The reason used the term "amazingly" is that these formats had to be developed simultaneously with the Apple TV 3.0 update. For the life of me, I can't imagine letting iTunes LP or iTunes Extras "into the wild" with the iTunes 9.0 release -- without being compatible with Apple TV 3.0 update that was being released a few weeks later.
In one famous test, a group of well known audiophiles were taken to hear a new speaker cable. After showing them how it was built and giving the usual tech spiel, they all agreed that there was definitely some more "brightness" to the new cables. However, the testers had actually replaced the cables with un-bent coat hangers, and then revealed this. Much consternation ensued.
In test after test after test, viewers cannot tell the difference between 720 and 1080 when compressed from the same original source to the same bit rate. What DOES matter is the compression, as all of us ATV owners are more than aware of.
Do you even know why there are two standards? It's because Ronald Reagan saw a demo of MUSE in Japan and freaked out, starting a program in the US to build a similar but incompatible analog HD format. You think I'm making this up, don't you?
But making an analog HD format is not easy. With four times the content you have four times the bandwidth, and MUSE's tradeoffs are questionable. Basically they only send HD for still images, and anything moving gets seriously degraded. Like SERIOUSLY. To the point where sports started looking like absolute pants, worse than conventional NTSC.
So someone at Zenith went to AT&T and asked them if they could come up with something better. Since the biggest problem had to do with motion artifacts and interlacing, they decided the proper solution was to use a progressive-scan system at the same refresh rate, thus basically doubling the effective frame rate.
Worse, 1080p still used up two channels, in an era when the number of free channels was disappearing at a furious rate. 720 used up 1.5. So there was some SERIOUS market interest.
When 720p went head-to-head against 1080i in testing, it won every single quality test hands down, if there was motion. The lack of flicker, especially on larger screens, was also widely noted. That's why 720 even exists, because at one point in time it had clearly better pictures.
Ahhh, but times change. Now the whole concept of interlace is a joke. Our TV's pull down both frames and apply DSP algos to de-line them, and display everything "progressive" on a display where the idea of "refresh" isn't what it used to be.
So everyone looks at the numbers and is utterly convinced that higher resolution means better picture. In fact, in most cases any differences between the two are due to differing levels of compression.
my 1080p aquos adjust to whatever incoming signal is on. so you are full of beans
most hd programming is 720p and it looks fantastic on a 34 in tv
that same 720p looks decent to spotty on the 50in monster sets
the 1080p vs 720p on a 34in TV SET or smaller is extremely hard to tell the differance except for brightness and slight increased depth of field vision
on a 50in set true 1080p or higher blows out 720p hands down
basic laws of lines of resolution and einstein come into play
on my MBP HD
the battlestar galacata's RAZOR has a timeless beauty in HD compared to lower qualities
stupid audio test tricks show us mp3 and aiff formats are hard to tell apart
I would love to see a "Queue" feature. I'm always bummed to see that a movie isn't rentable until such and such a date. I can never remember what the date is and find my self going into rent it and it's still not ready. It would be nice to save it to a queue list and be reminded when it's ready for renting. This would also be nice for any movie for that matter. Just build a list and be able to prioritize the list for which you want first.
you could join netflix and get the same movie for almost free
okay the burning question for me is does this work with iTunes 8.2.x for mac or do oyu have to have 9.0.2 for it to work?
I downgraded to iTunes 8 after making the huge mistake of upgrading to iTunes 9-man what a suckfest.
According to the email I got from Apple you have to have the newest version of iTunes. Here is what I got from them:
\t
You can now enjoy gorgeous, immersive iTunes Extras and iTunes LP on your Apple TV. You will receive updated versions of previously purchased iTunes LP and iTunes Extras because your current versions are not optimized for Apple TV. These updated iTunes LP and iTunes Extras will be added to your download queue free of charge, and you will receive an email alerting you when they are available. They will be delivered to your computer, and you can sync the movie or album that includes the iTunes Extras or iTunes LP to Apple TV. Enjoy!
Once you've received an email letting you know your updated iTunes LP or iTunes Extras are available, here are the steps you can take to get them:
1. Update to iTunes 9.0.2 and Apple TV 3.0
2. Launch iTunes Choose Store > Check for available downloads and, If prompted, enter your account name and password
3. Download the new iTunes Extras or iTunes LP to your computer (NOTE: This will automatically replace the same iTunes Extras or iTunes LP currently in your library)
4. Sync the movie or album that includes your updated iTunes Extras or iTunes LP to your Apple TV
my 1080p aquos adjust to whatever incoming signal is on. so you are full of beans
Oh here we go...
Quote:
most hd programming is 720p and it looks fantastic on a 34 in tv
that same 720p looks decent to spotty on the 50in monster sets
I have a 52 and my 720 looks great.
Quote:
on a 50in set true 1080p or higher blows out 720p hands down
basic laws of lines of resolution and einstein come into play
Huh. I'm a physicist, how about you?
Quote:
the battlestar galacata's RAZOR has a timeless beauty in HD compared to lower qualities
Did you even read the post? I said the thing that makes the difference is the compression. And 720p rips are generally compressed to lower quality. THAT'S why they don't look as good.
The more I see the new Apple TV front end the uglier it looks to me. It looks amateurish, very unfinished, with a basic helvetica font, masses of empty black screen space, and a bunch of ads (sorry, thumbnails of iTunes content) stuffed into the top third.
I want to like Apple TV, as here in the UK its basically the only show in town for HD movie rentals (the only other alternative is the 360's Zune marketplace, but content there is incredibly limited). But... Apple really need to try harder. Make it beautiful, make it Apple-like, and get with the times and add a subscription model. Give me a flat monthly fee for unlimited access, Netflix style. (there is of course, no Netflix in the UK... sadly)
Well I'm pretty happy with the upgrade so far. The menu responsiveness is a serious improvement, and I find the font a lot more readable. A small upgrade, but a nice one.
It's pretty lame that there's no way to search for just HD content in the YouTube interface, nor is there any kind of tag or icon marking that content which will play in HD; you don't know for sure until it starts streaming and does or does not look awful. I was excited about the radio feature as well, until I realized you can't search for a radio station — you have to try and find it in one of the categories amongst hundreds of others.
It's pretty lame that there's no way to search for just HD content in the YouTube interface, nor is there any kind of tag or icon marking that content which will play in HD; you don't know for sure until it starts streaming and does or does not look awful. I was excited about the radio feature as well, until I realized you can't search for a radio station ? you have to try and find it in one of the categories amongst hundreds of others.
You can always add HD or HQ to the search parameters, but this is still far from ideal. I haven?t seen any appliance make a great interface to YouTube. The AppleTV is the best I?ve seen and that isn?t saying much.
I don't think Apple is the best computer company in the world, nor do I think Microsoft is. I think each does it's own things well. Just like I enjoy the PS3, XBox 360 and Wii...I don't like to just jump on one bandwagon and ride along--I think each company's technology is great for certain things. (So please, Apple bashers keep your opinions to yourselves. And likewise to the Apple-is-superior camp...)
That being said, Apple hit one out of the park with the Apple TV. I have the 160GB version, but from what I understand, the 40GB is different only in capacity. Of course, being from Apple, the box, packaging and the device itself are very minimalist, sleek and modern. Set-up was a snap--connect the power cable, connect the HDMI cable and then give it the password to your wireless router. That's it. Seriously. Once it's online, launch iTunes and the Apple TV will give you a code to input into your computer to sync. It begins working without you even asking it to. I synced my entire library (>30GB) which took quite some time (bonus is that the Apple TV supports 802.11 N, which made the transfer quicker).
Comments
Are iTunes LP files supposed to work with the Apple TV now, as mine don't. They just play as regular music files wih static cover art...
Curious, and disappointing.
See my post #126 above:
Amazingly, you'll have to wait for Apple to update the content, then re-download it (assuming it would be at no additional cost).
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3938
The reason used the term "amazingly" is that these formats had to be developed simultaneously with the Apple TV 3.0 update. For the life of me, I can't imagine letting iTunes LP or iTunes Extras "into the wild" with the iTunes 9.0 release -- without being compatible with Apple TV 3.0 update that was being released a few weeks later.
In one famous test, a group of well known audiophiles were taken to hear a new speaker cable. After showing them how it was built and giving the usual tech spiel, they all agreed that there was definitely some more "brightness" to the new cables. However, the testers had actually replaced the cables with un-bent coat hangers, and then revealed this. Much consternation ensued.
In test after test after test, viewers cannot tell the difference between 720 and 1080 when compressed from the same original source to the same bit rate. What DOES matter is the compression, as all of us ATV owners are more than aware of.
Do you even know why there are two standards? It's because Ronald Reagan saw a demo of MUSE in Japan and freaked out, starting a program in the US to build a similar but incompatible analog HD format. You think I'm making this up, don't you?
But making an analog HD format is not easy. With four times the content you have four times the bandwidth, and MUSE's tradeoffs are questionable. Basically they only send HD for still images, and anything moving gets seriously degraded. Like SERIOUSLY. To the point where sports started looking like absolute pants, worse than conventional NTSC.
So someone at Zenith went to AT&T and asked them if they could come up with something better. Since the biggest problem had to do with motion artifacts and interlacing, they decided the proper solution was to use a progressive-scan system at the same refresh rate, thus basically doubling the effective frame rate.
Worse, 1080p still used up two channels, in an era when the number of free channels was disappearing at a furious rate. 720 used up 1.5. So there was some SERIOUS market interest.
When 720p went head-to-head against 1080i in testing, it won every single quality test hands down, if there was motion. The lack of flicker, especially on larger screens, was also widely noted. That's why 720 even exists, because at one point in time it had clearly better pictures.
Ahhh, but times change. Now the whole concept of interlace is a joke. Our TV's pull down both frames and apply DSP algos to de-line them, and display everything "progressive" on a display where the idea of "refresh" isn't what it used to be.
So everyone looks at the numbers and is utterly convinced that higher resolution means better picture. In fact, in most cases any differences between the two are due to differing levels of compression.
my 1080p aquos adjust to whatever incoming signal is on. so you are full of beans
most hd programming is 720p and it looks fantastic on a 34 in tv
that same 720p looks decent to spotty on the 50in monster sets
the 1080p vs 720p on a 34in TV SET or smaller is extremely hard to tell the differance except for brightness and slight increased depth of field vision
on a 50in set true 1080p or higher blows out 720p hands down
basic laws of lines of resolution and einstein come into play
on my MBP HD
the battlestar galacata's RAZOR has a timeless beauty in HD compared to lower qualities
stupid audio test tricks show us mp3 and aiff formats are hard to tell apart
video is not the same Story as audio dude
our eyes can tell the difference
peace
I would love to see a "Queue" feature. I'm always bummed to see that a movie isn't rentable until such and such a date. I can never remember what the date is and find my self going into rent it and it's still not ready. It would be nice to save it to a queue list and be reminded when it's ready for renting. This would also be nice for any movie for that matter. Just build a list and be able to prioritize the list for which you want first.
you could join netflix and get the same movie for almost free
on the same date
unless you want HD
okay the burning question for me is does this work with iTunes 8.2.x for mac or do oyu have to have 9.0.2 for it to work?
I downgraded to iTunes 8 after making the huge mistake of upgrading to iTunes 9-man what a suckfest.
According to the email I got from Apple you have to have the newest version of iTunes. Here is what I got from them:
\t
You can now enjoy gorgeous, immersive iTunes Extras and iTunes LP on your Apple TV. You will receive updated versions of previously purchased iTunes LP and iTunes Extras because your current versions are not optimized for Apple TV. These updated iTunes LP and iTunes Extras will be added to your download queue free of charge, and you will receive an email alerting you when they are available. They will be delivered to your computer, and you can sync the movie or album that includes the iTunes Extras or iTunes LP to Apple TV. Enjoy!
Once you've received an email letting you know your updated iTunes LP or iTunes Extras are available, here are the steps you can take to get them:
1. Update to iTunes 9.0.2 and Apple TV 3.0
2. Launch iTunes Choose Store > Check for available downloads and, If prompted, enter your account name and password
3. Download the new iTunes Extras or iTunes LP to your computer (NOTE: This will automatically replace the same iTunes Extras or iTunes LP currently in your library)
4. Sync the movie or album that includes your updated iTunes Extras or iTunes LP to your Apple TV
my 1080p aquos adjust to whatever incoming signal is on. so you are full of beans
Oh here we go...
most hd programming is 720p and it looks fantastic on a 34 in tv
that same 720p looks decent to spotty on the 50in monster sets
I have a 52 and my 720 looks great.
on a 50in set true 1080p or higher blows out 720p hands down
basic laws of lines of resolution and einstein come into play
Huh. I'm a physicist, how about you?
the battlestar galacata's RAZOR has a timeless beauty in HD compared to lower qualities
Did you even read the post? I said the thing that makes the difference is the compression. And 720p rips are generally compressed to lower quality. THAT'S why they don't look as good.
Maury
I want to like Apple TV, as here in the UK its basically the only show in town for HD movie rentals (the only other alternative is the 360's Zune marketplace, but content there is incredibly limited). But... Apple really need to try harder. Make it beautiful, make it Apple-like, and get with the times and add a subscription model. Give me a flat monthly fee for unlimited access, Netflix style. (there is of course, no Netflix in the UK... sadly)
As it stands now it just feels dated and creaky.
Maury
It's pretty lame that there's no way to search for just HD content in the YouTube interface, nor is there any kind of tag or icon marking that content which will play in HD; you don't know for sure until it starts streaming and does or does not look awful. I was excited about the radio feature as well, until I realized you can't search for a radio station ? you have to try and find it in one of the categories amongst hundreds of others.
You can always add HD or HQ to the search parameters, but this is still far from ideal. I haven?t seen any appliance make a great interface to YouTube. The AppleTV is the best I?ve seen and that isn?t saying much.
That being said, Apple hit one out of the park with the Apple TV. I have the 160GB version, but from what I understand, the 40GB is different only in capacity. Of course, being from Apple, the box, packaging and the device itself are very minimalist, sleek and modern. Set-up was a snap--connect the power cable, connect the HDMI cable and then give it the password to your wireless router. That's it. Seriously. Once it's online, launch iTunes and the Apple TV will give you a code to input into your computer to sync. It begins working without you even asking it to. I synced my entire library (>30GB) which took quite some time (bonus is that the Apple TV supports 802.11 N, which made the transfer quicker).