Inside Apple's lawsuit against HTC

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  • Reply 21 of 127
    gazoobeegazoobee Posts: 3,754member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sandau View Post


    I think you might find the most innovation has occurred in capitalist systems. I think its working fine. If the greater good is furthered through greed, I'm all for it.



    While the statement that "most innovation has happened in Capitalist systems" is probably true historically (well modern history anyway), I don't think that justifies the conclusion that things are "working fine."



    There have been very very very few "systems" in any modern or premodern countries that are *not* Capitalist. The ones that have existed were all totalitarian states. There hasn't been a non-capitalist system that I am aware of that didn't also at the same time squash personal freedoms and do lots of other social stuff that would be more at fault for stifling innovation than the monetary policy.



    In effect, we haven't really tried much of anything else besides the Capitalist system, and haven't tinkered much with the one we have. So there could conceivably be deleterious effects on innovation, invention, and progress in general that we haven't seen, simply because we haven't tried anything else.



    Certainly there are more than enough examples of aspects of Capitalism that serve to stifle innovation. You only have to look at the US Auto Industry to see that.
  • Reply 22 of 127
    ireality85ireality85 Posts: 316member
    I'll reserve judgment on this whole Apple vs. HTC debacle until a later time. But, you have to hand it to Apple in that whatever they do, they do it with style.



    Only Apple could make patent carpet bombing look cool.
  • Reply 23 of 127
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    Off topic for just a second: Is it just me, or has the site been upgraded again? Things are looking and acting very weird...



    EDIT.... Never mind.
  • Reply 24 of 127
    tulkastulkas Posts: 3,757member
    It is about time that Apple made some moves to defend their patents.



    It is funny though, how some people here take such a holier than thou attitude about Apple against HTC. Almost as though they don't realize that Apple has 'borrowed' features in the iPhone as well.
  • Reply 25 of 127
    aurchonaurchon Posts: 18member
    Lets also not forget, that HTC could pay royalties to Apple and it would solve the issue. Remember most of these lawsuits get handle outside of the courts. Just a way to speed the process up.



    There even may be a patent that Apple wants to use but knows if it approaches HTC that HTC would say no or ask for a large amount of money. Apple might be doing this to get leverage on HTC and then ask for the right to use some of their patents in return.



    These patent lawsuits are like cat and mouse. All the products stay in the market it is just getting what you can from them. There are millions of patents and I am sure a large portion of them are being violated in one way or another.



    One of the patents Apple maybe interested in, is the ability to link one person to all their messages, emails etc. That would be a nice feature on the iPhone.
  • Reply 26 of 127
    lukeskymaclukeskymac Posts: 506member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post


    It is about time that Apple made some moves to defend their patents.



    It is funny though, how some people here take such a holier than thou attitude about Apple against HTC. Almost as though they don't realize that Apple has 'borrowed' features in the iPhone as well.



    Such as?
  • Reply 27 of 127
    roboduderobodude Posts: 273member
    ...I wonder if Apple's real target is Google and not HTC.



    They did nick cover flow with their Sense UI though.
  • Reply 28 of 127
    abster2coreabster2core Posts: 2,501member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post


    It is about time that Apple made some moves to defend their patents.



    It is funny though, how some people here take such a holier than thou attitude about Apple against HTC. Almost as though they don't realize that Apple has 'borrowed' features in the iPhone as well.



    I agree whole heartedly on your first point. However, I don't see a single comment that suggests anybody has taken 'a holier than thou attitude about Apple against HTC'.
  • Reply 29 of 127
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Aurchon View Post


    Lets also not forget, that HTC could pay royalties to Apple and it would solve the issue. Remember most of these lawsuits get handle outside of the courts. Just a way to speed the process up.



    There even may be a patent that Apple wants to use but knows if it approaches HTC that HTC would say no or ask for a large amount of money. Apple might be doing this to get leverage on HTC and then ask for the right to use some of their patents in return.



    These patent lawsuits are like cat and mouse. All the products stay in the market it is just getting what you can from them. There are millions of patents and I am sure a large portion of them are being violated in one way or another.



    One of the patents Apple maybe interested in, is the ability to link one person to all their messages, emails etc. That would be a nice feature on the iPhone.



    With the amount of effort that appears to have been put into these patents and this lawsuit, I am no so sure Apple will accept royalty payments and/or an out-of-court settlement. This feels like Apple going in with an all out legal war. Apple new motto: Sweep the leg! Mercy is for the weak!
  • Reply 30 of 127
    gazoobeegazoobee Posts: 3,754member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sflocal View Post


    ... For HTC (for example) to claim they've been innovating for 13 years is pure BS. They have shown zero "innovation" before the iPhone was introduced. Their current products just reek of build-as-fast-as-one-can to get it to market in the hopes of getting some of the action. It no where even shows the kind of quality that gives the notion that serious thought to details have been done....



    Totally agree.



    HTC is a hairsbreadth away from being one of those clone manufacturers in China. Cheap crap, speedily made. Nothing wrong with that of course, but to then turn around and claim they are in the same ballpark as Apple is a bit much.
  • Reply 31 of 127
    gazoobeegazoobee Posts: 3,754member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by solipsism View Post


    With the amount of effort that appears to have been put into these patents and this lawsuit, I am no so sure Apple will accept royalty payments and/or an out-of-court settlement. This feels like Apple going in with an all out legal war. Apple new motto: Sweep the leg! Mercy is for the weak!



    Yeah, seems like war to me too.



    Gruber noted that he couldn't remember Apple ever initiating a patent complaint against anyone before. I can't either. Usually they are the respondents.



    This is more likely to be a serious long thought out decision by Apple to do this.
  • Reply 32 of 127
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post


    While the statement that "most innovation has happened in Capitalist systems" is probably true historically (well modern history anyway), I don't think that justifies the conclusion that things are "working fine."



    There have been very very very few "systems" in any modern or premodern countries that are *not* Capitalist. The ones that have existed were all totalitarian states. There hasn't been a non-capitalist system that I am aware of that didn't also at the same time squash personal freedoms and do lots of other social stuff that would be more at fault for stifling innovation than the monetary policy.



    In effect, we haven't really tried much of anything else besides the Capitalist system, and haven't tinkered much with the one we have. So there could conceivably be deleterious effects on innovation, invention, and progress in general that we haven't seen, simply because we haven't tried anything else.



    Certainly there are more than enough examples of aspects of Capitalism that serve to stifle innovation. You only have to look at the US Auto Industry to see that.



    This has to be the best bunch of words I've read since last month. It's incredibly wasteful all the money/work that gets incinerated through lawyer services.
  • Reply 33 of 127
    tulkastulkas Posts: 3,757member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Lukeskymac View Post


    Such as?



    Such as patents that Palm holds. A couple examples:

    #7,268,775 "Dynamic brightness range for portable computer displays based on ambient conditions" i.e. using ambient light sensors to adjust display brightness, a la iPhone.



    #7,007,239, "Method and apparatus for accessing a contacts database and telephone services" i.e. phone.app including buttons in the phone.app UI to bring up contacts, history, etc. In fact the diagram in the Palm patent submission is almost a diagram of the iPhone phone UI but was from 2006.





    That's just two. Palm has something like 1500 patents in their portfolio for mobiles.



    Seriously, why do you think Apple hasn't sued Palm? The resulting counter suits from Palm, if successful (and likely they would be) would gut much of the basic elements of the iPhone experience.
  • Reply 34 of 127
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by iVlad View Post


    This is a great example of why Monetary and Capitalist systems don't work and eventually will fail.

    Future civilization is gonna look at us and laugh of how dumb we are, fighting each other for Money instead of achieving common purpose for all humanity.



    Wow, are you from the future?! What's it like there future man!?



    Step away from the Star Trek.
  • Reply 35 of 127
    where is 10.6.3?
  • Reply 36 of 127
    solipsismsolipsism Posts: 25,726member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post


    Seriously, why do you think Apple hasn't sued Palm? The resulting counter suits from Palm, if successful (and likely they would be) would gut much of the basic elements of the iPhone experience.



    Possibly, but it also might be because Palm hasn't been successful enough in their stealing of Apple's patents, if they are, to make it viable. We'd also have to look at the nuisances of Palm's patents and how Apple implements ambient light sensors to see if there is a violation.
  • Reply 37 of 127
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post


    Yeah, seems like war to me too.



    Gruber noted that he couldn't remember Apple ever initiating a patent complaint against anyone before. I can't either. Usually they are the respondents.



    This is more likely to be a serious long thought out decision by Apple to do this.



    Didn't anyone tell Apple they should be filing suit in east Texas? LOL.



    This is just a subtle reminder that there are big, big dollar numbers involved here and that iPhone business is now the lions share of all Apple business.



    Is there a link to the Gruber comments?
  • Reply 38 of 127
    angusyoungangusyoung Posts: 184member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post


    Totally agree.



    HTC is a hairsbreadth away from being one of those clone manufacturers in China. Cheap crap, speedily made. Nothing wrong with that of course, but to then turn around and claim they are in the same ballpark as Apple is a bit much.



    Your lack of knowledge and ignorance given the comment above is amazing.



    You do realize that HTC has a 260 Billion dollar market cap as of today.



    http://investing.businessweek.com/re...ticker=2498:TT
  • Reply 39 of 127
    anantksundaramanantksundaram Posts: 20,407member
    Ah, Droid, prepare to meet thine very soon....
  • Reply 40 of 127
    blastdoorblastdoor Posts: 3,429member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Vmer View Post


    If the ITC finds all these companies guilty, there will soon be not many phones to choose from in the US.



    Heh... maybe they should do exactly that.
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