iPhone 4 Review: 1 - Hardware Fit & Finish

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  • Reply 81 of 338
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lostkiwi View Post


    Ireland, with respect, your comments are becoming a little petulant. I'm not covering anyone or any company's 'ass'. I was simply stating that I think the whole issue is overblown and that I, and a lot of other people were going to use a case anyway it so it won't be a problem for us. Thats it.



    This isn't the end of the world, its just a bug on a phone that may be fixed with an update, or it may not. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it or flame up forums because that won't really solve anything. Life is too short mate. If you want to get a Droid phone then all power to you and I look forward to hearing from the old happier Ireland on these boards with some intelligent comments on it.



    I have to agree with Ireland on comments, it not the issue so much, but the reply from SJ that irritates me. It was arrogant at least and crazy to be frank. You purchase a new product all excited and you found out that you can not use the product in comfortable fashion because there is an issue and SJ says "Hey why don't you adapt your practices to our product and get over it'



    Sorry mate, it may not be end of world, but not going to accept arrogance from anyone, when I am filling their company's bank account with my hard earned money. People should voice their concern and ensure Apple lives up to high quality products, we expect in paying premium prices (Not talking US market).



    As customer I am allowed to voice any opinion within reason, since I am PURCHASING the product and if SJ wants to be arrogant, then he may found history repeats itself, Can someone say Microsoft'



    AS Apple shareholder for a long time, he better not screw up my retirement plan by giving such answers, since I want the company banks to overflow and my dividends keep coming in and share price rise steadily
  • Reply 82 of 338
    vrkiranvrkiran Posts: 110member
    Very few people here are tolerant to any apple criticism.. including real, honest and factual criticism.



    I got a iPhone 4 32GB and I have suffered 10+ dropped calls at my home and I did not drop that many in 2 years of 3GS (well, before you yell, both my wife and I had 3GS since early days of it, so 1yr + 1yr = 2yrs). I love 4 in all other aspects, but guys, dropped calls and RF problems are real!!
  • Reply 83 of 338
    commun5commun5 Posts: 36member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post


    an Apple Fanboy.



    Excellent review as usual Dan, but you might want to tone down the slobbering a bit.



    You are correct about the iPhone 4's display being the new normal. I got to play with my wife's new phone for a few minutes and it is incredible.



    I find it trivial to get the bars to go down to zero. Sweaty fingers and just the right grip and poof; they are gone.



    www.marketingtactics.com





    And you, Dave Barnes, are practicing your "Marketing Tactics" in the hopes that you will find some gullible people who will decide not to buy iPhone 4 after finding your statement in a Google search. First tactic: claiming that, not you, but your wife, has the new iPhone. That shows so much objectivity. Second, presenting such a suave description of the reception problem; surely a sophisticated guy like you wouldn't get upset about it, but maybe someone else ought to. Great technique for trying to cultivate doubt and panic.



    Feel free to collect your Android check, but give your audience maybe just a tiny bit more credit than your "tactics" would admit. After all, there are millions of "Apple Fanboys" who are getting tired of the label.
  • Reply 84 of 338
    Read two paragraphs and gave up in embarrassment for DED. Are you sure this isn't a spoof Ã* la The Office?
  • Reply 85 of 338
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by robzr View Post


    ...Apple has raised the bar...



    Not the one that shows signal strength though.

    Sorry, couldn't resist.
  • Reply 86 of 338
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


    The new phone demands a sense of reverence, as if you're almost unworthy to use it...



    Wow, when this day comes, it really is a sad day for human dignity. There are a lot more important things in life, and global issues, to even contemplate such a thing. Whether the statement was made in jest or not, I'm sorry, I find it extremely, extremely offensive. A phone does not demand reverence. That's reserved for certain higher things, you know what I mean...



    It's just a goddammned mobile phone. FFS what is going on these past few days. Sure geekiness is fun and exciting and somewhat spiritually happy and uplifting, but, geeeez.
  • Reply 87 of 338
    bushman4bushman4 Posts: 862member
    Hardware fit and finish is sleek and pleasing to the eye and hand.



    As for the connectivity problem; Lets wait till next week and see if Apple posts a software update to remedy the problem. If you are unhappy with the phone after that keep in mind you have 30 days to bring it back without any ETF. don't complain later.



    ATT has just complicated the problem with their poor connectivity.Had the service been good to begin with, perhaps you signal strength would drop but not your call.
  • Reply 88 of 338
    lostkiwilostkiwi Posts: 639member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by souliisoul View Post


    I have to agree with Ireland on comments, it not the issue so much, but the reply from SJ that irritates me. It was arrogant at least and crazy to be frank. You purchase a new product all excited and you found out that you can not use the product in comfortable fashion because there is an issue and SJ says "Hey why don't you adapt your practices to our product and get over it'



    Sorry mate, it may not be end of world, but not going to accept arrogance from anyone, when I am filling their company's bank account with my hard earned money. People should voice their concern and ensure Apple lives up to high quality products, we expect in paying premium prices (Not talking US market).



    As customer I am allowed to voice any opinion within reason, since I am PURCHASING the product and if SJ wants to be arrogant, then he may found history repeats itself, Can someone say Microsoft'



    AS Apple shareholder for a long time, he better not screw up my retirement plan by giving such answers, since I want the company banks to overflow and my dividends keep coming in and share price rise steadily



    Oh, the quote from The Steve is quite another matter. I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who didn't think it was arrogant or perhaps ill advised. Still, I have to say it made me laugh when I read it. The guy is not known for his tact.

    I find it interesting there is such a dichotomy with Apple's CEO - he is famed for being a real SOB to work with and his one liner emails are.. well... interesting. On the other hand he can play a keynote audience like a concert pianist.



    I think everyone here wants Apple to put out the best products on the market. As their customers I agree that we are the ones to hold them to that. The point I was making is that I don't think angst and beating of chests is helping anything.

    I have no love for Microsoft and if I felt Apple was anything the Redmond people I would be the first one out the door.



    Even the Android fans want Apple to do well (secretly). Competition can only make smartphones better! Especially when it comes to reception.
  • Reply 89 of 338
    souliisoulsouliisoul Posts: 827member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lostkiwi View Post


    Oh, the quote from The Steve is quite another matter. I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who didn't think it was arrogant or perhaps ill advised. Still, I have to say it made me laugh when I read it. The guy is not known for his tact.

    I find it interesting there is such a dichotomy with Apple's CEO - he is famed for being a real SOB to work with and his one liner emails are.. well... interesting. On the other hand he can play a keynote audience like a concert pianist.



    I think everyone here wants Apple to put out the best products on the market. As their customers I agree that we are the ones to hold them to that. The point I was making is that I don't think angst and beating of chests is helping anything.

    I have no love for Microsoft and if I felt Apple was anything the Redmond people I would be the first one out the door.



    Even the Android fans want Apple to do well (secretly). Competition can only make smartphones better! Especially when it comes to reception.



    I have to say from pure design point of view, the Droid X is like a brick compared to the iPhone 4 and even though it has a bigger screen and more functionality (apparently), just does not cut it. Issue with majority of phones trying to compete with iPhone is the design. Customers will buy Droid X for a number of reasons, but it going to be difficult to pull existing iPhone users away from buying iPhone 4 and go to Droid X. Why have those four buttons that look frail and weak on bottom of the screen?



    Lets stop with 8MP camera crap, since 5MP in iPhone is has good, if not better than 8MP in Droid, if that marketing poly is still working with consumers, then serve them right! Since iPhone will not come to India until end of this year, I can wait and see how the performance goes, but unless someone comes with a smartphone that makes the iPhone 4 look like a brick, then I will be upgrading my iPhone 3GS.
  • Reply 90 of 338
    dick applebaumdick applebaum Posts: 12,527member
    I believe there is general agreement that some percentage of iPhone 4 users are experiencing problems with the 3G antenna.



    I think it is too early to tell if the problem can be resolved with a software/firmware fix.



    Let's say that it is a design defect that can only be resolved by changing the hardware-- say, move the separators on both sides down to the bottom of the phone where it would be difficult to hold the phone in such a way to short the antenna, (This could be done internally by deadening the bottom antenna areas that extend up from the bottom on each side)



    Let's say that Apple revises the design and comes out with rev 1 hardware, say, by Aug 1.



    At that time, lets assume there will be 1.5 million defective rev 0 iPhone 4s sold and delivered.



    The important question is: What does Apple do?





    History may give us some insight:



    Case 1



    Back in 1979, Apple came out with a 5 1/4 micro floppy external diskette drive for the Apple ][.



    This was a breakthrough product for its time-- in a way, very similar to the original iPhone. (VisiCalc, the first spreadsheet program had just become available, and many customers were buying Apple ][s with 2-4 floppy drives to run their budgets, forecasts, their businesses-- this was a big deal!).



    The floppy drives were very popular and difficult to get with a long lead time-- Our Computer store had hundreds of back orders. Apple ramped up production and filled the backlog. But, the latest run of floppy drives had problems reading/writing on the floppy disks. Our store would burn-in and test hardware for 24 hours (minimum) before delivering it to customers. We experienced a 80% failure rate on the drives.



    When we notified Apple*, they were concerned and sent some engineers to see if they could resolve the problem.



    The floppy diskettes were not being properly centered/seated when inserted into the drive (a hub dropped down to grab the diskette by a thin circle around the center - so it could spin the disk within the enclosing sleeve).



    A temporary fix was to apply a plastic adhesive circle around each floppy to stiffen the area where the hub grabbed the diskette. (Apple and the diskette mfgrs made these stiffeners available at no cost).



    Long story, short: The temporary fix was acceptable to some customers who desperately needed (or wanted) the devices and accepted the "inconvenience" as a cost of doing business (or just a hardship of being a pioneer). Others, decided to wait until the drive was reengineered.



    Apple allowed return of any drives at the option of the customers/dealers.



    I don't think a public announcement was made (no blogs back then, and we were much less litigious)-- But Apple did right by their customers and dealers.



    * We stacked 100 defective floppy drives on top of (and around) an Apple ][-- called it the "Data Wall". Then we called Wil Houd, Apple VP of Engineering, and invited him to stop in for lunch at the Chinese restaurant next door.



    Case 2:



    Much more recent-- circa 2007; Apple realizes that the iPhone is not meeting sales expectations and reduces the price $200. Many early adopters are upset, at a major price reduction, 2 months in. Apple does the right thing and offers $100 credits to early adopters... some grousing, but most are happy.





    If the Phone 4 is defective, what does Apple do?





    History tells us that Apple will do right by their customers, dealers and shareholders!



    .
  • Reply 91 of 338
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by lostkiwi View Post


    Oh, the quote from The Steve is quite another matter. I think you would be hard pressed to find anyone who didn't think it was arrogant or perhaps ill advised. Still, I have to say it made me laugh when I read it. The guy is not known for his tact.

    I find it interesting there is such a dichotomy with Apple's CEO - he is famed for being a real SOB to work with and his one liner emails are.. well... interesting. On the other hand he can play a keynote audience like a concert pianist...



    Steve will be known as an extremely innovative person and highly polished marketer. That's my view of him right now. Certainly in managing a company he's done a great job, but as he gets more eccentric, there will be certain incongruencies throughout Apple, for example, how Apple is run in non-Western countries, things like the iPhone4 where form appears to have (at least initially) overridden function to a certain extent, and of course, PR and other issues when it comes to how Steve responds and deals with the media, public and other businesses.
  • Reply 92 of 338
    Ok, my 4G does drop and will disconnect a call after 30-40 seconds of holding it the "wrong" way...But not to pile on here...but my phone has another bug which I've seen mentioned online but not experienced until this evening.



    It seems the proximity sensor, at least in my phone is buggy. I was on a call with my brother for about an hour. About half way through the call, my Bluetooth headset died on me. I switched to the wired headset and continued, putting the phone in my pocket. Not even a minute later, my brother interrupted me to ask, "Hey, what are you doing?"...My reply was, "What do you mean?" and he said it sounded like I was pressing on the keypad of the phone...he could hear the "beeps" as if I was pressing numbers on the keypad...Looking at my phone, which was in my pocket, sure enough were a bunch of random numbers showing in the input area of the keypad. Three other times on the call this happened...



    I took the phone out of my pocket and put my finger over the proximity sensor area, and the screen dimmed. Putting my phone to my ear, the screen came back, which makes sense since I uncovered the sensor. But holding the phone to my ear, it never reset itself and the screen stayed full active. By moving the phone around, I could randomly trigger key presses from the keypad from where my ear was making contact with the screen. Can someone else test this out to see if it's happening with your phone?
  • Reply 93 of 338
    deanbardeanbar Posts: 113member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    Thanks for the update, I thought the world was going to end.



    Ireland, ever since my first mobile dropped out of my shirt pocket to the floor and broke, back in the 80's, I've always had a case. Since then, no matter how many times I've dropped a mobile since, none have ever broken, so I always recommend them to any friends without a case. End of problem - but hopefully Apple will quickly issue a fix for the antenna problem.



    I have to agree with you though, that Jobs' comment was very bad and insulting. I guess the stress of the problem must have got under his skin, but he definitely lost the plot there and came across very arrogant - which we know he is anyway. Not the best attitude to promote your products - "customers go ***k yourselves"
  • Reply 94 of 338
    gescomgescom Posts: 69member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by vmcc View Post


    Jesus, Daniel. You need to move out of your mom's basement and get a life.



    Read it again and again. And again.
  • Reply 95 of 338
    babiasubabiasu Posts: 12member
  • Reply 96 of 338
    lostkiwilostkiwi Posts: 639member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post


    Steve will be known as an extremely innovative person and highly polished marketer. That's my view of him right now. Certainly in managing a company he's done a great job, but as he gets more eccentric, there will be certain incongruencies throughout Apple, for example, how Apple is run in non-Western countries, things like the iPhone4 where form appears to have (at least initially) overridden function to a certain extent, and of course, PR and other issues when it comes to how Steve responds and deals with the media, public and other businesses.



    Good points. I think people find it hard to argue with the results he achieved with Apple, even if you are just looking at bald stats like share pricing and market capitalisation.

    That being said I will be very interested to see how the antenna situation is handled. I hope Dick Applebaum above is right.
  • Reply 97 of 338
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    The iPhone 4 is beautiful. The iPhone 4 feels solid. The iPhone 4 is thin. The iPhone 4 is physically smaller and sleek. The iPhone 4 is simple to use. The iPhone 4 has one of the best displays out there. The iPhone 4 is fast! The iPhone 4 has the best OS out there. The iPhone 4 has super cameras. The iPhone 4 has the best games and third parry apps. The iPhone 4 has it all…



    But this new iPhone 4 has a big issue, and until that big issue is properly addressed I won't be buying an iPhone 4, and I certainly won't be recommending it. This: "just don't hold it in that way" crap is a big deal, and Steve needs to get his head out of his ass if he thinks people are going to accept it. The word on the street is hold off on purchasing an iPhone 4 until we know more. And the word is spreading. I want an iPhone 4 like the next guy, I have the money up stairs for it in fact. But this antenna debacle isn't going away anytime soon. Apple needs to wake up and fix the issue at hand, rather than blaming their customers for holding it wrong.



    Yes, we're still pissed about. Why wouldn't we be. Apple makes some of the best products in the world. We expect more from Apple. Some of us Mac fans we're taken aback by Steve's comment. Surely Apple is abandoning it's principles?



    Great device, but...



    Agreed. I'm glad anyways... I can save my money for the time being. It won't be out where I am for another few months so the problems should be all sorted out by then. But will my current perception of Apple be fixed by then after Steve's "you're holding it wrong"? I don't know. I really don't.
  • Reply 98 of 338
    nvidia2008nvidia2008 Posts: 9,262member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Jerseymac View Post


    ...But I'm sure the "call failed" message looks beautiful in hi def.







    Quote:
    Originally Posted by WasteLayer View Post


    Jesus dude, get a room. I love the product too but not enough to drool all over the eyes of everyone reading the review.



    "The new phone demands a sense of reverence, almost as if you're unworthy to use it." Really? I should feel unworthy to use a phone?



    Your delusions are out of hand. I recommend some ssrious in-patient therapy.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Ireland View Post


    You'll be labeled a troll now. I know, it's sad.



    Get used to it



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by thompr View Post


    Are you really that much against getting a bumper, which serves to also protect the phone in case of a drop?



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ski1 View Post


    How is that thin plastic bumper that only covers the strongest part of the iPhone 4 (the metal), going to protect it in a fall ? And why should anyone buy an accessory just so your phone works properly ?



    Bingo.



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RichL View Post


    The reason why the iPhone 3G/3GS had a plastic back hasn't got anything to do with reducing costs. The real reason, surprise surprise, it's down to our friend Mr. Antenna again. The signal propagates through plastic better than it does metal (or skin ).



    This is why virtually all cell phones are at least partially made from plastic. Cost is very much a secondary concern.



    I thought not having plastic was because of Apple's environment-friendly push? Or was it design, or both. Or obsession with something or other.
  • Reply 99 of 338
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Postulant View Post


    I sure hate it for those unfortunate customers. Both of the phones we bought work beautifully. I realize there's an issue, unfortunately, the people who aren't having problems don't chime in to let the world know their device works, and works great. I suspect, and I could be wrong, that out of the millions of iPhones Apple will sell, only a very small percentage will actually have problems.



    Mine works flawlessly, and I'm letting the world know. Others should do the same.



    Mine also works flawlessly, and I echo the sentiments of the article as well!
  • Reply 100 of 338
    jragostajragosta Posts: 10,473member
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by souliisoul View Post


    I have to agree with Ireland on comments, it not the issue so much, but the reply from SJ that irritates me.



    What you and everyone else is missing is that there are TWO antenna problems here.



    1. The normal degradation of signal when a hand is placed near or over the antenna. Every phone has this and it is controlled by the laws of physics. Apple can not change it. Even the Droid manual mentions it. This is the issue that Jobs suggested that people might hold their phones differently if it bothers them. Since Apple can't override the laws of physics, I don't know what else they could do. I suppose they could increase the signal power by an order of magnitude, but the FCC won't let them - and all the whiners would be complaining that Apple was frying peoples' brains.



    2. The abnormal degradation of signal if you touch the antennas at the spacer. As someone else pointed out, this is apparently due to a capacitance issue (like the lamps that turn on or off when you touch the base). Mossberg reported this in his review and the response from Apple was that it was a software problem and they would be fixing it. (There is a rumor of an iOS 4.0.1 coming out this week). This problem appears to be related to the quality of the signal - look at the tests in SF-some locations showed the problem and others didn't. I'm guessing that you can thank your friends at Gizmodo for reducing the number of iPhones in field testing.



    Now, if the software fix solves problem #2, then there's no issue. If the software fix doesn't solve problem #2, then Apple will have to do something else. Apple has consistently fixed customer problems throughout its history and there's no reason to think that they won't solve it this time.



    It IS interesting, though, that the loudest complainers on this topic are people who don't even own the phone - and the same people who have been whining about everything Apple does for years. That suggests that they're whining simply because that's what they do. If it wasn't the antenna issue, they'd complain about something else.
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