Professional Final Cut Pro users worried about upcoming changes

Posted:
in Mac Software edited January 2014
Final Cut Pro users are upset at the prospect of Apple tailoring its upcoming releases to fit the majority of its users, who are increasingly a prosumer audience.



The MacCreate blog noted the discontent, and contacted Apple to obtain an assurance that the company would not abandon its professional users, even as it refocused its video editing suite to fit where its revenues were coming from.



The site reportedly received an official comment stating, "Final Cut Pro is the first choice for professional video editors and we?ve never been more excited about its future. The next version of Final Cut is going to be awesome and our pro customers are going to love it."



Apple's response was apparently originally directed to CNET, which reported in a post by Jim Dalrymple that any efforts to retarget Final Cut Pro to match the needs of its actual audience "would mean Apple would target customers moving to Final Cut Studio from the company's more basic iMovie application, instead of continuing to offer more high-end features designed for video professionals."



Dalrymple's conclusion was not based on anything reported by AppleInsider, nor are the prosumers who buy Final Cut Express or Studio likely to be using iMovie or expecting an iLife-style app.



Dalrymple also speculated that, due to the presence of iMovie and Final Cut Express, "the Final Cut team should be free to concentrate on more high-end features." The information provided to AppleInsider by person with inside knowledge of Apple's plans does not support Dalrymple's speculation.



Too early to worry



The fact the Apple?s Professional Applications Design Group is still hiring a Senior Visual Interface Designer and Senior Human Interface Designer to help design future iterations of its "high-visibility applications that are used daily by creative professionals working in post-production," as reported by AppleInsider last week, makes it clear that the work on Final Cut's future direction is both still under way and still targeted to serve the needs of professionals.



At the same time, the role of Final Cut Pro to sell high end Macs or to earn substantial software revenues is clearly changing, both as high end Mac sales remain largely static and as the price of Final Cut Studio has dropped.



Apple still maintains a strong position among serious professionals however, with a 2007 SCRI study indicating that Final Cut Pro had a 49% share of the US professional editing market, compared to with Avid's 22% share. A 2008 survey by the American Cinema Editors Guild said that 21% of their members were Final Cut Pro users (a figure growing from previous surveys) while the rest were using Avid.



The changes Apple makes to its $1,000 Final Cut Studio package will certainly take into account the needs of its existing user base, and will assuredly not introduce the type of drastic changes Apple made to its largely free iMovie title in 2007.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 40
    oxygenhoseoxygenhose Posts: 236member
    Worrying about rumors is something pro users shouldn't be concerned with...



    Then again, 'pro user groups' are usually dominated by prosumers who want to feel superior over other prosumers. Working pros generally don't have time at the end of the day to go to Final Cut Pro meetings and club picnics.



  • Reply 3 of 40
    addaboxaddabox Posts: 12,664member
    Don't you think the name of this article ought to be "Apple flatly denies our thinly sourced rumor about dumbing down FCP" rather than "Professional Final Cut Pro users worried about upcoming changes"?



    Or maybe "Some people on the web react to our patently untrue story about dumbing down FCP, the refutation of which we're just going to kinda slip in while still talking about users 'worrying' about the false things we previously said, the net effect of which is to make us seem simultaneously duplicitous and possibly insane"?



    Really guys, a retraction and "we regret the error" would be more appropriate.
  • Reply 4 of 40
    clexmanclexman Posts: 170member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by addabox View Post


    Don't you think the name of this article ought to be "Apple flatly denies our thinly sourced rumor about dumbing down FCP" rather than "Professional Final Cut Pro users worried about upcoming changes"?



    Or maybe "Some people on the web react to our patently untrue story about dumbing down FCP, the refutation of which we're just going to kinda slip in while still talking about users 'worrying' about the false things we previously said, the net effect of which is to make us seem simultaneously duplicitous and possibly insane"?



    Really you guys, a retraction and "we regret the error" would be more appropriate.



    Awesome. I was checking the site all day to see what appleinsider would say in response. This blog post is a mixed bag of stats and nonsense.



    Final Cut Pro is, and will be for a long time to come, great software for making movies and TV.



    Your headline would be much more fitting.
  • Reply 5 of 40
    yodamacyodamac Posts: 59member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by oxygenhose View Post


    Worrying about rumors is something pro users shouldn't be concerned with...



    Then again, 'pro user groups' are usually dominated by prosumers who want to feel superior over other prosumers. Working pros generally don't have time at the end of the day to go to Final Cut Pro meetings and club picnics.







    Ditto. If something like that happens, there's nothing to worry about - just switch to Avid or (back to) Premiere Pro. I wouldn't have probably switched to FCP in the first place if my previous system managed to keep state-of-the-art. It's bound to flip-flop eventually.



    Editors simply need to get their work done. Final Cut is my preference for now, but editing is my job. (and my life...sigh)
  • Reply 6 of 40
    ihxoihxo Posts: 563member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by oxygenhose View Post


    Worrying about rumors is something pro users shouldn't be concerned with...



    lol you pretty much killed the article with one post.
  • Reply 7 of 40
    -ag--ag- Posts: 123member
    I just hope that out of all these hoax rumours something can come out of it.



    For example Apple are streamlining the Final Cut series and turning it into a 3 part platform.



    Free Final Cut Express to replace iMovie.



    Mid entry - For your prosumer class Kinda like the standalone FC Pro



    High end - For media professionals aka Final Cut Studio.



    This way they can streamline their offerings, make the mac a more viable alternative for people that want to do some form of video editing and if they wanted to upgrade to the more advanced levels there is a very small learning curve as all 3 platforms use the same base code.



    They could do the same thing with garageband/logic too.



    And while we are at it beef Aperture up to make it something that can work as an alternative to Gimp or Photoshop. because at the moment its just a glorified expensive version of iPhoto.
  • Reply 8 of 40
    graemegraeme Posts: 61member
    This is all a big fuss about nothing.

    I can't think of a single reason why Apple would sabotage a strong healthy product like FCS. The rewrite of the Studio apps is a big Job and will rely on QT 10 maturing to the standard of QT 7.



    The work involved in getting studio to 64bit could leave us with a 1st release that matches the current FCS product feature list- with new features coming in a later release. or maybe we will get something bigger, who knows- the important thing is that the current FCS already does the job and pays the rent.



    Strong robust updates and improvements are always welcome. it would be great to have a scrolling timeline, for FCP to be able to use all the processors for rendering, and better metadata handling & management- but FCS still remains a strong link in the production chain. so whats the worry? what editor has the time to spend looking at the interface, so what if it's the more or less the same as version 1.



    The only thing the previous article raised that was 'new news'- was that apple might be defining the difference between FCE and FCS, maybe we will get more pre production & production tools in FCS like the Adobe package offers, in addition to the all the current post production tools, along with workflow management and collaboration tools, with FCE remaining the more or less the same not needing a full production toolset.



    Im not worried- i can only see FCS getting stronger as a package. I always let out a little sigh now when i read appleinsiders coverage of pro apps, they always seem to be missing the point and out of touch regarding pro apps and products. this all seems to be a self generating story.
  • Reply 9 of 40
    Keep in mind that FC is one of the few remaining Carbon based applications in Apple's portfolio. Carbon is going away.



    It's a huge app with a lot of functionality to re-implment in cocoa. They probably learned a lot with the iMovie experience, but these aren't consumers making movies of vacations or their kids. The pro folk base their careers on the tools that they choose and use. They are right to be concerned and Apple needs to deliver the goods.
  • Reply 10 of 40
    zanshinzanshin Posts: 350member
    I thought all of Apple's major market already edits their video right there on the iPhone they shot it with...
  • Reply 11 of 40
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,217member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by -AG- View Post


    Free Final Cut Express to replace iMovie.




    more like ditch FCE and perhaps rev up imovie a little. either in the software or by allowing for plug ins.



    Quote:



    Mid entry - For your prosumer class Kinda like the standalone FC Pro




    perhaps. or perhaps just allow them to buy FCP by itself like they did in the beginning. with a new upgrade price for when you have just FCP and want to studio up.



    Quote:

    High end - For media professionals aka Final Cut Studio.



    i also think that it is possible that they might 'two mode' FCP like there is in Garageband and DVD Studio Pro. the most common features and a reduced track count etc could be in the basis. or with a quick setting change, you can open up all the advance features. they might also streamline the interfaces between apps, add back in some Shake, 64 bit support, create an advanced media browser for easier transfers between apps, add Blu-ray mapping, itunes formats and perhaps even facebook and youtube video into a DVD Studio replacing Media Studio



    Quote:

    They could do the same thing with garageband/logic too.




    a possibility



    Quote:

    And while we are at it beef Aperture up to make it something that can work as an alternative to Gimp or Photoshop. because at the moment its just a glorified expensive version of iPhoto.



    Aperture is not a photo compositing software. it is an alternative to Lightroom and yes its intention is to be a beefed up version of iphoto.



    that said, perhaps buying some smaller company and having an Apple branded 'photoshop' isn't out of line. particularly since it would have one major advantage over photoshop in that it's not the windows version with some translation stuff slapped around it so it would probably run a lot better.
  • Reply 12 of 40
    graemegraeme Posts: 61member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zanshin View Post


    I thought all of Apple's major market already edits their video right there on the iPhone they shot it with...



    LOL- i'm just waiting for the IPhone P2 reader
  • Reply 13 of 40
    jeffdmjeffdm Posts: 12,951member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by oxygenhose View Post


    Worrying about rumors is something pro users shouldn't be concerned with...



    Then again, 'pro user groups' are usually dominated by prosumers who want to feel superior over other prosumers. Working pros generally don't have time at the end of the day to go to Final Cut Pro meetings and club picnics.



    I expect that's probably what is really going on most of the time, basically, it's more work. After a 10+ hour work day, does a person want to learn more about what they've been using all day, or go home and take a break, deal/be with the family, etc, anything that's not more of what they've been doing all day.



    I do wonder if there's a grain of truth in the rumors, but I think it has been received the wrong way. Back when the big iMovie shake-up happened, there was considerable talk about how FCS users can benefit from a bit of a paradigm shift in the interface to improve productivity, among other things. I recall Alex Lindsay talking about how he can get from zero to a rough cut done in iMovie in the time it took to set up the project in Final Cut. So while I can understand the concerns, there is plenty of good potential. The iMovie 8 "dumbing down" was largely temporary anyway, once they got the new foundation down, they added back some features.
  • Reply 14 of 40
    k.c.k.c. Posts: 60member
    Here we are at speculation central.



    Got nothing but time on your hands, want to pontificate, you've come to the right place.



    Like any of the sites mentioned, or the responses given to inquiries define the collective body of FPC users as a whole.



    I use FCP and I'm not worried.



    I'd be willing to be that most of the 'Pro' FCP users don't even have time to read this crap. They're busy editing. And if they're not editing they're living a life, because they actually have one.
  • Reply 15 of 40
    graemegraeme Posts: 61member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by org-chart-leaf-node View Post


    Keep in mind that FC is one of the few remaining Carbon based applications in Apple's portfolio. Carbon is going away.



    It's a huge app with a lot of functionality to re-implment in cocoa. They probably learned a lot with the iMovie experience, but these aren't consumers making movies of vacations or their kids. The pro folk base their careers on the tools that they choose and use. They are right to be concerned and Apple needs to deliver the goods.



    True- Think i'm right in thinking Premier took a 2 year rewrite for 64bit (maybe that was photoshop ), FCP7 came out nearly a year ago- a good update, Logic and Aperture 64bit have just appeared this year. so FCS 64bit could come out any time in the next 12 months along with the needed 'mature QT10'. in the meantime the current package works well with 10.5.7 and with the 10.6.3 update it now plays well with SL. Soundtrack Pro still behaves as oddly as ever, it's a love hate relationship with STP\



    I have getting on for 10 years of projects tied up with FCP- but am not worried about the future of studio and i don't think i'm being gungho either.
  • Reply 17 of 40
    sashimisashimi Posts: 4member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by -AG- View Post


    I just hope that out of all these hoax rumours something can come out of it.



    For example Apple are streamlining the Final Cut series and turning it into a 3 part platform.



    Free Final Cut Express to replace iMovie.



    Mid entry - For your prosumer class Kinda like the standalone FC Pro



    High end - For media professionals aka Final Cut Studio.



    This way they can streamline their offerings, make the mac a more viable alternative for people that want to do some form of video editing and if they wanted to upgrade to the more advanced levels there is a very small learning curve as all 3 platforms use the same base code.



    They could do the same thing with garageband/logic too.



    And while we are at it beef Aperture up to make it something that can work as an alternative to Gimp or Photoshop. because at the moment its just a glorified expensive version of iPhoto.



    yuck! you mean apple will go the microsoft route?! so you have plenty of choices, so satisfy every apple customers?!



    final cut basic

    final cut standard

    final cut premium

    final cut professional

    final cut ultimate



    this is one of the reasons i switched to mac. how many times i had purchased a microsoft software that is crap and limited functionality and ended up upgrading..



    i'm sorry dude but i like what apple's offerings right now..
  • Reply 18 of 40
    tribalogicaltribalogical Posts: 1,182member
    I'm sure not worried...



    I've been using Logic since v5.5... it was horribly unintuitive back then. 7 was OK, 8 was sort of an improvement over that...



    But v9 blew my socks off.



    It has all the "pro" power I need, but also evolved into a very intuitive interface, easy to use and APPLY all that power under the hood. I haven't had to sacrifice anything for turning out professional audio productions. But those changes also make it more "accessible"... prosumers, as people are calling them, find it easy to use, and they too can get great, professional results from it.



    I think Apple is going to take a similar route with FInal Cut. Make it more intuitive and easy to use, but retain (and add to) all of its pro feature set.



    The last couple of FCP versions were a lot like the previous couple of Logic upgrades. Good, but not major leaps.



    If the next FCP is anything like the most recent Logic upgrade, I'm going to be celebrating...



    just my two-cents, fwiw
  • Reply 19 of 40
    john.bjohn.b Posts: 2,740member
    So the dust-up over a dumbed-down FCP was just an AI invention to generate traffic? Whodathunkit?
  • Reply 20 of 40
    esummersesummers Posts: 953member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by org-chart-leaf-node View Post


    Keep in mind that FC is one of the few remaining Carbon based applications in Apple's portfolio. Carbon is going away.



    It's a huge app with a lot of functionality to re-implment in cocoa. They probably learned a lot with the iMovie experience, but these aren't consumers making movies of vacations or their kids. The pro folk base their careers on the tools that they choose and use. They are right to be concerned and Apple needs to deliver the goods.



    Right. Sounds like Apple is reorganizing to do the Cocoa port of the UI. There may be quite a bit of polish added at the same time. Just because Apple rewrote iMovie doesn't mean they are redesigning Final Cut from scratch to be dumbed down. It is quite a stretch think that. It looks like this will be a great update to Final Cut. It looks like they have some very experienced guys on this. Hope this means that they will finally drop some of the remaining Macromedia baggage. Standard plist files so the app can actually be managed maybe?
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