AT&T sides with Google and Verizon over blanket Net neutrality rules

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2014
In a letter sent to the FCC on Tuesday, AT&T agreed with the positions of Verizon and Google over the idea that strict 'non-discrimination' rules would adversely affect the growth and stability of the Internet.



Tuesday, AT&T released a letter to the FCC, where it argued that while the idea of an open Internet was critical to innovation and opportunity, to make nondiscrimination the ultimate goal of the Net neutrality debate would unfairly hamstring AT&T and other companies from effectively managing their networks.



"Preserving the open character of the Internet is critically important to ensuring that all consumers have the opportunity to be creators of content," states the letter. In achieving this goal AT&T wants to make sure "regulations do not undermine our efforts to deploy affordable, ubiquitous broadband or inappropriately infringing on the flexibility for network operators to effectively manage their networks in order to ensure quality of service to all customers."



AT&T points to the joint blog post written on October 21 by the CEOs of Verizon and Google, titled "Finding Common Ground on an Open Internet" as support for its argument.



"Those companies (Google and Verizon) agreed that an open Internet is crucial for consumer choice while recognizing that broadband network providers should have the flexibility to manage their networks to deal with issues like traffic congestion, spam, malware, and denial of service attacks, as well as other threats that may emerge in the future - so long as they do it reasonably, consistent with their customers' preferences, and don't unreasonably discriminate in ways that either harm users or are anti-competitive."



AT&T and Google have not always seen eye-to-eye on the subject of Net neutrality. In September, AT&T argued that Google should be regulated under the same nondiscrimination rules as it does when it comes to blocking rural telephone numbers in its Google Voice application. In a public policy statement on the issue, AT&T wrote:



"While Google argues for others to be bounded by net neutrality rules, it argues against itself being bound by common carriage. Such a contradiction highlights the fallacy of any approach to Internet regulation that focuses myopically on network providers, but not application, service, and content providers."



Google had argued that its Google Voice application was not a regulated service since it originated from an online platform.

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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 21
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  • Reply 2 of 21
    eehdeehd Posts: 137member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jenkins170 View Post


    Hi,Dear Ladies and Gentlemen,Here are the most popular, most .



    Hey ASS HOLE! Stop Spamming these boards! Don't you have better things to do?
  • Reply 3 of 21
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jenkins170 View Post


    Hi,Dear Ladies and Gentlemen,Here are the most popular, most stylish and avantgarde shoes,handbags,Tshirts,jacket,Tracksuitw ect...



    Is that supposed to be Sarcasm?!!?! I hope so.... How can AI even stop that!?! I don't know if this guy posted on this forum before... Maybe he is trying to make fun of Net Neutrality? Would have been nice if there was word JOKE at the end, as a hint, so that we'd know that it was a JOKE! If it's SPAM, I hope it doesn't become a habit here... I would also not want the Net Neutrality Topic to be diverted to discussion of this SPAM(?)… But then, other smart asses might include "hints" to have it both ways!!! Hope AI can figure out how to filter this out...
  • Reply 4 of 21
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by eehd View Post


    Hey ASS HOLE! Stop Spamming these boards! Don't you have better things to do?



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by macologist View Post


    Is that supposed to be Sarcasm?!!?! I hope so.... How can AI even stop that!?! I don't know if this guy posted on this forum before... Maybe he is trying to make fun of Net Neutrality? Would have been nice if there was word JOKE at the end, as a hint, so that we'd know that it was a JOKE! If it's SPAM, I hope it doesn't become a habit here... I would also not want the Net Neutrality Topic to be diverted to discussion of this SPAM(?)… But then, other smart asses might include "hints" to have it both ways!!! Hope AI can figure out how to filter this out...



    It’s best not to acknowledge it as it means that even after the user is deleted any posts you have quoted remain, though without the spam links it is harmless Just click on this icon »»«« below their name and report them. The mods will see a bunch from the same user and get on top of it when they log in.
  • Reply 5 of 21
    Now would be a good time to recall AT&T's early attempts to carve long distance phone service into a series of warring ghettos, and all the "we only want what's best for everyone" arguments they made at the time.



    "Preserving the open character of the Internet is critically important..."



    But not as important as their attempts to dominant the competition at the expense of the common good.



    Regulate them. Regulate them with a rusty pipe wrench.
  • Reply 6 of 21
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It’s best not to acknowledge it as it means that even after the user is deleted any posts you have quoted remain, though without the spam links it is harmless Just click on this icon »»«« below their name and report them. The mods will see a bunch from the same user and get on top of it when they log in.



    Thanks.... I almost guessed it -- I figured not to include that SPAM Link...



    Now I know about The Red Exclamation Icon... I am a bit concerned about the Red Circle Icon next to my previous Post... I hope the Moderators don't misinterpret my good intension....



    UPDATE... The Red Dot Icon is gone on my previous post.... Thanks to whomever figured it out... LOVE this Forum!!!!!
  • Reply 7 of 21
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by macologist View Post


    Thanks.... I almost guessed it -- I figured not to include that SPAM Link...



    Now I know about The Red Exclamation Icon... I am a bit concerned about the Red Circle Icon next to my previous Post... I hope the Moderators don't misinterpret my good intension....



    The red circle means your user account is offline, green is online.
  • Reply 8 of 21
    AT&T: We fully support being able to advertise that we offer unlimited, unfettered internet access, but we reject the idea that anybody should expect that we actually provide it.
  • Reply 9 of 21
    Last time I checked the internet was growing mainly thanks to ordinary people creating content and small companies coming up with new ways for those people to communicate. No big companies want the internet to grow this way because it prevents them from controlling what we see and hear.
  • Reply 10 of 21
    eehdeehd Posts: 137member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It?s best not to acknowledge it as it means that even after the user is deleted any posts you have quoted remain, though without the spam links it is harmless Just click on this icon »»«« below their name and report them. The mods will see a bunch from the same user and get on top of it when they log in.



    I did, but this is starting to piss me off. It is happening in all the discussion forums I visit. These people never cease to amaze me how they find new ways of annoying people.
  • Reply 11 of 21
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by eehd View Post


    Hey ASS HOLE! Stop Spamming these boards! Don't you have better things to do?



    i think wiped him from the boards so your screaming at thin air .. any way



    i wonder when net 2 will come out ??
  • Reply 12 of 21
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It?s best not to acknowledge it as it means that even after the user is deleted any posts you have quoted remain, though without the spam links it is harmless Just click on this icon »»«« below their name and report them. The mods will see a bunch from the same user and get on top of it when they log in.



    i just informed on you

    as being a great guy !!!



    stud has been totally deleted



    posts and all



    wow
  • Reply 13 of 21
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by brucep View Post


    i just informed on you

    as being a great guy !!!



    stud has been totally deleted



    posts and all



    wow



    I'm a little surprised that Google is on board with AT&T. Not because of any past history between the two, but simply because they seem to try to avoid bad PR. I don't know of any nice way around saying "we want to control what you see and do in the internet because it's in your own best interests".



    We seem to be doing just fine today without said controls. All of this screaming from broadband providers could be better spent expanding their networks and bringing us up to par with the rest of the world (100 MB anyone?). We pay ridiculous prices for sub-par speeds and support straight from India.



    If they get what they want, we get to keep our 2mbps broadband, support from India, and certified AT&T content. Hoorah?
  • Reply 14 of 21
    I think one solution is to regulate the definition of "Internet" from a marketing perspective.



    AT&T is fine to provide access to all non-google content on their iPhone, but this should be called "network services" not "Internet service".
  • Reply 15 of 21
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    I don't think that any service provider should be allowed to provide content. It should have never been allowed and I think it would solve the current conflicts.
  • Reply 16 of 21
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DJRumpy View Post


    I don't think that any service provider should be allowed to provide content. It should have never been allowed and I think it would solve the current conflicts.



    I agree with that, but it seems that it is too late to make this a reality at least in the United States. Look at what Comcast has done and now they are buying a majority of NBC Universal. When I say look at what Comcast has done, I am referring to them as throttling up and throttling down their network, and disguising packets as not their own which interfered with P2P networks.



    Also if you read Comcast's history it reads full of negligence.



    It's all about controlling the whole widget. Own the Pipes, Own the content.
  • Reply 17 of 21
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by DJRumpy View Post


    I'm a little surprised that Google is on board with AT&T. Not because of any past history between the two, but simply because they seem to try to avoid bad PR. I don't know of any nice way around saying "we want to control what you see and do in the internet because it's in your own best interests".



    We seem to be doing just fine today without said controls. All of this screaming from broadband providers could be better spent expanding their networks and bringing us up to par with the rest of the world (100 MB anyone?). We pay ridiculous prices for sub-par speeds and support straight from India.



    If they get what they want, we get to keep our 2mbps broadband, support from India, and certified AT&T content. Hoorah?



    we will over throw the whole bunch one day !!

    teck is moving so fast that small start up's will reinvent the whole thing

    cheaper better faster and no gate keepers .





    go apple
  • Reply 18 of 21
    djrumpydjrumpy Posts: 1,116member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by brucep View Post


    we will over throw the whole bunch one day !!

    teck is moving so fast that small start up's will reinvent the whole thing

    cheaper better faster and no gate keepers .





    go apple



    Except that the current crop of providers have a virtual lock on the market, granted by our own government, and they present an almost impossible barrier for entry to any new competition.



    I just saw something over on Slashdot which makes me happy, should anything useful actually come out of it: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/12/...es-Competition



    I hope they don't screw it up...
  • Reply 19 of 21
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    The red circle means your user account is offline, green is online.



    It says: Welcome, macologist, and Log Out!!! So, why is my the Circle Red?



    When I started writing this Reply, I opened this Thread http://forums.appleinsider.com/showthread.php?p=1535664 in another Tab and the Circle on my and other Replies were Green. So, I guess, they turn Green when I start Replying, right?... A bit confusing!



    Thanks for your help!
  • Reply 20 of 21
    I guess I'm the only one who agrees with Google, AT&T and Verizon here.



    Network neutrality, while sounding good in theory, is based on the false assumption that the internet is public property, like broadcast airwaves.



    It's not. The internet is a conglomeration of hundreds of private networks, almost all of which are bought and paid for by corporations. These networks don't come cheap. It costs millions of dollars to install the thousands of miles of fiber and purchase the massive routers that make everything work.



    Just like you have (or should have) the final say over what content gets moved over your home network that you've bought and paid for, a carrier should have the final say over what gets moved over the network that they've bought and paid for.



    Will this bother some people? Probably, but that's why you've got the option to move to other carriers, whose policies you may find less objectionable. Yes, there may be no choice in some places, and perhaps some form of regulation might be appropriate in those locations, but they are really not appropriate when you've got several different companies to choose from. If the masses take their business away from the "bad" carriers and give it to the "good" ones, the profit motive alone will convince the "bad" carriers to improve.



    We've already seen this happen in the music business. Record companies started out refusing to permit any on-line distribution. Then customer demand and profit motive (and pressure from illegal file sharing) pushed them to selling songs on-line with DRM. Then additional customer pressure and profit motive pushed them into selling the sounds without DRM. Sure, the resulting system is not perfect, but I think it's a lot better than it would've been had some government agency stepped in and ordered the labels to sell their music on-line without DRM from the get-go.



    I don't see the network neutrality issue as any different. If government just keeps out of everybody else's way, we'll end up with a good result. Some carriers may try to be heavy-handed in the short run, but in the long run customer demand and profit motive will pull all of the important players in-line, and without any government agencies getting in the way.
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