1) I think you are grossly misinterpreting Apple's stance on multitasking. They are being responsible for the user experience by not allowing anarchical multitasking, unlike what Google and Palm are doing with Android and WebOS, respectively.
Excuse me, but what do you know about implementation of multitasking on Android or WebOS platform? Have you ever read SDK documentation related to this topic?
None of us are saying we don't want multitasking. We are saying we understand why Apple has not implemented it. We'd prefer they figure out a better way to do it
No he doesn't. He does get a little excited at times but as a moderator, and one would think, setting an example, he should hold his tongue. Truly, you get the behaviour you ask for. You can't expect these forums to be free of ad hominem when the moderators are at it as well.
Cut / Copy / Paste is a perfect example... They waited until iPhone 3 to release it... For two years, critics like yourself screamed from the roof tops that the iPhone was dead for not having it....instead, they waited until they got it right...implementing it better than any other phone. As it's been said a hundred times before, if you don't like Apple products, don't post here...Don't call us naive or stupid for not sharing your views though...
But how are you going to truly run Skype at the same time as another app. You only have room on your screen for one thing at a time.
Don't get me wrong. I'm all for more features. I just don't know if "true" multi-tasking is a necessity.
I use my iPhone a lot, probably more than my laptop. I just don't think it's a big deal.
I see Apple trying to take care of the Pandora/Spotify issue by offering their own version of it. Honestly, I don't care who offers it, but I agree, those stations music services are great and should be standard on a device.
I need to skype to run "all" of the time, to receive chat messages (skype is peer-to-peer) and answer calls - I don't need the display all of the time. Potentially other things too, like see if my girlfriend logs on. And at the time, I could be reading my latest PM network magazine.
As for Pandora/spotify, I prefer the availability over adding just an Apple service. Partly because this leaves room for innovation and differentiation, partly because Apple still isn't offering movies or TV here - and this service might not be available here for a while. If at all. I also dislike lock-in in general - I like my Apple products, but lock-in is something I don't like.
No he doesn't. He does get a little excited at times but as a moderator, and one would think, setting an example, he should hold his tongue. Truly, you get the behaviour you ask for. You can't expect these forums to be free of ad hominem when the moderators are at it as well.
Yep. If the moderators themselves insult and attack the forum users, there is little hope. I think that AI needs to rethink that guy's status. The types of remarks he makes likely chase away lots of other folks, and they significantly degrade the forum.
I'm fairly certain the viewpoint stated in that post was meant to be taken as a joke, not as the poster's honest opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius
Personal insults have no place here. I will report this sort of post to the Moderators if it is repeated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius
Personal insults have no place on this forum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius
This sort of insuting post has no place on this fourm. Moderators, please discipline this guy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius
This guy ruins this forum for the rest of us.
The forum rules, linked on the bottom of every thread, say that you cannot be vulgar, hateful, or threatening. It doesn't say anything specific about being insulting, just about being hateful, vulgar, or threatening.
I honestly didn't read hatefulness or vulgarity in any of what was written there. I find that melgross is usually perfectly capable of maintaining a fair, balanced discussion with those he doesn't agree with, provided the other participants also remain civil. But you can't blame him if he responds in kind to what's dealt to him. Oh, and by the way, melgross is a moderator.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius
Apple doesn't care about users like you. They design the iPhone so that the stupidest/most naive user can use it easily. Those types of users are (if we can believe the comments on this forum) Apple target demographic.
Indeed they are. Apple's design guidelines state quite plainly that (paraphrased) a user should be able to figure out how to use all the main features of an application intuitively, without the need to refer to documentation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius
I think that more and more folks are going to use this easy way out as more choices appear in the market.
I think the entrance of more and more choices on the market is a very good thing, and I welcome it wholeheartedly. That way, everybody has a chance to see what works and what doesn't, and all competitors' devices can improve upon each other as a result. Of course, if any prospective customer doesn't like what he sees in one device, and there is another alternative that does it better, it would only be rational for him to switch over to the other competitor.
Overall, customers will vote with their money - if Apple finds its userbase is substantially slipping or stagnating, then they will adapt accordingly. If Apple's userbase continues growing, then they'll be justified in the conclusion that whatever shortcomings they may have must be acceptable compromises.
Or just chose the worldwide standard. CDMA isn't used much outside the US, GSM is.
There are also several countries that started with CDMA and then have added 3GSM to their networks. The iPhone works in S. Korea on 3GSM-only with no GSM connectivity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwydion
Which anarchycal multitasking?
With no controlling rules or principles to give order.
Which rules and order? The system takes care of suspending and killing processes and the apps take care of saving its state when it occurs.
Can you give me and example of this anarchy?
Exhibit A: Advanced Task Killer - Android
Exhibit B: Reboot Scheduler - WebOS
Such a well governed system that 3rd-party apps for Android and WebOS had to be created to deal with the complete lack of effort made to regulate the way backgrounding occurs. \
Because unlike the 160k per day that are choosing Android. I have a contract with AT&T.
I have 1 more month. I won't wait foriPhone OS Promises 4.0.
First off your numbers are bogus.
As for iPhone please do leave as that means more bandwidth for me.
Quote:
I can get that phone next month. With the numbers of sales and Android is has I'd be like I was in 1994 and stuck in a dying Market Share.
That is one confused statement!
In any event I'm not one to slag Android as I think it is a very good attempt on Googles part to make a mobile OS. It is Not however competitive with even the current iPhone OS. Obviously a person as confused as the above statment implies won't see that.
Quote:
Apple may be great for stock holders but it's horrible at moving forward when they have an Advantage. History and now the current numbers are proof of that.
I don't know about that as I'm still valuing my Apple hardware highly. You on the otherhand equate recklessness with moving forward that has never been Apples way. Instead the build up systems in an organized manner.
As to current numbers I have no idea what you are talking about. Many of the Android phones shipping aren't competitors to iPhone. That is not a bad thing either as one thing is obvious is that Apple needs a broader lineup of hardware.
Quote:
Good luck with the future and make sure you have Apple Care on your computers because you'll need it given Apple's trend for the last 10 years.
What in the hell does Applecare have to do with this discussion??
By the way reling on Apple to actually improve things in the future can pay iff very well. Snow Leopard is a very good example of an OS upgrade that fixed more things than it harmed. Not only did Apple fix its problems, if you where a developer following Apples guidelines you would have seen improvements to your apps.
Quote:
By the way...
How long has Steve Jobs been with Apple? I wonder why he was fired. Mac's don't "just work" anymore.
Obviously a complete troll because my Mac works fine. In fact it's gotten significantly better over the years as the system has been updated. The only other systems I've had that have done that are my Linux based systems.
In any event instead of inflammatory statements why not do a real comparison of the different OS's. Android does have some good points but it's multitasking feature can be close to useless on many of the current Android phones.
You see I'm not really against your position that iPhone needs multi tasking. Right now it is a huge short coming. However the ability for other cell phones to multitask user apps is not a significant advantage and seldom warrants the choice over the purchase of an iPhone. It is the overall package that makes the difference.
melgross is usually perfectly capable of maintaining a fair, balanced discussion with those he doesn't agree with, provided the other participants also remain civil. But you can't blame him if he responds in kind to what's dealt to him. Oh, and by the way, melgross is a moderator.
I don't buy the lowest common denominator argument at all. If a moderator is going to participate in a thread then they should be setting the example in their dialogue with other users of the forum
I don't know how one can grow a thicker skin, but several need to find a way. The mods aren't here to coddle or to replace your parents.
They are hear to enforce the very limited regulations of this site. They are allowed to make to comments and disagree with people just like everyone else.
They even make comments about the quality of the articles. They've been chosen because of their long standing residence and objective replies. That does not mean they are here to babysit you, care about you or agree with you.
Comments
1) I think you are grossly misinterpreting Apple's stance on multitasking. They are being responsible for the user experience by not allowing anarchical multitasking, unlike what Google and Palm are doing with Android and WebOS, respectively.
Excuse me, but what do you know about implementation of multitasking on Android or WebOS platform? Have you ever read SDK documentation related to this topic?
None of us are saying we don't want multitasking. We are saying we understand why Apple has not implemented it. We'd prefer they figure out a better way to do it
What the heck is taking them so long?
If you had done yours,...
If you understood the way networks work, ...
If you also read the article properly,...
This guy ruins this forum for the rest of us.
This is what Apple does not want the iPhone user to have to deal with.
THe iPod touch has to deal with it
They've announce one today and will be available March 7th.
Cool. Thanks. I'll check it out.
This guy ruins this forum for the rest of us.
No he doesn't. He does get a little excited at times but as a moderator, and one would think, setting an example, he should hold his tongue. Truly, you get the behaviour you ask for. You can't expect these forums to be free of ad hominem when the moderators are at it as well.
iGenius, what were you just saying about personal attacks?
I was saying that personal attacks have no place on this forum. Attacks on companies/technologies/products should be welcome here.
What the heck is taking them so long?
Cut / Copy / Paste is a perfect example... They waited until iPhone 3 to release it... For two years, critics like yourself screamed from the roof tops that the iPhone was dead for not having it....instead, they waited until they got it right...implementing it better than any other phone. As it's been said a hundred times before, if you don't like Apple products, don't post here...Don't call us naive or stupid for not sharing your views though...
But how are you going to truly run Skype at the same time as another app. You only have room on your screen for one thing at a time.
Don't get me wrong. I'm all for more features. I just don't know if "true" multi-tasking is a necessity.
I use my iPhone a lot, probably more than my laptop. I just don't think it's a big deal.
I see Apple trying to take care of the Pandora/Spotify issue by offering their own version of it. Honestly, I don't care who offers it, but I agree, those stations music services are great and should be standard on a device.
I need to skype to run "all" of the time, to receive chat messages (skype is peer-to-peer) and answer calls - I don't need the display all of the time. Potentially other things too, like see if my girlfriend logs on. And at the time, I could be reading my latest PM network magazine.
As for Pandora/spotify, I prefer the availability over adding just an Apple service. Partly because this leaves room for innovation and differentiation, partly because Apple still isn't offering movies or TV here - and this service might not be available here for a while. If at all. I also dislike lock-in in general - I like my Apple products, but lock-in is something I don't like.
No he doesn't. He does get a little excited at times but as a moderator, and one would think, setting an example, he should hold his tongue. Truly, you get the behaviour you ask for. You can't expect these forums to be free of ad hominem when the moderators are at it as well.
Yep. If the moderators themselves insult and attack the forum users, there is little hope. I think that AI needs to rethink that guy's status. The types of remarks he makes likely chase away lots of other folks, and they significantly degrade the forum.
The implication is that Apple chose the standards that allow for simultaneous voice and data.
Or just chose the worldwide standard. CDMA isn't used much outside the US, GSM is.
not allowing anarchical multitasking, unlike what Google and Palm are doing with Android
Which anarchycal multitasking?
Your viewpoint smacks of delusion.
I'm fairly certain the viewpoint stated in that post was meant to be taken as a joke, not as the poster's honest opinion.
Personal insults have no place here. I will report this sort of post to the Moderators if it is repeated.
Personal insults have no place on this forum.
This sort of insuting post has no place on this fourm. Moderators, please discipline this guy.
This guy ruins this forum for the rest of us.
The forum rules, linked on the bottom of every thread, say that you cannot be vulgar, hateful, or threatening. It doesn't say anything specific about being insulting, just about being hateful, vulgar, or threatening.
I honestly didn't read hatefulness or vulgarity in any of what was written there. I find that melgross is usually perfectly capable of maintaining a fair, balanced discussion with those he doesn't agree with, provided the other participants also remain civil. But you can't blame him if he responds in kind to what's dealt to him. Oh, and by the way, melgross is a moderator.
Apple doesn't care about users like you. They design the iPhone so that the stupidest/most naive user can use it easily. Those types of users are (if we can believe the comments on this forum) Apple target demographic.
Indeed they are. Apple's design guidelines state quite plainly that (paraphrased) a user should be able to figure out how to use all the main features of an application intuitively, without the need to refer to documentation.
I think that more and more folks are going to use this easy way out as more choices appear in the market.
I think the entrance of more and more choices on the market is a very good thing, and I welcome it wholeheartedly. That way, everybody has a chance to see what works and what doesn't, and all competitors' devices can improve upon each other as a result. Of course, if any prospective customer doesn't like what he sees in one device, and there is another alternative that does it better, it would only be rational for him to switch over to the other competitor.
Overall, customers will vote with their money - if Apple finds its userbase is substantially slipping or stagnating, then they will adapt accordingly. If Apple's userbase continues growing, then they'll be justified in the conclusion that whatever shortcomings they may have must be acceptable compromises.
Or just chose the worldwide standard. CDMA isn't used much outside the US, GSM is.
There are also several countries that started with CDMA and then have added 3GSM to their networks. The iPhone works in S. Korea on 3GSM-only with no GSM connectivity.
Which anarchycal multitasking?
With no controlling rules or principles to give order.
With no controlling rules or principles to give order.
OK, it's clear now. You know nothing about multitasking implementation on Android platform
With no controlling rules or principles to give order.
Which rules and order? The system takes care of suspending and killing processes and the apps take care of saving its state when it occurs.
Can you give me and example of this anarchy?
Which rules and order? The system takes care of suspending and killing processes and the apps take care of saving its state when it occurs.
Can you give me and example of this anarchy?
Because unlike the 160k per day that are choosing Android. I have a contract with AT&T.
I have 1 more month. I won't wait foriPhone OS Promises 4.0.
First off your numbers are bogus.
As for iPhone please do leave as that means more bandwidth for me.
I can get that phone next month. With the numbers of sales and Android is has I'd be like I was in 1994 and stuck in a dying Market Share.
That is one confused statement!
In any event I'm not one to slag Android as I think it is a very good attempt on Googles part to make a mobile OS. It is Not however competitive with even the current iPhone OS. Obviously a person as confused as the above statment implies won't see that.
Apple may be great for stock holders but it's horrible at moving forward when they have an Advantage. History and now the current numbers are proof of that.
I don't know about that as I'm still valuing my Apple hardware highly. You on the otherhand equate recklessness with moving forward that has never been Apples way. Instead the build up systems in an organized manner.
As to current numbers I have no idea what you are talking about. Many of the Android phones shipping aren't competitors to iPhone. That is not a bad thing either as one thing is obvious is that Apple needs a broader lineup of hardware.
Good luck with the future and make sure you have Apple Care on your computers because you'll need it given Apple's trend for the last 10 years.
What in the hell does Applecare have to do with this discussion??
By the way reling on Apple to actually improve things in the future can pay iff very well. Snow Leopard is a very good example of an OS upgrade that fixed more things than it harmed. Not only did Apple fix its problems, if you where a developer following Apples guidelines you would have seen improvements to your apps.
By the way...
How long has Steve Jobs been with Apple? I wonder why he was fired. Mac's don't "just work" anymore.
Obviously a complete troll because my Mac works fine. In fact it's gotten significantly better over the years as the system has been updated. The only other systems I've had that have done that are my Linux based systems.
In any event instead of inflammatory statements why not do a real comparison of the different OS's. Android does have some good points but it's multitasking feature can be close to useless on many of the current Android phones.
You see I'm not really against your position that iPhone needs multi tasking. Right now it is a huge short coming. However the ability for other cell phones to multitask user apps is not a significant advantage and seldom warrants the choice over the purchase of an iPhone. It is the overall package that makes the difference.
Dave
melgross is usually perfectly capable of maintaining a fair, balanced discussion with those he doesn't agree with, provided the other participants also remain civil. But you can't blame him if he responds in kind to what's dealt to him. Oh, and by the way, melgross is a moderator.
I don't buy the lowest common denominator argument at all. If a moderator is going to participate in a thread then they should be setting the example in their dialogue with other users of the forum
They are hear to enforce the very limited regulations of this site. They are allowed to make to comments and disagree with people just like everyone else.
They even make comments about the quality of the articles. They've been chosen because of their long standing residence and objective replies. That does not mean they are here to babysit you, care about you or agree with you.