THAT doesn't matter actually lol. You're talking about a win that we won't see the results of for YEARS. A CMDA iPhone for Verizon would have a long enough life that by the time CMDA is gone, nobody will be pouting over their CMDA iPhone not working anymore.
People act as if Verizon or Sprint aren't facing the very issue we're discussing here. What will all of their users do with their phones as CMDA is phased out?
Companies like Sprint and Verizon will transition by starting to sell phones that work on both the old network and new network, then eventually they'll sell phones that only work with the new network. Apple could easily work with these companies to bring the iPhone to their network.
It's not a matter of CMDA being a "dead technology." It never was.
SERIOUSLY tempted NOT to pick up my iphone4 on the 24th and wait for a month. If AT&T were unable to anticipate demand when people were ordering, and their network in NY is by their own admission "lacking', then what will it become? Is it smarter for all those people who have pre-ordered and not paid/collected their phones to hold off and see how the network copes and maybe jump on Verizon's phone in November? Also... it AT&T sucks badly- will Apple move up the Verizon deal? Am curious to hear what others think
First: A rumored, or inferred action often has more leverage/value than the actual action itself!
Second: The only way I see this happening is that Apple offers a model with both GSM and CDMA.
Those, needing the capability for CDMA or both, would buy the new model.
In a way it would be augmentation instead of fragmentation. The network interoperability of the iPhone would be augmented, but the current core function of the device would be preserved-- all apps, iTunes, etc. would support all iPhones.
Here in the UK, as far as I know, an iPhone is an iPhone is an iPhone. That is, any iPhone will run on any of our networks - O2, Orange, Vodaphone. All you need is the requisite SIMM card for a particular network. I don't think the phones are manufactured to a particular mobile network brand. We use 3G networks here. Are they superior to what AT&T and Verizon's CDMA have to offer?
att*= GSM
verizon = CDMA
CDMA !=GSM therefore you need phones with different radios.
in the UK you probably do something smart like use a common technology.
In May, DigiTimes reported that Pegatron had won the contract from Apple to produce a CDMA iPhone. Previous iPhones were built by Foxconn, which also assembles Apple's Mac mini, iPods and the iPad, and is the company's main supplier.
But Foxconn has recently come under fire after a number of widely publicized employee suicides. The manufacturer has responded to the incident by saying it will increase wages for employees and may relocate some of its factories in China.
I would hazard a guess that those suicides have nothing to do with The Transformers getting the contract.
I'll say it again, they are wrong, this product which is in production which will be intro next month with VZ is a competitors product it is not an iphone, these idiot are just spreading miss information yet again. Also any rumor about an VZ ipad is also a competitor product and just VZ attempt to compete against the iphone and ipad
SERIOUSLY tempted NOT to pick up my iphone4 on the 24th and wait for a month. If AT&T were unable to anticipate demand when people were ordering, and their network in NY is by their own admission "lacking', then what will it become? Is it smarter for all those people who have pre-ordered and not paid/collected their phones to hold off and see how the network copes and maybe jump on Verizon's phone in November? Also... it AT&T sucks badly- will Apple move up the Verizon deal? Am curious to hear what others think
No. The only thing will happen is Verizon will "also" get the iPhone. GSM is the global standard.
The clue is in the name: Global System for Mobile Communications.
I'll say it again, they are wrong, this product which is in production which will be intro next month with VZ is a competitors product it is not an iphone, these idiot are just spreading miss information yet again.
You're wrong. You only have to look as far as the AT&T CEO to see the Verizon iPhone is coming in September. When asked about it on one of those "money" TV things he didn't even deny it. He only said that the vast majority of our customers are on a family plan, and a lot of the rest are enterprise customers and are very sticky customers. He doesn't want to deny it 'cause he trying to manage expectations around the stock. If it wasn't true he's say so. You'd have to see the video and I'm far too lazy to locate it.
This is not exactly breaking news, and I think people will be disappointed. There were already news reports a month or so ago about CDMA iPhones being made, but they are not destined for the US or Verizon. They are destined for other countries using CDMA networks like in Japan. In fact I believe one specific company in Japan is supposed to be getting something like 5 million CDMA iphones over time. Everyone likes a good rumor, but lets fact the facts. Apple and AT&T are in a contract, and Verizon is no longer interested in the iPhone even if people are still interested in one.
People act as if Verizon or Sprint aren't facing the very issue we're discussing here. What will all of their users do with their phones as CMDA is phased out?
Actually - they'll do what AT&T (Cingular) customers did in 2004 or 05 when Cingular moved from TDMA to GSM. Your old phone worked for a while on the old network, but when you upgraded to a new one it was the new technology. At some point they discontinued the TDMA service and the last few phones were orphaned - but they gave you a basic free GSM phone instead.
CDMA has no significant advantages. It's often slower than GSM and you can't browse the net or text while talking on the phone (although that might just be Verizon's implementation).
Anyone looking to upgrade their network will be looking at 4G technologies - not CDMA or GSM.
The upgrade is available this year, the question is whether or not Sprint and Verizon are upgrading their systems to match it or ignoring it in favor of working on their 4G rollouts. Doing both would be best of course.
Also CDMA does have one advantage over GSM, it hasn't been hacked yet. GSM was hacked for the first time a month or 2 ago. The protection level is higher in CDMA. May not be a major issue, but it's still something to consider
Here in the UK, as far as I know, an iPhone is an iPhone is an iPhone. That is, any iPhone will run on any of our networks - O2, Orange, Vodaphone. All you need is the requisite SIMM card for a particular network. I don't think the phones are manufactured to a particular mobile network brand. We use 3G networks here. Are they superior to what AT&T and Verizon's CDMA have to offer?
Not necessarily.
The thing is that in the UK, all those companies use GSM not CDMA. And all on the same bandwidth range. So as of the iphone 4 (if not before) the phones will be made with no software lock so that all you need is the SIM.
In the US it's a little different because there are only 2 GSM carriers and they use different bandwidth. So it would take actually tweaking or adding hardware to make the phone truly work on both. At least as they currently stand. Same with Verizon. They would have to have two antenna sets in the phone to handle both or make two different sets of phones.
However what all these rumors forget is that there were court documents showing a contract with ATT until 2012 for the iphone. Not the iphone on GSM but all of it. And no one has dispelled these documents as fakes, adjustable or adjusted. Until one of them does so, I'm in the camp of expecting nada until then
The boy keeps crying wolf, and the sheep want to see the wolf so bad they keep running to look everytime.
Apple said in court that they had a 5 year agreement with AT&T, that would take them until July 2012. There is no public info that suggests the contract has been invalidated or modified. They needed AT&T as a partner to change the mobile phone paradigm and to introduce visual voicemail. Once they had AT&T they were able to get other carriers on board with shorter terms, but AT&T took a huge gamble on Apple, and Apple had to give them the extended exclusivity in order to get them to do so. Deal with it, we ALL benefited, even if you are a Verizon customer with a Droid, to a large extent you owe a thanks to the Apple and AT&T deal for making it possible.
Verizon is doing just fine for now without the iPhone, and they have plenty of infrastructure issues to fix before they could handle a huge rush of iPhone users. They are probably plenty happy to sell Android phones and Blackberry devices until they get their LTE rollout across most of the US. Download speeds on their current 3G network are now significantly slower than the other 3 major vendors, and LTE chips are not available for handsets yet, so Verizon is probably happy to wait another year or more for the LTE iphone. It may or may not still need a CDMA fallback, but it will still give "switchers" a much better first impression if their new Verizon iPhone is faster rather than half the speed.
These rumors are great for stock traders, people in the media, and Verizon, so don't expect them to ever stop. Every idiot who believes this and who does not renew with AT&T or who decides not to leave Verizon is a big win for the Verizon rumor mill. Go ahead and keep living your life in limbo waiting for vaporware. You are being used.
Even as LTE and WiMax roll out, both Sprint and Verizon will rely on CDMA for a long while to come for broad voice coverage. They will continue selling all their phones with a CDMA radio for at least another 5 years. Wimax and LTE will be mostly used for data the first two years and not for voice calls. So if Apple ever decides to offer an iPhone on CDMA carriers here in the USA or abroad, they will have no choice but to include CDMA capability.
I am not saying that they will release a CDMA version of the iPhone, simply stating that if they do go with a CDMA carrier, they will need to include that radio for several more iterations of the iPhone.
Yes GSM is far larger than CDMA, but at around 550 million users around the world, CDMA is big enough to justify the small amount of money for Apple to make one. If HTC, Blackberry, and many other makers can make a CDMA and GSM model of their phones, so could Apple.
The US is also Apple's home market so it is vital that they curtail Android's growth here. The only way to do that is by offering it to more carriers. Many speculate that Verizon is still being stubborn about their demands. One way to really stick it to Verizon and get them to submit would be to offer the iPhone to Sprint and T-Mobile which combined are about as large as Verizon.
I am with Sprint and couldn't be happier. Excellent coverage and unbelievably cheap rates. With my 25% corporate discount, I pay only $52 a month for the $69 anymobile anytime unlimited data & text plan. It only includes 450 anytime minutes to landline phones before 7PM but I never come close to 450 because 90% of my calls are to cell phones. The AT&T plans are quite different, but the cheapest iPhone plan that comes close would cost me well over $100 a month for far inferior coverage. I know because I used to be with AT&T before Sprint. So I am not going anywhere. Even if Sprint charged a surcharge of $10 a month for the iPhone like they did for the new Evo, I could still have an iPhone for $62 a month for nearly unlimited everything. An iPhone on Sprint could also really turn things around for Sprint and start to bring back the customers.
I wouldn't get everyone's hopes up to soon.. Even if they are making a CDMA version of the iPhone it doesn't mean they are breaking their contract with AT&T. They idea that it HAS to be for verizon is an incorrect assumption.
For example, in Canada and China the iPhone is not exclusive to any one carrier, and some of these countrie's carriers use CDMA. A good example of this is MTS in Canada, who is an affiliate of Bell.. a carrier which already offers iPhone. Many claims have reported that MTS will infact be offering iPhone 4, and at this point that would require a CDMA version of the handset.
Bell and Telus together shared the cost to create a 3G GSM network in Canada - presumably a large objective of that was to be able to sell iPhones. iPhones sold by bell in canada are not CDMA.
They will continue selling all their phones with a CDMA radio for at least another 5 years.
The network will stay up for another 5-6 years, but I highly doubt all their phones will still have CDMA chips for that long. Take a look at AT&T and Canada for examples of carriers making a tech switch. VoLTE will be ready by 2012 if not 2011, and Verizon will be agressive in their coverage rollout for a number of reasons, so I would expect they will have phones without CDMA in 2012 or 2013.
In the timeframe of smartphones that have chips that have gone from roughly 400 mhz to soon to be dual core 1.2 snapdragon type processors or at a minimum 1 ghz A4 chips, and have gone from 480x320 to quadruple that, is it really so hard to believe or find someone who could create a chip that would cover both types of technology for cell reception?
I believe they exist, but are not (or were not) yet economical. I see no reason they can't have a CDMA iPhone, though.
A complementary device enhancement known as simultaneous 1X Voice and EV-DO Data (SVDO) will also become available during the same timeframe and will enable CDMA2000 devices to access EV-DO packet data services while in an active 1X circuit-switch voice call. For example, users will be able to send emails or access the Web while on voice calls; phones with GPS can update maps or download real-time traffic information while on voice calls, etc.
Comments
But it no longer matters: GSM/LTE won, CDMA lost.
THAT doesn't matter actually lol. You're talking about a win that we won't see the results of for YEARS. A CMDA iPhone for Verizon would have a long enough life that by the time CMDA is gone, nobody will be pouting over their CMDA iPhone not working anymore.
People act as if Verizon or Sprint aren't facing the very issue we're discussing here. What will all of their users do with their phones as CMDA is phased out?
Companies like Sprint and Verizon will transition by starting to sell phones that work on both the old network and new network, then eventually they'll sell phones that only work with the new network. Apple could easily work with these companies to bring the iPhone to their network.
It's not a matter of CMDA being a "dead technology." It never was.
First: A rumored, or inferred action often has more leverage/value than the actual action itself!
Second: The only way I see this happening is that Apple offers a model with both GSM and CDMA.
Those, needing the capability for CDMA or both, would buy the new model.
In a way it would be augmentation instead of fragmentation. The network interoperability of the iPhone would be augmented, but the current core function of the device would be preserved-- all apps, iTunes, etc. would support all iPhones.
.
Here in the UK, as far as I know, an iPhone is an iPhone is an iPhone. That is, any iPhone will run on any of our networks - O2, Orange, Vodaphone. All you need is the requisite SIMM card for a particular network. I don't think the phones are manufactured to a particular mobile network brand. We use 3G networks here. Are they superior to what AT&T and Verizon's CDMA have to offer?
att*= GSM
verizon = CDMA
CDMA !=GSM therefore you need phones with different radios.
in the UK you probably do something smart like use a common technology.
In May, DigiTimes reported that Pegatron had won the contract from Apple to produce a CDMA iPhone. Previous iPhones were built by Foxconn, which also assembles Apple's Mac mini, iPods and the iPad, and is the company's main supplier.
But Foxconn has recently come under fire after a number of widely publicized employee suicides. The manufacturer has responded to the incident by saying it will increase wages for employees and may relocate some of its factories in China.
I would hazard a guess that those suicides have nothing to do with The Transformers getting the contract.
att*= GSM
verizon = CDMA
CDMA !=GSM therefore you need phones with different radios.
in the UK you probably do something smart like use a common technology.
The standard is called GSM, Verizon bet on the wrong horse.
SERIOUSLY tempted NOT to pick up my iphone4 on the 24th and wait for a month. If AT&T were unable to anticipate demand when people were ordering, and their network in NY is by their own admission "lacking', then what will it become? Is it smarter for all those people who have pre-ordered and not paid/collected their phones to hold off and see how the network copes and maybe jump on Verizon's phone in November? Also... it AT&T sucks badly- will Apple move up the Verizon deal? Am curious to hear what others think
No. The only thing will happen is Verizon will "also" get the iPhone. GSM is the global standard.
The clue is in the name: Global System for Mobile Communications.
I'll say it again, they are wrong, this product which is in production which will be intro next month with VZ is a competitors product it is not an iphone, these idiot are just spreading miss information yet again.
You're wrong. You only have to look as far as the AT&T CEO to see the Verizon iPhone is coming in September. When asked about it on one of those "money" TV things he didn't even deny it. He only said that the vast majority of our customers are on a family plan, and a lot of the rest are enterprise customers and are very sticky customers. He doesn't want to deny it 'cause he trying to manage expectations around the stock. If it wasn't true he's say so. You'd have to see the video and I'm far too lazy to locate it.
People act as if Verizon or Sprint aren't facing the very issue we're discussing here. What will all of their users do with their phones as CMDA is phased out?
Actually - they'll do what AT&T (Cingular) customers did in 2004 or 05 when Cingular moved from TDMA to GSM. Your old phone worked for a while on the old network, but when you upgraded to a new one it was the new technology. At some point they discontinued the TDMA service and the last few phones were orphaned - but they gave you a basic free GSM phone instead.
CDMA has no significant advantages. It's often slower than GSM and you can't browse the net or text while talking on the phone (although that might just be Verizon's implementation).
Anyone looking to upgrade their network will be looking at 4G technologies - not CDMA or GSM.
http://pocketnow.com/news-archive/cd...ge-coming-soon
The upgrade is available this year, the question is whether or not Sprint and Verizon are upgrading their systems to match it or ignoring it in favor of working on their 4G rollouts. Doing both would be best of course.
Also CDMA does have one advantage over GSM, it hasn't been hacked yet. GSM was hacked for the first time a month or 2 ago. The protection level is higher in CDMA. May not be a major issue, but it's still something to consider
Here in the UK, as far as I know, an iPhone is an iPhone is an iPhone. That is, any iPhone will run on any of our networks - O2, Orange, Vodaphone. All you need is the requisite SIMM card for a particular network. I don't think the phones are manufactured to a particular mobile network brand. We use 3G networks here. Are they superior to what AT&T and Verizon's CDMA have to offer?
Not necessarily.
The thing is that in the UK, all those companies use GSM not CDMA. And all on the same bandwidth range. So as of the iphone 4 (if not before) the phones will be made with no software lock so that all you need is the SIM.
In the US it's a little different because there are only 2 GSM carriers and they use different bandwidth. So it would take actually tweaking or adding hardware to make the phone truly work on both. At least as they currently stand. Same with Verizon. They would have to have two antenna sets in the phone to handle both or make two different sets of phones.
However what all these rumors forget is that there were court documents showing a contract with ATT until 2012 for the iphone. Not the iphone on GSM but all of it. And no one has dispelled these documents as fakes, adjustable or adjusted. Until one of them does so, I'm in the camp of expecting nada until then
Apple said in court that they had a 5 year agreement with AT&T, that would take them until July 2012. There is no public info that suggests the contract has been invalidated or modified. They needed AT&T as a partner to change the mobile phone paradigm and to introduce visual voicemail. Once they had AT&T they were able to get other carriers on board with shorter terms, but AT&T took a huge gamble on Apple, and Apple had to give them the extended exclusivity in order to get them to do so. Deal with it, we ALL benefited, even if you are a Verizon customer with a Droid, to a large extent you owe a thanks to the Apple and AT&T deal for making it possible.
Verizon is doing just fine for now without the iPhone, and they have plenty of infrastructure issues to fix before they could handle a huge rush of iPhone users. They are probably plenty happy to sell Android phones and Blackberry devices until they get their LTE rollout across most of the US. Download speeds on their current 3G network are now significantly slower than the other 3 major vendors, and LTE chips are not available for handsets yet, so Verizon is probably happy to wait another year or more for the LTE iphone. It may or may not still need a CDMA fallback, but it will still give "switchers" a much better first impression if their new Verizon iPhone is faster rather than half the speed.
These rumors are great for stock traders, people in the media, and Verizon, so don't expect them to ever stop. Every idiot who believes this and who does not renew with AT&T or who decides not to leave Verizon is a big win for the Verizon rumor mill. Go ahead and keep living your life in limbo waiting for vaporware. You are being used.
I am not saying that they will release a CDMA version of the iPhone, simply stating that if they do go with a CDMA carrier, they will need to include that radio for several more iterations of the iPhone.
Yes GSM is far larger than CDMA, but at around 550 million users around the world, CDMA is big enough to justify the small amount of money for Apple to make one. If HTC, Blackberry, and many other makers can make a CDMA and GSM model of their phones, so could Apple.
The US is also Apple's home market so it is vital that they curtail Android's growth here. The only way to do that is by offering it to more carriers. Many speculate that Verizon is still being stubborn about their demands. One way to really stick it to Verizon and get them to submit would be to offer the iPhone to Sprint and T-Mobile which combined are about as large as Verizon.
I am with Sprint and couldn't be happier. Excellent coverage and unbelievably cheap rates. With my 25% corporate discount, I pay only $52 a month for the $69 anymobile anytime unlimited data & text plan. It only includes 450 anytime minutes to landline phones before 7PM but I never come close to 450 because 90% of my calls are to cell phones. The AT&T plans are quite different, but the cheapest iPhone plan that comes close would cost me well over $100 a month for far inferior coverage. I know because I used to be with AT&T before Sprint. So I am not going anywhere. Even if Sprint charged a surcharge of $10 a month for the iPhone like they did for the new Evo, I could still have an iPhone for $62 a month for nearly unlimited everything. An iPhone on Sprint could also really turn things around for Sprint and start to bring back the customers.
I wouldn't get everyone's hopes up to soon.. Even if they are making a CDMA version of the iPhone it doesn't mean they are breaking their contract with AT&T. They idea that it HAS to be for verizon is an incorrect assumption.
For example, in Canada and China the iPhone is not exclusive to any one carrier, and some of these countrie's carriers use CDMA. A good example of this is MTS in Canada, who is an affiliate of Bell.. a carrier which already offers iPhone. Many claims have reported that MTS will infact be offering iPhone 4, and at this point that would require a CDMA version of the handset.
Bell and Telus together shared the cost to create a 3G GSM network in Canada - presumably a large objective of that was to be able to sell iPhones. iPhones sold by bell in canada are not CDMA.
They will continue selling all their phones with a CDMA radio for at least another 5 years.
The network will stay up for another 5-6 years, but I highly doubt all their phones will still have CDMA chips for that long. Take a look at AT&T and Canada for examples of carriers making a tech switch. VoLTE will be ready by 2012 if not 2011, and Verizon will be agressive in their coverage rollout for a number of reasons, so I would expect they will have phones without CDMA in 2012 or 2013.
In the timeframe of smartphones that have chips that have gone from roughly 400 mhz to soon to be dual core 1.2 snapdragon type processors or at a minimum 1 ghz A4 chips, and have gone from 480x320 to quadruple that, is it really so hard to believe or find someone who could create a chip that would cover both types of technology for cell reception?
I believe they exist, but are not (or were not) yet economical. I see no reason they can't have a CDMA iPhone, though.
Contrary to popular belief, CDMA can support (or soon will support) simultaneous voice and data. http://www.cdg.org/news/press/2009/Aug17_09.asp
A complementary device enhancement known as simultaneous 1X Voice and EV-DO Data (SVDO) will also become available during the same timeframe and will enable CDMA2000 devices to access EV-DO packet data services while in an active 1X circuit-switch voice call. For example, users will be able to send emails or access the Web while on voice calls; phones with GPS can update maps or download real-time traffic information while on voice calls, etc.