wouldn't this just be a problem for right handed people who hold the phone in their left hand to touch the screen with their right index finger as appose to left handed people whom hold the phone in their right hand to touch the screen with their left index finger?
It's a little odd. Mine was showing this problem for most of the evening (I didn't get a bumper since they only had black), but I went ahead and restarted it and now I can't reproduce it, at least to the extent I was seeing earlier. I'm now seeing it drop around one bar, but nothing too drastic.
Calls don't seem to be affected and WiFi seems pretty stable for speed (1400 kbps down and 35-50 kbps up).
I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't just some weird software glitch.
If lawyers can prove, which shouldn't be too hard, that Apple knew about the flaw then Apple has already lost a potentially billion dollar case.
Not exactly true. In class actions, the money goes to the law firm bringing the case about. Users generally see next to nothing. Again, if the issue is not addressable using conventional methods, "free" bumpers are the likely outcome, or in more extreme cases of customer dissatisfaction, the phone returned for a full refund with no penalty.
over at macrumors, they have posted an email from SJ about the issue and according to him this is an non-issue, and if you have a problem, buy a case, or hold the phone differently.
So, I would assume that, if the email is real (and there are claims of verification), then no fix will be coming because there is no problem to be fixed.
This is what steve said in an interview with USA today:
"Q: What do you say to customers who just bought a new iPhone for $599? Sorry?
A: That's technology. If they bought it this morning, they should go back to where they bought it and talk to them. If they bought it a month ago, well, that's what happens in technology."
Essentially, he said lump it on September 5.
On September 6 he has an open letter that says:
"we have decided to offer every iPhone customer who purchased an iPhone from either Apple or AT&T, and who is not receiving a rebate or any other consideration, a $100 store credit towards the purchase of any product at an Apple Retail Store or the Apple Online Store.
...
We want to do the right thing for our valued iPhone customers. We apologize for disappointing some of you, and we are doing our best to live up to your high expectations of Apple"
Given this issue is more serious than folks whining that Apple lowered prices do folks really believe that Apple won't do something? $60M is a lot of money but Apple has what? $23B in cash?
If the problem is widespread, and it might be, then Apple will respond in a way to keep its reputation intact. It's worth a lot more than $60M. There isn't likely to be an open letter again but there have been "the sky is falling" problems with Apple gear that blew over because Apple replaced the defective units and made good.
If they don't...well folks should have locked in some of their profit on Apple stock and someone else becomes the darling of the tech world. But do folks really believe that Steve Jobs is stupid?
It's a little odd. Mine was showing this problem for most of the evening (I didn't get a bumper since they only had black), but I went ahead and restarted it and now I can't reproduce it, at least to the extent I was seeing earlier. I'm now seeing it drop around one bar, but nothing too drastic.
Calls don't seem to be affected and WiFi seems pretty stable for speed (1400 kbps down and 35-50 kbps up).
I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't just some weird software glitch.
A MacRumors poster whom Jobs initially emailed called into Apple Tech Support to just tell them about the issue.
Quote:
They offered up a free bumper for my troubles.
But here's the "kicker." Before they send me my free bumper - they are requesting I sign something legal (not sure what it is yet as it's going to be emailed to me in the next 24-48 hours) that I would need to sign..
Now - I have no idea what's in the paperwork. And nothing against Apple who is at least trying to do something. But I don't think I'm inclined to accept their free gift if it means signing away any ability to take other recourse if in the future there's a recall/suit/etc.
Perhaps paranoid - but I would imagine the paperwork to be signed says something to the effect that the matter has been "resolved." as far as both parties are concerned.
I've decided not to read the entire thread, I just wanted to let some of you folks know what the problem most likely is and to let you know that it isn't the major disaster most are making it out to be.
Physics dictates that you don't want to complete a circuit with your own body to make something work. You also don't want your to be body part of a circuit if it will work perfectly fine without you.
The easiest way to prevent this problem from happening is to coat the stainless steel with some thin poly coating as part of the manufacturing process. My guess is, that was what Apple intended (and probably did with the vast majority of those manufactured) but (and for those who have ever worked in a factory, you know this sometimes happens, no matter how good your processes) somebody mixed up coated parts with uncoated parts. I don't know if this was a few boxes or most of the first run shipments, but it's a problem easily corrected with future manufacturing.
Obviously those who got uncoated antennas will have to put a bumper on it or return it (and I feel your pain) but the problem will go away very quickly.
I doubt it's a software problem if it only happens physically with some of the iPhones. Either way, Apple will receive a minor black eye with this one as it will dull some of the excitement for early buyers.
If the yellow screens go away with usage as predicted (the glue merely has to dry) no one will much care about this news a couple of weeks from now.
A simple test would be to check the continuity of the band. If it is coated, there will be no conductivity. Would someone please do this. Just be careful to not press to hard with the probes.
wouldn't this just be a problem for right handed people who hold the phone in their left hand to touch the screen with their right index finger as appose to left handed people whom hold the phone in their right hand to touch the screen with their left index finger?
My iPhone will go down to 1 bar even when trying to hold it "Steve's way". Just when cradling the phone and only touching the two sides around the upper or midway down part of the phone, I loose most of my signal bars. I have had dropped calls to everyone I have talked to with it. I have not had a single successful phone call with it so far.
I can replicate this all around town. However, I could not replicate it for the AT&T representative. He informed me that they have incredible signal strength at their store. (Makes sense, since they want to impress customers.) This makes one hypothesize if all iPhone 4's probably have the same antenna issue, but some people may not be able to replicate the issue if they are trying to do so in an area with incredible signal strength.
It's a little odd. Mine was showing this problem for most of the evening (I didn't get a bumper since they only had black), but I went ahead and restarted it and now I can't reproduce it, at least to the extent I was seeing earlier. I'm now seeing it drop around one bar, but nothing too drastic.
Calls don't seem to be affected and WiFi seems pretty stable for speed (1400 kbps down and 35-50 kbps up).
I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't just some weird software glitch.
I was able to do it a couple times this morning but not since without trying really really hard. As in cupping the whole bottom, pressing really firmly and even using a penny I lose only 2 bars.
That's with wifi being used and BT on (but not paired).
wouldn't this just be a problem for right handed people who hold the phone in their left hand to touch the screen with their right index finger as appose to left handed people whom hold the phone in their right hand to touch the screen with their left index finger?
Left handed people put the phone in their left hand to make calls. Like me. This is where the problem. They should have broke the antennas on the bottom to reduce the chance of touching the bands.
Left handed people put the phone in their left hand to make calls. Like me. This is where the problem. They should have broke the antennas on the bottom to reduce the chance of touching the bands.
But don't right-handed people hold the phone in the left hand while dialing? I think either way, it's a little insane to have not had this issue brought up prior to manufacture. Could it be that the engineers are being ignored/overruled in favor of aesthetics... even if it results in a faulty product?
Reading through these comments has been a riot- really. That said, I think I have some good news on how the Company is going to handle the situation... I do this kind of thing for a living
Before the end of business (EST) on Friday, a statement to all customers with existing orders as well as those who have already purchased will be sent via email. It will begin restating much of what was already explained in the brief Company statement released Thursday evening- that all phones on the market today are susceptible to reception interference based on the manner in which the user holds the device relative to the built in antennae. The statement will then go on to explain that while the latest design of Apple's iPhone has proven to have the best reception of any model released to date, Apple understands that *some* customers may experience issues more than others. With that in mind, Apple is happy to offer these customers a complimentary case OR the customer has the option of returning the iPhone within 30 days of purchase for a full refund and release of contract with AT&T. Apple understands the high expectations of it's customers and appreciates the feedback as it continues to develop state of the art products.
Not exactly true. In class actions, the money goes to the law firm bringing the case about. Users generally see next to nothing. Again, if the issue is not addressable using conventional methods, "free" bumpers are the likely outcome, or in more extreme cases of customer dissatisfaction, the phone returned for a full refund with no penalty.
I'm not a lawyer so I can't speak with great knowledge so you may be right but the more extreme cases seems more likely especially if plaintiffs are willing to use up their time joining this suit though a court could, as you said, just rule to hand out bumpers.
The reason I think Apple could potentially lose a billion dollars is that the flaw will be so widespread (because of the high volume of sales) that there will be more than one of these class-action suits in more than one country. I never thought the plaintiffs would ever make any serious cash on this as it's the lawyers who always win; even if they lose.
I can hold my Evo any way (with no rubber bumper) and it makes a call with a great 3G signal. Great 4G signal here in Chicago too for data. Haven't charged it since last night. :-) Commence flaming.........now.
Reading through these comments has been a riot- really. That said, I think I have some good news on how the Company is going to handle the situation... I do this kind of thing for a living
Before the end of business (EST) on Friday, a statement to all customers with existing orders as well as those who have already purchased will be sent via email. It will begin restating much of what was already explained in the brief Company statement released Thursday evening- that all phones on the market today are susceptible to reception interference based on the manner in which the user holds the device relative to the built in antennae. The statement will then go on to explain that while the latest design of Apple's iPhone has proven to have the best reception of any model released to date, Apple understands that *some* customers may experience issues more than others. With that in mind, Apple is happy to offer these customers a complimentary case OR the customer has the option of returning the iPhone within 30 days of purchase for a full refund and release of contract with AT&T. Apple understands the high expectations of it's customers and appreciates the feedback as it continues to develop state of the art products.
Heh...I'd rather have a $100.
For folks that feel the aesthetics of the phone would be destroyed by the case they could try this:
The film should be enough to stop the skin conductance and you can just use the two thin side pieces. I don't like the feel of the skins on the touchscreen itself but around the bezel is probably okay and makes them a little grippier.
Hard to see if the strips have the right cut outs but hopefully it does or someone will make it given this issue.
While I am glad I waited to buy, I still feel slighted by SJs reply on this. Yes, it may change, but him saying this is very disappointing.
If all customers were having this issue, then I could at least see his answer being accurate. But since many users aren't effected it seems like it HAS to be either a software glitch that some have, or a manufacturing error in which some phones did not get the proper anti-conduction coating on the antenna band.
I just don't understand any of this. Maybe because I am not an engineer or electronics guru, but it doesn't make sense for some to have the problem and not others. If everyone holds the phone incorrectly, then everyone should have the same lack of signal, but this is not the case somehow.
Reading through these comments has been a riot- really. That said, I think I have some good news on how the Company is going to handle the situation... I do this kind of thing for a living
Before the end of business (EST) on Friday, a statement to all customers with existing orders as well as those who have already purchased will be sent via email. It will begin restating much of what was already explained in the brief Company statement released Thursday evening- that all phones on the market today are susceptible to reception interference based on the manner in which the user holds the device relative to the built in antennae. The statement will then go on to explain that while the latest design of Apple's iPhone has proven to have the best reception of any model released to date, Apple understands that *some* customers may experience issues more than others. With that in mind, Apple is happy to offer these customers a complimentary case OR the customer has the option of returning the iPhone within 30 days of purchase for a full refund and release of contract with AT&T. Apple understands the high expectations of it's customers and appreciates the feedback as it continues to develop state of the art products.
That sounds about right. It would be the same kind of lame PR speak that could potentially resolve the issue for *some* customers. For others, it won't. Those bumpers ruin the look of the device and its initial appeal.
Comments
Calls don't seem to be affected and WiFi seems pretty stable for speed (1400 kbps down and 35-50 kbps up).
I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't just some weird software glitch.
If lawyers can prove, which shouldn't be too hard, that Apple knew about the flaw then Apple has already lost a potentially billion dollar case.
Not exactly true. In class actions, the money goes to the law firm bringing the case about. Users generally see next to nothing. Again, if the issue is not addressable using conventional methods, "free" bumpers are the likely outcome, or in more extreme cases of customer dissatisfaction, the phone returned for a full refund with no penalty.
over at macrumors, they have posted an email from SJ about the issue and according to him this is an non-issue, and if you have a problem, buy a case, or hold the phone differently.
So, I would assume that, if the email is real (and there are claims of verification), then no fix will be coming because there is no problem to be fixed.
This is what steve said in an interview with USA today:
"Q: What do you say to customers who just bought a new iPhone for $599? Sorry?
A: That's technology. If they bought it this morning, they should go back to where they bought it and talk to them. If they bought it a month ago, well, that's what happens in technology."
Essentially, he said lump it on September 5.
On September 6 he has an open letter that says:
"we have decided to offer every iPhone customer who purchased an iPhone from either Apple or AT&T, and who is not receiving a rebate or any other consideration, a $100 store credit towards the purchase of any product at an Apple Retail Store or the Apple Online Store.
...
We want to do the right thing for our valued iPhone customers. We apologize for disappointing some of you, and we are doing our best to live up to your high expectations of Apple"
Given this issue is more serious than folks whining that Apple lowered prices do folks really believe that Apple won't do something? $60M is a lot of money but Apple has what? $23B in cash?
If the problem is widespread, and it might be, then Apple will respond in a way to keep its reputation intact. It's worth a lot more than $60M. There isn't likely to be an open letter again but there have been "the sky is falling" problems with Apple gear that blew over because Apple replaced the defective units and made good.
If they don't...well folks should have locked in some of their profit on Apple stock and someone else becomes the darling of the tech world. But do folks really believe that Steve Jobs is stupid?
It's a little odd. Mine was showing this problem for most of the evening (I didn't get a bumper since they only had black), but I went ahead and restarted it and now I can't reproduce it, at least to the extent I was seeing earlier. I'm now seeing it drop around one bar, but nothing too drastic.
Calls don't seem to be affected and WiFi seems pretty stable for speed (1400 kbps down and 35-50 kbps up).
I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't just some weird software glitch.
Boy, wouldn't that be a relief.
They offered up a free bumper for my troubles.
But here's the "kicker." Before they send me my free bumper - they are requesting I sign something legal (not sure what it is yet as it's going to be emailed to me in the next 24-48 hours) that I would need to sign..
Now - I have no idea what's in the paperwork. And nothing against Apple who is at least trying to do something. But I don't think I'm inclined to accept their free gift if it means signing away any ability to take other recourse if in the future there's a recall/suit/etc.
Perhaps paranoid - but I would imagine the paperwork to be signed says something to the effect that the matter has been "resolved." as far as both parties are concerned.
Will let you know when I get the email/document.
And the hits just keep on comin'!
I've decided not to read the entire thread, I just wanted to let some of you folks know what the problem most likely is and to let you know that it isn't the major disaster most are making it out to be.
Physics dictates that you don't want to complete a circuit with your own body to make something work. You also don't want your to be body part of a circuit if it will work perfectly fine without you.
The easiest way to prevent this problem from happening is to coat the stainless steel with some thin poly coating as part of the manufacturing process. My guess is, that was what Apple intended (and probably did with the vast majority of those manufactured) but (and for those who have ever worked in a factory, you know this sometimes happens, no matter how good your processes) somebody mixed up coated parts with uncoated parts. I don't know if this was a few boxes or most of the first run shipments, but it's a problem easily corrected with future manufacturing.
Obviously those who got uncoated antennas will have to put a bumper on it or return it (and I feel your pain) but the problem will go away very quickly.
I doubt it's a software problem if it only happens physically with some of the iPhones. Either way, Apple will receive a minor black eye with this one as it will dull some of the excitement for early buyers.
If the yellow screens go away with usage as predicted (the glue merely has to dry) no one will much care about this news a couple of weeks from now.
A simple test would be to check the continuity of the band. If it is coated, there will be no conductivity. Would someone please do this. Just be careful to not press to hard with the probes.
wouldn't this just be a problem for right handed people who hold the phone in their left hand to touch the screen with their right index finger as appose to left handed people whom hold the phone in their right hand to touch the screen with their left index finger?
My iPhone will go down to 1 bar even when trying to hold it "Steve's way". Just when cradling the phone and only touching the two sides around the upper or midway down part of the phone, I loose most of my signal bars. I have had dropped calls to everyone I have talked to with it. I have not had a single successful phone call with it so far.
I can replicate this all around town. However, I could not replicate it for the AT&T representative. He informed me that they have incredible signal strength at their store. (Makes sense, since they want to impress customers.) This makes one hypothesize if all iPhone 4's probably have the same antenna issue, but some people may not be able to replicate the issue if they are trying to do so in an area with incredible signal strength.
It's a little odd. Mine was showing this problem for most of the evening (I didn't get a bumper since they only had black), but I went ahead and restarted it and now I can't reproduce it, at least to the extent I was seeing earlier. I'm now seeing it drop around one bar, but nothing too drastic.
Calls don't seem to be affected and WiFi seems pretty stable for speed (1400 kbps down and 35-50 kbps up).
I'm beginning to wonder if this isn't just some weird software glitch.
I was able to do it a couple times this morning but not since without trying really really hard. As in cupping the whole bottom, pressing really firmly and even using a penny I lose only 2 bars.
That's with wifi being used and BT on (but not paired).
wouldn't this just be a problem for right handed people who hold the phone in their left hand to touch the screen with their right index finger as appose to left handed people whom hold the phone in their right hand to touch the screen with their left index finger?
Left handed people put the phone in their left hand to make calls. Like me. This is where the problem. They should have broke the antennas on the bottom to reduce the chance of touching the bands.
Left handed people put the phone in their left hand to make calls. Like me. This is where the problem. They should have broke the antennas on the bottom to reduce the chance of touching the bands.
But don't right-handed people hold the phone in the left hand while dialing? I think either way, it's a little insane to have not had this issue brought up prior to manufacture. Could it be that the engineers are being ignored/overruled in favor of aesthetics... even if it results in a faulty product?
The should really use Gaga's song to promote the phone
Before the end of business (EST) on Friday, a statement to all customers with existing orders as well as those who have already purchased will be sent via email. It will begin restating much of what was already explained in the brief Company statement released Thursday evening- that all phones on the market today are susceptible to reception interference based on the manner in which the user holds the device relative to the built in antennae. The statement will then go on to explain that while the latest design of Apple's iPhone has proven to have the best reception of any model released to date, Apple understands that *some* customers may experience issues more than others. With that in mind, Apple is happy to offer these customers a complimentary case OR the customer has the option of returning the iPhone within 30 days of purchase for a full refund and release of contract with AT&T. Apple understands the high expectations of it's customers and appreciates the feedback as it continues to develop state of the art products.
Not exactly true. In class actions, the money goes to the law firm bringing the case about. Users generally see next to nothing. Again, if the issue is not addressable using conventional methods, "free" bumpers are the likely outcome, or in more extreme cases of customer dissatisfaction, the phone returned for a full refund with no penalty.
I'm not a lawyer so I can't speak with great knowledge so you may be right but the more extreme cases seems more likely especially if plaintiffs are willing to use up their time joining this suit though a court could, as you said, just rule to hand out bumpers.
The reason I think Apple could potentially lose a billion dollars is that the flaw will be so widespread (because of the high volume of sales) that there will be more than one of these class-action suits in more than one country. I never thought the plaintiffs would ever make any serious cash on this as it's the lawyers who always win; even if they lose.
Reading through these comments has been a riot- really. That said, I think I have some good news on how the Company is going to handle the situation... I do this kind of thing for a living
Before the end of business (EST) on Friday, a statement to all customers with existing orders as well as those who have already purchased will be sent via email. It will begin restating much of what was already explained in the brief Company statement released Thursday evening- that all phones on the market today are susceptible to reception interference based on the manner in which the user holds the device relative to the built in antennae. The statement will then go on to explain that while the latest design of Apple's iPhone has proven to have the best reception of any model released to date, Apple understands that *some* customers may experience issues more than others. With that in mind, Apple is happy to offer these customers a complimentary case OR the customer has the option of returning the iPhone within 30 days of purchase for a full refund and release of contract with AT&T. Apple understands the high expectations of it's customers and appreciates the feedback as it continues to develop state of the art products.
Heh...I'd rather have a $100.
For folks that feel the aesthetics of the phone would be destroyed by the case they could try this:
http://www.amazon.com/Skinomi-TechSk...7439166&sr=1-1
The film should be enough to stop the skin conductance and you can just use the two thin side pieces. I don't like the feel of the skins on the touchscreen itself but around the bezel is probably okay and makes them a little grippier.
Hard to see if the strips have the right cut outs but hopefully it does or someone will make it given this issue.
While I am glad I waited to buy, I still feel slighted by SJs reply on this. Yes, it may change, but him saying this is very disappointing.
If all customers were having this issue, then I could at least see his answer being accurate. But since many users aren't effected it seems like it HAS to be either a software glitch that some have, or a manufacturing error in which some phones did not get the proper anti-conduction coating on the antenna band.
I just don't understand any of this. Maybe because I am not an engineer or electronics guru, but it doesn't make sense for some to have the problem and not others. If everyone holds the phone incorrectly, then everyone should have the same lack of signal, but this is not the case somehow.
Is this a bad dream?
Reading through these comments has been a riot- really. That said, I think I have some good news on how the Company is going to handle the situation... I do this kind of thing for a living
Before the end of business (EST) on Friday, a statement to all customers with existing orders as well as those who have already purchased will be sent via email. It will begin restating much of what was already explained in the brief Company statement released Thursday evening- that all phones on the market today are susceptible to reception interference based on the manner in which the user holds the device relative to the built in antennae. The statement will then go on to explain that while the latest design of Apple's iPhone has proven to have the best reception of any model released to date, Apple understands that *some* customers may experience issues more than others. With that in mind, Apple is happy to offer these customers a complimentary case OR the customer has the option of returning the iPhone within 30 days of purchase for a full refund and release of contract with AT&T. Apple understands the high expectations of it's customers and appreciates the feedback as it continues to develop state of the art products.
That sounds about right. It would be the same kind of lame PR speak that could potentially resolve the issue for *some* customers. For others, it won't. Those bumpers ruin the look of the device and its initial appeal.