What's the killer App?
Will it run flash video?
A tablet that can't play flash video would seem to be a DOA product. I can't see a lot of people paying $900 and not getting the 'full' internet experience. Likewise, what productivity apps will there be fro this device. Again at the rumored price of $900, I really want to do more than surf the web and check email.
They would never design the keyboard to only appear within the little app window (even if the apps were really borrowed from the iPhone) - they'd be adapted to have the keyboard appear in a larger area so you could actually use it on a screen that large.
There is good reason to keep iPhone apps operating like iPhone apps. Number one is the issue of focus and associated keyboard. Second is that a iPhone sized keyboard in some instances will be a faster and better solution.
Think about it a bit and imagine a touch screen keyboard stretched across the screen and a bunch of little iPhone programs multitasking on the screen. Also imagine that the bottom of the screen contains a dock, but this is a dock that is amped up to be a central point of interaction between the user and executing programs. Keyboards across the bottom of the screen may not make sense at all if you are dealing with a bunch of smaller apps.
Now this doesn't preclude a larger keyboard for the device just that your complaints are not well thought out about the support of iPhone apps. Think of iphone apps as a level of compatibility that is eclipsed with enhanced API's to better leverage the larger screen. If this is in fact what we are getting then I really think it is a smart move on Apples part. It means lots of apps right out of the gate and plenty of time for developers to leverage the machine with newer software updates. Think of this as a bridging feature.
Dave
The screen in the video is definetifly not oled. When he presses the app button in the dock, you'll see those small waves or fluctouations or call it whatever you want. That wouldn't happen to an oled screen, cause there are no liquids, like in liquid crystal displays.
Recently Apple gives all its new products, iphone, new macbooks, screens a hard glass cover, this would prevent this formations on an lcd screen.
So, concidering that he neglected to demonstrate a multi touch feature whatsoever, that could differentiate this touch screen from the mass, i think we saw just an ordinary touchscreen device.
My money says that the "tablet" will be branded as the new iBook which will run just as the myriad of rumors say it will. Apple already owns every aspect of the iBook trademark and this device will prove to actually be the reason that every laptop was branded under the MacBook name. EXCEPT....the major marketing angle will the "Book" in iBOOK. A bookstore will be added to iTunes utilizing the open 'eBook' standard (just like Barnes and Noble is committed to). A high res full color - hopefully OLED - touchpad ebook aimed directly at kicking the shit out of Amazon just like the iPhone is kicking Palm, RIM, Nokia, PSP, and DS.
I've said before that I agree with this rebranding idea (even though I was not the first to suggest it)... if there even is one, iBook will be the new iPad/iTablet/whatever.
A tablet that can't play flash video would seem to be a DOA product. I can't see a lot of people paying $900 and not getting the 'full' internet experience. Likewise, what productivity apps will there be fro this device. Again at the rumored price of $900, I really want to do more than surf the web and check email.
IMO, the killer app would be Keynote. In fact I'd go as far as to say, if they don't get Keynote running on this device, then I probably won't want one. If they do, then it replaces my old PowerBook. If they don't, it doesn't.
One rumor that is pretty consistent in regards to this tablet device is that it'll be powered by an ARM cpu. There hasn't been any rumors at all, that I'm aware of, where Atom is mentioned.
If that's the case it'll most likely be iPhone OS or a variant. SL removes all ability to run on RISC cpus, so that make's full Mac OSX unlikely in my book.
With that in mind I have two unanswered questions:
What's the killer App?
Will it run flash video?
A tablet that can't play flash video would seem to be a DOA product. I can't see a lot of people paying $900 and not getting the 'full' internet experience. Likewise, what productivity apps will there be fro this device. Again at the rumored price of $900, I really want to do more than surf the web and check email.
My guess is that it would ship with a touch optimized version of iLife. The recent UI changes to iMovie have been suspiciously touch friendly, and it's easy to imaging a multi-touch iPhoto and Garage Band with finger friendly sliders for adjustments.
The iWork apps would be tougher to modify, but then again a tablet like this wouldn't really be designed for heavy duty world processing or number crunching, any more than netbooks are. Keynote, on the other hand would be a natural for the touch treatment, and I can imagine modifications to the UI that would make it a completely killer presentation tool on a tablet (flick to advance a slide, real time pinch zooming, etc.).
At any rate, I would bet that Apple has been devoting a fair amount of development time to getting a full set of apps that work really, really well in this form factor. Some people think it would be too much to create yet another UI that blends Snow Leopard with the iPhone, but I wonder if such a UI might not be, in fact, the "killer app."
As has been pointed out, the iPhone UI was a revelation, even before the App Store. Imagine a 10" tablet with that kind of wow factor but far more capability. Imagine Spaces being incorporated as part of the experience, so that your entire app environment is never more than a flick away. Cover Flow letting you literally thumb through docs and media, with Quick Look just a tap away. Accelerometer based screen reorientation. And whither Inkwell? Has Apple possibly been slaving away on top notch handwriting recognition?
When you think about some of the things Apple has been doing with their desktop UI for that last few years, and we hear about how long this device has been in development, it makes you wonder if Apple hasn't been laying the groundwork for a different kind of computing paradigm for a while.
IMO, the killer app would be Keynote. In fact I'd go as far as to say, if they don't get Keynote running on this device, then I probably won't want one. If they do, then it replaces my old PowerBook. If they don't, it doesn't.
Great minds, my friend.