Apple strikes back at Adobe, says Flash is 'closed and proprietary'

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  • Reply 121 of 281
    clexmanclexman Posts: 208member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    "Adobe's Flash is closed and proprietary,"



    Talk about the pot calling the kettle black... Because everyone knows that Apple's platforms are not closed and proprietary...
  • Reply 122 of 281
    tundraboytundraboy Posts: 1,884member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by druble View Post


    "We don't know how to make a $500 computer that's not a piece of junk" - Steve Jobs



    Price of an iPad - $499



    Well, they do now. Isn't progress nice?
  • Reply 123 of 281
    drubledruble Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


    I get the distinction you were making and I somewhat agree. It just sounded like you were taking the idea of the iPad being only for media consumption a bit too far. Ironically, I think I probably have a bit of a problem with that characterisation because it's kind of true at the moment.



    My disappointment with the iPad (even though I will get one anyway), is exactly that it's (so far) pretty poor for creating things. All I expected/hoped for before it was introduced was that I could write and possibly do a bit of drawing on it, and I was really disappointed that this is not really possible yet. It's technically possible, but only in the same vein as cruising the web was on a Pocket PC in 1995. It works, but it isn't really useable.



    However, it's a new platform and I think over time, the iPad will become capable of taking over a large part of content creation even though we will still need desktops for the more complex creation tasks. I think the iPad could easily displace the laptop though as most people with laptops are not really into content creation in a big way and they mostly buy the laptop for it's portable characteristics.



    The thing you said that I really agree with is the idea that the words we have right now are inadequate. iPads are not "real" computers in that they aren't desktops and have extremely limited content creation possibilities, but they are still computers of some kind. As I said, I'm buying the current one anyway, but in reality, I'm thinking the iPad I really want (one that you can write on etc.), won't be available until about 2013 or so.



    The resources and processing power needed for media creation (At least business grade) is well beyond the abilities of the current iPad. You could be right about 2013. Technology changes at a rapid pace, and in 3 years. mobile technology should be catching up to what desktop technology is now. So I would have to say that by then, you could be right. Some competitors like HP though are already ahead of the game developing a product with a full OS on it. Other manufactures developing similar devices will also go the full OS route. This will trigger hardware developers to increase efforts on mobile technologies that drive slate devices and netbooks. It is already possible to get netbooks with power equal to entry level gaming machines, and the slates with tegra 2 processors that are coming out very quickly will already be powerful enough for the likes of Photoshop or CAD. It's going to get interesting.
  • Reply 124 of 281
    graxspoograxspoo Posts: 162member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post


    I'd love to be able to transfer my license via iTunes to another user for store credit. We're talking about digital data here which almost by definition is portable.



    Yes, similarly, I made the mistake of setting my work computer up with a different iTunes account than my home computer. Now some of my app purchases show up as being associated with my work iTunes ID, and some show up as being associated with my home iTunes ID. Apparently there's no way for me to consolidate my accounts, so forever more I have to juggle these two different ID/password combinations on my iPhone, or re-purchase the apps. What a bunch a bunk.
  • Reply 125 of 281
    ssquirrelssquirrel Posts: 1,196member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by druble View Post


    Copycats galore? The world does not revolve around Apple. It revolves around PC's. Name one single technology Apple has used that someone did not use before Apple. Even at their roots, the GUI that made Apple so famous was licensed from Xerox. Seems Apple copies others. They just have good marketing, thats all. Some people do try to copy Apple, but a lot of people are not trying to copy Apple. The sooner people realize that, we will stop seeing pointless comparisons of products to Apple products.



    You mean like Firewire? They were also the first computer company to release a MIDI interface for their system. Just a couple off the top of my head
  • Reply 126 of 281
    rybryb Posts: 56member
    [/QUOTE=druble]Don't forget the droid has better hardware! I love my WM6 phone, but when I upgrade again, I am going to droid. Microsoft is even jumping on the band wagon and locking things down, so I have to abandon them. I love what they are doing with the new phones, the WP7 phones will be amazing and possibly superior to the iPhone based on the leaked specs, but in the end I don't need someone looming overhead ready to tell me what I can and can't do.[/QUOTE]





    Most phone users do not look at specs, they only care about how it works for them and about what their friends say about their phones. They probably don't think about whether the company who sells the (smart)phone is telling them what they can or can't do; they do want to know if they can get calls at home and at work and if there are games that they like available for download.



    Better hardware only matters if consumers recognize it as a part of their experience with the product. They often do, but if two products are each perceived to have good hardware, then other factors are going to guide their choice.



    If Microsoft is jumping on the bandwagon, it might be because they have some smart people working for them who recognize a model that is working with consumers. These are consumer products.
  • Reply 127 of 281
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,857member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blullama View Post


    Didn't say that it couldn't be done. I said it's not feasible.



    A distinction without a difference.



    Quote:

    A whole new environment would have to be written. One does not exist for your precious objective-c. The environment would have to catch up to the tweening and filter capabilities with Flash. Believe me, if someone wrote such an environment, it could make a killing.



    Someone will, and they will make a killing, but it doesn't look like it will be Adobe.



    As far as Flash goes, sometimes Shiva has to destroy the world so Brahma can create it anew.
  • Reply 128 of 281
    drubledruble Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post


    You mean like Firewire? They were also the first computer company to release a MIDI interface for their system. Just a couple off the top of my head



    Please quote your source for Apple being the first. 1983 was a long time ago, and Apple Macintosh, Commodore 64, Commodore Amiga and the PC-DOS all received MIDI interfaces in 1983 after MIDI was standardized. However, there were computers prior to 1983 that were using non-standardized midi interfaces. I don't think you are going to find a pre 1983 source, sorry. As far as Firewire (Apple's name for IEEE 1394) it was a joint development with major contributions made by engineers from Texas Instruments, Sony, Digital Equipment Corporation, IBM, and INMOS/SGS Thomson (now STMicroelectronics). As an additional note, hardly anyone uses firewire. That is not something for Apple to hang their hat one. It was never that successful outside of niche markets. The same could be said for midi.
  • Reply 129 of 281
    drubledruble Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ryb View Post


    Most phone users do not look at specs, they only care about how it works for them and about what their friends say about their phones.





    [Removed comment] Thanks for clarifying what you meant. Initially it sounded like you meant something else.
  • Reply 130 of 281
    mstonemstone Posts: 11,510member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by xyz001 View Post


    whats the problem with flash? It might not be perfect, but it's everywhere on the web and i don't see anyone paying royalties to use it?...why not just support it already? It would just make the iphone/ipad a better device...



    It's personal. Jobs dislikes it. I can see his point. Flash doesn't belong on the iPhone and by inheritance, the iPad. Flash sucks because it is so damn easy to program that any idiot can make it work. Work well or tastefully that is an entirely different subject.



    The thing that will happen is that we go back to the bad old days where you have to detect the user's browser and show whatever is appropriate. No Flash, fine HTML5 for you. Oops, no Flash but IE, okay, Silverlight for you, etc, etc. The developers have actually had a couple year reprieve from sniffing the smelly under garments of the browsers and now we go back to spending 10x the amount of time to code because this CEO doesn't like that CEO and this spokeswoman said this about that apologist. It is all so petty, but necessary because there are so many advertising eyeballs at stake. Money grubbing slime the whole lot of them.
  • Reply 131 of 281
    drubledruble Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    A distinction without a difference.







    Someone will, and they will make a killing, but it doesn't look like it will be Adobe.



    As far as Flash goes, sometimes Shiva has to destroy the world so Brahma can create it anew.



    Om Namah Shivaya
  • Reply 132 of 281
    drubledruble Posts: 62member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by mstone View Post


    It's personal. Jobs dislikes it. I can see his point. Flash doesn't belong on the iPhone and by inheritance, the iPad. Flash sucks because it is so damn easy to program that any idiot can make it work. Work well or tastefully that is an entirely different subject.



    The thing that will happen is that we go back to the bad old days where you have to detect the user's browser and show whatever is appropriate. No Flash, fine HTML5 for you. Oops, no Flash but IE, okay, Silverlight for you, etc, etc. The developers have actually had a couple year reprieve from sniffing the smelly under garments of the browsers and now we go back to spending 10x the amount of time to code because this CEO doesn't like that CEO and this spokeswoman said this about that apologist. It is all so petty, but necessary because there are so many advertising eyeballs at stake. Money grubbing slime the whole lot of them.



    I truly hope that this is not the case....Either companies will have to develop for all the possibilities, or some of us just won't get to see websites in their full glory anymore. Flash bridges so many gaps between browser compatability it's not even funny, but if Steve dosn't like it, I guess we can reset ourselves to the 90's again. With all the different browsers now days, it will take quite a bit of coding to compensate for the differences between browsers. Anyone who has wrote W3C compliant sites knows all about how different browsers display things differently. At least with flash, you could expect the same results from browser to browser.
  • Reply 133 of 281
    rybryb Posts: 56member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by druble View Post


    Ouch, actually I don't really think most people care what others think about their phone. Only certain kind of people care what others think about stuff they own. That is a sad way to live life if you need other people to envy something you own...



    I think you misunderstood me. I think that people who are considering buying a phone often ask others if they are happy with their phone and if they recommend it for others. I know that I have discussed phone experience several times over the last ten years or so.
  • Reply 134 of 281
    cdong4cdong4 Posts: 194member
    Ummm H.264 is not open. MPEG LA has just allowed royalty free licensing until 12/31/2015. Close but not quite.
  • Reply 135 of 281
    tummytummy Posts: 21member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by graxspoo View Post


    And then, there's Apple's dumb rules that restrict what app developers can do. For example, I'd like an app that can stream media over m WiFi in my house so I don't need to sync it through iTunes. As far as I can tell, there are no apps that let you do this very basfunction andand probably because Apple wants iTunes to be the alpha and omega of your media life.



    And BTW, I'm focused on my craft, so up yours buddy.



    AirVideo and StreamToMe do exactly what you describe and they are awesome on the iPad. Air video has been out for iPhone for almost a year.
  • Reply 136 of 281
    bulk001bulk001 Posts: 764member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Woode View Post


    Where are the usual Flash apologists now that Adobe has caved?



    Right here. Till there are HTLM 5 tools that do the sort of interactive type things like playhousedisney.com, pbskids, nickjr.com etc. we will keep using Flash. Now, once HTML 5 gets a tool kit that provides what Flash does with a strong scripting and design environment, we will look at moving over. Not that I am an Adobe apologist though - the CS5 update is over priced and under whelming but CS4 does everything we need.
  • Reply 137 of 281
    ilogicilogic Posts: 298member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by str1f3 View Post


    Adobe had better pray that there is never an iPhone on Verizon because the Droid is the only reason why Android has any market share.



    Droid is the Creative Zen that competed with the iPod early on. I was once such user, who thought a more feature fitted device would trounce Apple's offering readily. When I finally sat down with an iPod, I then came around, soon after I made my / - and I never bought Creative again.



    This is where Droid is eventually headed.
  • Reply 138 of 281
    graxspoograxspoo Posts: 162member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Tummy View Post


    AirVideo and StreamToMe do exactly what you describe and they are awesome on the iPad. Air video has been out for iPhone for almost a year.



    Well, I spent like an hour trying to find an app to do that, and I bought something for $5 that didn't, though from the description it seemed like it would. Case in point.



    Also, looking at these products, you need to run a server on the other side. This is not what I want. I just want to browse my network, find a folder with a bunch of stuff in it, pick a file and say "play this now" just like you can on a Mac. Why can't I do this? Why do I need server software running. I already have a server running, and its called OS X.
  • Reply 139 of 281
    bulk001bulk001 Posts: 764member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blullama View Post


    Obviously, you don't know anything about Android or what Jailbroken means.



    ...



    Jailbroken means that you remove the lock on the wireless carrier that the phone is locked down to. In Apple's case, that's AT&T.



    So, stop spreading around lies.



    That is not entirely correct. "Jailbroken" refers to the ability to install apps that have not been approved by apple and are available via a source like cydia. "Unlock" refers to being able to use your iPhone on a different cellular network. It is possible to jailbreak your phone without unlocking it, but you can't unlock your phone without jailbreaking it first.
  • Reply 140 of 281
    ilogicilogic Posts: 298member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by CDonG4 View Post


    Ummm H.264 is not open. MPEG LA has just allowed royalty free licensing until 12/31/2015. Close but not quite.



    H.264 is free for anyone to use, which means that while not an open specification, it is a feature rich and low cost alternative to support.



    If you want truly open, the OGG is okay, but being that it is open, it has the Linux complex, which is "open" but doesn't really go very far. The 264 specification is privately owned, which means investment is driving innovation. Yeah, they could choose to not keep it royalty free someday but that is not likely as it lead by a consortium of companies that want it as their leading format for their consumer devices.



    I could use a political analogy to further my point, but I'll be wise in this case
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