iPhone App Store developers find ways to profit from pirates

12357

Comments

  • Reply 81 of 139
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    It's easier to install a pirated app on Mac OS X than it is on the iPhone so saying that a jailbroken is only used for piracy or elude to both App Stores being equal is so far from the truth that is laughable and clear that you've never jailbroken your phoe and checke out the diversity of the Cydia or Rock stores.



    Logically, if it's just for stealing apps then why even have an app store when in of itself is not required for app piracy, only access to the root which could be built into the jailbreak. The fact is there is a huge amount of functionality that can be had, most of which I hope Apple adds to iPhone OS v4.0 so I don't have to bother with jailbreaking.



    The concept "if Apple doesn't include the functionality it must not be important to me" is one reason people tend to have Apple enthusiests.



    I've been to them. I know what's there.



    It's interesting to think that it's the "other things" that's driving them. It isn't. If there's one thing that 80% of people go for, but 99 that the other 20% go for, what do you think the main purpose is for?



    I know it will take some time to work that out, so I'll wait.
  • Reply 82 of 139
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post


    I would like to see you try this in, lets say an Apple store. 'Excuse me, I'm just shoplifting this iMac to try it out and to see if I like it. Don't worry if I don't like it I will bring it back'



    I am afraid that your arguments are now null and void as you have publicly admitted to being a pirate.



    Sure have and unless Apple include a way to test apps before purchase, like you can with an iMac in every Apple Store, I'll continue to test any app over $10. If your problemish

    was with afesr of reprisal that is understandable, but if your problem is a myopic veiw or right and wrong without consideration for the situation at and then I feel sorry you. I wasn't going to dish out $100 for an app just to never use it again because it crashes or fails to do what I need I to do.



    Not that care what you think but every app I've tested I've either deleted because I didn't like it or bought on the App Store to support the developer. That means not a single IPA file I have is cracked.
  • Reply 83 of 139
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    I've been to them. I know what's there.



    It's interesting to think that it's the "other things" that's driving them. It isn't. If there's one thing that 80% of people go for, but 99 that the other 20% go for, what do you think the main purpose is for?



    I know it will take some time to work that out, so I'll wait.



    By that logic, an invaluable App Store app that appeals only to a small fraction of the iPhone OS community invalidates the app's importance overall.
  • Reply 84 of 139
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Sure have and unless Apple include a way to test apps before purchase, like you can with an iMac in every Apple Store, I'll continue to test any app over $10. If your problemish

    was with afesr of reprisal that is understandable, but if your problem is a myopic veiw or right and wrong without consideration for the situation at and then I feel sorry you. I wasn't going to dish out $100 for an app just to never use it again because it crashes or fails to do what I need I to do.



    Not that care what you think but every app I've tested I've either deleted because I didn't like it or bought on the App Store to support the developer. That means not a single IPA file I have is cracked.



    If you really don't like an app, you can usually get your money back. Try it. It still doesn't mean that pirating it is proper.



    Besides, most pirates use that excuse. It's still just an excuse.
  • Reply 85 of 139
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    By that logic, an invaluable App Store app that appeals only to a small fraction of the iPhone OS community invalidates the app's importance overall.



    No, you're changing the argument, though I don't think you realize that.



    People go to the app store to get apps, legally, and properly. How well any individual app does doesn't invalidate that.



    When you go to a place that specializes in helping you pirate apps, and most are going there for that, then that's what it's for, despite other things being available there that may be more legit.
  • Reply 86 of 139
    irnchrizirnchriz Posts: 1,617member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Sure have and unless Apple include a way to test apps before purchase, like you can with an iMac in every Apple Store, I'll continue to test any app over $10. If your problemish

    was with afesr of reprisal that is understandable, but if your problem is a myopic veiw or right and wrong without consideration for the situation at and then I feel sorry you. I wasn't going to dish out $100 for an app just to never use it again because it crashes or fails to do what I need I to do.



    Not that care what you think but every app I've tested I've either deleted because I didn't like it or bought on the App Store to support the developer. That means not a single IPA file I have is cracked.



    You openly admitted to pirating the TomTom app and have openly admitted that any app over $10 you will also pirate to 'test'. Unfortunately it appears that you are a thief and you try and dress it up so that it plays well with your conscience, but at the end of the day you are no better than a shoplifter or burglar or even a scummy street mugger.
  • Reply 87 of 139
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    If you really don't like an app, you can usually get your money back. Try it. It still doesn't mean that pirating it is proper.



    You can and I addressed this. Apple phenomenal about the refunds it’s just less convenient and as i’ve stated I’ve paid for every app I’ve decided to keep. Various pricey games which I like and think I’ll play but never do. TomTom is the only non-game I’ve pirated, and I deleted it quickly seeing that it was no replacement to my stand alone TomTom.



    You may or not may not recall, but I’ve saying that the notification system was woefully out of date before WebOS and Android made it blatantly clear. Maybe as far back in iPhone v1.x.



    And I’ve been requesting a trial version of apps using the exploding FairPlay DRM found in iTS movie rentals since the iPhone OS SDK was introduced. Though I seem to be the only one. Why would I even conceive of such a thing if stealing apps was the only thing on my agenda?



    The fact is, convenience is my primary concern and if that means taking a very, very slim risk of getting my phone repaired under warranty or risk having the “EULA police” knocking down my door, then so be it. I buy new HW every year as it is so I’m not worried.



    Quote:

    Besides, most pirates use that excuse. It's still just an excuse.



    That doesn’t change the fact that Cydia and Rock app stores are filled with apps free and paod for that don’t have anything to do with cracked IPAs.



    I don’t feel a sense of entitlement to my jailbreaking. I’ve always maintained, even in this thread, that Apple has the right to lock down their HW, OS and App Store, but that doesn’t mean I don’t feel I’m allowed to use my device as I see fit.



    "I do not agree with what you do with your iPhone, but I'll defend to the death your right to use it."
  • Reply 88 of 139
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    No, you're changing the argument, though I don't think you realize that.



    People go to the app store to get apps, legally, and properly. How well any individual app does doesn't invalidate that.



    When you go to a place that specializes in helping you pirate apps, and most are going there for that, then that's what it's for, despite other things being available there that may be more legit.



    By that logic any internet search engine is guilty of aiding and abetting piracy, child abuse, infidelity, animal abuse, etc. I may have given you a point if jailbreaking didn?t predate the App Store, if Cydia and Rock?s only purpose was to make stealing apps easier, and if iPhone OS plus App Store had every single functionality that a jailbroken iPhone had. As it stands, it?s not even close, at least not with iPhone OS v3.x.
  • Reply 89 of 139
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post


    You openly admitted to pirating...



    Yep, sure did.
  • Reply 90 of 139
    Please, look these up if need be but ENOUGH with "Jailbreakers are pirates" bullsh*t.

    -*SBS settings*

    -quickscroll

    -haptic feedback

    -notifications

    -Stacks

    -ssh

    -TOGGLE:

    rotation

    volume

    brightness

    location

    auolock

    -quick restart-respring

    -themes

    -animated icons

    And many many more..



    **Long live the jailbreaking community**
  • Reply 91 of 139
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Boogerman2000 View Post


    Please, look these up if need be but ENOUGH with "Jailbreakers are pirates" bullsh*t.

    […]

    brightness



    Now that you mention it, even having a flashlight app that will automatically go to full brightness when accessed without first having to go Settings » Brightness to adjust it and back again to correct it, are enough for me to continue jailbreaking.
  • Reply 92 of 139
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    Now that you mention it, even having a flashlight app that will automatically go to full brightness when accessed without first having to go Settings » Brightness to adjust it and back again to correct it, are enough for me to continue jailbreaking.



    Exactly.. I'll be paying close attention Wed. for more than just news of the tablet. Maybe some of these functionalities will be addressed in 4.0. I too have quite the list going.
  • Reply 93 of 139
    tulkastulkas Posts: 3,757member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


    I can tether, with no jailbreak.



    What about developers, who have their work stolen and have to make up for it by plying pirates with more ads, ads which legitimate owners also have to put up with.



    Jailbreaking enables pirates!





    And, if one was a complete and total idiot, that might be reason alone to believe that Jailbreaking is therefore a bad, evil thing. Since it can be used for nefarious purposes, it must itself be nefarious.



    Those without Jobs' nuts in their mouths and a brain in their heads might think differently.



    When you rip a DVD or CD, depending copyright and fair use laws in your jurisdiction, you might be well within your rights. Hell, even Apple originally launched iTunes as a CD ripping app. Does that mean iTunes is wrong and should be avoided? After all, RIPPING CD'S IN ITUNES ENABLES PIRATES. Oh well, I am sure you will rationalize this, as it was Apple that released it.



    Hell, you, I assume, own a computer. Perhaps even a Mac. Were you aware that computers can be used for piracy? A shocking thought, I know, but it is true. Really. Anyone so self righteous as to paint all users of a tool that might enable piracy, would certainly ball up and give up their computer. I have my doubts about the strength of their convictions though. Ironically if Jobs asked these the people to do it (and perhaps drink some purple kool-aid), they would do so in a heart beat. That is what happens when some of the devoted turn in their brains.



    Not all jailbreakers are thieves. It takes very, very dense line of thought to make that equation. Almost as dense as believing that JB is wrong because pirates also use it.
  • Reply 94 of 139
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    Cydia, like the x86 project, is being disingenuous. They know very well that the entire purpose of their existence is for people to download pirated apps. They serve no other purpose.



    I must ask you something, but wouldn't want you to take it as a flame:



    Do you even know what's Cydia is all about?



    There is not a single pirate app in Cydia!

    Again: Not even one of the hundred of thousands apps available in iTunes could be found on Cydia!



    The only way Cydia coud be possibly linked to piracy is that it's possible - I say POSSIBLE - for some to include a pirate repository in Cydia, in a way that through it some could install a patch that would allow some to include pirate apps in iPhones (by other means, that's not Cydia) .





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    They say what they do in an attempt to stay out of Apple's claws. They attempt to present the information as "educational", and not for what it really is.



    I bought some apps from Cydia repos, usually via PayPal payment.

    None of them are ever available in app store (some never submitted, some not approved by apple draconian approval process). Where's the piracy of that?

    Most of them are donationware, which means that you can use anyways, paying or not.

    People coding these apps are devs too, like the other ones, and make legitimate money (by legitimate I mean not stealing IP from anybody)...





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    The fact that some apps are not found in Brazil's store isn't a good reason to steal them.

    It's still theft.



    You're right, but not quite.



    First of all, it's not "some apps", it's almost the entire library of apps. The ones that are present here are, mostly, some of the free apps.



    Stealing something from someone also means, thinking the other way around, that someone would still have that something in his/her possession.



    If the someones (the devs) - whatever the reason - could not sell their app in Brazil (or any other unimportant market for Apple), they will not make any money in that specific market, whether piracy exists or not.

    It's a matter of Apple's priority, and it's not a transfer of money, from the devs hands to the pirates hands, in this specific case.





    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post


    If there are licensing issues, or some other problem that prevents them from being sold there, you can be sure that it's rarely the developer who prefers it that way, or, for that matter, Apple.



    Neither, for that matter, by the users' choice, for sure.



    I prefer to pay for them.

    Most of people I know, says the same.

    Most of people I know buy the rare apps and musics available in the BR's iTunes store.
  • Reply 95 of 139
    successsuccess Posts: 1,040member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post


    The very fact that someone would bother to pirate a 99 cent or $1.99 app just illustrates what kind of mentality permeates consumer and geek culture. Further reinforces the notion of a "freemium" app being the best model.



    No. It's not just one off's. Pirates download packs of (cracked) apps and install all at once. $0.99 x 200 apps = $200.00. Quite easy to find them on the net.



    The guys from TapTap took advantage of what the RIAA did not. Pirating does not take away sales. We've been over this over and over.



    Pirates either would never have bought in the first place or will buy if the app is not a piece of shit. Same goes for music. In the case where a pirate would never have bought the app in the first place he/she still tells their circle of friends about the app and it get more publicity.



    If your product is quality pirating does nothing except promote that product. If your product is shit well, it's shit and that's par for the course.



    And yes that is why as a developer if you don't have a free version of your app, you're an idiot. This is echoed on all app development and marketing sites as well. I can't count the times I've passed by an app because there was no trial. I've bought full versions of 90% of the lite versions I've tried.
  • Reply 96 of 139
    palegolaspalegolas Posts: 1,361member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by charlituna View Post


    two different games. not everyone that does one does the other.

    also, at least in the US there's not unlock fee. You can't unlock under the terms. there's a blackmarket for unlocking and some folks will do it for a price. but you can not,for example,go to ATT with your iphone and say 'okay so I did my two years, unlock it' at any price at this point in time



    That's really mean.. Over here in Europe I think that would be illegal.

    I'd never jailbreak my phone if I could buy it at a normal price with free choice of carrier. Not interested in jailbreaking or piracy, i just want it to work for my carrier at home and pay cards abroad, since they have benefits the iPhone carriers do not. So I'm left with the hackers.



    Lately I've found one of the iPhone carriers over here though that has one package aimed for companies. Paying for the iPhone, then for breaking the contract and unlocking the phone ends up in, roughly, 2x the price. That's better than 4x the price that has been the normal unlocked iPhone-price in EU. Getting more reasonable
  • Reply 97 of 139
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,992member
    Like you have done, you mean?



    Examine the statement:-



    JAILBREAKING ENABLES PIRATES



    and kindly explain how you reached the conclusion that it states that all jailbreakers are pirates based on these three simple words?



    All pirates are jailbreakers is the obvious conclusion.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post


    Not all jailbreakers are thieves. It takes very, very dense line of thought to make that equation. Almost as dense as believing that JB is wrong because pirates also use it.



  • Reply 98 of 139
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,992member
    Cydia, Rock store,



    Rock store, Cydia,



    Are not the source of cracked Apps and all the defenders know that.



    To mention the source should get the post deleted as that is one of the jobs of the Mods.



    Everyone knows that cracked Apps don't come from Cydia.



    So please move on from that feeble defensive argument.
  • Reply 99 of 139
    ivan.rnn01ivan.rnn01 Posts: 1,822member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


    Cydia, Rock store,

    Rock store, Cydia,

    Are not the source of cracked Apps and all the defenders know that.

    To mention the source should get the post deleted as that is one of the jobs of the Mods.

    Everyone knows that cracked Apps don't come from Cydia.

    So please move on from that feeble defensive argument.



    Actually, it's even worse than what you might have presumed. Cydia distributes crackers. Cydia sells apps rejected by Apple at AppStore; nobody can guarantee these apps are harmless.

    They are unlawful.
  • Reply 100 of 139
    hill60hill60 Posts: 6,992member
    Well I guess that came about by the noble, holier than thou, "it's about the freedom to use my hardware as I see fit" crowd over at Cydia being rolled by a younger, faster crowd with less scruples.



    A little rain has turned into a flood.



    The unofficial App store that begins with the letter 'I" shall remain nameless.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ivan.rnn01 View Post


    Actually, it's even worse than what you might have presumed. Cydia distributes crackers. Cydia sells apps rejected by Apple at AppStore; nobody can guarantee these apps are harmless.

    They are unlawful.



Sign In or Register to comment.