According to the Anand report it's both a software and hardware issue. Holding the phone that way does cause a signal drop, but it's only a few %. The bars software makes it look like 80%.
Some kind of non-conductive coating could reduce the real percent even further.
As has been noted before in the letter sent to Jobs from that PhD guy, this issue is extremely simple to fix. Simply spray a coating of some kind of plastic material over the problem area on the phone. It won't even be visible. Apple Stores will probably offer this for free in the near future. It shouldn't be too hard to figure out how to do it yourself though, so this isn't really a problem. Sure, the phone shouldn't have had this issue in the first place, but so long as Apple offers a free and simple fix like the one mentioned I don't have any issue with it. I'm still gonna get an iPhone 4 as soon as it goes on sale here in Norway. Calm down people. This is a problem, but the solution is either free or extremely cheap, and easy to implement.
How come no-one is selling clear pre cut two inch pieces of ultra thin self adhesive silicon strips, yet? 5 bucks for a set of two. Seems like a no brainer to me if this problem really does cause as many dropped calls as one is led to believe.
... Unfortunately, that would involve a recall, or at the very least a trip to the Apple store and a Genius to swap out the antennas with coated ones.
Exactly, the fact that you are talking about a complete recall is why it will never happen.
The antennas are one and the same with the entire chassis of the phone. They *can't* be "swapped out at the Apple store," it's just not possible to do so without replacing the entire phone. No way Apple will agree to a fault in iPhone 4 that requires them to recall every copy of one of the best selling products in their history.
In any case it's not a problem for most people, so they will never do it unless it becomes much more widespread. I never have signal problems on my current iPhone and have never experienced a dropped call. I also don't hold my phone like that when i'm using it as a phone so I don't anticipate any problem at all.
There are millions of folks out there like me, that don't have big sweaty paws and don't hold the phone to their head like it's a softball who are more than happy to buy an iPhone 4. If only the US sold them unlocked, then all us Canadians could pick them up on eBay for a song. I can't wait to get mine and I will be paying full price for it to boot.
The company needs to swallow their pride and fix this issue.
I mean, c'mon, it took them 3 years to realize that there was a bug in the code that displays the signal bars? Give me an f-ing break. The code these guys work on would melt a Cray supercomputer, and a bug like that gets by them? If that's the case, the entire iPhone software team should be fired.
I am taking my iPhone 4 into an Apple Store this week to get a refund, and a replacement 3GS. And I also need to convince my wife that she's not getting the white iPhone she thinks she's getting later this month.
That's not fair. All you have to do is put it in a case. I got one for $2.73 delivered last week. Don't disappoint your wife when the two of you could be facebooking by August. I'm waiting for white and I'm not worried about the reception "issue" at all.
Actually what is really happening is a "BAD" Proximity Sensor.
I have that issue but that is not the issue that is happening with a lot of users. There is a well known issue of reception issues from bridging the gap between antennas.
Also, I?ve tried every remedy to resolve the proximity sensor issue. None have worked. I say it?s going to require a SW update to fix.
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram
I agree that some people (in particular, one across the pond!) were over-the-top, but most of us chose to focus on the substance, not the style, of comments related to this issue.
My issue is with the absolute statements and emotional responses, not to the cogent and mature arguments as to why one thinks it?s a design flaw or why it can?t be resolved with a SW update. Unfortunately, those posters got lost in noise of the trollers.
Its incredible how people haven't figured out the real problem, and it is NOT a reception/signal problem. People are complaining and returning their iphone 4 because of "Bad Reception" and a lot of Call Drops. Actually what is really happening is a "BAD" Proximity Sensor. I have had my iPhone 4 since day 1 and I have had no issue with my signal, sometimes it is a bit low (very few times), but normally it works very well. The proximity sensor is the real issue. I keep hanging up calls, clicking mute, speaker and FaceTime. Mainly when people click End Call, Hold or Mute they actually think there was a problem with the call. A lot of friends who have had the iphone for the first time (including my wife), think it is a call drop/ reception issue, I know exactly what the problem is because I have had an iPhone since June, 2007. The real problem is the Proximity Sensor, and people are returning their iPhones 4 just because they have read that the signal problem is severe and they think it is a hardware problem. Proximity Sensor will be fixed in the next update (hopefully) and people will realize that by "Magic", all the signal problems were actually fixed.
Just hold the phone against your ear, but not pressed against your face. It works great.
Considering the attitude of the community here for the most part as well as robust sales, I'm sure most people wont mind it if their smartphone can't make phone calls. All Steve has to do is crank up the reality distortion field and everything will be fine. All you stock holders can relax.
Some good news for you. Today is the very last day of my AT&T two year agreement and I'm out. I strongly believe that one shouldn't post here unless they actually own the product in question so this shall be my final attempt to make the community here see reason. Here it goes:
It is madness to own an expensive smart phone when it can't make simple telephone calls.
There. I said it and you heard it or you didn't.
Hope to post something again in the rare chance that anyone here wants to talk about the Mac and not the bloody iPad and iPhone. They really should consider renaming this site iPhone insider in my opinion.
These are some of the most irresponsible advices I have ever seen here.
Excuse me? What advices?
ivan.rnn01 gives free advices in the "Genius Bar" forum of this board and nowhere else. He equally refuses to take any responsibility for whatever it may be in zones of marginal reception.
How come no-one is selling clear pre cut two inch pieces of ultra thin self adhesive silicon strips, yet? 5 bucks for a set of two. Seems like a no brainer to me if this problem really does cause as many dropped calls as one is led to believe.
This is exactly what I've been thinking too! Something even half an inch long would probably suffice, and be subtle enough.
To be fair, Apple doesn?t claim it?s a software problem?they acknowledge it?s a real problem (and that other phones have it?but they gloss over the fact that the iPhone has it worse than most).
Apple claims that the software is hiding information ABOUT the problem. To wit: the software problem can sometimes hide when you?re in a weak signal area?and that?s when the problem crops up. As a result, you may think you?ve lose a STRONG signal, when really you?ve lost a weak signal. (Worth fixing, but it?s not the actual problem.)
CR tells me nothing new here?I already knew two things about the iPhone 4 in weak-signal areas:
1. It can get BETTER signal than previous iPhones (and various other phones too). AND it can make do with less signal and still hold onto a call or data connection. (See Anandtech?s test among others: driving through an area where a 3G was useless, the 4 never dropped a call all day.)
2. The better signal can then be worsened by touching that black stripe.
Does #2 outweigh #1? The only answer is ?sometimes.? (Which is indeed what CR found.) In other cases (like Anandtech?and of course people who use cases), the new antenna design will prove to worthwhile despite this issue. Three steps forward, one step back, as Daring Fireball described it.
It?s a better antenna AND a worse one. Try it out, and note the return policy. (As you would with ANY phone. Any phone will perform differently from another in a certain spot, and you can?t accept a phone that doesn?t make calls where you are!)
My order is definitely not cancelled (Besides, AT&T is decent in my city.)
I still hope Apple suffers. Not for the bug, but for their response. Frankly, I find it insulting, treating their users and the public like idiots. So they should suffer for their hubris and arrogance.
That said, I picked up a set of Gelskins. Even though the side tapes do not cover the entire metal antenna, it takes care of the reception issues I was having. And is in its own garish way nicer and cheaper than the bumper.
Considering the attitude of the community here for the most part as well as robust sales, I'm sure most people wont mind it if their smartphone can't make phone calls. All Steve has to do is crank up the reality distortion field and everything will be fine. All you stock holders can relax.
Some good news for you. Today is the very last day of my AT&T two year agreement and I'm out. I strongly believe that one shouldn't post here unless they actually own the product in question so this shall be my final attempt to make the community here see reason. Here it goes:
It is madness to own an expensive smart phone when it can't make simple telephone calls.
There. I said it and you heard it or you didn't.
Hope to post something again in the rare chance that anyone here wants to talk about the Mac and not the bloody iPad and iPhone. They really should consider renaming this site iPhone insider in my opinion.
Have a great day and hey, call me sometime.
I own the said product, and I can quite happily make simple phone calls.
It is Appleinsider, iPhone made by Apple. It is not Macinsider!
But they didn't qualify it with "certain employees within Apple were stunned (mainly the marketing dept, accounting and some of the janitorial staff) to find...". They said "we" as in Apple. Apple said they were surprised.
They also, explicitly said it was a mistake.
Not knowing exactly the entire process behind the writing, approval and posting of the letter, I will only say that it was a bit of stupidity as a PR move.
But, it's possible that at the time they wrote and posted it, they either weren't aware of, or in denial about, the issue of bridging the seam, and the letter was intended to be one of those, "This isn't really an issue and here's why," things that they considered would be of no consequence in the long-run.
To be fair, Apple doesn?t claim it?s a software problem?they acknowledge it?s a real problem (and that other phones have it?but they gloss over the fact that the iPhone has it worse than most).
Apple claims that the software is hiding information ABOUT the problem. To wit: the software problem can sometimes hide when you?re in a weak signal area?and that?s when the problem crops up. As a result, you may think you?ve lose a STRONG signal, when really you?ve lost a weak signal. (Worth fixing, but it?s not the actual problem.)
CR tells me nothing new here?I already knew two things about the iPhone 4 in weak-signal areas:
1. It can get BETTER signal than previous iPhones (and various other phones too). AND it can make do with less signal and still hold onto a call or data connection. (See Anandtech?s test among others: driving through an area where a 3G was useless, the 4 never dropped a call all day.)
2. The better signal can then be worsened by touching that black stripe.
Does #2 outweigh #1? The only answer is ?sometimes.? (Which is indeed what CR found.) In other cases (like Anandtech?and of course people who use cases), the new antenna design will prove to worthwhile despite this issue. Three steps forward, one step back, as Daring Fireball described it.
It?s a better antenna AND a worse one. Try it out, and note the return policy. (As you would with ANY phone. Any phone will perform differently from another in a certain spot, and you can?t accept a phone that doesn?t make calls where you are!)
My order is definitely not cancelled (Besides, AT&T is decent in my city.)
You make some very good points. But you should know that, in my experience (with my handset), it is not only in weak signal areas: it happens when there is a full five bars (I've now seen that in five different cities I've traveled to).
There are many issues with technology in general. The current iPhone 4 problem is just one of them. The thing that amazes me is that if I were to buy an iPhone 4 and use it to replace my Vonage phone my monthly bill would go from $30 to $104 minumum. Why is no one complaining about how much money to costs to use one of these phones. They may be smart phones, but the people using them are not real smart.
What are you talking about? Everybody who owns a cell phone complains how much it costs. Every single person who has ever had a hole burned in the their bank account while happily roaming (happens only once!) are complaining. But IP telephony has its own problems. So far I have not found a satisfactory IP solution. Specially not one I can use anywhere anytime.
Comments
Some kind of non-conductive coating could reduce the real percent even further.
As has been noted before in the letter sent to Jobs from that PhD guy, this issue is extremely simple to fix. Simply spray a coating of some kind of plastic material over the problem area on the phone. It won't even be visible. Apple Stores will probably offer this for free in the near future. It shouldn't be too hard to figure out how to do it yourself though, so this isn't really a problem. Sure, the phone shouldn't have had this issue in the first place, but so long as Apple offers a free and simple fix like the one mentioned I don't have any issue with it. I'm still gonna get an iPhone 4 as soon as it goes on sale here in Norway. Calm down people. This is a problem, but the solution is either free or extremely cheap, and easy to implement.
How come no-one is selling clear pre cut two inch pieces of ultra thin self adhesive silicon strips, yet? 5 bucks for a set of two. Seems like a no brainer to me if this problem really does cause as many dropped calls as one is led to believe.
... Unfortunately, that would involve a recall, or at the very least a trip to the Apple store and a Genius to swap out the antennas with coated ones.
Exactly, the fact that you are talking about a complete recall is why it will never happen.
The antennas are one and the same with the entire chassis of the phone. They *can't* be "swapped out at the Apple store," it's just not possible to do so without replacing the entire phone. No way Apple will agree to a fault in iPhone 4 that requires them to recall every copy of one of the best selling products in their history.
In any case it's not a problem for most people, so they will never do it unless it becomes much more widespread. I never have signal problems on my current iPhone and have never experienced a dropped call. I also don't hold my phone like that when i'm using it as a phone so I don't anticipate any problem at all.
There are millions of folks out there like me, that don't have big sweaty paws and don't hold the phone to their head like it's a softball who are more than happy to buy an iPhone 4. If only the US sold them unlocked, then all us Canadians could pick them up on eBay for a song. I can't wait to get mine and I will be paying full price for it to boot.
I'm an Apple fanboi, but this is f-ed up.
The company needs to swallow their pride and fix this issue.
I mean, c'mon, it took them 3 years to realize that there was a bug in the code that displays the signal bars? Give me an f-ing break. The code these guys work on would melt a Cray supercomputer, and a bug like that gets by them? If that's the case, the entire iPhone software team should be fired.
I am taking my iPhone 4 into an Apple Store this week to get a refund, and a replacement 3GS. And I also need to convince my wife that she's not getting the white iPhone she thinks she's getting later this month.
That's not fair. All you have to do is put it in a case. I got one for $2.73 delivered last week. Don't disappoint your wife when the two of you could be facebooking by August. I'm waiting for white and I'm not worried about the reception "issue" at all.
The signal bar display is not a bug. They intentionally chose to have the bars not present a display that was analogous to signal strength.
Citation needed.
Actually what is really happening is a "BAD" Proximity Sensor.
I have that issue but that is not the issue that is happening with a lot of users. There is a well known issue of reception issues from bridging the gap between antennas.
Also, I?ve tried every remedy to resolve the proximity sensor issue. None have worked. I say it?s going to require a SW update to fix.
I agree that some people (in particular, one across the pond!) were over-the-top, but most of us chose to focus on the substance, not the style, of comments related to this issue.
My issue is with the absolute statements and emotional responses, not to the cogent and mature arguments as to why one thinks it?s a design flaw or why it can?t be resolved with a SW update. Unfortunately, those posters got lost in noise of the trollers.
Its incredible how people haven't figured out the real problem, and it is NOT a reception/signal problem. People are complaining and returning their iphone 4 because of "Bad Reception" and a lot of Call Drops. Actually what is really happening is a "BAD" Proximity Sensor. I have had my iPhone 4 since day 1 and I have had no issue with my signal, sometimes it is a bit low (very few times), but normally it works very well. The proximity sensor is the real issue. I keep hanging up calls, clicking mute, speaker and FaceTime. Mainly when people click End Call, Hold or Mute they actually think there was a problem with the call. A lot of friends who have had the iphone for the first time (including my wife), think it is a call drop/ reception issue, I know exactly what the problem is because I have had an iPhone since June, 2007. The real problem is the Proximity Sensor, and people are returning their iPhones 4 just because they have read that the signal problem is severe and they think it is a hardware problem. Proximity Sensor will be fixed in the next update (hopefully) and people will realize that by "Magic", all the signal problems were actually fixed.
Just hold the phone against your ear, but not pressed against your face. It works great.
Some good news for you. Today is the very last day of my AT&T two year agreement and I'm out. I strongly believe that one shouldn't post here unless they actually own the product in question so this shall be my final attempt to make the community here see reason. Here it goes:
It is madness to own an expensive smart phone when it can't make simple telephone calls.
There. I said it and you heard it or you didn't.
Hope to post something again in the rare chance that anyone here wants to talk about the Mac and not the bloody iPad and iPhone. They really should consider renaming this site iPhone insider in my opinion.
Have a great day and hey, call me sometime.
These are some of the most irresponsible advices I have ever seen here.
Excuse me? What advices?
ivan.rnn01 gives free advices in the "Genius Bar" forum of this board and nowhere else. He equally refuses to take any responsibility for whatever it may be in zones of marginal reception.
How come no-one is selling clear pre cut two inch pieces of ultra thin self adhesive silicon strips, yet? 5 bucks for a set of two. Seems like a no brainer to me if this problem really does cause as many dropped calls as one is led to believe.
This is exactly what I've been thinking too! Something even half an inch long would probably suffice, and be subtle enough.
Apple claims that the software is hiding information ABOUT the problem. To wit: the software problem can sometimes hide when you?re in a weak signal area?and that?s when the problem crops up. As a result, you may think you?ve lose a STRONG signal, when really you?ve lost a weak signal. (Worth fixing, but it?s not the actual problem.)
CR tells me nothing new here?I already knew two things about the iPhone 4 in weak-signal areas:
1. It can get BETTER signal than previous iPhones (and various other phones too). AND it can make do with less signal and still hold onto a call or data connection. (See Anandtech?s test among others: driving through an area where a 3G was useless, the 4 never dropped a call all day.)
2. The better signal can then be worsened by touching that black stripe.
Does #2 outweigh #1? The only answer is ?sometimes.? (Which is indeed what CR found.) In other cases (like Anandtech?and of course people who use cases), the new antenna design will prove to worthwhile despite this issue. Three steps forward, one step back, as Daring Fireball described it.
It?s a better antenna AND a worse one. Try it out, and note the return policy. (As you would with ANY phone. Any phone will perform differently from another in a certain spot, and you can?t accept a phone that doesn?t make calls where you are!)
My order is definitely not cancelled
Hey, Hiro's teacher is right.
I believe in that and that that is also a right.
Hiro's teacher was absolutely right. It takes balls for a teacher to sit a student down and have that conversation with him.
Or it will be the problem for CR itself? Consider the reception problem is not new issue, how come they can change stance easily?
That said, I picked up a set of Gelskins. Even though the side tapes do not cover the entire metal antenna, it takes care of the reception issues I was having. And is in its own garish way nicer and cheaper than the bumper.
For all of the people that bashed the ones of us that said there is a problem and pointed out that Consumer Reports said it was "OK", SUCK IT.
Ireland, is it you speaking there?
Considering the attitude of the community here for the most part as well as robust sales, I'm sure most people wont mind it if their smartphone can't make phone calls. All Steve has to do is crank up the reality distortion field and everything will be fine. All you stock holders can relax.
Some good news for you. Today is the very last day of my AT&T two year agreement and I'm out. I strongly believe that one shouldn't post here unless they actually own the product in question so this shall be my final attempt to make the community here see reason. Here it goes:
It is madness to own an expensive smart phone when it can't make simple telephone calls.
There. I said it and you heard it or you didn't.
Hope to post something again in the rare chance that anyone here wants to talk about the Mac and not the bloody iPad and iPhone. They really should consider renaming this site iPhone insider in my opinion.
Have a great day and hey, call me sometime.
I own the said product, and I can quite happily make simple phone calls.
It is Appleinsider, iPhone made by Apple. It is not Macinsider!
But they didn't qualify it with "certain employees within Apple were stunned (mainly the marketing dept, accounting and some of the janitorial staff) to find...". They said "we" as in Apple. Apple said they were surprised.
They also, explicitly said it was a mistake.
Not knowing exactly the entire process behind the writing, approval and posting of the letter, I will only say that it was a bit of stupidity as a PR move.
But, it's possible that at the time they wrote and posted it, they either weren't aware of, or in denial about, the issue of bridging the seam, and the letter was intended to be one of those, "This isn't really an issue and here's why," things that they considered would be of no consequence in the long-run.
To be fair, Apple doesn?t claim it?s a software problem?they acknowledge it?s a real problem (and that other phones have it?but they gloss over the fact that the iPhone has it worse than most).
Apple claims that the software is hiding information ABOUT the problem. To wit: the software problem can sometimes hide when you?re in a weak signal area?and that?s when the problem crops up. As a result, you may think you?ve lose a STRONG signal, when really you?ve lost a weak signal. (Worth fixing, but it?s not the actual problem.)
CR tells me nothing new here?I already knew two things about the iPhone 4 in weak-signal areas:
1. It can get BETTER signal than previous iPhones (and various other phones too). AND it can make do with less signal and still hold onto a call or data connection. (See Anandtech?s test among others: driving through an area where a 3G was useless, the 4 never dropped a call all day.)
2. The better signal can then be worsened by touching that black stripe.
Does #2 outweigh #1? The only answer is ?sometimes.? (Which is indeed what CR found.) In other cases (like Anandtech?and of course people who use cases), the new antenna design will prove to worthwhile despite this issue. Three steps forward, one step back, as Daring Fireball described it.
It?s a better antenna AND a worse one. Try it out, and note the return policy. (As you would with ANY phone. Any phone will perform differently from another in a certain spot, and you can?t accept a phone that doesn?t make calls where you are!)
My order is definitely not cancelled
You make some very good points. But you should know that, in my experience (with my handset), it is not only in weak signal areas: it happens when there is a full five bars (I've now seen that in five different cities I've traveled to).
Good luck with yours!
There are many issues with technology in general. The current iPhone 4 problem is just one of them. The thing that amazes me is that if I were to buy an iPhone 4 and use it to replace my Vonage phone my monthly bill would go from $30 to $104 minumum. Why is no one complaining about how much money to costs to use one of these phones. They may be smart phones, but the people using them are not real smart.
What are you talking about? Everybody who owns a cell phone complains how much it costs. Every single person who has ever had a hole burned in the their bank account while happily roaming (happens only once!) are complaining. But IP telephony has its own problems. So far I have not found a satisfactory IP solution. Specially not one I can use anywhere anytime.