My contact information is mine, not Microsoft's, not Apple's, not Google's, not Pre's, not AT&T's, not Verison or Nokia or the NSA, or hackers or anyone else, especially not some smart geek who will download the entire database every chance they get and sell it to my competition.
When the iPhone came out, I bet the snoops and hackers just leaped with joy as a phone has less protection than a computer, legally and security speaking. And people are just going to put all their data on it like sheep to the slaughterhouse.
What's funny is they are setting the stage that if your not "in the cloud" and revealing everything about yourself, you must be a terrorist or a secret baby eater or something.
Screw the cloud. Don't need it or want it.
Well for us small businesses that have global offices and do not want to invest large amount of cash outlay nto servers, it is god send and allows us to keep our outlay for IT support at fraction of the price, it would have cost 5 years ago.
We have 4 back ups for our data, each local office has a backup services within office distance and then back-up for backup.
But I agree for a mobile phone, why would you not backup on your computer as well as alternative.
The "screw the cloud" comments bewilder me. Generally speaking, your data is safer there. I agree that you need control of either live data or backups, but the vast majority of people just can't handle it. Things like Google Apps, Salesforce, etc. offer real benefits that you just can't get from traditional routes.
As things get more complicated and database driven, the complexity kills many things. This makes useful backups much harder to do. But I for one would much rather have Google handle my company's email than try and do it myself. Just can't beat the value.
As a backup medium it's still better than having nothing at all. It's another redundancy with the added benefit (in MobileMe's case) of allowing the user to work on their files (or whatever they have on the Cloud) from anywhere in tne world, across a range of devices.
For instance, I work solely off the Cloud, using my iDisk. I automatically have a local backup on my Mac, but my documents folder is actually a shortcut to my iDisk. Even if Apple, by some strange twist of fate, lost all my info on the Cloud, I'll still have it locally, automatically.
The way I use it at least, there is no downside to the Cloud except for a possible security issue, but even if my most personal files on the Cloud were somehow hacked or violated, there would be no real personal risk to me, unless someone were out to publish my scholarly papers before I did.
Exactly, it's a case of 'do what fits'. There is no one strategy that is perfect. I have over 4 TB of data on line at any one time and obviously impossible to back up with cloud technology. I use Carbon Copy Cloner to make updated clones of all drives weekly, twice - one stored locally one off site including boot drive and Time Machine on the boot drive locally and Mobile me for the tiny stiff like settings, contacts and calendars. I use Gmail to make a copy of all e-mails from MobileMe, so far this goes back to inception of GMail. I only fear an EMP ... \
Lets review: The company that couldn't be bothered to write their own music sync solution also has no meaningful way to sync Pre contact and appointment data from the cloud to the user's desktop/laptop computer? Yeah. Like everyone couldn't see that coming...
I wonder if the Pre crowd still thinks Jon Rubinstein walks on water?
The cloud was quicker in this instance but having one or many local backups is always a smart way to go.
For some reason, people still come to me with crashes and no backups. Backing up for the average person, it seems to me, is still not mainstream.
Even though I think most people still don't back up their stuff, not having the option to do it is ludicrous. When someone learns the hard way that their information is toast, and I tell them to get a backup device with their new hard drive, they are all ears.
The inability to backup your information should be a huge warning on the package of the product.
To me the Achille's Heel of any Cloud Computing based system or company is their financial stability. What happens if everything works perfectly technically (and that's a BIG IF) and the company goes out of business?
Years ago In the stock photo business, there were photographers that lost hundreds, if not thousands of their images (back when images were primarily submitted to agencies as 35mm slide transparencies and the agency required originals, not dupes) when some photo agencies went out of business. To send all the images back to the photographers (postage, packing, sorting, handling, etc.) was cost prohibitive and in most cases was never done. Even if the photographer had made dupes the quality usually did not match that of their original slide transparency.
So what happens to all those servers if a cloud computing company ever goes out of business?
And what 100%, iron-clad guarantee can ANY company give you that they will NEVER go out of business? And what recourse do you have if they do go out of business and break that guarantee? Sue them to get all your data back?
Ughghhhhhghhhahhhh. Another knife at the heart of the Pre. That's gotta hurt; sincerely. That's the worst press I could imagine. MJ being a pedophile was less damaging than this.
SRY.
It seems pretty arrogant for a company with as many users as Palm and MSFT to not take heavy measures to protect everyones data or admit that they'd be better off letting the user backup their won data. It goes without saying, when you're talking about backing up data, cover your ass. On sight backups are fast and make for a speedy recovery and offsite backups will protect you from fires, theft, flooding etc. It's not really a choice of one or the other for 100% protection; either can and probably will (even in an insignificant way) "fail" a couple of times every year.
It's a poor choice for manufacturers to force users to put their device data solely on a cloud; and in fact tout that condition as if it were a feature. Apple made the right call in this regard. As others have pointed out, Mobile me is a different beast.
Anybody who is serious about their data should not entrust their data solely to a cloud service whether paid or free. In my business I use RAID servers and in addition I got external hard drives for archival back ups. On top of that I use an offsite back up service. Any back up procedure needs to be checked routinely for data integrity.
Same precautions need to be taken with the iPhone data. Plus make hard copy back ups in paper. Saves a lot of grief.
"We envisioned a world where your various computers and phones would always be in sync without needing discipline, USB cables, Bluetooth, and synchronization software."
More like: "We envision a world where your address book is on our (and only our) server so you're locked in to our products."
My contact information is mine, not Microsoft's, not Apple's, not Google's, not Pre's, not AT&T's, not Verison or Nokia or the NSA, or hackers or anyone else, especially not some smart geek who will download the entire database every chance they get and sell it to my competition.
When the iPhone came out, I bet the snoops and hackers just leaped with joy as a phone has less protection than a computer, legally and security speaking. And people are just going to put all their data on it like sheep to the slaughterhouse.
What's funny is they are setting the stage that if your not "in the cloud" and revealing everything about yourself, you must be a terrorist or a secret baby eater or something.
Screw the cloud. Don't need it or want it.
Wow, I could have written your post, almost word for word. My information is mine, and no one else's, especially not Microsoft or Google or Facebook, AT&T, etc., as they are the biggest collectors. And the notion that if you do not participate you are somehow "dirty", is also depicted by the TV ads that show how paying cash is bad because it inconveniences others. The truth is simply that it doesn't generate any revenue for the credit/debit card companies!
But back to the cloud; let's take this a step further. Even if you don't put your personal data and information in the cloud, unless you're insanely demanding, your friends are handing out your personal contact information to all these services and corporations. On Facebook, in their Yahoo contact lists, hell even in their cell phone address books, which get synch'd back up to the corporate servers.
It's all about convenience. Most people are lazy and ignorant, and they don't give a rip about other people's personal information. Sucks.
The "screw the cloud" comments bewilder me. Generally speaking, your data is safer there. I agree that you need control of either live data or backups, but the vast majority of people just can't handle it. Things like Google Apps, Salesforce, etc. offer real benefits that you just can't get from traditional routes.
While this is true, if I don't back up my data at home then I know that it's unsafe. If I have confidence that "the cloud" is backing up my data when in reality it's lost it, I'd consider myself worse off - when I finally need that back up I find it's not there.
I would treat any cloud service as a secondary backup to my own, but unfortunately in the case of Palm/Microsoft/Danger victims, I wouldn't have much choice.
Like many people here, I use a combination of 'the cloud' (MobileMe, iDisk, and GMail and some Google Calendars) and local storage (Mac) and backup (TC and occaisional archive of important data).
However, where things often go wrong is in the data management. For instance, Sidekick users that rebooted their devices lost the local copy of data as it was written overwritten by 'nothing' from the cloud. The service made an assumption that the clud was right, and the device wrong.
Data management needs to be smarter. Master Data Management (MDM) is a relatively new thing in the enterprise, and can be viewed as a sort of middleware for managing multiple versions of data (or data for an entity) held across multiple systems. MDM tools can decide which is the 'golden copy' based upon a number of criteria, other than 'most recently changed' (which seems to be how most of these data sync services work). Since the MS/Danger servers were wiped after the data was added to the client Sidekick, the assumption was that the wiped data was the golden copy.
Until we get our sync software design smarter, we're still going to run into the same problems.
We need to understand that for years, very few ordinary phone users have ever had any kind of a backup of phone data.
As a photographer, we have a saying, 'if your photos are not in at least three places they don't exist'. And that is it. A backup locally, AND on the cloud, is sensible if it is stuff you value.
And who would I trust with Cloud data:- Microsoft? Never. Palm? Never. Adobe? Never. HP? Never. Apple, and for some data, Google, yes. That's it.
As a backup medium it's still better than having nothing at all. It's another redundancy with the added benefit (in MobileMe's case) of allowing the user to work on their files (or whatever they have on the Cloud) from anywhere in tne world, across a range of devices.
For instance, I work solely off the Cloud, using my iDisk. I automatically have a local backup on my Mac, but my documents folder is actually a shortcut to my iDisk. Even if Apple, by some strange twist of fate, lost all my info on the Cloud, I'll still have it locally, automatically.
The way I use it at least, there is no downside to the Cloud except for a possible security issue, but even if my most personal files on the Cloud were somehow hacked or violated, there would be no real personal risk to me, unless someone were out to publish my scholarly papers before I did.
i use the cloud to save some important stuff and i put a couple 100 songs to share up there .
but i fear for you that count on so heavy on the cloud
Well for us small businesses that have global offices and do not want to invest large amount of cash outlay nto servers, it is god send and allows us to keep our outlay for IT support at fraction of the price, it would have cost 5 years ago.
We have 4 back ups for our data, each local office has a backup services within office distance and then back-up for backup.
But I agree for a mobile phone, why would you not backup on your computer as well as alternative.
I always find this claim of IT staff support odd.
NeXT was global with offices in over a dozen countries and multiple locations within each country.
Our combined staff for IT was three Engineers. Yes you read correctly. Three Engineers who were experts in all matters regarding NIS/NFS/DNS/distributed networks, et, al.
They were paid very well and with Engineering developed a wide variety of enhancements to NeXTStep in-house only to make our productivity more than double itself.
These three guys split up after the Apple Merger. One took over Apple's network, another went to run ILM and a third went to PIXAR.
We need to understand that for years, very few ordinary phone users have ever had any kind of a backup of phone data.
As a photographer, we have a saying, 'if your photos are not in at least three places they don't exist'. And that is it. A backup locally, AND on the cloud, is sensible if it is stuff you value.
And who would I trust with Cloud data:- Microsoft? Never. Palm? Never. Adobe? Never. HP? Never. Apple, and for some data, Google, yes. That's it.
apple them selves dis agree
with so many hard drives crashing lately
and the cloud can un svnc or lose data at anytime from a dozen reasons , the only true safe way is to ALSO besides <cloud/HD /back up HD > is to burn to a multiple 8 g DVD'S .
and burn a second archive set and bank vault i >tex wife it every 3 months
i lost 71 hours of home videos even w/ 2 1tb WD drives
You have a valid point. Companies like AT&T and Verizon are famous for giving the government free access to your information without the minimum standard of probably cause necessary for a court order. Further, it is perfectly legal for companies to just hand over your stuff to practically anybody it pleases without any regard for Constitutional protections or privacy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper
A-fscking-MEN to that.
My contact information is mine, not Microsoft's, not Apple's, not Google's, not Pre's, not AT&T's, not Verison or Nokia or the NSA, or hackers or anyone else, especially not some smart geek who will download the entire database every chance they get and sell it to my competition.
When the iPhone came out, I bet the snoops and hackers just leaped with joy as a phone has less protection than a computer, legally and security speaking. And people are just going to put all their data on it like sheep to the slaughterhouse.
What's funny is they are setting the stage that if your not "in the cloud" and revealing everything about yourself, you must be a terrorist or a secret baby eater or something.
Wow, I could have written your post, almost word for word. My information is mine, and no one else's, especially not Microsoft or Google or Facebook, AT&T, etc., as they are the biggest collectors. And the notion that if you do not participate you are somehow "dirty", is also depicted by the TV ads that show how paying cash is bad because it inconveniences others. The truth is simply that it doesn't generate any revenue for the credit/debit card companies!
But back to the cloud; let's take this a step further. Even if you don't put your personal data and information in the cloud, unless you're insanely demanding, your friends are handing out your personal contact information to all these services and corporations. On Facebook, in their Yahoo contact lists, hell even in their cell phone address books, which get synch'd back up to the corporate servers.
It's all about convenience. Most people are lazy and ignorant, and they don't give a rip about other people's personal information. Sucks.
you would need billions of people just to review all that stupid mundane home info
but yes
goggle collects more than all the rest combined
only the chinese govt has more data
and all these companies are helping the chinese gov't supress there people by collecting data for them and using key words to catch them
google search peace in red china and you will get flagged and watched
fuck the world
our own top companies in bed with the commies
and that includes red apple's no wifi phone scandel
anybody in their right mind will not believe any of the assurances and hype in connection with cloud computing. would you store your most valued possessions with a stranger just because they claim to do all to protect your stuff?
the incidents where all went wrong should be a warning. do not do this just because some companies and the main stream media tell you its the best thing since sliced bread.
Comments
A-fscking-MEN to that.
My contact information is mine, not Microsoft's, not Apple's, not Google's, not Pre's, not AT&T's, not Verison or Nokia or the NSA, or hackers or anyone else, especially not some smart geek who will download the entire database every chance they get and sell it to my competition.
When the iPhone came out, I bet the snoops and hackers just leaped with joy as a phone has less protection than a computer, legally and security speaking. And people are just going to put all their data on it like sheep to the slaughterhouse.
What's funny is they are setting the stage that if your not "in the cloud" and revealing everything about yourself, you must be a terrorist or a secret baby eater or something.
Screw the cloud. Don't need it or want it.
Well for us small businesses that have global offices and do not want to invest large amount of cash outlay nto servers, it is god send and allows us to keep our outlay for IT support at fraction of the price, it would have cost 5 years ago.
We have 4 back ups for our data, each local office has a backup services within office distance and then back-up for backup.
But I agree for a mobile phone, why would you not backup on your computer as well as alternative.
As things get more complicated and database driven, the complexity kills many things. This makes useful backups much harder to do. But I for one would much rather have Google handle my company's email than try and do it myself. Just can't beat the value.
As a backup medium it's still better than having nothing at all. It's another redundancy with the added benefit (in MobileMe's case) of allowing the user to work on their files (or whatever they have on the Cloud) from anywhere in tne world, across a range of devices.
For instance, I work solely off the Cloud, using my iDisk. I automatically have a local backup on my Mac, but my documents folder is actually a shortcut to my iDisk. Even if Apple, by some strange twist of fate, lost all my info on the Cloud, I'll still have it locally, automatically.
The way I use it at least, there is no downside to the Cloud except for a possible security issue, but even if my most personal files on the Cloud were somehow hacked or violated, there would be no real personal risk to me, unless someone were out to publish my scholarly papers before I did.
Exactly, it's a case of 'do what fits'. There is no one strategy that is perfect. I have over 4 TB of data on line at any one time and obviously impossible to back up with cloud technology. I use Carbon Copy Cloner to make updated clones of all drives weekly, twice - one stored locally one off site including boot drive and Time Machine on the boot drive locally and Mobile me for the tiny stiff like settings, contacts and calendars. I use Gmail to make a copy of all e-mails from MobileMe, so far this goes back to inception of GMail. I only fear an EMP ...
I wonder if the Pre crowd still thinks Jon Rubinstein walks on water?
The cloud was quicker in this instance but having one or many local backups is always a smart way to go.
For some reason, people still come to me with crashes and no backups. Backing up for the average person, it seems to me, is still not mainstream.
Even though I think most people still don't back up their stuff, not having the option to do it is ludicrous. When someone learns the hard way that their information is toast, and I tell them to get a backup device with their new hard drive, they are all ears.
The inability to backup your information should be a huge warning on the package of the product.
Years ago In the stock photo business, there were photographers that lost hundreds, if not thousands of their images (back when images were primarily submitted to agencies as 35mm slide transparencies and the agency required originals, not dupes) when some photo agencies went out of business. To send all the images back to the photographers (postage, packing, sorting, handling, etc.) was cost prohibitive and in most cases was never done. Even if the photographer had made dupes the quality usually did not match that of their original slide transparency.
So what happens to all those servers if a cloud computing company ever goes out of business?
And what 100%, iron-clad guarantee can ANY company give you that they will NEVER go out of business? And what recourse do you have if they do go out of business and break that guarantee? Sue them to get all your data back?
SRY.
It seems pretty arrogant for a company with as many users as Palm and MSFT to not take heavy measures to protect everyones data or admit that they'd be better off letting the user backup their won data. It goes without saying, when you're talking about backing up data, cover your ass. On sight backups are fast and make for a speedy recovery and offsite backups will protect you from fires, theft, flooding etc. It's not really a choice of one or the other for 100% protection; either can and probably will (even in an insignificant way) "fail" a couple of times every year.
It's a poor choice for manufacturers to force users to put their device data solely on a cloud; and in fact tout that condition as if it were a feature. Apple made the right call in this regard. As others have pointed out, Mobile me is a different beast.
Happy Thanksgiving for anyone in the states.
Same precautions need to be taken with the iPhone data. Plus make hard copy back ups in paper. Saves a lot of grief.
To think that Google's Chrome OS will have ALL your content stored in the Cloud is a little disconcerting right now...
It will, but that doesn?t mean you won?t be able to have a local copy, too.
More like: "We envision a world where your address book is on our (and only our) server so you're locked in to our products."
A-fscking-MEN to that.
My contact information is mine, not Microsoft's, not Apple's, not Google's, not Pre's, not AT&T's, not Verison or Nokia or the NSA, or hackers or anyone else, especially not some smart geek who will download the entire database every chance they get and sell it to my competition.
When the iPhone came out, I bet the snoops and hackers just leaped with joy as a phone has less protection than a computer, legally and security speaking. And people are just going to put all their data on it like sheep to the slaughterhouse.
What's funny is they are setting the stage that if your not "in the cloud" and revealing everything about yourself, you must be a terrorist or a secret baby eater or something.
Screw the cloud. Don't need it or want it.
Wow, I could have written your post, almost word for word. My information is mine, and no one else's, especially not Microsoft or Google or Facebook, AT&T, etc., as they are the biggest collectors. And the notion that if you do not participate you are somehow "dirty", is also depicted by the TV ads that show how paying cash is bad because it inconveniences others. The truth is simply that it doesn't generate any revenue for the credit/debit card companies!
But back to the cloud; let's take this a step further. Even if you don't put your personal data and information in the cloud, unless you're insanely demanding, your friends are handing out your personal contact information to all these services and corporations. On Facebook, in their Yahoo contact lists, hell even in their cell phone address books, which get synch'd back up to the corporate servers.
It's all about convenience. Most people are lazy and ignorant, and they don't give a rip about other people's personal information. Sucks.
The "screw the cloud" comments bewilder me. Generally speaking, your data is safer there. I agree that you need control of either live data or backups, but the vast majority of people just can't handle it. Things like Google Apps, Salesforce, etc. offer real benefits that you just can't get from traditional routes.
While this is true, if I don't back up my data at home then I know that it's unsafe. If I have confidence that "the cloud" is backing up my data when in reality it's lost it, I'd consider myself worse off - when I finally need that back up I find it's not there.
I would treat any cloud service as a secondary backup to my own, but unfortunately in the case of Palm/Microsoft/Danger victims, I wouldn't have much choice.
However, where things often go wrong is in the data management. For instance, Sidekick users that rebooted their devices lost the local copy of data as it was written overwritten by 'nothing' from the cloud. The service made an assumption that the clud was right, and the device wrong.
Data management needs to be smarter. Master Data Management (MDM) is a relatively new thing in the enterprise, and can be viewed as a sort of middleware for managing multiple versions of data (or data for an entity) held across multiple systems. MDM tools can decide which is the 'golden copy' based upon a number of criteria, other than 'most recently changed' (which seems to be how most of these data sync services work). Since the MS/Danger servers were wiped after the data was added to the client Sidekick, the assumption was that the wiped data was the golden copy.
Until we get our sync software design smarter, we're still going to run into the same problems.
As a photographer, we have a saying, 'if your photos are not in at least three places they don't exist'. And that is it. A backup locally, AND on the cloud, is sensible if it is stuff you value.
And who would I trust with Cloud data:- Microsoft? Never. Palm? Never. Adobe? Never. HP? Never. Apple, and for some data, Google, yes. That's it.
As a backup medium it's still better than having nothing at all. It's another redundancy with the added benefit (in MobileMe's case) of allowing the user to work on their files (or whatever they have on the Cloud) from anywhere in tne world, across a range of devices.
For instance, I work solely off the Cloud, using my iDisk. I automatically have a local backup on my Mac, but my documents folder is actually a shortcut to my iDisk. Even if Apple, by some strange twist of fate, lost all my info on the Cloud, I'll still have it locally, automatically.
The way I use it at least, there is no downside to the Cloud except for a possible security issue, but even if my most personal files on the Cloud were somehow hacked or violated, there would be no real personal risk to me, unless someone were out to publish my scholarly papers before I did.
i use the cloud to save some important stuff and i put a couple 100 songs to share up there .
but i fear for you that count on so heavy on the cloud
happy thanksgiving dude
peace
9
Well for us small businesses that have global offices and do not want to invest large amount of cash outlay nto servers, it is god send and allows us to keep our outlay for IT support at fraction of the price, it would have cost 5 years ago.
We have 4 back ups for our data, each local office has a backup services within office distance and then back-up for backup.
But I agree for a mobile phone, why would you not backup on your computer as well as alternative.
I always find this claim of IT staff support odd.
NeXT was global with offices in over a dozen countries and multiple locations within each country.
Our combined staff for IT was three Engineers. Yes you read correctly. Three Engineers who were experts in all matters regarding NIS/NFS/DNS/distributed networks, et, al.
They were paid very well and with Engineering developed a wide variety of enhancements to NeXTStep in-house only to make our productivity more than double itself.
These three guys split up after the Apple Merger. One took over Apple's network, another went to run ILM and a third went to PIXAR.
Quality over Quantity.
We need to understand that for years, very few ordinary phone users have ever had any kind of a backup of phone data.
As a photographer, we have a saying, 'if your photos are not in at least three places they don't exist'. And that is it. A backup locally, AND on the cloud, is sensible if it is stuff you value.
And who would I trust with Cloud data:- Microsoft? Never. Palm? Never. Adobe? Never. HP? Never. Apple, and for some data, Google, yes. That's it.
apple them selves dis agree
with so many hard drives crashing lately
and the cloud can un svnc or lose data at anytime from a dozen reasons , the only true safe way is to ALSO besides <cloud/HD /back up HD > is to burn to a multiple 8 g DVD'S .
and burn a second archive set and bank vault i >tex wife it every 3 months
i lost 71 hours of home videos even w/ 2 1tb WD drives
peace 9
A-fscking-MEN to that.
My contact information is mine, not Microsoft's, not Apple's, not Google's, not Pre's, not AT&T's, not Verison or Nokia or the NSA, or hackers or anyone else, especially not some smart geek who will download the entire database every chance they get and sell it to my competition.
When the iPhone came out, I bet the snoops and hackers just leaped with joy as a phone has less protection than a computer, legally and security speaking. And people are just going to put all their data on it like sheep to the slaughterhouse.
What's funny is they are setting the stage that if your not "in the cloud" and revealing everything about yourself, you must be a terrorist or a secret baby eater or something.
Screw the cloud. Don't need it or want it.
Wow, I could have written your post, almost word for word. My information is mine, and no one else's, especially not Microsoft or Google or Facebook, AT&T, etc., as they are the biggest collectors. And the notion that if you do not participate you are somehow "dirty", is also depicted by the TV ads that show how paying cash is bad because it inconveniences others. The truth is simply that it doesn't generate any revenue for the credit/debit card companies!
But back to the cloud; let's take this a step further. Even if you don't put your personal data and information in the cloud, unless you're insanely demanding, your friends are handing out your personal contact information to all these services and corporations. On Facebook, in their Yahoo contact lists, hell even in their cell phone address books, which get synch'd back up to the corporate servers.
It's all about convenience. Most people are lazy and ignorant, and they don't give a rip about other people's personal information. Sucks.
you would need billions of people just to review all that stupid mundane home info
but yes
goggle collects more than all the rest combined
only the chinese govt has more data
and all these companies are helping the chinese gov't supress there people by collecting data for them and using key words to catch them
google search peace in red china and you will get flagged and watched
fuck the world
our own top companies in bed with the commies
and that includes red apple's no wifi phone scandel
9
the incidents where all went wrong should be a warning. do not do this just because some companies and the main stream media tell you its the best thing since sliced bread.