Google will fight to keep AdMob, calls Apple's iAd discriminatory

24

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 65
    foo2foo2 Posts: 1,077member
    The Snoop Nazi (Google) should stop putzing around and hire that ubergenius and supersnooper Zuckerberg as their CEO.



    FWIW: Apple might consider producing an iAd SDK for Android.
  • Reply 22 of 65
    foo2foo2 Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I don't know if Google sells the data or exposes personally identifiable user data to business partner. So far that I've seen, they've only used the data to help them improve ad placement. That doesn't mean they won't do something more with it, but so far, I haven't seen proof of sinister personal data use on their part.



    What do you know? Can you predict the future? Do you know if a Google employee has acted--or ever will act--independently to browse the data collected about you? What are the odds that Google will suffer a major security breach or that Google will make a disastrous decision about how it uses your data. Oh, wait...



    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01...tack_analysis/



    http://www.pcworld.com/businesscente..._accounts.html



    http://www.businessinsider.com/warni...cy-flaw-2010-2



    And of course there are these "trivialities":



    http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2010/...on-update.html



    http://www.ipadrblog.com/2010/04/art...isual-artists/
  • Reply 23 of 65
    foo2foo2 Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MacTel View Post


    So if Google can't make a decent buck on the iPhone OS platform will they start charging iPhone OS users for search results? More likely they may block search from the iPhone OS users.



    Google has been making a decent buck off search on the iPhone. Otherwise why would Google have paid Apple hundreds of millions of dollars? When has Google charged anyone for search results?
  • Reply 24 of 65
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,698member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    If you're worried about your data, there are a lot of businesses you shouldn't deal with. Amazon is aggressive about recording what you look at. It might not be a good idea to be on the internet at all. It is probably best to pay cash for everything you buy too, and don't give them any information when you're buying your items, and certainly don't use the frequent customer cards.



    That's just a ridiculous attitude toward privacy. If one is worried about one's privacy, the thing to do is to take steps to protect it. That includes blocking tracking cookies, blocking gscripts, and lobbying your elected representatives to enact laws to protect it. The idea that we ought to have to give up privacy to go on the internet is entirely offensive. What we have to do is put some strong restraints on those who wish to be intrusive.



    EDIT: Seriously, do we need Google to be able to effectively target us with ads? No we do not. What we do need is to have Google's propensity to intrude into our private lives be curbed.
  • Reply 25 of 65
    macinthe408macinthe408 Posts: 1,050member
    Why does everyone (Google, especially) assume that everyone is a master computer user and can automatically deal with the nefariousness of accessing rogue, unpatrolled app stores?



    We all know how well Grandma Tilly has fared with her Windows machine, what with her grandkids coming over every 2 hours to resuscitate her useless beige box and downloading yet another set of virus definitions.



    I'd rather err on the side of keeping the ecosystem closed. Everyone on this site know how to jump the gate (jailbreak, hack, etc.), so I don't know why all the Apple naysayers are whining. To paraphrase one of the redneck South Park characters and which has been repeated ad nauseam, "If you don't like Apple, then giiiiit out!"
  • Reply 26 of 65
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    That's just a ridiculous attitude toward privacy. If one is worried about one's privacy, the thing to do is to take steps to protect it. That includes blocking tracking cookies, blocking gscripts, and lobbying your elected representatives to enact laws to protect it. The idea that we ought to have to give up privacy to go on the internet is entirely offensive. What we have to do is put some strong restraints on those who wish to be intrusive.



    I'm making an argument about consistency though. If you're worried about Google having your data, you should be worried about browsing/ordering from Amazon, using Facebook, nearly any large web site, and frankly, the grocery chain that uses frequent customer cards is probably collecting and tabulating a lot of your purchase data too. I'm not saying people should be giving up their privacy, I'm saying that the problem is far broader than just one internet company. Fighting one bogeyman is just a distraction that prevents a broader perspective.



    Blocking cookies and scripts help, but it's not a complete solution. Repeatedly visiting the same service/site from the same IP address for a while is often enough to build a good profile.
  • Reply 27 of 65
    gin_tonicgin_tonic Posts: 163member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    Android does not appear to have any restrictions on the private user data apps can forward to third parties.



    I'm sorry to read this at the site, but this is BS and 100% lie. An user on Android platform must explicitly give permissions an application to do something like accessing to internet or using GPS



    http://developer.android.com/guide/t.../security.html

    Quote:

    A basic Android application has no permissions associated with it, meaning it can not do anything that would adversely impact the user experience or any data on the device.



  • Reply 28 of 65
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,698member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I'm making an argument about consistency though. If you're worried about Google having your data, you should be worried about browsing/ordering from Amazon, using Facebook, nearly any large web site, and frankly, the grocery chain that uses frequent customer cards is probably collecting and tabulating a lot of your purchase data too. I'm not saying people should be giving up their privacy, I'm saying that the problem is far broader than just one internet company.



    Blocking cookies and scripts help, but it's not a complete solution. Repeatedly visiting the same service/site from the same IP address for a while is often enough to build a good profile.



    Yes, Google isn't the only problem, just the biggest problem. Because of this, it's appropriate to spotlight them as the poster child of privacy abuse and corporate intrusiveness. But, by all means, let us be aware of the privacy violations of Amazon and others. And let us press for laws to make all of this sort of behavior illegal.



    However, there should be not even the suggestion, even obliquely, that people rightfully concerned about privacy issues and corporate abuses of the same should stay off the Internet. That's equivalent to telling people worried about crime that they should stay locked inside their houses with their windows barred.
  • Reply 29 of 65
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    Yes, Google isn't the only problem, just the biggest problem. Because of this, it's appropriate to spotlight them as the poster child of privacy abuse and corporate intrusiveness. But, by all means, let us be aware of the privacy violations of Amazon and others. And let us press for laws to make all of this sort of behavior illegal.



    I don't think Google is the worst though, I'm pretty sure that would have to be Facebook.



    Quote:

    However, there should be not even the suggestion, even obliquely, that people rightfully concerned about privacy issues and corporate abuses of the same should stay off the Internet. That's equivalent to telling people worried about crime that they should stay locked inside their houses with their windows barred.



    That's true, but I was making a point, just one that happened to make you uncomfortable. Highlighting just the posterboy doesn't make people aware that they're leaking their personal data all the time in their regular day to day activities, just swiping a credit/debit card is one such leak, they get your name on the swipe and tie it to what you just bought and the chain can start compiling a history, for internal use and possible resale. One such danger is that people might switch to Yahoo not aware that it can happen there too, meaning that Yahoo & Microsoft get your search & browsing data.
  • Reply 30 of 65
    anonymouseanonymouse Posts: 6,698member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I don't think Google is the worst though, I'm pretty sure that would have to be Facebook.



    Well, Facebook has become very problematic of late. However, it's relatively easy to avoid Facebook, just don't open an account with them. With Google Analytics spread all over the web, and with Google with its tentacles everywhere, it's almost impossible to avoid Google.



    Quote:

    That's true, but I was making a point, just one that happened to make you uncomfortable. Highlighting just the posterboy doesn't make people aware that they're leaking their personal data all the time in their regular day to day activities, just swiping a credit/debit card is one such leak, they get your name on the swipe and tie it to what you just bought and the chain can start compiling a history, for internal use and possible resale. One such danger is that people might switch to Yahoo not aware that it can happen there too, meaning that Yahoo & Microsoft get your search & browsing data.



    All good points, and all things that privacy laws should cover.
  • Reply 31 of 65
    foo2foo2 Posts: 1,077member
    Just a bit off-topic...



    No. 1 on my list of privacy concerns is e-mail. I believe this issue should be high--if not #1--on everyone else's list, too. It therefore surprises me that the vast majority of people have their e-mail hosted on a shared server without encryption. Easy-to-use, encrypted e-mail communications combined with encrypted storage ought to be a huge market opportunity.
  • Reply 32 of 65
    os2babaos2baba Posts: 262member
    Quote:



    It was a Windows virus on the microSD card. Same as a virus on a USB Flash card. It's not a Android malaware.
  • Reply 33 of 65
    jetzjetz Posts: 1,293member
    I for one, have zero issues, with Google's invasion of my privacy. As an adult I fully understand the trade I am making. I am getting free services in exchange for their snooping. If I don't like it, I can go elsewhere.



    I don't see what the big deal is. People who want privacy can and should avoid all web-based services. Don't use Google or Bing Maps. Don't use Google or Yahoo for search. Don't use Hotmail or GMail. Don't use Facebook. Heck, don't use any sort of online chat service. You never know who's snooping on your conversation there. How sure can you really be that MSN isn't being mined for keywords?



    And personally I don't think even Apple si beyond snooping my data. Does anybody seriously think Apple isn't going to mine MobileMe for info to target ads at some point in the future? And if they do, I'll have zero issues with it. As long as they are using that revenue to discount the service.



    If you value privacy, spend the cash and accept limitations on your mobility and information. Ditch Google Maps. Pay for a GPS. Ditch web-based mail. Use an email client and keep e-mail on your computer. Use Firefox. And pray that isn't calling home. Etc. And after all that, pray that your ISP/telco isn't in cahoots with the government.



    And while you're at it, ditch the store loyalty cards. Ditch all your credit cards as well. I daresay that Aeroplan, Air Miles, Visa and American Express probably know me better than Google, after all is said and done. Or at least they know me better on what counts: how I spend my money.



    It's hypocrisy though to just complain about Google and then use other services which equally imperil your privacy. At least have the gumption to admit that it's more about Google getting your info than privacy itself.
  • Reply 34 of 65
    jetzjetz Posts: 1,293member
    Complaining about Google's invasion of privacy is no better than those who complain about Apple's "walled garden". And equally annoying. Don't like the "walled garden"? Don't use it. Nobody is forcing you to buy an iPhone or an iPod Touch. If you want Flash and Jobs doesn't allow it, go somewhere else. It's Apple's platform. They can do as they please. And the same goes for Google. If you don't like Google, don't use their services. And don't frequent websites that use Adsense/Adwords. Nobody is forcing you to use Google. Just like nobody is forcing anybody to buy anything Apple.
  • Reply 35 of 65
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


    I'm making an argument about consistency though. If you're worried about Google having your data, you should be worried about browsing/ordering from Amazon, using Facebook, nearly any large web site, and frankly, the grocery chain that uses frequent customer cards is probably collecting and tabulating a lot of your purchase data too. I'm not saying people should be giving up their privacy, I'm saying that the problem is far broader than just one internet company. Fighting one bogeyman is just a distraction that prevents a broader perspective.



    Blocking cookies and scripts help, but it's not a complete solution. Repeatedly visiting the same service/site from the same IP address for a while is often enough to build a good profile.



    While what you say is true, Google (and, to a lesser extent Facebook) are an entirely different scope of problem than your corner grocery store. When you sign up for a shopping card at your local store, you're expecting that they will track your shopping - because that's what you signed up for them to do.



    Google, OTOH, tracks EVERYTHING you do - without permission. They almost certainly have more information about you than the U.S. Government.



    I wouldn't be as concerned if Google didn't have a history of ignoring everyone's rights in order to get their way. Their attempts to copy and disseminate all the world's literature WITHOUT PERMISSION ought to be an eye opener for everyone.



    Facebook has a different problem. When you create a Facebook page and ask friends to recognize you, they can post all sorts of junk about you on the page. Because it's your page, readers assume that you're OK with what's posted there. Your control over the page is very crude and clumsy.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post


    That's just a ridiculous attitude toward privacy. If one is worried about one's privacy, the thing to do is to take steps to protect it. That includes blocking tracking cookies, blocking gscripts, and lobbying your elected representatives to enact laws to protect it. The idea that we ought to have to give up privacy to go on the internet is entirely offensive. What we have to do is put some strong restraints on those who wish to be intrusive.



    I agree. Historically, the internet has been "anything you want to do is OK unless specifically prohibited" (with very little, if anything, that's specifically prohibited). There need to be specific rules to protect your privacy online.
  • Reply 36 of 65
    jetzjetz Posts: 1,293member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


    While what you say is true, Google (and, to a lesser extent Facebook) are an entirely different scope of problem than your corner grocery store. When you sign up for a shopping card at your local store, you're expecting that they will track your shopping - because that's what you signed up for them to do.



    How is it different? You are choosing to use Google. And you are choosing to sign up for their services. There are plenty of other options out there, if you don't like Google. You can always use Bing.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


    Google, OTOH, tracks EVERYTHING you do - without permission. They almost certainly have more information about you than the U.S. Government.



    I highly doubt they have more info on you than the US government, unless you are somehow repeatedly typing in your tax return and social security number into Google Search for some reason. Then again Google probably knows whether you like blonds or brunettes and whether you are a T or an A man, so maybe they do have a headstart on Homeland Security.



    But let's say they do know more, who gave them that info? You did. You chose to do it. Is there anybody out there that does not know how Google works or operates at this point? Don't like it? Don't use it. Simple as that.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


    I wouldn't be as concerned if Google didn't have a history of ignoring everyone's rights in order to get their way. Their attempts to copy and disseminate all the world's literature WITHOUT PERMISSION ought to be an eye opener for everyone.



    That was a terrible move. And they rightly got rapped on the wrist for that one. Nevertheless, I certainly appreciate the effort to get all sorts of formerly inaccessible literature online. If Lexus Nexus had done it first, I'd be on there reading stuff I don't normally have access to. Perhaps their methods leave much to be desired, but I don't find their goal the least bit objectionable.



    And again, if you have issues with it, you don't have to use it.
  • Reply 37 of 65
    Does Google allow other competing ad networks to place ads in their web apps? As far as I understand only Google can place ads in gmail. How is that less discriminatory than what Apple is doing? In fact it seems to me Apple is being very generous.
  • Reply 38 of 65
    brucepbrucep Posts: 2,823member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jetz View Post


    How is it different? You are choosing to use Google. And you are choosing to sign up for their services. There are plenty of other options out there, if you don't like Google. You can always use Bing.







    I highly doubt they have more info on you than the US government, unless you are somehow repeatedly typing in your tax return and social security number into Google Search for some reason. Then again Google probably knows whether you like blonds or brunettes and whether you are a T or an A man, so maybe they do have a headstart on Homeland Security.



    But let's say they do know more, who gave them that info? You did. You chose to do it. Is there anybody out there that does not know how Google works or operates at this point? Don't like it? Don't use it. Simple as that.







    That was a terrible move. And they rightly got rapped on the wrist for that one. Nevertheless, I certainly appreciate the effort to get all sorts of formerly inaccessible literature online. If Lexus Nexus had done it first, I'd be on there reading stuff I don't normally have access to. Perhaps their methods leave much to be desired, but I don't find their goal the least bit objectionable.



    And again, if you have issues with it, you don't have to use it.



    bing !!!!
  • Reply 39 of 65
    foo2foo2 Posts: 1,077member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jetz View Post


    I for one, have zero issues, with Google's invasion of my privacy. As an adult I fully understand the trade I am making. I am getting free services in exchange for their snooping.



    Bra-vo! Somebody's got to help all those Googlenauts keep busy. It must cost a bundle to employ them all, but snooping on you is apparently quite profitable.



    Quote:

    If I don't like it, I can go elsewhere.



    Really? Where?



    Quote:

    Don't use Hotmail or GMail. Don't use Facebook. Heck, don't use any sort of online chat service.



    I don't, but thanks anyway!



    Quote:

    And personally I don't think even Apple si beyond snooping my data. Does anybody seriously think Apple isn't going to mine MobileMe for info to target ads at some point in the future?



    This wouldn't surprise me either.



    Quote:

    If you value privacy, spend the cash and accept limitations on your mobility and information.



    Better yet: demand legislation that prohibits service providers from tracking you and requires service providers to maintain your data (such as e-mail) in encrypted formats.
  • Reply 40 of 65
    jetzjetz Posts: 1,293member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bloodstains View Post


    Does Google allow other competing ad networks to place ads in their web apps? As far as I understand only Google can place ads in gmail. How is that less discriminatory than what Apple is doing? In fact it seems to me Apple is being very generous.



    Google owns GMail. Does Apple own every app on the App store? Shouldn't the developer get to choose which advertiser can get on there and shouldn't that advertiser have access to the same info as iAds? Given that iAds will be baked into the OS, it's more akin to Apple running ads in your browser from OS X and then feeding back info from your computer to advertisers that only deal with Apple. I don't know if it's right or wrong. Should Apple be allowed to gain an edge on advertisers because they control the hardware and operating system? Is that the same or different from Microsoft's dealings during the browser wars for example? Oh well, the feds will answer all those nagging questions.



    All that said, I can't see why anyone wouldn't use iAds when putting apps with ads on the App Store. iAds is a far better integrated product anyway.
Sign In or Register to comment.