We are not talking about surviving without Adobe, just Flash. I don't think Apple wants to exclude Google, they just have to protect what their turf. Bluray on the other hand, is a dead duck. I know some people love it for good reasons, but it will never be main stream on computers. Specially not on Apple computers. An optical drive is clunky and occupies too much valuable space.
Agreed, maybe we just need one optical drive per house hold....on an AppleTV or one inside TimeCapsule....and no more in desktops or laptops (or in landfills for that matter!).
Or maybe just one portable optical drive like the MBA's.....I hardly ever put a DVD/CD in my MacBook anymore or even in my car for that matter. I would rather have thinner quieter, lighter machines and less expensive machines without optical drives.
Could take it to the next level or if the vast majority of Macs being Macbooks sold to general users could result in Mac sales free falling when they learn they learn they can't go out and by software or watch a DVD without an external device. SD cards are too expensive for software distribution and the way Apple has managed the iPhone App store, I'm not so sure I want a Mac version. Move away from optical media before the market is ready and it could be very much to Apple's peril.
Most software that I get these days is downloaded, without an app store. I still regularly use DVD for movies though.
Steve Jobs is a genious[sic] but Apple cannot survive without Adobe, Google, or Blu-ray IMHO.
I have no idea how this comment relates to the ones you replied to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenRoethig
Could take it to the next level or if the vast majority of Macs being Macbooks sold to general users could result in Mac sales free falling when they learn they learn they can't go out and by software or watch a DVD without an external device. SD cards are too expensive for software distribution and the way Apple has managed the iPhone App store, I'm not so sure I want a Mac version. Move away from optical media before the market is ready and it could be very much to Apple's peril.
Before it's tome, no. When it's time, yes. This isn't the 1990s. People are well connected to the internet and to networks in their home. Installing software via CD/DVD or watching/listening to music from a disc isn't that common in personal computers these. Is it done, sure, but Apple doesn't make decisions on what some may still be doing. They have several other agendas that are helping to push this change. It will happen and those that think it won't are just as wrong as the ones that thought you can't remove the floppydrive, serial and parallel ports from computers.
I think you missed the boat- Steve Jobs wants to you buy anything and everything from his iTunes store plantation from now on. He's trying to kill FLASH for that very reason in that it competes with his game sales on iTunes, Blu-ray competes with his low grade HD movies at iTunes, etc , etc. There is a method to his greed- say one thing, mean another.
Why would they promote open standards and build the browser with leading HTML5 support, if that's the plan? Makes no sense. Apple even allows the software of competing shops and music services in the App Store...
He is trying to kill Flash, because Adobe is not giving Mac users a good product. They ignored Cocoa for a decade, now they can't even provide 64-bit apps, Flash crashes and eats resources like a 3D renderer, just for the trivial task of playing a movie... They want the revenues, but do not want to invest any work. Serves them right.
BTW, maybe read the blog of the Fennec (Mozilla browser used on Nokia's N900) developers. Guess what they have just done? Right. They disabled support for the Flash plug-in, as it was ruining the user experience to the degree of making the browser unusable.
Perfect...well said and that is exactly apple's approach. Which I for one really appreciate.
Do you think by new macs this year he is referring to Apple Chips being inside and slowly changing from intel?
I hope that Apple remain in bed with Intel, it's good to see the Intel badge - it's reassuring for Windows switchers. I believe Apple should continue to excel at what they are good at - Intel do chips, Apple do the user experience - let's hope they keep it that way. I'm sure Apple can excel, but for now, let's withhold judgement until we see what the A4 processor delivers.
Integration of these companies, not a lot of competitors is the way forward. An Apple aligned with google and Intel can define the future of computing. An Apple with Google and Intel as enemies would be doomed.
I just wish Apple would buy Adobe, and sort the current mess.
Awesome! P!ss off your only important friends- Intel, Google, and Adobe.
Your ego will bring Apple to its knees and I'll be there to laugh.
There is no point in having a sycophantic relationship. Apple need to deliver a high standard of user experience, if Adobe don't do this, then a conversation needs to be had. Friendships are not all about the good times. Apple must constantly push the industry, suppliers, component manufacturers and think tanks. Going through business walking on eggshells will result in a lethargic attitude from the likes of Adobe, this can't happen - it's not good for anyone.
Adobe need to up their game, and google and apple need to work out common ground and work together, they should not be competitors.
I read a lot of the finger pointing between the two and it seems to be the same ol' same ol'. I don't see why Adobe and Apple can't work together to make things better. Flash is garbage on OS X, but it's not as if Apple is making it easy for Adobe. In fact, I can't remember the last time Flash crashed on my SL install since a removal and reinstall for it. No flash and no java runtime equals not being the whole internet experience as Apple claims. I don't miss Flash that much on my iPhone, but there are times when I am driving with co-workers trying to look at an online menu for some eatery and it doesn't work because it's in Flash. Other than that, no issues.
It's SJ's company, and that's his right - don't like it, don't buy the product.
Bold statement, but it does sum up Apple's attitude lately. Unfortunately.
No flash, no blu ray, heck, no DVD drive before long. It sure seems Apple doesn't want you to have any choice (my favorite word) but to buy from iTunes.
When I bought my first PC, I had to use Windows because I had no choice. (No Apple stores or Macs at Best Buy.) I didn't like it and when a choice was made available to me, I took it and got a Mac. I didn't like a company that had the attitude of "You WILL love XP."
I don't think people like being treated in that manner. People outside of the AI forum anyway.
...It will happen and those that think it won't are just as wrong as the ones that thought you can't remove the floppydrive, serial and parallel ports from computers.
The replacements for floppy drives and serial and parallel ports represented clear and obvious benefits over their predecessors. I don't, however, see a replacement for optical drives that offers such a clear and obvious benefit just yet. Yes, I agree that it will happen, but optical drives still represent a cheap and effective means of delivering and storing data.
You really don't know what you're talking about, do you?
For someone who has a signature that says "Don't feed the trolls" you certainly are acting like one.
It's not my problem you can't spot where Apple is going based upon recent events, product announcements, processor changes etc.
Apple has switched from PPC to Intel processors in a emergency basically because the PPC was too hot for laptops. As a result the cloners reared their ugly heads, but Apple bought PA Semi to make their own processors and now with the iPad announcement that it has a Apple A4 processor, goes to show Apple doesn't need Intel processors any longer.
Apple is making thinner and lighter machines, as witnessed by the MacBook Air and the iPad, both don't have a Superdrive as a internal device. Apple has recently introduced SD slots on their computers, which is a thin interface. Apple likes thin.
Apple is also doing away with hard drives, using SSD instead, as witnessed by the MacBook Air, the Pad, the iPod Touch, the iPhones etc.
So given all these obvious signs, and especially Steve's coded message that big changes are coming to most of the Mac line, it's rather safe to conclude what is coming based upon current trends.
For me, 1 in 50 DVDs show up damaged or cracked. I haven't received any damaged blu-rays yet though. Scratch-wise, everything seems to play just fine.
I dont think thats a testament to the quality of the disc more than it is mailing and shipping. I only buy Blu-ray dvds but i'll go out to the redbox and rent some on occasion and i have yet to have one not work from scratches/or be cracked.
Apple could easily support Blu-ray for their AppleTV instead of the paltry and lacking offering that it currently is. What annoys me to no end is their new upper end of devices like the new iMac both 21 & 27' models which support Blu-ray resolutions are missing this. I can see MBPs and the Mini missing this support, but damn throw us a bone.
Now you can say people dont watch movies on their computers but simply that isnt true. At 27" that is still a great size for movies in incredibly high resolution.
Adobe's products are still using code from the early 1990's. They had a chance to write their apps from scratch 10 years ago when OS X debuted and didn't do it. Photoshop and Illustrator are so bloated and complicated that you practically need a degree to learn how to use them.
But there's no alternative because Adobe has no competition. As long as that's the case, Adobe will continue to drag along.
As much as I hate Flash, it's not what makes Mac crash.
I hope that Apple remain in bed with Intel, it's good to see the Intel badge - it's reassuring for Windows switchers. I believe Apple should continue to excel at what they are good at - Intel do chips, Apple do the user experience - let's hope they keep it that way. I'm sure Apple can excel, but for now, let's withhold judgement until we see what the A4 processor delivers.
Integration of these companies, not a lot of competitors is the way forward. An Apple aligned with google and Intel can define the future of computing. An Apple with Google and Intel as enemies would be doomed.
I just wish Apple would buy Adobe, and sort the current mess.
I can't wait for Apple to lead the way and remove optical drives from their line up, the uproar will be exactly as the loss of the floppy drive or the ADB/SCSI/Serial ports. Then in a few years, you won't even think about them. Fragile, limited useful life and bulky to store. An SD card will hold so much more data than a CD/DVD/Blu-Ray disc, with faster access times and less draw on battery, cost less to produce and be easy to carry around.
Are you glad that Apple didn't build in an SD card reader into the iPad?
There is no point in having a sycophantic relationship. Apple need to deliver a high standard of user experience, if Adobe don't do this, then a conversation needs to be had. Friendships are not all about the good times. Apple must constantly push the industry, suppliers, component manufacturers and think tanks. Going through business walking on eggshells will result in a lethargic attitude from the likes of Adobe, this can't happen - it's not good for anyone.
The problem with this event was more like talking behind someone else's back, not a direct conversation like you suggest. It needs to be said to Adobe, not preached to the Apple employee choir.
For god's sake, I just want them to rev the processor on the MBPs already. I've been waiting with increasing impatience since December, hammering away at my aging G4.
Noupdatesattheeventdontneedanipadmumblegrumble.
Well the event was to launch the iPad, nothing was ever mention about MBP updated. The iMac wasn't updated at this event either - what's your point?
The current MBP is less than a year old. You don't even know what the upgrade will bring, or when it will be, so instead of buying what is already a great product, you're hammering away on technology far inferior. Very odd mindset.
There will always be something new around the corner - that's the nature of any industry, any product. It's not a reason to not buy today, unless you know the update is coming tomorrow. You don't know this, so just buy the MBP already!
Well thank goodness you can go out and buy an external blue-ray or dvd drive and plug it into your Macs trusty little USB port.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerseymac
Bold statement, but it does sum up Apple's attitude lately. Unfortunately.
No flash, no blu ray, heck, no DVD drive before long. It sure seems Apple doesn't want you to have any choice (my favorite word) but to buy from iTunes.
When I bought my first PC, I had to use Windows because I had no choice. (No Apple stores or Macs at Best Buy.) I didn't like it and when a choice was made available to me, I took it and got a Mac. I didn't like a company that had the attitude of "You WILL love XP."
I don't think people like being treated in that manner. People outside of the AI forum anyway.
Comments
We are not talking about surviving without Adobe, just Flash. I don't think Apple wants to exclude Google, they just have to protect what their turf. Bluray on the other hand, is a dead duck. I know some people love it for good reasons, but it will never be main stream on computers. Specially not on Apple computers. An optical drive is clunky and occupies too much valuable space.
Agreed, maybe we just need one optical drive per house hold....on an AppleTV or one inside TimeCapsule....and no more in desktops or laptops (or in landfills for that matter!).
Or maybe just one portable optical drive like the MBA's.....I hardly ever put a DVD/CD in my MacBook anymore or even in my car for that matter. I would rather have thinner quieter, lighter machines and less expensive machines without optical drives.
Apple and Google were the subjects of an investigation from the Federal Trade Commission over potential antitrust ties.
Do antitrust ties go with antitrust suits?
For anyone who had any questions about why Apple should not and will not acquire Adobe, Steve's remarks about them should be Exhibit A.
Could take it to the next level or if the vast majority of Macs being Macbooks sold to general users could result in Mac sales free falling when they learn they learn they can't go out and by software or watch a DVD without an external device. SD cards are too expensive for software distribution and the way Apple has managed the iPhone App store, I'm not so sure I want a Mac version. Move away from optical media before the market is ready and it could be very much to Apple's peril.
Most software that I get these days is downloaded, without an app store. I still regularly use DVD for movies though.
Steve Jobs is a genious[sic] but Apple cannot survive without Adobe, Google, or Blu-ray IMHO.
I have no idea how this comment relates to the ones you replied to.
Could take it to the next level or if the vast majority of Macs being Macbooks sold to general users could result in Mac sales free falling when they learn they learn they can't go out and by software or watch a DVD without an external device. SD cards are too expensive for software distribution and the way Apple has managed the iPhone App store, I'm not so sure I want a Mac version. Move away from optical media before the market is ready and it could be very much to Apple's peril.
Before it's tome, no. When it's time, yes. This isn't the 1990s. People are well connected to the internet and to networks in their home. Installing software via CD/DVD or watching/listening to music from a disc isn't that common in personal computers these. Is it done, sure, but Apple doesn't make decisions on what some may still be doing. They have several other agendas that are helping to push this change. It will happen and those that think it won't are just as wrong as the ones that thought you can't remove the floppydrive, serial and parallel ports from computers.
I think you missed the boat- Steve Jobs wants to you buy anything and everything from his iTunes store plantation from now on. He's trying to kill FLASH for that very reason in that it competes with his game sales on iTunes, Blu-ray competes with his low grade HD movies at iTunes, etc , etc. There is a method to his greed- say one thing, mean another.
Why would they promote open standards and build the browser with leading HTML5 support, if that's the plan? Makes no sense. Apple even allows the software of competing shops and music services in the App Store...
He is trying to kill Flash, because Adobe is not giving Mac users a good product. They ignored Cocoa for a decade, now they can't even provide 64-bit apps, Flash crashes and eats resources like a 3D renderer, just for the trivial task of playing a movie... They want the revenues, but do not want to invest any work. Serves them right.
BTW, maybe read the blog of the Fennec (Mozilla browser used on Nokia's N900) developers. Guess what they have just done? Right. They disabled support for the Flash plug-in, as it was ruining the user experience to the degree of making the browser unusable.
Your ego will bring Apple to its knees and I'll be there to laugh.
Another kool-aid drinker. Just another flavor.
Because competition is bad?
Perfect...well said and that is exactly apple's approach. Which I for one really appreciate.
Do you think by new macs this year he is referring to Apple Chips being inside and slowly changing from intel?
I hope that Apple remain in bed with Intel, it's good to see the Intel badge - it's reassuring for Windows switchers. I believe Apple should continue to excel at what they are good at - Intel do chips, Apple do the user experience - let's hope they keep it that way. I'm sure Apple can excel, but for now, let's withhold judgement until we see what the A4 processor delivers.
Integration of these companies, not a lot of competitors is the way forward. An Apple aligned with google and Intel can define the future of computing. An Apple with Google and Intel as enemies would be doomed.
I just wish Apple would buy Adobe, and sort the current mess.
Awesome! P!ss off your only important friends- Intel, Google, and Adobe.
Your ego will bring Apple to its knees and I'll be there to laugh.
There is no point in having a sycophantic relationship. Apple need to deliver a high standard of user experience, if Adobe don't do this, then a conversation needs to be had. Friendships are not all about the good times. Apple must constantly push the industry, suppliers, component manufacturers and think tanks. Going through business walking on eggshells will result in a lethargic attitude from the likes of Adobe, this can't happen - it's not good for anyone.
Adobe need to up their game, and google and apple need to work out common ground and work together, they should not be competitors.
It's SJ's company, and that's his right - don't like it, don't buy the product.
Bold statement, but it does sum up Apple's attitude lately. Unfortunately.
No flash, no blu ray, heck, no DVD drive before long. It sure seems Apple doesn't want you to have any choice (my favorite word) but to buy from iTunes.
When I bought my first PC, I had to use Windows because I had no choice. (No Apple stores or Macs at Best Buy.) I didn't like it and when a choice was made available to me, I took it and got a Mac. I didn't like a company that had the attitude of "You WILL love XP."
I don't think people like being treated in that manner. People outside of the AI forum anyway.
...It will happen and those that think it won't are just as wrong as the ones that thought you can't remove the floppydrive, serial and parallel ports from computers.
The replacements for floppy drives and serial and parallel ports represented clear and obvious benefits over their predecessors. I don't, however, see a replacement for optical drives that offers such a clear and obvious benefit just yet. Yes, I agree that it will happen, but optical drives still represent a cheap and effective means of delivering and storing data.
You really don't know what you're talking about, do you?
For someone who has a signature that says "Don't feed the trolls" you certainly are acting like one.
It's not my problem you can't spot where Apple is going based upon recent events, product announcements, processor changes etc.
Apple has switched from PPC to Intel processors in a emergency basically because the PPC was too hot for laptops. As a result the cloners reared their ugly heads, but Apple bought PA Semi to make their own processors and now with the iPad announcement that it has a Apple A4 processor, goes to show Apple doesn't need Intel processors any longer.
Apple is making thinner and lighter machines, as witnessed by the MacBook Air and the iPad, both don't have a Superdrive as a internal device. Apple has recently introduced SD slots on their computers, which is a thin interface. Apple likes thin.
Apple is also doing away with hard drives, using SSD instead, as witnessed by the MacBook Air, the Pad, the iPod Touch, the iPhones etc.
So given all these obvious signs, and especially Steve's coded message that big changes are coming to most of the Mac line, it's rather safe to conclude what is coming based upon current trends.
For me, 1 in 50 DVDs show up damaged or cracked. I haven't received any damaged blu-rays yet though. Scratch-wise, everything seems to play just fine.
I dont think thats a testament to the quality of the disc more than it is mailing and shipping. I only buy Blu-ray dvds but i'll go out to the redbox and rent some on occasion and i have yet to have one not work from scratches/or be cracked.
Apple could easily support Blu-ray for their AppleTV instead of the paltry and lacking offering that it currently is. What annoys me to no end is their new upper end of devices like the new iMac both 21 & 27' models which support Blu-ray resolutions are missing this. I can see MBPs and the Mini missing this support, but damn throw us a bone.
Now you can say people dont watch movies on their computers but simply that isnt true. At 27" that is still a great size for movies in incredibly high resolution.
But there's no alternative because Adobe has no competition. As long as that's the case, Adobe will continue to drag along.
As much as I hate Flash, it's not what makes Mac crash.
I hope that Apple remain in bed with Intel, it's good to see the Intel badge - it's reassuring for Windows switchers. I believe Apple should continue to excel at what they are good at - Intel do chips, Apple do the user experience - let's hope they keep it that way. I'm sure Apple can excel, but for now, let's withhold judgement until we see what the A4 processor delivers.
Integration of these companies, not a lot of competitors is the way forward. An Apple aligned with google and Intel can define the future of computing. An Apple with Google and Intel as enemies would be doomed.
I just wish Apple would buy Adobe, and sort the current mess.
Good points!
I can't wait for Apple to lead the way and remove optical drives from their line up, the uproar will be exactly as the loss of the floppy drive or the ADB/SCSI/Serial ports. Then in a few years, you won't even think about them. Fragile, limited useful life and bulky to store. An SD card will hold so much more data than a CD/DVD/Blu-Ray disc, with faster access times and less draw on battery, cost less to produce and be easy to carry around.
Are you glad that Apple didn't build in an SD card reader into the iPad?
There is no point in having a sycophantic relationship. Apple need to deliver a high standard of user experience, if Adobe don't do this, then a conversation needs to be had. Friendships are not all about the good times. Apple must constantly push the industry, suppliers, component manufacturers and think tanks. Going through business walking on eggshells will result in a lethargic attitude from the likes of Adobe, this can't happen - it's not good for anyone.
The problem with this event was more like talking behind someone else's back, not a direct conversation like you suggest. It needs to be said to Adobe, not preached to the Apple employee choir.
For god's sake, I just want them to rev the processor on the MBPs already. I've been waiting with increasing impatience since December, hammering away at my aging G4.
Noupdatesattheeventdontneedanipadmumblegrumble.
Well the event was to launch the iPad, nothing was ever mention about MBP updated. The iMac wasn't updated at this event either - what's your point?
The current MBP is less than a year old. You don't even know what the upgrade will bring, or when it will be, so instead of buying what is already a great product, you're hammering away on technology far inferior. Very odd mindset.
There will always be something new around the corner - that's the nature of any industry, any product. It's not a reason to not buy today, unless you know the update is coming tomorrow. You don't know this, so just buy the MBP already!
Bold statement, but it does sum up Apple's attitude lately. Unfortunately.
No flash, no blu ray, heck, no DVD drive before long. It sure seems Apple doesn't want you to have any choice (my favorite word) but to buy from iTunes.
When I bought my first PC, I had to use Windows because I had no choice. (No Apple stores or Macs at Best Buy.) I didn't like it and when a choice was made available to me, I took it and got a Mac. I didn't like a company that had the attitude of "You WILL love XP."
I don't think people like being treated in that manner. People outside of the AI forum anyway.